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Michele Obama sponsors sub crewed by women.

vwhugger

The Kindly Curmudgeon
Full Member
Minuteman
Jan 17, 2003
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NW WI
<span style="font-style: italic">So I take it no Se<span style="text-decoration: line-through">a</span>men will be on board then.</span>
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UPDATE: The Hill has since updated its post to say that they were mistaken in reporting that the USS Illinois would be crewed only by women. The Hill left unclear whether this mistake was made completely erroneously or because the Illinois would have more than the usual opportunities for seawomen seeking posts on nuclear submarines. Please enjoy the rest of this post, which is still otherwise about factual gender opportunities or lack-thereof in the U.S. armed forces and Command Sgt. Maj. Jane Baldwin and Col. Ellen Haring’s lawsuit against the mandates that restrict them.

Nuclear submarines have been some of the last holdouts in co-ed military integration worldwide. Long deployments and superlatively cramped and mostly communal living spaces kept most navies from being comfortable with bunking men and women together. The strict economy of space has kept separate bathrooms and sleeping quarters low on the priority list of technological innovations for new submarine classes.

However, in the past year or so, the United States increased the categories of women allowed to set foot on submarines from “female civilian technicians for a few days at most; women midshipmen on an overnight during summer training for both Navy ROTC and Naval Academy; [and] family members for one-day dependent cruises,” to allow women to serve in certain cases. <span style="color: #FF0000">But yesterday, Memorial Day, First Lady Michelle Obama sponsored and announced the creation of the USS Illinois, a Virginia-class nuclear sub that will, when it enteres the Navy fleet in 2015, be crewed by women, exclusively.</span>

Last May, the Navy decided that since officers on nuclear subs get a private bunk and access to an officers only bathroom, female officers could serve on the subs with the implementation of a flippable sign to let other officers know whether the bathroom was being used by a man or a woman. Eight women graduated from Naval Submarine School’s Submarine Officer Basic Course last year and proceeded to their posts. The Illinois, named after Ms. Obama’s home state, widens the possible roles for women on American submarines considerably. She said, in a statement:

<span style="color: #FFCC66">
It’s an honor and a privilege to serve as sponsor of the USS Illinois. This submarine is a tribute to the strength, courage and determination that our Navy families exhibit every day.</span>

Sponsoring ships and even subs is not an uncommon First Lady-like activity: Ms. Obama has also sponsored the USCGC Stratton, Laura Bush sponsored the USS Texas (another nuclear sub of the same class), and Hillary Clinton sponsored the USS Columbia.

Would now be a good time to mention Pirate Jenny, daughter of Captain Nemo and captain of the Nautilus in Alan Moore’s League of Extraordinary Gentlemen?

I digress.

The announcement of a submarine crewed by women is well timed with the Pentagon’s announcement that it is opening up 14,000 positions (mostly in the Army) that were previously exclusively available to men by mandate. There are still more than 250,000 jobs in the U.S. armed forces that are unavailable to women. In fact, Command Sgt. Maj. Jane Baldwin and Col. Ellen Haring, two Army reserve officers, are suing the U.S. Department of Defense and Army for the rights of female soldiers under the Fifth Amendment to serve as they are able, not as gender exclusive mandates will allow.

From CBS news:

<span style="color: #FFCC66">The lawsuit also notes that women are already serving in combat in Iraq and Afghanistan, and instead of assigning them to combat units, the military is purposefully and deliberately circumventing the exclusion by “attaching” them to such units. In doing so, however, the policies put the women in more danger than their male counterparts because they’re barred from receiving combat-arms training necessary for engaging with hostile forces.</span>

Haring has held positions as platoon leader, commander, executive officer and bridge commander over a 28-year Army career. She currently serves as a Joint Concept Officer for the Joint and Coalition Warfighting Center in Suffolk, Va. The lawsuit argues that Haring’s options “were limited to support positions with no possibility to compete within the combat arms.”
The Department of Defense declined to comment specifically on the lawsuit.

(via The Hill and CBS.)


http://www.themarysue.com/michelle-obama-sponsors-all-female-submarine/
 
Re: Michele Obama sponsors sub crewed by women.

Awesome, two more dumb-asses to deal with.

Question: Are soldiers allowed to sue the DoD and the Army for this kind of crap? Just wondering...
 
Re: Michele Obama sponsors sub crewed by women.

I couldn't F&cking resist...
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Serious time now...

I met a female NCO(this is her story as she claimed it) one time who claimed to be attached to 10th Group during a conflict for a specific mission(I'm leaving some details out on purpose), with her in a support role. She noticed that a lot of the team had withdrawn away from her in terms of interaction, and she asked the Team Sergeant why. He told her that they considered her bad luck, because if they were all captured then all of the men would focus on trying to keep her safe, and they all were worried that she would crack if question(she didn't have any SERE training at the time). She said this worrying caused a loss of focus on the mission.

In her words it was the Big Brother/Little Sister effect. She said that after Bosnia, she firmly believed that women had no place in Combat Arms, or being anywhere near combat, but was accepting of women in support roles.
 
Re: Michele Obama sponsors sub crewed by women.

I feel like we should let women serve open and freely in the military in any capacity they want on the same day they have to register for the draft at 18. Lets be equal here guys.
 
Re: Michele Obama sponsors sub crewed by women.

Soo...women can't drive cars...but let's give them a billion dollar boat...brilliant! haha

On a serious note, an all female sub would be fine. If nothing else it'd smell better! It's only when they mix units that problems (pregnancy, sexual harassment, distractions, special treatment) happen.
 
Re: Michele Obama sponsors sub crewed by women.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Savage 10fp</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I feel like we should let women serve open and freely in the military in any capacity they want on the same day they have to register for the draft at 18. Lets be equal here guys. </div></div>

Let me make a guess that you were never in the military!
 
Re: Michele Obama sponsors sub crewed by women.

"<span style="color: #990000">UPDATE: The Hill has since updated its post to say that they were mistaken in reporting that the USS Illinois would be crewed only by women</span>."

That's right, it was suppsed to be the USS Carpet Muncher.
 
Re: Michele Obama sponsors sub crewed by women.

I wunder what kind of procedures they'll develop to handle the monthly thing.
 
Re: Michele Obama sponsors sub crewed by women.

Women have been serving on US Naval Vessels for quite some time now; so I think it's safe to say that whatever questions have all been addressed in some way, maybe some better than others, by now.

With respect, you'd have a tough time getting <span style="font-style: italic">me</span> to put up with the stresses involved in sub service, let alone a bunch of women volunteers. Just sayin'...

Greg
 
Re: Michele Obama sponsors sub crewed by women.

Dont know how the female cdr's rate in the Navy, but the absolute worst commanders I have had in the Army were female. My last one got a job with a state agency after she retired, and was fired and investigated by the Texas Rangers for pulling the same crap she did in the Army. Karma
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