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Hey western Montana folks

1713627909545.png

The income a family of 4 needs to live comfortably in every U.S. state​


www.cnbc.com

The income a family of 4 needs to live comfortably in every U.S. state

In Massachusetts, a family of four needs more than $300,000 to live comfortably — the highest of all U.S. states.
www.cnbc.com www.cnbc.com
 
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With the large influx of transient people coming to Montana, the Legislature attempted to keep them from voting in 2 (or more) states.
"State Attorneys" (paid by the taxpayers) fought the law. So much for protecting the State that pays their salary.

www.kpax.com

Federal judge blocks Montana law on changing voter registrations

A federal judge has blocked Montana from enforcing one section of a 2023 law that established requirements for voters changing their registration.
www.kpax.com www.kpax.com
 
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Here is the mindset of a Liberal city with Liberal Commissioners. "We will cross that bridge when we get to it"... In the mean time build, build, build and let the long time residents foot the bill.
_______________________

“Well, people don't like the traffic that comes with growth. That's been a major complaint so far. A little disappointed, upset by Reserve Street and how that's functioning. But cities grow and you have to accommodate growth the best you can,” Kidston explained. “We all know housing costs are high. The only to alleviate housing costs is to build more housing. So, it's the nature of things. Until somebody comes up with a better idea this is kind of what we got. “

www.kpax.com

Current Events: Large scale development continues in Missoula’s Mullan Road area

This edition of Current Events takes an in-depth look at the ongoing development taking place in the Mullan Road area of Missoula.
www.kpax.com www.kpax.com
 
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Every day I'm looking at a way to cash out of a bunch of high value farmland here in MN and move to MT. Run cattle or drive truck, something else. Give MT an additional 7 Constitution loving conservatives
 
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goinghunting said:
Every day I'm looking at a way to cash out of a bunch of high value farmland here in MN and move to MT. Run cattle or drive truck, something else. Give MT an additional 7 Constitution loving conservatives
Click to expand...
Do your Homework.
Communicate off line with eca7891
He went down that road recently.
Narrow your focus, list your priorities "Needs"... or "Wants"...
Rural living is expensive, as far as supplies go.
Medical care will 2nd tier in rural areas but better in the larger cities. But, homeless are an issue in large cities.
 
Hobo Hilton said:
Do your Homework.
Communicate off line with eca7891
He went down that road recently.
Narrow your focus, list your priorities "Needs"... or "Wants"...
Rural living is expensive, as far as supplies go.
Medical care will 2nd tier in rural areas but better in the larger cities. But, homeless are an issue in large cities.
Click to expand...
We live and farm in rural MN so understand what is needed. VERY self sufficient family, homeschool, etc. We spend several weeks to a couple months a year in MT/AZ hunting and just getting away. Love it.
 
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Malum Prohibitum said:
Probably not "illegals" that can be deported. More likely asylum applicants awaiting a hearing at some point six years in the future, with work permits, which makes them legals, not illegals.

The federal law on asylum and Congress's refusal to change it have landed us in a bind.

There is no provision in federal law for deporting asylum applicants until after their hearing, and, as I pointed out, the backlog is about six years right now. Congress does nothing. Voters are not demanding any action by Congress. Indeed, the voters most concerned about the situation are fruitlessly focusing on the presidential election in November, thinking that will fix things. It won't. Only congressional action will fix this issue.
Click to expand...
Not exactly true, EO fixed it, then EO destroyed it. The permanent fix is to have some laws passed, yes through congress. However it is doubtful either party would do this unless we get a lot of MAGA Republicans in those seats. They are unwilling and lack the integrity and fortitude to make things right. The provisions for deporting maybe not, but the pre-screening and rejecting their claims up front and tell them No Entry does exist, this corrupt president and his cronies have turned it upside down. This is part of a bigger plan to bring America to its knees using our own laws…. It is all part of Marxism and Communism and so many other ism’s
 
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SmokeyJoe101 said:
Not exactly true, EO fixed it, then EO destroyed it.
Click to expand...

You need to look at those EOs and the court cases ruling on those EOs, and, after devoting considerable study, let us know if you still hold the same opinion.

In the words of Judge VanDyke, a Trump appointee to the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals:

"The Biden administration’s ‘Pathways Rule’ before us in this appeal is not meaningfully different from the prior administration’s rules that were backhanded by my two colleagues. This new rule looks like the Trump administration’s Port of Entry Rule and Transit Rule got together, had a baby, and then dolled it up in a stylish modern outfit, complete with a phone app.”

There was no EO that "fixed it," nor was there an EO that "destroyed it." As Judge VanDyke said, the rules of Trump and Biden are "not meaningfully different." That is a Trump appointee to a federal appeals court and no friend to the Biden administration. In fact, in the same dissent, he accused the two Democrat appointee judges on the panel with him of potentially allowing Biden to get away with more on undermining the asylum statute than Trump because of political partisanship.

The courts have struck down both Trump and Biden EOs as violating the plain text of the federal statute.

The more interesting thing about your comments on Congress is that the House sent a representative to the Senate to negotiate the exact fix you suggest, prescreening and rejecting claims up front. That would then become federal law. The Senate agreed to it, and sent it to the House. The Border Patrol Union (which hates Biden, just check out their Twitter - X- page) wanted it and posted on X (Twitter) that it was a "huge improvement" - those words were repeated four times in one post with respect to things in the bill. It was supposed to reduce the average stay in country from 6 years (current) to less than six weeks, with the majority being rejected right out of the gate. Trump tweeted out that it was "garbage," however, and the House announced it DOA.

The House then passed a bill that they knew the Senate would not agree to, which means it was intended to be only a political posture, not a real legislative solution.

Why?

Because this is an election year. The illegal alien crisis has to remain unabated in order to give Trump a boost at the polls. It motivates more of the base to turn out and vote, and a lot of folks in the middle believe the propaganda that this is an EO issue. The vast majority of Americans have no idea about the federal asylum statutes or that EOs issued by both Trump and Biden trying to get around the asylum law have been struck down in the federal courts as violating federal law.

It is the federal law that needs to be fixed.

It will not be touched until after the presidential election, though, because the House Republicans know that this is a winning election year issue. That issue goes away for Trump if they fix it before November.

THAT is what is happening.

It's too bad that the propaganda on this issue has been so successful. The propaganda has actually prevented a real fix.
 
Malum Prohibitum said:
You need to look at those EOs and the court cases ruling on those EOs, and, after devoting considerable study, let us know if you still hold the same opinion.

In the words of Judge VanDyke, a Trump appointee to the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals:

"The Biden administration’s ‘Pathways Rule’ before us in this appeal is not meaningfully different from the prior administration’s rules that were backhanded by my two colleagues. This new rule looks like the Trump administration’s Port of Entry Rule and Transit Rule got together, had a baby, and then dolled it up in a stylish modern outfit, complete with a phone app.”

There was no EO that "fixed it," nor was there an EO that "destroyed it." As Judge VanDyke said, the rules of Trump and Biden are "not meaningfully different." That is a Trump appointee to a federal appeals court and no friend to the Biden administration. In fact, in the same dissent, he accused the two Democrat appointee judges on the panel with him of potentially allowing Biden to get away with more on undermining the asylum statute than Trump because of political partisanship.

The courts have struck down both Trump and Biden EOs as violating the plain text of the federal statute.

The more interesting thing about your comments on Congress is that the House sent a representative to the Senate to negotiate the exact fix you suggest, prescreening and rejecting claims up front. That would then become federal law. The Senate agreed to it, and sent it to the House. The Border Patrol Union (which hates Biden, just check out their Twitter - X- page) wanted it and posted on X (Twitter) that it was a "huge improvement" - those words were repeated four times in one post with respect to things in the bill. It was supposed to reduce the average stay in country from 6 years (current) to less than six weeks, with the majority being rejected right out of the gate. Trump tweeted out that it was "garbage," however, and the House announced it DOA.

The House then passed a bill that they knew the Senate would not agree to, which means it was intended to be only a political posture, not a real legislative solution.

Why?

Because this is an election year. The illegal alien crisis has to remain unabated in order to give Trump a boost at the polls. It motivates more of the base to turn out and vote, and a lot of folks in the middle believe the propaganda that this is an EO issue. The vast majority of Americans have no idea about the federal asylum statutes or that EOs issued by both Trump and Biden trying to get around the asylum law have been struck down in the federal courts as violating federal law.

It is the federal law that needs to be fixed.

It will not be touched until after the presidential election, though, because the House Republicans know that this is a winning election year issue. That issue goes away for Trump if they fix it before November.

THAT is what is happening.

It's too bad that the propaganda on this issue has been so successful. The propaganda has actually prevented a real fix.
Click to expand...
This chart only represents the Mexican border and the illegal aliens they caught, no get always no Canada border. I think you’re wasting your breath the charts speak for themselves. There is some truths to your speculations that could be debated. However I will refer you to this chart for any future debates
 

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There is no speculation whatsoever in my post, nor do I take issue with your chart. The problem for you is that the chart has nothing to do with what I wrote. Apparently there is a lot going on that you just simply do not understand (not from lack of intelligence, just from either a lack of interest or a lack of investigation leading to a lack of knowledge, sort of like, hey, here is a chart, and that is enough for me. I am not looking further). My guess is that you have no real idea of what the executive orders are from each president and what the courts have done with them.

I quoted Judge VanDyke, a Trump appointee, hoping it would spark some interest.

It certainly did for me.

I used to think what you think. Judge VanDyke's writing woke me up to what is really going on, and, once I read the court opinions and the history of the executive orders that social media and Fox News are always going on about, I now have a very clear view of both the law and the current state of affairs.

You can get that, too.

Or you can decide I am wasting my breath and your little chart summarizes all federal asylum law and court cases and executive orders all in one handy little graphic and refuse to expand your knowledge beyond wherever it was when you read what Judge VanDyke had to say.

Your choice.

Most Americans choose ignorance. I sincerely hope you do not, but I certainly understand if you do. It's a lot of work to become knowledgeable, in this case requiring many hours of searching and very deliberate and conscious focus. Most are just trying to work and spend time with family and get by. I get it.
 
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Malum Prohibitum said:
Probably a good development.
Click to expand...
I know several kids who were home schooled, got an AA degree at a junior college and got snapped up by companies that rejected the DEI culture.
They did have to leave Montana and relocate but they are knocking down big bucks, saving their money and will eventually return. Not a bad plan.
 
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Hobo Hilton said:
saving their money and will eventually return
Click to expand...
Depends on where...Even for folks that make a good living BozeAngeles is a tough road to hoe. GF, Billings, are probably more in reach. I really wish I would have realized how good we had it when interest rates were so low, I really should have snatched up a few rental properties.

I live in a very modest house in a semi decent neighborhood. I built an addition on to it when my kiddo was young and self performed pretty much everything or had buddies who were licensed electricians help me on that side. I went from a 3 bedroom 2 bath to a 4 bedroom 3 bath, all on one level. Realtors have told me numerous times I could sell my house for a small fortune, which is still really hard for me to believe since it is far from a trophy home. Most decent homes now here you are looking at a minimum of a 250-350k down payment and then a monthly payment that is 3-4k. I don't know very many folks who can swing that.
 
shields shtr said:
Depends on where...Even for folks that make a good living BozeAngeles is a tough road to hoe. GF, Billings, are probably more in reach. I really wish I would have realized how good we had it when interest rates were so low, I really should have snatched up a few rental properties.

I live in a very modest house in a semi decent neighborhood. I built an addition on to it when my kiddo was young and self performed pretty much everything or had buddies who were licensed electricians help me on that side. I went from a 3 bedroom 2 bath to a 4 bedroom 3 bath, all on one level. Realtors have told me numerous times I could sell my house for a small fortune, which is still really hard for me to believe since it is far from a trophy home. Most decent homes now here you are looking at a minimum of a 250-350k down payment and then a monthly payment that is 3-4k. I don't know very many folks who can swing that.
Click to expand...
Hind sight is still 20 / 20. The one's I speak of are smart. They know they must pay their dues as they advance in the working world. They have family here who have a grapevine of information of properties that will come available some time in the future. Properties change hands daily that have never been listed on the market. They are knowledgeable on "The Right of First Refusal". A hedge that cost nothing more than the lawyer fee to draw up the agreement. Everything runs in cycles. I have lived through 4 real estate cycles and passed on some killer deals. If anyone thinks this bubble will not burst, they are mistaken. When the out of state money stops flowing there will be many left high and dry with real estate and a pipe dream.
 
Hobo Hilton said:
When the out of state money stops flowing there will be many left high and dry with real estate and a pipe dream.
Click to expand...
I can only hope this will happen, but I am skeptical. I am in the construction biz and we are contacted all the time by large investment groups looking to do real estate developments. East Coast, West Coast, Denver area, all over. Their sole purpose is basically the same concept as "house flipping", but on a larger scale. These people are paying upwards of 10-15 million on properties less than 10 acres in some cases and develop an entire model to gain a return. Whether they are houses or high density residential, their model certainly doesn't fall into the "affordable" category for most people. I can only imagine the people living in them are high salary tech sector types who have migrated here.

Hopefully we get a couple of really harsh winters here in the next few years. 96-97 down here was basically Siberia. Colder than hell Dec-Mar and a shit ton of snow. That might scare some people off.
 
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shields shtr said:
I can only hope this will happen, but I am skeptical. I am in the construction biz and we are contacted all the time by large investment groups looking to do real estate developments. East Coast, West Coast, Denver area, all over. Their sole purpose is basically the same concept as "house flipping", but on a larger scale. These people are paying upwards of 10-15 million on properties less than 10 acres in some cases and develop an entire model to gain a return. Whether they are houses or high density residential, their model certainly doesn't fall into the "affordable" category for most people. I can only imagine the people living in them are high salary tech sector types who have migrated here.

Hopefully we get a couple of really harsh winters here in the next few years. 96-97 down here was basically Siberia. Colder than hell Dec-Mar and a shit ton of snow. That might scare some people off.
Click to expand...
Deja Vu of 1980's.

Remember those investor groups are "playing with other people's money". Even BlackRock is floating on investors money. Those developers are not putting up the deed to their house as collateral. They are putting up the 401k money of some working stiff that is getting greedy and investing in real estate.

As the Bible says, often, there will be suffering. Suffering comes in many shapes and sizes.


en.wikipedia.org

BlackRock - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
shields shtr said:
Most decent homes now here you are looking at a minimum of a 250-350k down payment and then a monthly payment that is 3-4k. I don't know very many folks who can swing that.
Click to expand...
There are as many folks swinging it as there are homes available to buy, or more.

If that was not true, and there were less folks, then the prices would come down.
 
Malum Prohibitum said:
Why is everything so vague?

What does it mean that a nonprofit is "connected" to the Biden Administration? What is the connection?
Click to expand...
americafirstpolicy.com

How the Border Crisis is Impacting Montana

Over the past two and a half years, the Biden Administration has ushered in an historic security, humanitarian, and fentanyl crisis along our southern border. Today, we see record numbers of illegal aliens released into American communities, tragic deaths from illicit fentanyl poising, an...
americafirstpolicy.com americafirstpolicy.com
“It's hard to look at actions like this from the Biden administration and not say that this is some sort of political retribution," he said. "You start talking about the northern tier states, especially the western states like Montana, South Dakota, North Dakota and Wyoming are obviously deep red states in what the President and his coastal buddies consider flyover country. We've been very critical of him in his policies. Like I said, it's hard to look at a proposed action like this and not think this is some sort of political retribution.”

Read More: Montana AG on Undocumented Immigrants Possibly Coming to Montana | https://newstalkkgvo.com/montana-ag...ntana/?utm_source=tsmclip&utm_medium=referral
 
Three links, and none of them have anything addressing any of my questions. Did you mean for them to do so? I am not sure if I misunderstood why you quoted my post when you added the links.
 
shields shtr said:
Depends on where...Even for folks that make a good living BozeAngeles is a tough road to hoe. GF, Billings, are probably more in reach. I really wish I would have realized how good we had it when interest rates were so low, I really should have snatched up a few rental properties.

I live in a very modest house in a semi decent neighborhood. I built an addition on to it when my kiddo was young and self performed pretty much everything or had buddies who were licensed electricians help me on that side. I went from a 3 bedroom 2 bath to a 4 bedroom 3 bath, all on one level. Realtors have told me numerous times I could sell my house for a small fortune, which is still really hard for me to believe since it is far from a trophy home. Most decent homes now here you are looking at a minimum of a 250-350k down payment and then a monthly payment that is 3-4k. I don't know very many folks who can swing that.
Click to expand...
Depending on the neighborhood, the condition of the house might not matter as it is the land they are after.

My brother has a "beach view" house in Rhode Island. He says it would bring a million if he sold it. His neighbor's "water front" just sold for $1.2 Mil. And after laying out over a million dollars, the buyer promptly razed the existing structure to put up a new house.
 
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shields shtr said:
Depends on where...Even for folks that make a good living BozeAngeles is a tough road to hoe. GF, Billings, are probably more in reach. I really wish I would have realized how good we had it when interest rates were so low, I really should have snatched up a few rental properties.

I live in a very modest house in a semi decent neighborhood. I built an addition on to it when my kiddo was young and self performed pretty much everything or had buddies who were licensed electricians help me on that side. I went from a 3 bedroom 2 bath to a 4 bedroom 3 bath, all on one level. Realtors have told me numerous times I could sell my house for a small fortune, which is still really hard for me to believe since it is far from a trophy home. Most decent homes now here you are looking at a minimum of a 250-350k down payment and then a monthly payment that is 3-4k. I don't know very many folks who can swing that.
Click to expand...

Smile on your good fortune. Not everybody builds a significant amount of wealth just by having purchased a modest house in the right place for a future time when it would be valued at "a small fortune."
 
Malum Prohibitum said:
Smile on your good fortune. Not everybody builds a significant amount of wealth just by having purchased a modest house in the right place for a future time when it would be valued at "a small fortune."
Click to expand...
It's not all rainbows and unicorns though. Many people are getting forced out of their now high dollar homes, because of property taxes.

That's why California voted in Prop 13 way back in the day.
 
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Steve_In_29 said:
It's not all rainbows and unicorns though. Many people are getting forced out of their now high dollar homes, because of property taxes.

That's why California voted in Prop 13 way back in the day.
Click to expand...
But, 2%+2%+2%+2%+2%+2% X year after after year with compound interest eventually mounts up to more than an old guy with a fixed income number that was established 20 years ago can afford.

The same with the FED Reserve telling American's 2% yearly inflation is great. Eventually, it all adds up
2% taxes +2% inflation = Nothing to show for the money of the working American.

Like living in a house being eaten up by termites.
 
I have to go to a funeral in trout creek area in a couple weeks is there anything to see or do there I’ll be spending the night so I’ll have some time, any ranges or gun stores within a hours drive worth seeing, anything else worth seeing??? Thanx
 
7.62willdo said:
I have to go to a funeral in trout creek area in a couple weeks is there anything to see or do there I’ll be spending the night so I’ll have some time, any ranges or gun stores within a hours drive worth seeing, anything else worth seeing??? Thanx
Click to expand...
Actually that is where those residing in the big cities go to fish and relax with their RV's.
 
Hobo Hilton said:
But, 2%+2%+2%+2%+2%+2% X year after after year with compound interest eventually mounts up to more than an old guy with a fixed income number that was established 20 years ago can afford.

The same with the FED Reserve telling American's 2% yearly inflation is great. Eventually, it all adds up
2% taxes +2% inflation = Nothing to show for the money of the working American.

Like living in a house being eaten up by termites.
Click to expand...
I understand what you are getting at but under Prop 13 it's not a 2% annual tax increase., The increase of the taxable value of the property is what gets limited. Which in turn keeps the tax payment lower. Then when sold the new owner's taxes are reset to current market value of the property.
 
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Steve_In_29 said:
It's not all rainbows and unicorns though. Many people are getting forced out of their now high dollar homes, because of property taxes.
Click to expand...

I did not get the sense that he was being "forced out" of his home.

I don't know many folks who bought a house for $98,000, are living in it until they can get $980,000 if they sold it today, who are complaining about that. They may complain about the tax bill each year, sure. When you have $600,000 in your 401(k) and can sell your home tomorrow for a million, you now have $1.6 Million to settle elsewhere. (minus capital gains tax, of which the first $500k is excluded if married, then 15% on the amount over $94,050 - the amount under that is 0%)

I mean, is the tax bill a problem? Sure. But this is one of those first world problems.

Appreciating assets are wealth.

I mean, he would definitely be bitching had he bought his house for $132k and today nobody would give him more than $40k for it. You can't bitch in both directions. Something has to make you happy.
 

Sen. Jon Tester Flip-Flops on Laken Riley Act After Voting Against It as Amendment in March​

Sen. Jon Tester (D-MT), one of the most vulnerable Democrats running for reelection in the 2024 cycle, is changing his stance on the Laken Riley Act after voting against it as an amendment in March.
On Thursday, Tester announced he supported the Republican-led legislation, which advanced from the House of Representatives in March, ABC News reported.
Republican Tim Sheehy, who is running for Tester’s seat, took to X after the Democrat came out in support of the bill, writing, “Flip-Flop Flattop strikes again!”



 
Made a run through the Bitterroot Valley this week, heading to Missoula for supplies. I make that run about once a month.
Appeared that someone opened the flood gates and people are moving here in droves. Few actually have a "Plan".
Every UHaul lot I passed was full of moving trucks and trailers. Very few things here are what I call affordable.
IMG_1416.JPG
 

Montana population growth slows​

As of July 1, 2023, the federal demographics agency estimates Montana had 1,132,800 residents. That’s about 9,900 more than a year prior, or a 0.9% increase.
Click to expand...
While that’s a lot of new Montanans — roughly as many people as the populations of Belgrade, Miles City or Whitefish — it’s a markedly more modest increase than the state has seen in prior years. Between mid-2021 and mid-2022, for example, the agency estimates Montana grew almost twice that fast, adding about 19,200 residents.
Click to expand...

That's barely thirty thousand people over two years, or an average of 15,000 a year. I suppose it may feel like a lot, but that's not a lot.

I live in Georgia, and we have added roughly 100,000 persons a year every year from 2010 until now. Georgia is tiny compared to Montana, like one third the size.

I am not suggesting that you should want to see that sort of population growth, but I have been lead to believe reading here that Montana is being swamped with folks moving in from California and New York and other places, but it does not appear to be true at all.
 
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Malum Prohibitum said:

Montana population growth slows​




That's barely thirty thousand people over two years, or an average of 15,000 a year. I suppose it may feel like a lot, but that's not a lot.

I live in Georgia, and we have added roughly 100,000 persons a year every year from 2010 until now. Georgia is tiny compared to Montana, like one third the size.

I am not suggesting that you should want to see that sort of population growth, but I have been lead to believe reading here that Montana is being swamped with folks moving in from California and New York and other places, but it does not appear to be true at all.
Click to expand...
federal-lands.jpg


map_indian_reservations_usa.png
 
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Malum Prohibitum said:

Montana population growth slows​




That's barely thirty thousand people over two years, or an average of 15,000 a year. I suppose it may feel like a lot, but that's not a lot.

I live in Georgia, and we have added roughly 100,000 persons a year every year from 2010 until now. Georgia is tiny compared to Montana, like one third the size.

I am not suggesting that you should want to see that sort of population growth, but I have been lead to believe reading here that Montana is being swamped with folks moving in from California and New York and other places, but it does not appear to be true at all.
Click to expand...
That would depend on a person's perspective.
If you watched Andy on Mayberry RFD during the show's first season and tuned in several years later and Mayberry looked like Atlanta then the perspective of the residents changed.

Now, the folks in Prairie County, Montana are probably not feeling the squeeze like the folks around Bozeman, Montana and Yellowstone County, Montana.

Actually I am watching people moving here without a plan and expecting the "Government" to give them food, clothing, shelter, medical care like they were getting in the metro cities.

Buying an average track home that is 25 years old will cost $400k.

IMG_1416.JPG

www.kpax.com

Bozeman School District seeing increase in homeless students

MTN has covered many stories about unhoused adults around Bzoeman, but what resources are available for unhoused students?
www.kpax.com www.kpax.com
www.kpax.com

HRDC: Over 300 unhoused people in Bozeman, new shelter to open in 2025

HRDC Housing Director Brian Guyer says plans are in the works to handle the rising numbers of people needing services in Bozeman.
www.kpax.com www.kpax.com
www.kpax.com

Dane Fletcher, owner of The Pitt in Bozeman says homeless camps out of hand

Bozeman native and former NFL football player Dane Fletcher says homeless camps have gotten out of hand and city leaders need to be held accountable.
www.kpax.com www.kpax.com
 
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