500 Jeffery parent case with 338 Lapua rim diameter ?
Been there done that since 2011 .... in 30, 338 & 375 cal
Been there done that since 2011 .... in 30, 338 & 375 cal
- Thread starter Mr.BR
- Start date
I'm finding nothing on either the PGM or VOERE (base or tactical) sites noting offering in .375 Swiss P. Where are you finding that info - and the side-by-side photo you posted? If that is your pic, please measure the diameter of the primer pocket. Given the increase case capacity, I'm guessing they will be using the RUAG/GECO 6.53mm primer. Thanks.
Also, my take...given the .304" difference in case length and the .018" difference in base powder chamber diameter between the .375 CT and the .375 Swiss P, I can see only two reasons why RUAG has pursued this cartridge - (1) magazine fit (hugely reduced cost to deploy), and (2) CheyTac is not "public domain". Petersons's (rendering) of the now MIA .375 CT "CIP" - https://vertassets.blob.core.window...7c-4837-9f62-ce16bb6fc15d/_375__9_5_x_77_.pdf
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I sure magazine compatibility is certainly a factor and not having a cheytac boltface is a plus.
Case capacity doesn’t seem a lot more than 338 lapua so I’d imagine a standard LR primer size.
PGM announced it on the FB page and Voere was touted as offering the chambering in the German article on .375SwissP.
'' The CIP has been listing the .375 Swiss P since May 2018. The full metal jacket version will be available from April 2021, the hard core bullet is expected to be available from the end of 2021. Currently, PGM with the Mini Hecate II and Voere with the X3, X4 and X5 offer the new caliber, and the TTS Xceed is also to be available in .375 Swiss P. For the time being, the .375 Swiss P is intended only for military/LE users.''
Its obvious enough, it's meant for use in existing systems hence limitations on both OAL and case diameter adding more umph without adding to the bulk of the rifle. Side by side pic is from RUAG brochure the other one from an article on case surface effects on bolt thrust and bullet pull out force.
CheyTac is a nonplayer besides mostly building on oversized modified .50BMG sized rifles, there is no standard for ammo let alone a ready supply of ammo made to MIL/LE standards in mil-spec packaging. They had all the time in the world to make it happen ......
.33/37XC kinda demonstrates why Cheytac is a dead end.
Some of the test rifles were PGM Mini Hecate II
Different test batches.
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Hi,
As per RUAG Industry Development Director the primer is RUAG large rifle magnum.
So essentially the 375 Swiss P is manufactured completely in-house at their Thun facility. This facility only manufactures for the RUAG label brand and does not interconnect/overlay any other products from any of the companies under their corporate umbrella.
Also, isn't it Ginex in Bosnia that has the 6.53mm primer and not GECO?
Sincerely,
Theis
As per RUAG Industry Development Director the primer is RUAG large rifle magnum.
So essentially the 375 Swiss P is manufactured completely in-house at their Thun facility. This facility only manufactures for the RUAG label brand and does not interconnect/overlay any other products from any of the companies under their corporate umbrella.
Also, isn't it Ginex in Bosnia that has the 6.53mm primer and not GECO?
Sincerely,
Theis
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My error, there are (as best I know) two suppliers of 6.53 primers, Murom - http://www.mpzflame.ru/production/primers/ and https://www.elr-resources.com/UNIS Ginex 338 LM oversize primers 6,53-0,70-1.pdf
My degenerate self was just thinking about a .338 Ruag...wonder what velocity you could get necking it down or would it be the same as a 338 lapua ackley improved?
Hi,
Get in line at the degenerate checkout lane, lol...
Reamer already in the works, hahahaha
Sincerely,
Theis
Your not alone.
And possibly explore a 35 caliber version with solids?
350 track suit magnum?
This has me rethinking doing any of the XC cartridges. Especially if it can be mag fed.
Hi,
With proper 338 monos it will more than likely be longer than mag length....but getting mono maker to design a specific mono for it
Sincerely,
Theis
Hi,
The "I-dadis" magnum, lolol
Sincerely,
Theis
With a nice positioning in the neck probably a 4.15 OAL with a 285 badlands.Hi,
With proper 338 monos it will more than likely be longer than mag length....but getting mono maker to design a specific mono for it
Sincerely,
Theis
Hi,
The "I-dadis" magnum, lolol
Sincerely,
Theis
Ah...re the discussions about spin-off chamberings using the 375 Swiss case...since this is currently a mil-only product and there is, as best I know, zero commitment from RUAG to sell brass standalone, why the discussion? Pipe dreams?
Theis - to be clear, you have an agreement with RUAG to acquire 375 Swiss brass? For what purpose...for internal use to supply non-375 Swiss cartridge ammo to non-mil/LE customers? To resell that brass into the retail channel, direct or thru resellers? Please clarify for we mere mortals that acquire brass from folks like Grafs. Thanks.
Basic Economics, demand drives supply. Elon has sold almost 1Million cyber trucks(pre-order) with little marketing and not even having a product out yet, and it wont cannibalize other sales. In this case I'd be ditching a heavy single shot .375 cheytac for something i can shoot out my mrad or other .338 caliber rifle. People are always looking for the new hotness. I was contemplating going with a 33xc and 37xc but I'd like to see how this turns out, or if brass is available.
Sooo much more than just "supply and demand"!
In any case, a fairly simple solution is to rebate the rim of Peterson .375 CT brass. Can be done right now, no drama, minimal waiting.
@Geno C. isnt that what the 338 Carnie is with a different shoulder?
Pretty much, yes. You ain’t mag feeding it out of a Lapua mag though.
The case is too big as it is so .5 shorter would be a good thing. Now you’re in the 338 enabler area with a rebated rim. I think that size is about max for current powders and pressures
We need a 338 carnie midget magnum.
I actually have. An idea for that already
Look forward to seeing it!
question...for most poeple not singling you out
why are people so willing/rushing into AI a cartridge before they even saw the original shoot?
if the original cartridge winds up being all a shoulder can handle (just example) for 20 shots a day, why would someone immediate add more powder?
thanks
Looking at this cartridge, it is very close to a AI design except the case taper . Everything i run is on a improved case. Brass growth!!!! The main reason i run all improved cartridges.
This case looks very close to a 375-338 LMAI. Do we have the H2o capacity?
Judging from its performance and case size somewear between 375rum/375-338 lapua improved and 378 weatherby.
105-110 usable?
For the average enthusiast that seems about perfect and should be rather sporty necked down to 338.
Steel head did I hear you say 338 and 110 grains..? I hope capacity is a bit more.
I’m short bus ELR.
I shoot a 4.25” long cartridge out of a short action Nuke.
So measuring last night the 375 Swiss body dimensions are considerably smaller than Geno’s 338 Carnie.
I think that would be a cool base cartridge to shorten enough for Solids in a CIP friendly oal with good case capacity still.
I’m going to measure tonight where 110 grains of N570 ends up in it for powder column height.
It would possibly look like a 25WSSM on steroids.
I may try my hand at making a Rube Goldberg die for it as I have a piece of steel at the shop that would harden up nicely.
I’ll see if Geno has some more smoked cases he’ll send me.
You’ll have to sign a NDA with G&J ultra elite party time ELR enterprises first.
both of them are a day late and a dollar short both Pro and I have made this basic cartridge many years ago and we have the action and detachable mags to feed this with the heavy Badlands and our capacity is aprox the same as the xc case . Our revised virsion is even shorter then the 375 swiss
Hi,
I think some are missing the entire point of the 375 Swiss P....
It is not intended nor marketed as the first xyz.
It is not intended nor marketed as the "greatest" elr cartridge known to man.
What it IS intended and marketed for is increasing the already existing LM weapon systems usability with a FACTORY based ammunition for the mil/leo worlds.
They have never said it is better than the various ELR wildcat cartridges that NO mil/leo entities will ever use anyways.
What can be pretty much guaranteed is that they have more rounds through more barrels in the testing and designing of this cartridge than all the other elr wildcats combined....period. That matters in the real mil/leo world of insurance and liability issues.
Sincerely,
Theis
I think some are missing the entire point of the 375 Swiss P....
It is not intended nor marketed as the first xyz.
It is not intended nor marketed as the "greatest" elr cartridge known to man.
What it IS intended and marketed for is increasing the already existing LM weapon systems usability with a FACTORY based ammunition for the mil/leo worlds.
They have never said it is better than the various ELR wildcat cartridges that NO mil/leo entities will ever use anyways.
What can be pretty much guaranteed is that they have more rounds through more barrels in the testing and designing of this cartridge than all the other elr wildcats combined....period. That matters in the real mil/leo world of insurance and liability issues.
Sincerely,
Theis
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I agree buddy. the only real problem I have when you have an endless supply of Revenue and the equipment to build anything you want why the hell would you ever just basically duplicate what has already been done endless boundaries why not just make it from scratch like nothing else
Think of it from the exact opposite direction...that’s why they have a endless supply of revenue
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