IDPA/USPSA gun? New guy

[FUNCTIONAL]

I realize there are better forums for this but figured I'd start here.

Looking to up my pistol game and get into IDPA and some USPSA matches around me. Rules wise I think it's straight forward but I want to ask here and get opinions on my potential gun selection.

I'm looking to likely pick up a optics ready m&p 2.0 compact and slap a red dot on it to run carry optics. I don't see the compact version on the production gun list (unless I'm missing it, it looks a little confusing) so I'm assuming the carry optics division is the only one I can run with that setup?

Would I be hamstringing myself going with this pistol for any reason? Is the metal version night and day difference? I'm assuming the full size 5" won't buy me much until I have a few years experience under my belt? Size wise my hands are not large and a compact fits me just fine.

For background I have a cz p07 with rmr I can run in the meantime but I really want to get a striker fire as a main. With the 07 listed I can only run carry optics and production correct?

 

[W54/XM-388]

Have you looked at the Walther PDP Match and PDP Match metal frame?
Some folks also really love the CZ-P10 optics ready

 

[davsco]

with an optic you really don't need a long barrel for the sight radius, but the extra weight does help mitigate recoil/jump, vs some sort of compact.

i'd do a few matches with what you have (when registering they will let you know the best division for that gun etc) and use that time to scope out what everyone is using. most will let you fondle their guns and even shoot some after the match.

 

[ECK]

I always advocate running the gun you have and then check out what others are using at a match. Most guys will let you check out their gun, and may even let you shoot it. It may change your mind.

Your CZ P-07 is fine in USPSA Carry Optics division with optic, or in Production or Limited without optic. Carry Optics and Limited allow mag extensions up to a total length of 141.25mm, so basically a +5 or +6 extension and with the right mag follower and springs you should be able to get 23 rnd in the mag. Production capacity was increased to 15 rnds at the end of January.

Strong side or appendix holster (no crossdraw, SOB, or shoulder holsters), 3 mags if CO or Limited division, 4 mags if Production. Eye and ear pro, a few mag pouches, 150-200 rnds of ammo, and you’re ready to rock.

I don’t really have an opinion on the M&P 2.0, sure why not if you want one. You have to make minor PF at a minimum (125,000), and some factory ammo doesn’t make minor PF out of compact barrels. So there is some advantage with the 5” models. There is a M&P 9mm 4” or the M&P 2.0 4.25” barrel listed on the USPSA Production list. What’s barrel on the M&P 2.0 Compact?

 

[Modoc]

^^^^^^. This!

I went down this rabbit hole a few years ago. Run what you brung and ask plenty of questions. Lol! I’m still running my old slab side 1911, but converted it to 9mm/38 Super. Still a middle “D” Class shooter in Single Stack, but go to relax and keep the skills up. Plus I’m not running that match.

 

[SanPatHogger]

A guy I shoot with bought tyhe M+P metal and said he hated it. He said he didn't put a whole magazine through it. It's on consignment at the gun store he bought it at. I never handled it.

I also say run what you have. Buy more ammo and shoot the hell out of it.

 

[knuckleballz]

I showed up to shoot production with an m&p 9 gen 1 and was scoffed at.... until I was winning production each week and outshooting guys running open guns. That pissed some guys off and I got some hate. Spend your time practicing mag changes, drawing and getting a good grip, and dry firing. Thats all i did. I got tired of the egos, politics, and had my fill after 2 years. Hope you will find a good group to shoot with and have a good experience. I even ran a cheap serpa 2 retension holster because thats what I wore when I bow hunted and fished with in bear country and wanted to be proficient with.

 

[308pirate]

.Spend your time practicing mag changes, drawing and getting a good grip, and dry firing. Thats all i did.

+1

I got tired of the egos, politics, and had my fill after 2 years.

Winning is the best revenge

 

[308pirate]

Looking to up my pistol game and get into IDPA and some USPSA matches around me.

Fuck IDPA. It's bush league. Go to USPSA and don't waste your time elsewhere.

I'm looking to likely pick up a optics ready m&p 2.0 compact and slap a red dot on it to run carry optics.

You'll do fine. Polymer pistols are absolutely competitive.

I don't see the compact version on the production gun list (unless I'm missing it, it looks a little confusing) so I'm assuming the carry optics division is the only one I can run with that setup?

It is confusing but if you email USPSA NROI they will confirm the M&P 2.0 Compact is in the Production list regardless of barrel length. Regardless, handguns approved for USPSA Carry Optics MUST be in the Production approval list. See USPSA Handgun Rules Appendix D7 Special Condition 1.

Also, external magwells are absolutely not allowed in either Production or Carry Optics even if they came with the gun. You have to take it off. If you want to use a magwell you can do so in Limited division (with iron sights), in Limited Optics division (must have a slide mounted optic) or Open division (anything goes).

Would I be hamstringing myself going with this pistol for any reason?

No.

Is the metal version night and day difference?

It's a waste of money. The metal is aluminum, not steel, so there is virtually no difference in weight compared to the plastic version.

I'm assuming the full size 5" won't buy me much until I have a few years experience under my belt?

The 5" won't gain you anything at all, ever, if all you shoot is carry optics.

Size wise my hands are not large and a compact fits me just fine.

The girth/circumference of all M&P2.0 grips is the same regardless of how long they are.

With the 07 listed I can only run carry optics and production correct?

No. You can shoot it in any handgun division except single stack and revolver. However, CO and Production are where it is most competitive.

The absolute biggest mistake noobs make in USPSA is obsessing on the gear and on fast splits and forgetting the fact that the overwhelming majority of your time gains (and hence score gains) is going to come from efficient stage plans and efficient movement. The second biggest time gain will come from shooting sooner instead of faster (transitioning sooner, shooting while entering a position, shooting your way out of a position)

Compare these two side by side on the same stage and notice the difference between an efficient stage plan executed without hesitation and a choppy, clunky, poorly executed one.




If you put in the work both physically and mentally you will be amazed at what you can do with a pistol.

 

[308pirate]

Some folks also really love the CZ-P10 optics ready

Yep. Made both A and M class and shot my second GM-level classifier (97%) with an F. Carry a C every day.

 

[308pirate]

For background I have a cz p07 with rmr I can run in the meantime

Just use that for now.

Use whatever holster you have for it, even if it's IWB.

If you have only 15 round magazines for it, you'll want four on you. Three on the belt (any mag pouch will do for now) and one in your back pocket to load the pistol at make ready.

How familiar are you with administrative gun handling rules of USPSA? There are some rules that you may not be familiar with and violating them will get you disqualified before you even begin. Do not assume it's like rifle matches or your regular day at the range.

 

[Cascade Hemi]

I started shooting IDPA with a 1st gen M&P in the mid 00's. The gun won't hold you back. If I were buying a new rig today for USPSA CO, I would choose a different gun. I would not choose a different gun until I had a year or two of experience (along the line of what pirate said). I have a bunch of guns I set up for different USPSA divisions, they early ones I would do differently today.

 

[308pirate]

I started shooting IDPA with a 1st gen M&P in the mid 00's. The gun won't hold you back. If I were buying a new rig today for USPSA CO, I would choose a different gun. I would not choose a different gun until I had a year or two of experience (along the line of what pirate said). I have a bunch of guns I set up for different USPSA divisions, they early ones I would do differently today.

There are some legit GMs in my area that are killing it with plain M&Ps with a few minor Apex upgrades.

Brantley Merriam (nationals level GM) switched from a Shadow 2 to a nearly bone stock Glock 17 late last year and it is not holding him back at all.

Even a hack like me made it to M with a lightly modded P-10F, and will likely make GM with it too.

 

[Cascade Hemi]

There are some legit GMs in my area that are killing it with plain M&Ps with a few minor Apex upgrades.

Brantley Merriam (nationals level GM) switched from a Shadow 2 to a nearly bone stock Glock 17 late last year and it is not holding him back at all.

Even a hack like me made it to M with a lightly modded P-10F, and will likely make GM with it too.

I have no doubt. The gun is not the determining factor.

 

[FUNCTIONAL]

I have no doubt. The gun is not the determining factor.

But youtube tells me the gun is the only thing that matters?

I appreciate the advice from all of you. Good to know the m&p compact is on the list also. I'm going to try to refrain from purchasing before getting a match or 2 under my belt. I shoot my shield probably the best of any gun I own and the 2.0 feels great in the hand. Was hoping it shot as well for me as the shield plus.

I didn't know I could run an appendix holster though... guess I should read the rules more.

Really just want to use these matches to push myself and get better at pistol shooting. Same reason I got into matches before the prs was even a thing though and that took me down a deep rabbit hole for many years.

 

[ECK]

But youtube tells me the gun is the only thing that matters?

I appreciate the advice from all of you. Good to know the m&p compact is on the list also. I'm going to try to refrain from purchasing before getting a match or 2 under my belt. I shoot my shield probably the best of any gun I own and the 2.0 feels great in the hand. Was hoping it shot as well for me as the shield plus.

I didn't know I could run an appendix holster though... guess I should read the rules more.

Really just want to use these matches to push myself and get better at pistol shooting. Same reason I got into matches before the prs was even a thing though and that took me down a deep rabbit hole for many years.

I shot a 1911 for the first couple of years. A) it was the gun(s) I had, B) shooting a 1911 was second nature to me. But eventually the urge to move towards hi-cap and more racy guns kicked in. Fast forward 15+ yrs and old eyes caught up to me, and now I have to shoot red dot guns by default. Being that you’re new-ish to pistol comp shooting, shoot the gun you are most familiar with. There’ll be enough “new” things to learn in the beginning, so a gun you know is one less thing to worry about.

Yep, AIWB was authorized a couple years ago. The rules don’t specifically say AIWB, but they got rid of the rule that said holster and mag pouches must be behind the hipbone for a few divisions. A few people run AIWB but the vast majority (99.9%) run OWB on the strongside. For OWB you can run a dropped and offset holster (most do) but the holster must position the gun so the butt of the gun is level or above the top of belt, and the grip can only be the width of a credit card distanced from the outside of the belt in Production and Carry Optics divisions. For Limited and Limited Optics, it can be the long way of a credit card distance from the belt.

Shooting comp (any IMO) will improve your pistol shooting, gun handling, and gun safety. I don’t plink anymore since I started USPSA. Now most of my pistol range time is practicing for USPSA matches (shooting at speed, shooting on the move, reload while moving, one-handed, getting in and out of position, awkward leans…etc.). This is a rabbit hole that is only as deep as you make it. You can just go and shoot matches and have fun (majority of people), or you can chase classifications and higher finishes at major matches (I used to, but less so now).

As far as what kind of matches, try them all. You may find you like IDPA (I’m lukewarm on IDPA but I shoot a match or two every year with my EDC gun and gear) and mainly shoot USPSA the rest of the time. I may dabble in a Steel Challenge match now and then if there’s no other match to shoot at. But just like PRS, you get out of it what you put in. Dryfire and livefire practice, strategize the stage, keeping your wits about you on the clock…. One big diff from PRS, USPSA is hit factor scoring instead of 10-12 rnds in 90 secs. Your score in USPSA is your points divided by your time. It’s kind of like the tie breaker stages in PRS where it benefits you to be fast. In USPSA hit factor scoring, he who has the most A-zone hits in the least amount of time wins. So speed (and accuracy) is key.

 

[308pirate]

guess I should read the rules more.

I strongly suggest reading sections 10.3, 10.4, and 10.5 first.

 

[308pirate]

I don’t plink anymore since I started USPSA. Now most of my pistol range time is practicing for USPSA matches (shooting at speed, shooting on the move, reload while moving, one-handed, getting in and out of position, awkward leans…etc.). This is a rabbit hole that is only as deep as you make it.

QFTMFT

And to be honest, while I still do in live fire most of what you describe, about 85% of my live fire practice is three drills: doubles, practical accuracy, and the accelerator.

 

[ECK]

For background I have a cz p07 with rmr I can run in the meantime but I really want to get a striker fire as a main. With the 07 listed I can only run carry optics and production correct?

One thing to mention: When you shoot a P-07 in Production or Carry Optics divisions, the rules say DA/SA guns must start with the hammer down in DA mode. If you shoot it in Limited or Limited Optics you can start in SA mode with the hammer back but the thumb safety must be on. But if your P-07 is setup with the decocker instead of the manual safety (Omega trigger system gives you the option, right?) then you have to decock the hammer before you holster it. In this instance, striker fired guns are simpler manual of arms. I mainly shoot a Shadow 2 these days and manually decock the hammer which is no big deal if you do it a lot.

I think IPSC has a rule about the first trigger pull on a DA/SA gun must be 5 lbs or more, thereafter the subsequent SA pulls can be any weight. But a striker fired guns must have at least a 3 lb trigger pull. For this reason, DA/SA guns like the Shadow 2, SP-01 Shadow, or Tangfolio Stock 2 etc. are more popular in IPSC than striker fired guns. Fortunately in USPSA we don’t have a minimum trigger pull weight, hence striker fired guns are more common here, plus there’s Nils with his Canik, Mason Lane with his Sig 320, Vogel with his Glock, et.al. rocking striker fired guns and doing quite well.

 

[JGunns]

Saw a USPSA thread and got excited. Thought I’d come offer my advice not knowing there’d be so many others, which is awesome. Don’t get too caught up on gun selection. I made GM with a stock Glock 34 with an SRO in carry optics a couple years ago. You can be very competitive with stock guns. My friend Hunter Constantine shoots M&Ps and does very very well with them.

OP where are you located?

 

[CK1.0]

I used to shoot a lot of IDPA/USPSA and at different points was pretty good... until I started getting old and slow along with having less free time and picking up the bolt-gun habit. I still try to shoot a USPSA match or 2 every year, but I go just hoping to burn a stage or two down, I know I'm not in danger of winning anything anymore lol.

The biggest thing is time, mostly time for dry-fire, but also practice getting in and out of positions, the gun almost doesn't even matter as long as it runs without fucking up (because your time and gas back and forth to the range and matches adds up).

I have more than a few cool "game guns" I've put together over the years: full Cajun S2 w/ SRO and brass LOK grips for CO, STI 1911/2011's for SS/Limited, etc, but my favorite is probably my near-stock, beautifully boring, Glock 17 Gen3 that's literally seen tens of thousands of rounds...

Remember, it's the Indian, not the arrow.

 

[FUNCTIONAL]

Saw a USPSA thread and got excited. Thought I’d come offer my advice not knowing there’d be so many others, which is awesome. Don’t get too caught up on gun selection. I made GM with a stock Glock 34 with an SRO in carry optics a couple years ago. You can be very competitive with stock guns. My friend Hunter Constantine shoots M&Ps and does very very well with them.

OP where are you located?

Yea I gotta say I wasn't expecting the amount of great info I've gotten in here haha.

I'm just a little east of Raleigh NC. Good amount of steel challenge and uspsa matches with a few idpa sprinkled here and there.