Buying 308/338 reloading

[timelinex]

So I just bought a 338lm and it has made the decision to start reloading a very easy one. So far all I have is a lyman reloading guide(which I have read), some old rcbs trickler and powder thrower. Based on ALOT of reading, replies to my old thread, and advice from an internet friend I have compiled a list of things I need to get me started.

My goals are to create precision ammo. This should be read as not necessarily bnechrest <.25moa accuracy ammo but not blasting ammo either. I am willing to pay money for tools that I need to get me there, but I don't need the best of them either. If a tool is 'good enough' and costs alot less , then thats the one for me. Later down the road I can always replace parts.

Without further delay:

<span style="font-weight: bold">Main supplies</span>
lee chalenger breech lock single stage
powder funnel
rcbs 505 scale
lee autoprime
hornady one shot case sizing wax
lyman debur and chamfer kit
rcbs flashwhole deburing tool
digital caliper
primer pocket sinclair uniform
wilson case trimmer (<span style="font-style: italic">Do I need the micrometer one for 100+ or is the $40 one good too?</span>)
ultrasonic cleaner from harbor freight
Tempilaq for annealing

<span style="font-weight: bold">308 specific</span>
Case trimmer shell holder
AutoPrime Shell holder
Redding body die
Redding type s bushing neck sizer
Forster benchrest seater die ( <span style="font-style: italic">do I need the ultra micrometer or just the bench rest?</span>)
Redding shellholder #1
Redding bushing 331 diameter steel

<span style="font-weight: bold">338 specific</span>
Case trimmer shell holder
AutoPrime Shell holder
Redding body die
Redding type s bushing neck sizer
Forster benchrest seater die
Redding shellholder #35
Redding Bushing (<span style="font-style: italic">which one do I need?</span>)

<span style="font-weight: bold">308 components</span> (savage fcp-k)
I have once fired winchester and other brass
CCI-Br2 or Federal 210-GMM primers
varget
175 SMK

<span style="font-weight: bold">338 components</span> (savage 110ba)
I will have once fired brass
CCI250 or Fed 215 primers
H1000 or retumbo
300smk

Ok, so I think that's everything. If its not on there, I don't have it and its not being bought. So if I'm missing something crucial please do tell me. I put a couple questions throughout the list and I have a couple more that I can't seem to get.

1. Do you actually need a tumbler? As long as you have an ultrasonic cleaner, is the tumbler just to make the brass look pretty?

2. Between all those deburring and brass tools, do I have overlap? What I mean is, I'm not sure if I'm buying some duplicate tools, with slightly different names.

3.Are any of those comparator tools and some other ones I can't remember, actually needed? I remember reading somewhere that you can just find distance to the lands using a dummy piece of ammo you make and keep setting the bullet back till you can barely actually close the bolt.

4. For the life of me I cant figure out if you need to full length re-size or neck re-size. The only thing I can tell is that its a heated debate. For a beginner though, whats a safe middle ground. I'm guessing with my list of things, I don't need a FL length sizer because the combination of the body and neck sizers = a fl length sizer?

Answers to those questions, and just general feedback on my list would be greatly appreciated!!

 

[MALLARD]

Re: Buying 308/338 reloading

good stuff , i'd get k&m flashole and primer pocket tool instead of sinclair/rcbs.

 

[ChrisGarrett]

Re: Buying 308/338 reloading

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So I just bought a 338lm and it has made the decision to start reloading a very easy one. So far all I have is a lyman reloading guide(which I have read), some old rcbs trickler and powder thrower. Based on ALOT of reading, replies to my old thread, and advice from an internet friend I have compiled a list of things I need to get me started.

My goals are to create precision ammo. This should be read as not necessarily bnechrest <.25moa accuracy ammo but not blasting ammo either. I am willing to pay money for tools that I need to get me there, but I don't need the best of them either. If a tool is 'good enough' and costs alot less , then thats the one for me. Later down the road I can always replace parts.

Without further delay:

<span style="font-weight: bold">Main supplies</span>
lee chalenger breech lock single stage
powder funnel
rcbs 505 scale
lee autoprime + 330 and 308 shell holder
hornady one shot case sizing wax
lyman debur and chamfer kit
rcbs flashwhole deburing tool
digital caliper
primer pocket sinclair uniform
wilson ss case trimmer + 308 and 338 shellholder
ultrasonic cleaner from harbor freight
Tempilaq for annealing

<span style="font-weight: bold">308 specific</span>
Case trimmer shell holder
AutoPrime Shell holder
Redding body die
Redding type s bushing size sizer
Forster benchrest seater die ( <span style="font-style: italic">do I need the ultra micrometer or just the bench rest?</span>)
Redding shellholder #1
Redding bushing 331 diameter steel

<span style="font-weight: bold">338 specific</span>
Case trimmer shell holder
AutoPrime Shell holder
Redding body die
Redding type s bushing size sizer
Forster benchrest seater die
Redding shellholder #35
Redding Bushing (<span style="font-style: italic">which one do I need?</span>)

<span style="font-weight: bold">308 components</span> (savage fcp-k)
I have once fired winchester and other brass
CCI-Br2 or Federal 210-GMM primers
varget
175 SMK

<span style="font-weight: bold">338 components</span> (savage 110ba)
I will have once fired brass
CCI250 or Fed 215 primers
H1000 or retumbo
300smk

Ok, so I think that's everything. If its not on there, I don't have it and its not being bought. So if I'm missing something crucial please do tell me. I put a couple questions throughout the list and I have a couple more that I can't seem to get.

1. Do you actually need a tumbler? As long as you have an ultrasonic cleaner, is the tumbler just to make the brass look pretty?

2. Between all those deburring and brass tools, do I have overlap? What I mean is, I'm not sure if I'm buying some duplicate tools, with slightly different names.

3.Are any of those comparator tools and some other ones I can't remember, actually needed? I remember reading somewhere that you can just find distance to the lands using a dummy piece of ammo you make and keep setting the bullet back till you can barely actually close the bolt.

4. For the life of me I cant figure out if you need to full length re-size or neck re-size. The only thing I can tell is that its a heated debate. For a beginner though, whats a safe middle ground. I'm guessing with my list of things, I don't need a FL length sizer because the combination of the body and neck sizers = a fl length sizer?

Answers to those questions, and just general feedback on my list would be greatly appreciated!! </div></div>

I'd go with the Lee Classic Cast O-Frame press, as it's the one they use in their 50 BMG kit. It's very robust, made in America from American railroad rails on modern American made CNC machinery.

You might be able find one for $100 shipped.

The 505 is a classic beam scale, but you might just go digital as they're much faster and with a trickler, you can dial things in with less fuss and muss. I used my Dillon beam scale for years, but it takes a bit more time. If you're doing small batches, then sure...a beam scale will be fine.

I use the RCBS ChargeMaster 1500 now, for my target loads and while not super fast, one can be doing other things while it's dispensing into the pan.

For case prep tools, I use the Lyman flash hole deburrer, the classic Wilson/RCBS type campher/deburring tool and the Sinclair primer pocket uniformers. For trimming, it's the Lyman Universal Chuck with power drill adapter bar.

I'm sure the Wilson will be more than sufficient, if not a bit slow. The other tools are kind of generics and most brands will suffice.

For cleaning, I'm still using my 17 year old Dillon vibratory tumbler. I can't really find any justification for 'wet' cleaning, either U.S. or S.S.. Cases don't need to be 'emergency room' clean and I go only an hour with corn/walnut/polish and I'm ready to load. No drying them in the oven and having to wait, but that's just my personal bias.

Personally, I think you're getting ahead of yourself, but I anneal with my RCBS Trim Mate case prep center and a BenzOmatic torch and do it by eye, in my darkened kitchen. I like spinning the cases, so you'll need something like the drill adapter for the 'campher/deburring' tool, to hold the cases. The 'water in the pan' method doesn't cut it.

As far as you dies go, the Redding body die, along with the S bushing neck die should be fine for sizing. I use the Forster MicroMeter seating die for the 338LM, but I've also used the Hornady micro seating stem on a Hornady seating die. For 308, I also run the Hornady seater w/micro stem and things are fine.

I have micro seaters from Redding, Hornady and Forster and they all work well. I think you have more case support with the Reddings and Forsters, but the Hornadys are semi supported. You can load just as well with standard seater plugs, but the 40 T.P.I. bolts on the micros are just much smoother and easier to dial in.

Get TiNi bushings, so you don't need to lube the necks.

The one thing that you're missing is a powder measure, but if you're doing only small batches, you might not need one. I used to use a tea cup and sugar spoon to load up the scale's pan, before using my trickler...for years. Slow, but it worked.

I'll not address your components, as that's something you'll be fiddling with as a rule.

Chris

 

[azhank]

Re: Buying 308/338 reloading

Check out http://www.brunoshooters.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=SFNT&Store_Code=BSS

He is local and should have most of your list. He is knowledgeable and helped me when I was getting started. Nice sized showroom too, a reloaders paradise.

 

[timelinex]

Re: Buying 308/338 reloading

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: azhank</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Check out http://www.brunoshooters.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=SFNT&Store_Code=BSS

He is local and should have most of your list. He is knowledgeable and helped me when I was getting started. Nice sized showroom too, a reloaders paradise. </div></div>
Yea I've been to bruno's for some ammo before. I was planning on buying powder and such there but didn't even realize that they had reloading supplies and at very reasonable prices too! Thanks for the tip.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ChrisGarrett</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

......

</div></div>
Is there a reason for recommending that press over the regular challenger press? Seems like both are built pretty much like tanks.

As far as the time saving comments you suggested... I agree that its gonna take a bit longer with some of these tools. For now I'm ok with that. Once I learn what I'm doing and if I decide to stick with it and start doing alot of rounds, I'll upgrade.

So your saying all the case prep small tools, I can buy cheaper brands like lyman and it will work basically as good?

Do I need the micrometer version of a case trimmer, or does a standard one work good enough.

 

[ChrisGarrett]

Re: Buying 308/338 reloading

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: azhank</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Check out http://www.brunoshooters.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=SFNT&Store_Code=BSS

He is local and should have most of your list. He is knowledgeable and helped me when I was getting started. Nice sized showroom too, a reloaders paradise. </div></div>
Yea I've been to bruno's for some ammo before. I was planning on buying powder and such there but didn't even realize that they had reloading supplies and at very reasonable prices too! Thanks for the tip.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ChrisGarrett</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

......

</div></div>
Is there a reason for recommending that press over the regular challenger press? Seems like both are built pretty much like tanks.

As far as the time saving comments you suggested... I agree that its gonna take a bit longer with some of these tools. For now I'm ok with that. Once I learn what I'm doing and if I decide to stick with it and start doing alot of rounds, I'll upgrade.

So your saying all the case prep small tools, I can buy cheaper brands like lyman and it will work basically as good?

Do I need the micrometer version of a case trimmer, or does a standard one work good enough. </div></div>

I'm pretty sure that if you look at the two presses' linkages, you'll find that the Classic Cast is a bit thicker and beefier, but I'm just going on memory.

The Classic Cast is what they include in their 50 BMG kit, so you're pretty safe with that one.

I'm not a huge trimming fanboy, so if you can get w/i +/- .001, you should be good. As I said above, my Lyman Universal has been pretty robust and fairly consistent over 17 years, so that's been fine for me. Other trimmers like the Forster, the Wilson and the RCBS have served others quite well, for years.

As far as the deburring/camphering tool, they all seem to be the same deal. Maybe the steel is harder on one, vs. the other, but I'm going on 17 years with the Wilson, with an RCBS waiting in the wings and the Wilson has been fine and is still cutting well.

Some comments I've read, for instance, about the Lyman flash hole tool, state that it wore out fast, but I've done thousands on mine and it still cuts true, so who knows?

Good luck with whatever you go with.

Chris

 

[timelinex]

Re: Buying 308/338 reloading

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ChrisGarrett</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm pretty sure that if you look at the two presses' linkages, you'll find that the Classic Cast is a bit thicker and beefier, but I'm just going on memory.

The Classic Cast is what they include in their 50 BMG kit, so you're pretty safe with that one.

I'm not a huge trimming fanboy, so if you can get w/i +/- .001, you should be good. As I said above, my Lyman Universal has been pretty robust and fairly consistent over 17 years, so that's been fine for me. Other trimmers like the Forster, the Wilson and the RCBS have served others quite well, for years.

As far as the deburring/camphering tool, they all seem to be the same deal. Maybe the steel is harder on one, vs. the other, but I'm going on 17 years with the Wilson, with an RCBS waiting in the wings and the Wilson has been fine and is still cutting well.

Some comments I've read, for instance, about the Lyman flash hole tool, state that it wore out fast, but I've done thousands on mine and it still cuts true, so who knows?

Good luck with whatever you go with.

Chris</div></div>
Gotcha, thanks for the advice. I'm gonna look if there's just a set somewhere that has all those small tools.


So when I first reload my fired cases. Do I body size it as well or what? I thought its a goode thing that its 'fire formed'?

 

[timelinex]

Re: Buying 308/338 reloading

Just got back from Bruno's Shooting Supply

Got most of everything I need. They were out of stock of the dies, so they ordered some and they will be here in a week. Also out of stock of varget till 2 weeks from now. Already have a redding 2400 trimmer, 505 scale, HF ultrasonic cleaner and rock chucker supreme waiting for me.

All I have left to order is basically 175smk's that they dont know when they will have them at brunos and forster seating die's!


I got TiN neck bushings, but I'm not sure if I got the right dimensions. I brought in a spent 308 and 338 shell, he measured them for me and we came up with Redding 330 for the 308 and Redding 362 for the 338. Those are smaller then what I'm reading other people are using, am I going to have a problem? <span style="font-weight: bold">How do I even know if I'm using the right or wrong size.</span>

 

[boltgunluvr]

Re: Buying 308/338 reloading

What kind of action??????

 

[timelinex]

Re: Buying 308/338 reloading

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: boltgunluvr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What kind of action??????</div></div>
action?

 

[boltgunluvr]

Re: Buying 308/338 reloading

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: boltgunluvr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What kind of action??????</div></div>
action? </div></div>

Bolt, semi, etc?????

 

[BIRDHUNTER]

Re: Buying 308/338 reloading

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just got back from Bruno's Shooting Supply

Got most of everything I need. They were out of stock of the dies, so they ordered some and they will be here in a week. Also out of stock of varget till 2 weeks from now. Already have a redding 2400 trimmer, 505 scale, HF ultrasonic cleaner and rock chucker supreme waiting for me.

All I have left to order is basically 175smk's that they dont know when they will have them at brunos and forster seating die's!


I got TiN neck bushings, but I'm not sure if I got the right dimensions. I brought in a spent 308 and 338 shell, he measured them for me and we came up with Redding 330 for the 308 and Redding 362 for the 338. Those are smaller then what I'm reading other people are using, am I going to have a problem? <span style="font-weight: bold">How do I even know if I'm using the right or wrong size.</span> </div></div>

For your neck bushings the best way to select, per Redding is to measure the neck of a loaded round and select .001 below. All brass is different. For Win. I use 331, Fed 337 and Lapua 335. Win and Fed are easy, measure a factory round with the same bullet you plan on using and select .001 below that number. Good luck