moa vs mils, the forbidden thread

[Aftermath]

C'mon fellas....
It's fucking July.
You are supposed to have all this MILOA crap out of your system during the month of February.
Fucking rookies...
Or maybe your niece is a high end hostess somewhere doing sexual deviation trainings.

 

[Dead Eye Dick]

In a more serious line of thought. Depending on the situation, one is better than the other. (And vice versa).

In bench rest, where the smallest of measurements are necessary to get exactly on targert, the one tenths click of the MOA is much finer than the MIL clicks. Advantage MOA

In Precision Rifle, either will work equally well, except, MIL is the standard that virtually everyone uses, so that one advantage, being able to discuss distances and scope settings, in an apple to apple manner gives MIL the advantage.

In hunting, I use MOA but I could use MIL, As getting a clean kill is more important than bragging rights, I limit the distance of my shots, to virtual point blank range (250 yards with a fast .25-06 round). So, after rifle is sighted at 200 yards, that’s it for me, I leave the scope alone.

 

[cuirc]

The MOA is the imperial system where the mil is a metric system one is the same as the other except the base for the calculation is minuets of an angle where the mil, a metric system, is based on radians, as far as going from 100 yards to ant further distance the are the same. the difficulty comes in the dial for elevation it is hard be to be exact in the mil because of graduations. A MOA at 100 yards is 1 inch a mil at 100 yards is something like .33 inches scopes are not graduated for this;.
Both the MOA and the MIL are not different at 1000 yards or any distance. What is boils down to is preference.
The military uses MILs. Many shooters are use to that. I have scopes graduated in both MOA and MIL so that i maintain comfort with both. The difference between them is not large enough to be an obsticle.

 

[cuirc]

C'mon fellas....
It's fucking July.
You are supposed to have all this MILOA crap out of your system during the month of February.
Fucking rookies...
Or maybe your niece is a high end hostess somewhere doing sexual deviation trainings.

If your going to use the F bomb discuss this is the bear pit

 

[Gunfighter14e2]

A MOA at 100 yards is 1 inch a mil at 100 yards is something like .33 inches scopes are not graduated for this;.

Totally, Wrong.

 

[cuirc]

Totally, Wrong.

my mistake they are

 

[SmileMaker]

You realize all the accuracy crap goes out the window once the 0.05 mil adjustable turret becomes readily available.

 

[cuirc]

You realize all the accuracy crap goes out the window once the 0.05 mil adjustable turret becomes readily available.

And when would that be i have a lot invested in nightforce scopes

 

[PappyM3]

lol it's not a fallacy.

please tell me how .36 times a number is easier than 1 times a number??

Why are you needing to learn 0.36 times a number?

Which is easier to remember and dial for a hold?

8.4

Or

28.88 …. 28 and 3/4? Or 28.75?

Base 10 numbers are easier to remember and dial.

If you’re trying to convert for target size in your reticle and you’re more used to knowing groups/targets in MOA, all you need to know is every 0.3 mil is an MOA, 0.6 is 2 MOA. Close enough for hitting targets.

I still think of group sizes in MOA, but I don’t need to do any crazy 0.36 multiplication for conversions. If I see a target is 0.4 mil wide in my reticle, I know it’s a little bigger than an MOA. Easy.

 

[PappyM3]

The MOA is the imperial system where the mil is a metric system one is the same as the other except the base for the calculation is minuets of an angle where the mil, a metric system, is based on radians, as far as going from 100 yards to ant further distance the are the same. the difficulty comes in the dial for elevation it is hard be to be exact in the mil because of graduations. A MOA at 100 yards is 1 inch a mil at 100 yards is something like .33 inches scopes are not graduated for this;.
Both the MOA and the MIL are not different at 1000 yards or any distance. What is boils down to is preference.
The military uses MILs. Many shooters are use to that. I have scopes graduated in both MOA and MIL so that i maintain comfort with both. The difference between them is not large enough to be an obsticle.

It’s not imperial vs metric. Degrees and radians are just two separate units of angular measurement. MOA and MRAD are just subunits.

Yes, the body controlling metric standards adopted radians/MRAD because it’s base 10 and works easier with metric ranges than degrees. But radians weren’t invented for the metric system. MRAD works with imperial ranges too.

 

[Makinchips208]

Haha! Yess!!! Let’s go!

 

[Ronws]

It’s not imperial vs metric. Degrees and radians are just two separate units of angular measurement. MOA and MRAD are just subunits.

Yes, the body controlling metric standards adopted radians/MRAD because it’s base 10 and works easier with metric ranges than degrees. But radians weren’t invented for the metric system. MRAD works with imperial ranges too.

 

[Ronin22]

The only thing gayer than MOA is arguing MOA vs MRAD. Carry on…

 

[SmileMaker]

And when would that be i have a lot invested in nightforce scopes

March 5-40x56mm GenII - FML-PDKI Reticle - 0.05 Mil Clicks - FFP + Locking Turrets D40V56FML-G2

 

[Dead Eye Dick]

I Absolutely Refuse To Convert Our Sailboats Compass to Milradians

So, There!

 

[AMTGMC]

If only someone would make a scope like my favorite tape measure, with a MIL reticle and MOA turrets then we would have the best of both worlds.

 

[LeftyJason]

If only someone would make a scope like my favorite tape measure, with a MIL reticle and MOA turrets then we would have the best of both worlds. View attachment 8735975

Leupold did for years on many models. It sucked. Mark ar 3-9x40 sfp mil reticle moa elevation and iphy windage. Gave to my FIL on a non dialing 22lr to replace a broken tasco.

You want the turrets and reticle to match.

 

[TriggerJerk!]

 

[Aftermath]

If your going to use the F bomb discuss this is the bear pit

The F bomb?
The word FUCK?

 

[Aftermath]

The MOA is the imperial system where the mil is a metric system one is the same as the other except the base for the calculation is minuets of an angle where the mil, a metric system, is based on radians, as far as going from 100 yards to ant further distance the are the same. the difficulty comes in the dial for elevation it is hard be to be exact in the mil because of graduations. A MOA at 100 yards is 1 inch a mil at 100 yards is something like .33 inches scopes are not graduated for this;.
Both the MOA and the MIL are not different at 1000 yards or any distance. What is boils down to is preference.
The military uses MILs. Many shooters are use to that. I have scopes graduated in both MOA and MIL so that i maintain comfort with both. The difference between them is not large enough to be an obsticle.

Gross conceptual error

 

[Aftermath]

 

[Maurygold]

If only someone would make a scope like my favorite tape measure, with a MIL reticle and MOA turrets then we would have the best of both worlds. View attachment 8735975

We’ve already recovered from that catastrophe. Please let’s not go back.

 

[zaprosper]

No man. Inch Per Hundred Meters. Cause if you are going to make your life hard might as well go all the way. lol

My wife likes it hard too, but we don't all get what we want, do we.

 

[zaprosper]

Does me giving her an inch at 100 yards equate to the 6 inches she wants at 600 yards? What would that measure in Mils?

 

[Aftermath]

Does me giving her an inch at 100 yards equate to the 6 inches she wants at 600 yards? What would that measure in Mils?

How many times does it take you to get to the inch? I'm not sure how your MIL comes into this but that's sorta kinky.

 

[zaprosper]

How many times does it take you to get to the inch? I'm not sure how your MIL comes into this but that's sorta kinky.

Hmmm, do I solve this one with a ruler or a protractor?

 

[Dead Eye Dick]

GOD, Moses, the Phoenicians, Columbus and the peoples of the HAN and Song Dynasty of Formally NON Red China, all determined that each and every compass Shall Have 360 Degrees. Shooters recognize that 1/60 of a degree is what GOD, Moses, the Phoenicians and the peoples of the HAN and Song Dynasty INTENDED for us to use when sighting in our rifles.

Now, some devilish individual from that EVIL Europe, invented those devilish MIL Radians. How fiendish! How cruel. I don’t know how many mil radians or mil radishes or mil anythign is supposed to be.

But this sailor will guide his little craft by GOD’s invention of the 360 Points of that wonderful device given to us by Inspired man, the Compass.

I don’t care how many mills or bills is in a MilRadian, cause when I make landfall, I want my craft to make landfall WHERE I want it to make landfall.

Besides, leaving Key West with the intention of sailing to Pensacola is not a fun trip when one winds up in Havana, Cuba without permission by the communist government of Cuba giving me permission to land in Communist Cuba.

My other Craft that is also steered by GOD’s 360 points of the compass

I wouldn’t dare sail this boat off shore. A nice boat for sure, but definitly a lake sailor.

 

[Aftermath]

Hmmm, do I solve this one with a ruler or a protractor?

It would be ok if you solved that problem with a finger.

 

[Makinchips208]

GOD, Moses, the Phoenicians, Columbus and the peoples of the HAN and Song Dynasty of Formally NON Red China, all determined that each and every compass Shall Have 360 Degrees. Shooters recognize that 1/60 of a degree is what GOD, Moses, the Phoenicians and the peoples of the HAN and Song Dynasty INTENDED for us to use when sighting in our rifles.

Now, some devilish individual from that EVIL Europe, invented those devilish MIL Radians. How fiendish! How cruel. I don’t know how many mil radians or mil radishes or mil anythign is supposed to be.

But this sailor will guide his little craft by GOD’s invention of the 360 Points of that wonderful device given to us by Inspired man, the Compass.

I don’t care how many mills or bills is in a MilRadian, cause when I make landfall, I want my craft to make landfall WHERE I want it to make landfall.

Besides, leaving Key West with the intention of sailing to Pensacola is not a fun trip when one winds up in Havana, Cuba without permission by the communist government of Cuba giving me permission to land in Communist Cuba.

My other Craft that is also steered by GOD’s 360 points of the compass

View attachment 8736137

I wouldn’t dare sail this boat off shore. A nice boat for sure, but definitly a lake sailor.

on the 4th day God made the sun, moon, and stars, then He divided the compass into 360 degrees, and set the earth to move around the sun about the space of 1 degree every day, and every 4th year we shall have an extra day, this shall be a year of leaping.

 

[Aftermath]

on the 4th day God made the sun, moon, and stars, then He divided the compass into 360 degrees, and set the earth to move around the sun about the space of 1 degree every day, and every 4th year we shall have an extra day, this shall be a year of leaping.

This is the way.

1 revolution is 2π.
2π-6≈0.283
0.283*4≈1

We just can't get away from π. It is written.

 

[Ronws]

It would be ok if you solved that problem with a finger.

New revised chorus from the song "Linger" by The Cranberries.

"Do you have to, do you have to use your finger?"

 

[zaprosper]

on the 4th day God made the sun, moon, and stars, then He divided the compass into 360 degrees, and set the earth to move around the sun about the space of 1 degree every day, and every 4th year we shall have an extra day, this shall be a year of leaping.

We gain a quarter moa every year, I.e an inch at hundred yards?

 

[Aftermath]

We gain a quarter moa every year, I.e an inch at hundred yards?

Not quite.
A quarter minute of angle would subtend 1.047/4 inches at 100 yards. 1.047/4≈.26"

Now...think about the 2πr stuff.

 

[zaprosper]

Not quite.
A quarter minute of angle would subtend 1.047/4 inches at 100 yards. 1.047/4≈.26"

Now...think about the 2πr stuff.

I'd like to circumvent the nitty gritty details, but we seem to have traveled the circumference of the conversation and ended up at square one. Or is it circle one?

 

[Aftermath]

I'd like to circumvent the nitty gritty details, but we seem to have traveled the circumference of the conversation and ended up at square one. Or is it circle one?

A unit circle.
However, we did not circle back to square one if you still consider a quarter minute of angle as subtending about an inch at 100 yards.

 

[zaprosper]

A unit circle.
However, we did not circle back to square one if you still consider a quarter minute of angle as subtending about an inch at 100 yards.

Want to know the real reason I prefer mil? I can assure delivery of a solid 6 mils, but 6 inches seem unnecessary

 

[Aftermath]

If you must subtend 1 MOA to be equal to 1", carefully measure your range to be exactly 95.49296586 yards.

A DOPE card would be extremely useful because that's not a nice number. 1 MOA would subtend exactly 2" at 190.98593171 yards.

Carry on.

 

[zaprosper]

If you must subtend 1 MOA to be equal to 1", carefully measure your range to be exactly 95.49296586 yards.

A DOPE card would be extremely useful because that's not a nice number. 1 MOA would subtend exactly 2" at 190.98593171 yards.

Carry on.

At what distance does Maurygold start making calls to the eighth of an inch so the F class guys can get accurate click values?

 

[Rob01]

At what distance does Maurygold start making calls to the eighth of an inch so the F class guys can get accurate click values?

It’s 1/8 moa. Not inches. Why people keep bringing inches in amazes me.

 

[Mean_Man]

My mind thinks MOA, but I LOVE MRAD! It’s just so much simpler when your reticle and turrets are MRAD, if you can spot your impact you can just look and see did I miss by .1mil, 1.2mils etc and either dial or hold with the reticle that amount and send it.

I have to think more for MOA… from memory I will note technically 1/4moa is a finer adjustment than .1mil…. Buuut I doubt it will realistically ever matter for 99% of us.
(If I’m wrong here correct me please but I think that’s right)

Didn’t read except the title and posted, now post posting I’ll read and see how good or bad I did lol.

 

[Maurygold]

At what distance does Maurygold start making calls to the eighth of an inch so the F class guys can get accurate click values?

I actually own an 1/8 moa scope. Hate to disappoint you

Glad we could teach you something new

 

[Rob01]

My mind thinks MOA, but I LOVE MRAD! It’s just so much simpler when your reticle and turrets are MRAD, if you can spot your impact you can just look and see did I miss by .1mil, 1.2mils etc and either dial or hold with the reticle that amount and send it.

I have to think more for MOA… from memory I will note technically 1/4moa is a finer adjustment than .1mil…. Buuut I doubt it will realistically ever matter for 99% of us.
(If I’m wrong here correct me please but I think that’s right)

Didn’t read except the title and posted, now post posting I’ll read and see how good or bad I did lol.

You don’t have to think more for MOA. You do it the exact same way as mils. Problem is idiots start bringing linear in and fuck up the simple task.

 

[Aftermath]

My mind thinks MOA, but I LOVE MRAD! It’s just so much simpler when your reticle and turrets are MRAD, if you can spot your impact you can just look and see did I miss by .1mil, 1.2mils etc and either dial or hold with the reticle that amount and send it.

I have to think more for MOA… from memory I will note technically 1/4moa is a finer adjustment than .1mil…. Buuut I doubt it will realistically ever matter for 99% of us.
(If I’m wrong here correct me please but I think that’s right)

Didn’t read except the title and posted, now post posting I’ll read and see how good or bad I did lol.

I am confused.
If you are able to "spot your impact you can just look and see did I miss by .1mil, 1.2mils etc and either dial or hold with the reticle that amount and send it", why are you not able to do that with any other reticle markings?

 

[zaprosper]

I actually own an 1/8 moa scope. Hate to disappoint you

Glad we could teach you something new

I was bored today and learned a lot! Sadly I didn't learn anything about math, measurements, rifles and ballistics. But I did learn how confidently people can carry the perception of understanding, while completely missing the point made by others.
Sorry @Rob01 if I inched a little too close to you thinking you were in the presence of another tard. I won't rule of further message however, should the conversation subtend into that direction.

 

[Genin]

This topic will never die. It’s amazing. Use whichever. Scopes have great reticles for both with matching turrets and either will get the job done more than adequately.

 

[Mean_Man]

I am confused.
If you are able to "spot your impact you can just look and see did I miss by .1mil, 1.2mils etc and either dial or hold with the reticle that amount and send it", why are you not able to do that with any other reticle markings?

………fair point.


Whatever I like MRAD.

 

[Aftermath]

I was bored today and learned a lot! Sadly I didn't learn anything about math, measurements, rifles and ballistics. But I did learn how confidently people can carry the perception of understanding, while completely missing the point made by others.
Sorry @Rob01 if I inched a little too close to you thinking you were in the presence of another tard. I won't rule of further message however, should the conversation subtend into that direction.

 

[LeftyJason]

GOD, Moses, the Phoenicians, Columbus and the peoples of the HAN and Song Dynasty of Formally NON Red China, all determined that each and every compass Shall Have 360 Degrees. Shooters recognize that 1/60 of a degree is what GOD, Moses, the Phoenicians and the peoples of the HAN and Song Dynasty INTENDED for us to use when sighting in our rifles.

Now, some devilish individual from that EVIL Europe, invented those devilish MIL Radians. How fiendish! How cruel. I don’t know how many mil radians or mil radishes or mil anythign is supposed to be.

But this sailor will guide his little craft by GOD’s invention of the 360 Points of that wonderful device given to us by Inspired man, the Compass.

I don’t care how many mills or bills is in a MilRadian, cause when I make landfall, I want my craft to make landfall WHERE I want it to make landfall.

Besides, leaving Key West with the intention of sailing to Pensacola is not a fun trip when one winds up in Havana, Cuba without permission by the communist government of Cuba giving me permission to land in Communist Cuba.

My other Craft that is also steered by GOD’s 360 points of the compass

View attachment 8736137

I wouldn’t dare sail this boat off shore. A nice boat for sure, but definitly a lake sailor.

Looked it up for you. 17.45.. Mils per degree

 

[PappyM3]

Looked it up for you. 17.45.. Mils per degree

Or: (2π*1000) / 360

Because there are 2π radians in a circle.

 

[Ronin22]

MOA turrets wear out faster with the increase in dialing...