- Thread starter Jakediesel06
- Start date
The first thing that comes to mind for me is to wonder if your Pic rail could be loose? Or something that mounts the scope to the rifle.
I have a Burris pepr quick detach mount. I seems to be tight but I definitely plan on changing the mount when I get another scope.
The horizontal string is probably wind. Get some wind flags.
The vertical string is probably speed of the bullet. get a chronograph.
The vertical string is probably speed of the bullet. get a chronograph.
Do you have a collapsable stock on the gun?
Is there much movement between the upper and lower receivers?
Is there much movement between the upper and lower receivers?
Thud it was a little breezy at only 100yrds wind affect it that much?
ShtrRdy stock isn’t collapsable. Magpul prs. Minimal movement between receiver. Aero precision has an Allen screw that you can adjust to put pressure on take down pin to tighten it up.
ShtrRdy stock isn’t collapsable. Magpul prs. Minimal movement between receiver. Aero precision has an Allen screw that you can adjust to put pressure on take down pin to tighten it up.
Wind will not cause that much horizontal stringing at 100 yards, unless you are shooting in damn near hurricane wind.
Barring some sort of mechanical issue with your rifle, horizontal stringing is caused by poor trigger control, and where you break the shot in conjunction with your breathing cycle can cause vertical stringing.
I would take a look at your fundamentals. Often we like to blame the equipment, when a lot of the times the issue stems from the trigger puller.
Barring some sort of mechanical issue with your rifle, horizontal stringing is caused by poor trigger control, and where you break the shot in conjunction with your breathing cycle can cause vertical stringing.
I would take a look at your fundamentals. Often we like to blame the equipment, when a lot of the times the issue stems from the trigger puller.
A few years back, I had a post on another forum asking to diagnose my issue with a 6.8 SPC upper I had built. Like you mention, I was able to shoot a couple tight shots, then the group would open up. I asked a fellow good shooter to get behind the gun and he put 5 shots down range that measured just over 1/2 inch.
Sometimes we are too smart for our own good; we so badly want a one-hole group and we pay attention to attaining it......instead of sights, trigger, follow-through. That was my problem and my experience.
Lastly, you might put a paper target at 200 or 300 yards or beyond (non-Shoot & See), and focus on executing 5 good shots. You won't be able to see your results and they may surprise you.
Sometimes we are too smart for our own good; we so badly want a one-hole group and we pay attention to attaining it......instead of sights, trigger, follow-through. That was my problem and my experience.
Lastly, you might put a paper target at 200 or 300 yards or beyond (non-Shoot & See), and focus on executing 5 good shots. You won't be able to see your results and they may surprise you.
I was blaming myself and still believe it could be me. Just weird it’s so consistent to me. Is there a certain way you grip the handle and pull trigger to prevent pull. I already try to pull trigger with tip of my finger.
Is this the only rifle that does this? Try having someone else shoot your rifle who you know is a great shot. If the same thing happens to them, it might be the gun.
When I was having issues with vertical groups, it was discover through having another shooter watch me, that I was continually breathing through my trigger press. Once I trained and became better at exploiting my respiratory pause, my vertical group has almost gone away. As far as horizontal, check your parallax.
Gil. P my ar15 .223 seems to have 1 flyer in 5 shot group but the flyer is closer than these.
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Deleted member 10043
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You need to look at the speed of the wind and how it relates to your position. The wind will speed up and slow down and swirl.
One range we shoot at in Texas the wind will move in 2 directions at the same time. Reason it bounces off the different berms and the tree lines.
Yes the wind has a great effect on bullet movement.
Wind in your face will push the bullet down, at your back will raise it up.
Get flags and learn the wind.
One range we shoot at in Texas the wind will move in 2 directions at the same time. Reason it bounces off the different berms and the tree lines.
Yes the wind has a great effect on bullet movement.
Wind in your face will push the bullet down, at your back will raise it up.
Get flags and learn the wind.
Respiratory pause (term used in my training history, possibly different term than you have used), is at the end of your natural exhale. When breathing, your abdomen extends out as you inhale (air fills your lungs) and retracts in as you exhale (air exits your body). At the end of your exhale, your body has a brief amount of time where the muscles responsible for breathing are most at rest (your body is stable). This time is different for each person and different based on how fast you are breathing (are you relaxed or just finishing wind sprints). If you have a string of shots that are standing up and down, it is possible you are breathing during the shot causing your body to go up and down as well as the gun.
Attached is a graph I was able to find quickly to give a visual of this process. Disregard the numbers but the graph demonstrates the period at the end of an exhale in which your body is in a respiratory pause.
Hopefully this helped. If not let me know.
Attachments
Can’t say I do the respiratory pause. Something I will have to try next time.
Are you loading the bipod and is the bipod tight? I had this problem with vertical strings at 100 yards. I had a friend watch me shoot the groups, and he picked that up right away. Now I load the bipod and shoot bugholes.
Bipod is tight. What do you mean load the bipod. Put forward force on it?
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Deleted member 10043
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I second the check your sight rail and scope mount. Make sure everything is rock solid. I blue Locktite mine because it can be a tiny movement that you don't feel or see but it can affect groups in a way that you demonstrated.
Just make sure you don't hold your breath. Oxygen deprivation affects your eye sight first, and it happens only seconds after starting to hold your breath.
I highly recommend taking training classes. The best money I've ever spent on this sport was (and continues to be) training. My knowledge and skillset has exponentially grown since I've taken my first training class at Rifles Only a few years ago.
Sometimes people will say they have flyers, I'm not saying you don't, but it's important to realize that flyers are usually caused by a lack of focus. It's not that easy to maintain focus for 5 shots on paper.
Anyway, listen to what these guys are telling you about your breathing. Always pull the trigger during your natural respiratory pause, don't hold your breath. If the shot doesn't come, breath again and start over.
This is all stuff I’m going to practice for sure. Would you recommend shooting from a prone position like guy in video or does that not make much of a difference and just preference. Thankyou for the replies.
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Deleted member 10043
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You can shoot from bench with a bipod. The same fundamentals apply.
Practice shooting from the prone position, it'll help you practice your recoil management from that position. Once you find your good position with a perfect natural point of aim, you'll really see your groups improve.
When you watch many / most people shoot both prone and from a bench you will note that most show a big variation in the relationship of the shoulders and hips to the rifle at the bench. Many have their weak side shoulder cranked around perpendicular to the rifle on the table top. The relationship of shoulders and hips needs to be same as while prone.
Bi pods hop / reticles don't return to POA b/c linear recoil forces are being met by a body that is askew to the target.
And unless one is shooting a rimfire, "wind" does not factor in at 100 yards.
As stated above, when the bipod hops and reticle doesn’t return to point of aim, there is usually a problem with the position you have built. Get square/straight behind the rifle. Load the bipod consistently.
Additionally, make sure that the butt of the rifle is always in the same “pocket” of your shoulder(up-down and side to side). Most body types have two shoulder pockets in prone and bench shooting positions.
In prone, squaring my elbows to the straight rifle/body line helps me build a consistent position.
Additionally, make sure that the butt of the rifle is always in the same “pocket” of your shoulder(up-down and side to side). Most body types have two shoulder pockets in prone and bench shooting positions.
In prone, squaring my elbows to the straight rifle/body line helps me build a consistent position.
Good advice in this thread. Another thing to pay attention to is your static body position and natural POA. What I mean is that you don't want to have to manipulate the rifle much at all to be on target -- your body position should put the reticle on target with only support of the rifle. If it doesn't, move around until it does. What your feet are doing is also important. I prefer to get as much surface area on the deck as possible. Base out. Stable.
If your using factory ammo, pick one, buy a bunch of the same lot, chronograph the lot. Trying to diagnose groups of 5 different types of ammo isn't going to answer any of your questions.
