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Rifle Scopes I think I am looking for a new scope

tango6

tango6

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Sep 28, 2009
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I have a nikon prostaff 3-9x40. my goal is to shoot out to 600 yards and eventually 1000 yards. I have it on my foirst bolt gun which is a r700 5r in 308. what would you suggest? I dont have a budget yet but I dont want to break the bank. also I want a milspec scope, one that has on the knobs the moa adjustments, the one I have now doesnt. If I sound like an idiot its because I am I know nothing about long range shooting and bolt action rifles. I dont even know what magnification to look for. Thanks in advance.

Dan
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

You should do some research, there is a lot of info on snipers hide and the Internet. Learn about the different features that are available on scopes( parallax adjustment, Ffp or sfp, reticle choices, click values, fixed mag or variable, etc) then you can make an informed decision based on youre budget and what is features are important to you.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

I have no idea what you are talking about ftp or stp., that is the whole reason I posted this.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

US Optics 3.2-17 t-pal
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tango 6</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have no idea what you are talking about ftp or stp., that is the whole reason I posted this. </div></div>

Read this and the link in that thread. That should keep you busy for awhile.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

Tango 6. You have a great rifle for shooting long range. I think that 15-20x is a good power for 1000 yds, but 10x is acceptable. If you want to keep your scope at a budget price, I would suggest a scope with a reticle calibrated for 1000 yds. Otherwise you will need a scope with accurate/precise turret adjustments and that will cost more. I could give a better response if you said that you had $150 to spend or $1750 to spend on a scope. If you post a budget, I think you will get a more detailed response. The talent available on this site is amazing.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

I would look at the viper pst by vortex they ear a great scope and won't break the bank.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

the counter sniper scope is by far the best scope available. buy one immediately!
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ffhogue</div><div class="ubbcode-body">the counter sniper scope is by far the best scope available. buy one immediately! </div></div>

Oh dear.

Heres a short article about First or front focal plane vs Second focal plane scopes.

http://www.premierreticles.com/pdfs/2009-HowToFFP-SFP.pdf
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

I would also suggest your scope have matching turrets and reticle. Mil Mil or Moa Moa.
I personally prefer Mil Mil with first focal plane.

SWFA currently has some coupons if you like them on facebook for their SS line. Look around their site, lots of info and pics of sexy naked scopes.

After your research and changing your wish list several times
smile.gif
there are likely reviews and comparisons already posted here.

It is easier to pick out which car to buy than which scope.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

Shooting longer ranges that you're talking about, i'd stick with the matching turrets and FFP. A Mil-Mil setup in FFP is really the way to go at 600+ yards.

With FFP the reticle increases in size as you adjust the power ring up. Say you have a 3-15x FFP scope. At 3 power, your reticle will appear much smaller than when you adjust upwards to 15x. This, with matching turrets makes the math equations much easier when dialing in for elevation and windage.

Read up on the links provided. It's great info.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

SWFA SS-HD 5-20x50 FFP
Illuminated reticule $1500
Non illuminated reticule $1300
All you need is for SWFA to get to 4000 Facebook likes and you get $250 off the price of the NON ILLUMINATED reticule. I think they are approaching 3000 likes already.
Anyway this scope gets good reviews and a fantastic price point.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoFail</div><div class="ubbcode-body">SWFA SS-HD 5-20x50 FFP
Illuminated reticule $1500
Non illuminated reticule $1300
All you need is for SWFA to get to 4000 Facebook likes and you get $250 off the price of the NON ILLUMINATED reticule. I think they are approaching 3000 likes already.
Anyway this scope gets good reviews and a fantastic price point. </div></div>

+1 on SWFA. Great, great people, CS, and even better products. I honestly believe they put the best bang for your buck in terms of optics.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tango 6</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a nikon prostaff 3-9x40. my goal is to shoot out to 600 yards and eventually 1000 yards. I have it on my foirst bolt gun which is a r700 5r in 308. what would you suggest? I dont have a budget yet but I dont want to break the bank. also I want a milspec scope, one that has on the knobs the moa adjustments, the one I have now doesnt. If I sound like an idiot its because I am I know nothing about long range shooting and bolt action rifles. I dont even know what magnification to look for. Thanks in advance.</div></div>
It is hard to make a recommendation without a budget in mind.

With a smaller budget, I'd get a Vortex Viper PST 4-16x50. $700 for SFP (second focal plane) or $900 for FFP (first focal plane). SFP vs FFP has been hashed to death in these forums so I don't want to go into it yet again here.

If you budget is a quite a bit higher than that, then I'd recommend a Nightforce NXS 3.5-15x50. They also have SFP and FFP models.

I strongly second the recommendation to get matching reticle and knobs. If by "milspec" you meant mildot, then get mil knobs. The PST and NXS are both available in either mil/mil or moa/moa.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

Buying a scope is like buying a car.

Most people set a budget first, then figure out what options you want, see what models are in you're price range with those options, narrow it down to your top 2 or three choices. A compromise of some sort usually happens when you're on a budget.

So starting with a budget will help. You need to know what the options are/do so you can decide what's important to you. That's where the research comes in. All the information is out there. You just have to look.

People can recommend scopes all day long. But you won't know why. Or they may not even be in your budget.
Just trying to help you
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

Great I have no idea now
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope



Start at square one and give a budget, Then take the great advise given and start to apply it. It all starts with a budget.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

Save up for a Nightforce then talk to Jay at Sport optics. He will set you straight on what you need for the task you have in mind. He is a valuable source of knowledge and eager to help the beginner. I know he did that for me when I first started LR shooting.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

ok budget will be 1200 since the rifle was 1200 I will equal it on the glass and rings.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Outdoorsman9</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Viper PST and Seekins rings </div></div>

This would be a pretty good match for your rifle and shooting objectives. You can get it with either MIL/MIL or MOA/MOA reticle and adjustment. The 4-16x50 would fit your objective well and this combo provides decent glass without breaking the bank.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

I would recommend reading about, looking at, fondling, and using if possible before you make a decision. The more informed you are about features, and pros and cons the better chance of not having to go through several scopes before you are happy with your rig.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

the local gun shop have a bunch and I cant remember the brands, I am trying to figure out what magnifications to look at. I am heading there to look at cleaning supplies.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

I find 20x to be plenty. If you're going SFP, the reticle will be accurate at max mag. This might be an issue with a 25x scope when mirage is heavy.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

Whats a 20X the 1st number or the second number? and I know I am looking for a mil because I dont want the targer to be hit somewhere I am not aiming, so mil, mil is what I am going for?
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

FFP (First Focal Plane) is only beneficial if you need to use your scope for calculating the range to a target. And even then, it is of dubious value vs. SFP (Second Focal Plane) when ranging at long distance.

I find FFP most useful if you need to range in the grey area between MPBR and 500 yards.

(Maximum Point Blank Range is the range to target at which you can keep your shots within a particular vertical range, i.e for 0-300 meters, you can hold at the center of the bullseye and hit within a 6" vertical target diameter.)

From 300-500 yards you can use a FFP optic to range your target using lower magnifications, which can be helpful.

Past 500 yards you are probably going to use the optic's max power for target ranging anyway, and FFP will have no advantage over SFP.

Another good use for FFP is when you have a scope that doubles as a close-range and medium-range optic. It's nice to be able to have a well-designed reticle mimic a red-dot at 1X, and become a precision optic at 6X - something only a FFP optic can do.

Otherwise, there is no benefit to a FFP optic.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tango 6</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Whats a 20X the 1st number or the second number? and I know I am looking for a mil because I dont want the targer to be hit somewhere I am not aiming, so mil, mil is what I am going for? </div></div>mil/mil is useful for ranging, because it's simple to calculate distance for a known target size, but it's generally less precise than MOA/MOA.

Consider that a reticle with hash marks that subtend 1 MOA are 10 inches apart at 1000 yards (actually it's 10.47", but 10" is a practical rounding,) and a reticle with 1 mil hash marks subtends 36 inches at 1000 yards.

I use a 2.5-8x optic out to 600 yards, and it's good enough to hit 14" steel plates. Most precision long-range shooters use 32x out to 1000 yard, but 20, 22, or 24x optics should work fine.

Keep in mind that the higher the power, the smaller the exit pupil will be, and the more difficult it will be to get a good sight picture

Also, a turret that has 1/4 MOA clicks will move the POA (Point Of Impact) 2.5" per click at 1000 yards, and a turret with .1 mil clicks will move POA 3.6 inches at 1000 yards.

I like MOA better, because I'm not a sniper needing to make fast long-range distance estimations. I prefer the precision of MOA.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eracer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I like MOA better, because I'm not a sniper needing to make fast long-range distance estimations. I prefer the precision of MOA. </div></div>So, can we presume that all of your precision rifles have 1/8 moa clicks?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eracer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">mil/mil is useful for ranging, because it's simple to calculate distance for a known target size, but it's generally less precise than MOA/MOA.</div></div>Actually, mil/mil is useful for the same reason moa/moa is usefull. When the reticle is accurate and you see your shot and you need to make a correction, you use the reticle to measure the correction needed and just make the correction with the turrets. No calculations are required.
It used to be that you had a mil dot scope with moa dials. If the impact occured 1/2 mil right, you had to take 1/2 mil multiplied by 3.6 and then dial your correction which in this case would be 1.75 moa. With a mil/mil scope, you dial 0.5 mils left and shoot again.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eracer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">FFP (First Focal Plane) is only beneficial if you need to use your scope for calculating the range to a target. And even then, it is of dubious value vs. SFP (Second Focal Plane) when ranging at long distance.</div></div><span style="color: #FF0000">False</span>. If you are shooting at a target that is located at 731 yards and you take a shot with a 5-25 power FFP scope and mirage is bad so, you have the power adjusted to 16.3x and you see your impact is 0.7 mils left, guess how much right windage you put on your second shot. Thats correct, 0.7 mils.

Now lets take the same senario with your 5.5-22 power SFP. Mirage is still bad so, you have to crank your power ring down to 16.3x to get a good sight picture. You take your shot and see the impact is 0.7 mils left. What is the correction for your second shot??? Your reticle is accurate at 22x and 11x (twice the correction). I don't know about you but, I don't want to have to pull out a calculator and start running the nimbers to get my correction. I know that the conditions will change before I can get the shot off.

FFP scopes give you a measuring device (your reticle) that is accurate at any power. The reticle does however become more difficult to see when the power is turned down.

SFP scope give you a constant sized reticle that is only accurate at it's highest magnification. This will become an issue when mirage will not allow you to run the scope at it's max power.

If all you will ever do with the rifle / scope combo is shoot paper at fixed distances, then a SFP scope will work just fine. If however you will be shooting at targets and making corrections based on a first shot in a wide variety of conditions, the FFP will be more versitile.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

Tango6, do yourself a favor and carefully check out the SS from SWFA they are a damn good scope equal to a lot of the more expensive scopes out there, and for the money you can't beat it. If your not going to be ranging with a FFP scope then you may not need a variable scope. A 10 or 16 or even 20 power SS will serve you great and save you a ton of money. Don't get caught up paying more for a scope because of the brand or because of sudden popularity. I own a Leupold Mark 4 a Vortex pst and a 10x SS and I can tell you I like the SS better and it cost me $399 the Leupold was $1200 the Vortex was $800. I should have gotten all SS and saved a lot of money. There is no bought that NF, S&B are great scopes and if money to you is no option then why not. I personally like getting more bang for my buck. Just my opinion....
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

also arent they 299 and 199 since they have over 3000 likes, I will buy one for sure then. I am leaning towards what is mrad? I think because they have the likes its 199
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

Rarley do I post on here I would prefer just to read and learn as much as possible but Tango man do yourself a favor and utilize the vast ammount of information provided on the Hide. You've been a memebr of this great site since 09' and your asking questions you could have easily answered yourself by using some very simple research.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

well after searching their site I found a bunch of models that are the same, and I asked about a picture thread. I have been reading threads non stop and I have no idea what half of it means so I have no idea what I am looking for, I want to buy once and get it and think great I need a new one. Yes I have been a member for 3 years and I finally bought a bolt action rifle, that took 3 years to figure out exactly what I was looking for.
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

Just speaking frankly here.. If you don't know what anything means, you have no reason buying a mid to high end optic. If you don't understand what you are buying, you won't understand how to properly use it defeating your purpose. Don't be in such a rush. Do your research and make an educated decision. You don't need us to hand-hold you through this decision. Yeah the search function isn't the best, but if you are thinking it.. it's been asked. Google and YouTube are your friends in research. Do a weeks worth of research at least and then report back with a more narrow idea of your perspective choices and why.. then you will get more useful feedback. Used optics are a good way to go as well..
 
Re: I think I am looking for a new scope

alright. I'll just get a SS.
 
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