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Spotting Nation State/Agitator Accounts

The King

Back to the Range
Banned !
Minuteman
  • Sep 17, 2004
    2,935
    4,932
    Florence, CO
    I wanted to toss out a little bit of Cyber Warfare information here so that our members can be more informed and vigilant regarding Nation State/Agitator accounts.

    Being aware will allow us to not engage unnecessarily, and reduce the overall divisiveness and anger that are beginning to permeate gun boards across the spectrum.

    How Attackers Operate
    Cyber attacks on an information medium such as this site come in 3 different tiers of sophistication.

    -Amateur
    1. This attacker is the typical uninformed visitor from the opposite idealogical alignment.
    2. They are here mostly to stir things up, confirm their opinions of the evil nature of the people they consider the baddies, and achieve a catharsis by jousting on the internet with their foes.
    3. TTP's include accounts with recent join dates, immediate engagement in mostly controversial topics, and low-information attacks that follow the typical Logical Fallacy chain.
    4. These attackers are low risk, and mostly only serve to slightly increase the tension on Social Media.
    5. Amateur attackers will generally stick to the opposing talking points and have very low information responses outside of them.
    -Professional
    1. Professionals are using a greater skillset and technology support structure to create the maximal desired effect within the minimal budgetary envelope.
    2. A professional attacker will generally have a well defined script they are following, immediately search for these controversial topics and begin engaging, and will frequently take EITHER the most supportive or inflammatory positions possible depending on who paid them for what reason.
    3. Accounts used to by Professionals will be short lived, but more sophisticated than the blatant shill accounts used by the Amateur. These accounts may have a join date of several years ago, but are mostly abandoned by their owners.
    4. Professionals take over accounts by using a technology called Credential Stuffing. Credential Stuffing allows the attacker to use passwords that were stolen from major data breaches to access systems that weren't part of the original hack.
    5. Highly active users are less susceptible to Credential Stuffing as they will reset their password quickly if their account begins posting nonsense on the forum.
    6. Professionals can be in the employ of private political organizations, politicians, companies, or Nation State actors.
    7. Highly professional organizations will have a psychologist design their script to create maximum damage.
    8. Professional campaigns are able to be spotted most effectively by analyzing a users post history for primarily low non-propaganda participation, or the reactivation of an abandoned account.
    9. Most professional agitators will have an extreme opinion that they are more than happy to interject with, despite the fact that no person who actually held such an opinion would say so publicly or likely be a member of the site in question.
    -Nation State
    1. Nation State actors exist on todays Social Media spectrum in almost all instances, and will represent the Cyber Combatants from both sides.
    2. Effective Nation State operations can weaken civil unity, discredit legitimate government interests, damage economies and infrastructures, and destroy beneficial social structures like institutional trust, family dynamics, and morality/ethics.
    3. Nation State actors combine Professional paid engagements for deniability with dedicated full time resources that are working to achieve their Cyber Goals.
    4. A Nation State actor is part of an overall strategy to create the effects listed in part 2 of this subsection, and has substantial financial, technical, and planning support to achieve their goals.
    5. Almost all NS influence operations are supported by dedicated psychologists/propagandists and computer infrastructure designed to measure and multiply the damage caused by the enemy.
    6. Spotting NS actors is extremely difficult - skilled operatives will appear to be precisely what they claim to be, and a combination of long-running strategy and the full time employment aspect of the job allow them to create convincing cyber profiles that can span for years.
    7. Nation State actors will generally speak flawless English, and immediately respond properly to the different branches of conversation they wish to influence.
    8. The best way to spot and mitigate damage from NS operatives is to identify likely narratives and TTP's and assume even in the absence of evidence that these campaigns are underway.
    Examples From Recent Threads
    These are some of the example narratives from recent threads that seem to match active campaigns, with the possible campaign identified:
    • Statements that any person in the US capitol was a traitor and should have been/be executed (weakens institutional trust, furthers US Civil War)
    • Statements that police should be defunded and replaced with a Federal local police force (weakens institutional trust, strengthens central government activities, furthers US Civil War)
    • Statements that socialism is the only possible solution to our societal ills (support for Communism/greater government control, greater acceptance of China)
    • Racism/Sexism/Religious Persecution (destroys civil unity and justifies narratives around reparations and racist behaviors towards the majority, enrichment of racial propagandists, strengthening of Democratic narratives)
    • Ukranian Corruption Scandal (Narrative is being magnified to reduce public interest in intervening in Ukraine/Russia Affairs)
    • Higher incidence of extreme hostility from accounts that identify as Australian (likely next Chinese target after Taiwan, meant to destroy Western civil unity)
    Authors Note
    I look forward to the day that the majority of social media posts and traffic is strictly manipulative in nature.
     
    I believe I've recognized posts fitting these descriptions. Some are obvious, others just suspicious. It's interesting to see how well the conversations are sometimes manipulated. It's like the forum has been studied enough to know exactly what strings to pull to get certain reactions from well known members. It's certainly known what buttons to push on whom.
     
    • Like
    Reactions: BLKWLFK9
    It’s also a convenient excuse to use against anyone with a different opinion than you.
    Pro-tip.

    If what you post looks EXACTLY like everything that China would post in an effort to utterly destroy our nation, you should be concerned about how you view things.

    Or you should ask for a raise because you are nailing your workplace obligations.
     
    It’s also a convenient excuse to use against anyone with a different opinion than you.
    🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

    Funny you should say that huh? Let’s see then, shall we?

    - account created in 2013, but not used since then, check

    - show back up in March 2021 as “same guy”, check

    - only posts in the Bear Pit, check

    - single inflammatory posts interjected into conversations to provoke reactions, check

    - obviously an agitator with no redeeming value added to the site, check

    If it looks like shit, smells like shit and talks shit, well guess what?
     
    A brief analysis - thank you for stopping in here to help drive this discussion. Is it Fyodor, or Chen?

    At any rate - John Holmes joined in 2013. Nice long account lifetime - and has posted on average 8 or fewer posts a year.

    Of those posts, the majority were very early in his posting career and technical in nature. This is a common pattern for soon to be abandoned accounts. There were additional posts in 2019 of a technical nature.

    This account then immediately switches to political activity of an extreme nature and participates more than ever in recent discussions. Discussions all centered around a key narrative campaign currently underway.

    In responding to this post, this account notes correctly that yelling "CONSPIRACY!" is somewhat like yelling "RACISM!" It can be used to silence your opposition.

    That said - when there IS CONSPIRACY! or RACISM! we have a duty to call it out. The preponderance of evidence in the case of this account is that it is a Professional Agitator.
    You make me laugh dude 😘
     
    🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

    Funny you should say that huh? Let’s see then, shall we?

    - account created in 2013, but not used since then, check

    - show back up in March 2021 as “same guy”, check

    - only posts in the Bear Pit, check

    - single inflammatory posts interjected into conversations to provoke reactions, check

    - obviously an agitator with no redeeming value added to the site, check
    I could have just held my tongue lol.
     
    That article sounds like to was written by one.

    Open debate is what this nation was founded on, a solid idea will stand on its own merits without forcing silence from the other side (which is also a pillar of fascism, forceful silencing of opposition).

    Example, someone with a honestly shit idea, in a open dialogue that others witness, if anything it’s going to highlight all the ways said shit idea, is...well a shit idea.

    But who knows, maybe I’m one of those russian sex bots the TV warns about lol
     
    • Like
    Reactions: John holmes
    🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

    Funny you should say that huh? Let’s see then, shall we?

    - account created in 2013, but not used since then, check

    - show back up in March 2021 as “same guy”, check

    - only posts in the Bear Pit, check

    - single inflammatory posts interjected into conversations to provoke reactions, check

    - obviously an agitator with no redeeming value added to the site, check

    If it looks like shit, smells like shit and talks shit, well guess what?
     
    As do I. It does get to a point where people who come here to read or talk about shooting get sick and tired of reading the conspiracy crap. Eventually some of us may decide to speak up.
    When I find a website that spouts leftist BS, I don't waste my time trying to change someone's mind or engage in douche nozzle chatter with them. Why would you want to spend time on this site with a bunch of neanderthals like us? If you were contributing to a conversation with facts instead of just taking a contrary opinion, some may want to at least engage.
    Go to one of the other sections and give us your knowledge on optics or reloading. I looked to see your history since coming back in March. Your true stripes are showing Johnny....
     
    As do I. It does get to a point where people who come here to read or talk about shooting get sick and tired of reading the conspiracy crap. Eventually some of us may decide to speak up.
    The conspiracy crap.

    Made up by right wing nutters on Snipershide:


    OR - in every news media arm, professional trade journal, aaand in all the briefings on Cyber Warfare.

    If you don’t think that one of the top shooting websites on the internet isn’t part of the battleground you are officially an idiot.

    And I’m willing to concede that some of you may very well be exactly that dumb.
     
    • Like
    Reactions: armorpl8chikn
    3B66DEEC-9DD0-476D-AF95-D2D376A32386.gif
     
    Seriously do you guys have nothing to do but sit around and think about this stuff? It’s pretty over the top. Just because someone doesn’t post enough to meet your standards does not mean they are an ‘actor’ from China.
    Weird.
    People who don't think about what they are reading and who might be injecting said ideas into a conversation aren't a net benefit to society.

    You chose 3 and a half months to show up here after the fact and immediately asshammer the most extreme opinion of the events that is physically possible. This opinion could become a leading cause of Civil War 2. Your attitude towards being called out on it is dismissive, deflective, and low/no information.

    To summarize, you did exactly what known disinformation agitator accounts did down to the T. Including/especially your response.
     
    As do I. It does get to a point where people who come here to read or talk about shooting get sick and tired of reading the conspiracy crap. Eventually some of us may decide to speak up.
    If you want to talk about shooting there are a lot of threads dedicated to that. Teh Bear Pit, not so much. If the dialogue bothers you stick to the shooting threads.
     
    • Like
    Reactions: camocorvette
    Actually “King” I was responding to a current thread. The fact is anyone who says anything contrary to a certain agenda on here is instantly called a commie or a Biden dick sucker. Sure seems like American ideal the fathers were hoping we would have.
    Ohhh and Keep your bullshit civil war comments to yourself please.
    Propaganda analysis:

    17.1.a Personal attack, name calling.
    22.4.d Justification of ultra-extreme statements by recasting reasonable discourse as an "agenda."
    4.2.a Appeal to traditionalism or nationalist imagery.
    2.1.a Deflection of recognition of actual narrative goal being advanced.

    The main reason I'm writing more here recently is because we have been trained BY the agitators in how we respond to others. This is called behavioral recruitment, and both the ideas and the techniques follow us in our online discourse.

    Recruitment is highly dangerous in that the quality of discourse is destroyed and reasonable discourse is key to a healthy civilization.
     
    Last edited:
    When I find a website that spouts leftist BS, I don't waste my time trying to change someone's mind or engage in douche nozzle chatter with them. Why would you want to spend time on this site with a bunch of neanderthals like us? If you were contributing to a conversation with facts instead of just taking a contrary opinion, some may want to at least engage.
    Go to one of the other sections and give us your knowledge on optics or reloading. I looked to see your history since coming back in March. Your true stripes are showing Johnny....

    Isn’t open debate fun? I like it, it’s sharpens ones mental blade.

    Even if it’s a really obvious point I’ll debate it within reason, look at it like this, if you hit a plate at 800yrds, why do you bother shooting at plates inside of 800yrds too? Because it’s fun, and more trigger time is more better.

    Same with debating statists, they might just be a 200yrd target, but I’m still gonna send it :)
    And just maybe I’ll luck out and win a heart or mind along the way
     
    • Like
    Reactions: John holmes
    🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

    Funny you should say that huh? Let’s see then, shall we?

    - account created in 2013, but not used since then, check

    - show back up in March 2021 as “same guy”, check

    - only posts in the Bear Pit, check

    - single inflammatory posts interjected into conversations to provoke reactions, check

    - obviously an agitator with no redeeming value added to the site, check

    If it looks like shit, smells like shit and talks shit, well guess what?
    giphy.gif
     
    I wanted to toss out a little bit of Cyber Warfare information here so that our members can be more informed and vigilant regarding Nation State/Agitator accounts.

    Being aware will allow us to not engage unnecessarily, and reduce the overall divisiveness and anger that are beginning to permeate gun boards across the spectrum.

    How Attackers Operate
    Cyber attacks on an information medium such as this site come in 3 different tiers of sophistication.

    -Amateur
    1. This attacker is the typical uninformed visitor from the opposite idealogical alignment.
    2. They are here mostly to stir things up, confirm their opinions of the evil nature of the people they consider the baddies, and achieve a catharsis by jousting on the internet with their foes.
    3. TTP's include accounts with recent join dates, immediate engagement in mostly controversial topics, and low-information attacks that follow the typical Logical Fallacy chain.
    4. These attackers are low risk, and mostly only serve to slightly increase the tension on Social Media.
    5. Amateur attackers will generally stick to the opposing talking points and have very low information responses outside of them.
    -Professional
    1. Professionals are using a greater skillset and technology support structure to create the maximal desired effect within the minimal budgetary envelope.
    2. A professional attacker will generally have a well defined script they are following, immediately search for these controversial topics and begin engaging, and will frequently take EITHER the most supportive or inflammatory positions possible depending on who paid them for what reason.
    3. Accounts used to by Professionals will be short lived, but more sophisticated than the blatant shill accounts used by the Amateur. These accounts may have a join date of several years ago, but are mostly abandoned by their owners.
    4. Professionals take over accounts by using a technology called Credential Stuffing. Credential Stuffing allows the attacker to use passwords that were stolen from major data breaches to access systems that weren't part of the original hack.
    5. Highly active users are less susceptible to Credential Stuffing as they will reset their password quickly if their account begins posting nonsense on the forum.
    6. Professionals can be in the employ of private political organizations, politicians, companies, or Nation State actors.
    7. Highly professional organizations will have a psychologist design their script to create maximum damage.
    8. Professional campaigns are able to be spotted most effectively by analyzing a users post history for primarily low non-propaganda participation, or the reactivation of an abandoned account.
    9. Most professional agitators will have an extreme opinion that they are more than happy to interject with, despite the fact that no person who actually held such an opinion would say so publicly or likely be a member of the site in question.
    -Nation State
    1. Nation State actors exist on todays Social Media spectrum in almost all instances, and will represent the Cyber Combatants from both sides.
    2. Effective Nation State operations can weaken civil unity, discredit legitimate government interests, damage economies and infrastructures, and destroy beneficial social structures like institutional trust, family dynamics, and morality/ethics.
    3. Nation State actors combine Professional paid engagements for deniability with dedicated full time resources that are working to achieve their Cyber Goals.
    4. A Nation State actor is part of an overall strategy to create the effects listed in part 2 of this subsection, and has substantial financial, technical, and planning support to achieve their goals.
    5. Almost all NS influence operations are supported by dedicated psychologists/propagandists and computer infrastructure designed to measure and multiply the damage caused by the enemy.
    6. Spotting NS actors is extremely difficult - skilled operatives will appear to be precisely what they claim to be, and a combination of long-running strategy and the full time employment aspect of the job allow them to create convincing cyber profiles that can span for years.
    7. Nation State actors will generally speak flawless English, and immediately respond properly to the different branches of conversation they wish to influence.
    8. The best way to spot and mitigate damage from NS operatives is to identify likely narratives and TTP's and assume even in the absence of evidence that these campaigns are underway.
    Examples From Recent Threads
    These are some of the example narratives from recent threads that seem to match active campaigns, with the possible campaign identified:
    • Statements that any person in the US capitol was a traitor and should have been/be executed (weakens institutional trust, furthers US Civil War)
    • Statements that police should be defunded and replaced with a Federal local police force (weakens institutional trust, strengthens central government activities, furthers US Civil War)
    • Statements that socialism is the only possible solution to our societal ills (support for Communism/greater government control, greater acceptance of China)
    • Racism/Sexism/Religious Persecution (destroys civil unity and justifies narratives around reparations and racist behaviors towards the majority, enrichment of racial propagandists, strengthening of Democratic narratives)
    • Ukranian Corruption Scandal (Narrative is being magnified to reduce public interest in intervening in Ukraine/Russia Affairs)
    • Higher incidence of extreme hostility from accounts that identify as Australian (likely next Chinese target after Taiwan, meant to destroy Western civil unity)
    Authors Note
    I look forward to the day that the majority of social media posts and traffic is strictly manipulative in nature.
    giphy.gif
     
    Isn’t open debate fun? I like it, it’s sharpens ones mental blade.

    Even if it’s a really obvious point I’ll debate it within reason, look at it like this, if you hit a plate at 800yrds, why do you bother shooting at plates inside of 800yrds too? Because it’s fun, and more trigger time is more better.

    Same with debating statists, they might just be a 200yrd target, but I’m still gonna send it :)
    And just maybe I’ll luck out and win a heart or mind along the way
    I have several family members that are on the "left side" of the isle that I will spend hours engaged in conversation with on subjects we seldom agree on. It is good to not be 24/7 in an "echo chamber", and at least hear what others think. I don't need it while on this site however. Especially when it is someone that is here just to stir up shit.
    Cheers
     
    I have several family members that are on the "left side" of the isle that I will spend hours engaged in conversation with on subjects we seldom agree on. It is good to not be 24/7 in an "echo chamber", and at least hear what others think. I don't need it while on this site however. Especially when it is someone that is here just to stir up shit.
    Cheers
    I strongly agree with that - in fact I would say the most disappointing thing for me in the modern era is that the Left and the Right divided up the American Dream and each ran off with large chunks of it.

    And you pretty much can't get the full experience of living in a free, moral, and prosperous country if you take either of their sides. The ultra left is run by asshole statists who think the Capitol protestors should have been shot and the ultra right is full of racist homophobic statist douchebags.

    And they are in control of the narrative.
     
    Isn’t open debate fun? I like it, it’s sharpens ones mental blade.

    Even if it’s a really obvious point I’ll debate it within reason, look at it like this, if you hit a plate at 800yrds, why do you bother shooting at plates inside of 800yrds too? Because it’s fun, and more trigger time is more better.

    Same with debating statists, they might just be a 200yrd target, but I’m still gonna send it :)
    And just maybe I’ll luck out and win a heart or mind along the way
    So, you cant just flip and flop and say i was just playing devils advocate when you are wrong or proved to be an idiot. Your argument is "i have no spine and that makes me smarter". Im argumenative, and wrong alot too, i take a stance though on what i feel is right or wrong. I take my ass whoopins like a man and try not to gloat too much in victory... how does it feel to argue so much that you forget who you really are?
     
    • Haha
    Reactions: Threadcutter308
    I strongly agree with that - in fact I would say the most disappointing thing for me in the modern era is that the Left and the Right divided up the American Dream and each ran off with large chunks of it.

    And you pretty much can't get the full experience of living in a free, moral, and prosperous country if you take either of their sides. The ultra left is run by asshole statists who think the Capitol protestors should have been shot and the ultra right is full of racist homophobic statist douchebags.

    And they are in control of the narrative.
    See, this is where I disagree. I don’t think we are full of racist homophobic people. I think the left tells everybody that we are. Projection. I think the left is more full of racist and homophobic people than the right. But here we are arguing because we’ve been programmed too.
     
    So, you cant just flip and flop and say i was just playing devils advocate when you are wrong or proved to be an idiot. Your argument is "i have no spine and that makes me smarter". Im argumenative, and wrong alot too, i take a stance though on what i feel is right or wrong. I take my ass whoopins like a man and try not to gloat too much in victory... how does it feel to argue so much that you forget who you really are?

    If that was a question to me, I’m pretty consistent, I’m no statist, never claimed to be, don’t want to be, nope.

    Have noticed some folks who won’t point counter point, they just call names, that does get annoying
     
    • Like
    Reactions: John holmes

    Always just viewed socialism as the sales pitch for communism, socialism is like all the great ideas the left side has, they are really good ideas, minus the minor detail of how they don’t work in the real world, unless you use force, tons of force from a massive government, which turns the beautiful love fest of image of socialism, into just another pumpkin spice basic version communism.

    Thomas Sowell has some good talks on this.

    Always just scratched my head, but many people are dumb, as in if no one told them not to they’d probably try to eat their own poo, same reason marketing people get paid to tell others what to buy, only reason they are paid so well is it actually works on most people. Go figure
     
    Last edited:
    You are the very POS this article is intended to expose.

    Just curious, do you have friends that like to act like spidermen, I mean spiderpersons?
    To be honest, it was reading his posts that prompted me to put this out there.

    But it wasn't his posts, it was the 50 other accounts I had seen where when I moused over people spouting the most insane shit they were all a few years old but had 10 posts. It helped me put this with other data I see off forum and get this pumped out there.
     
    Thanks Maggot I do appreciate your post.


    King left off the part about agitators, and how they'll seek to build alliances with the resident felons and misfits... Those that "don't belong", but, nevertheless, stick around anyway...

    Next thing we know, you'll be posting pictures of your piss-stained diapers and tagging @Maser.

    God damn, I'm gonna have to speak to your manager. You have fucked this whole thing all the way up.