Like for the 155 AMAX? results? I bought some and heard good things about it. Is it the same powder as 2000MR?
Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
- Thread starter JGorski
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Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
I just picked up a lb to try. 168 A-MAX out of my 16" LR 308... Looking forward to it...
I just picked up a lb to try. 168 A-MAX out of my 16" LR 308... Looking forward to it...
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
2600 ft/sec out of a 16" gasser. 168gr a-max. 2000mr. yes same powder. 1gr below max.
I've heard great things about 8208xbr with the 155's.
2600 ft/sec out of a 16" gasser. 168gr a-max. 2000mr. yes same powder. 1gr below max.
I've heard great things about 8208xbr with the 155's.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
i doubt 2 competing companies would sell the same powder. it does seem to get really nice velocity numbers. ive got 2 lbs to try in my AAC SD.
i doubt 2 competing companies would sell the same powder. it does seem to get really nice velocity numbers. ive got 2 lbs to try in my AAC SD.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Twitch2120</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i doubt 2 competing companies would sell the same powder. it does seem to get really nice velocity numbers. ive got 2 lbs to try in my AAC SD. </div></div>
Its happened before, the company that markets a powder is rarely if ever the company that produces the powder.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Twitch2120</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i doubt 2 competing companies would sell the same powder. it does seem to get really nice velocity numbers. ive got 2 lbs to try in my AAC SD. </div></div>
Its happened before, the company that markets a powder is rarely if ever the company that produces the powder.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: squirrel_slayer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">2600 ft/sec out of a 16" gasser. 168gr a-max. 2000mr. yes same powder. 1gr below max.
I've heard great things about 8208xbr with the 155's. </div></div>
That could be, too. Ive been getting outstanding results RE15, but cant find any around here right now.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: squirrel_slayer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">2600 ft/sec out of a 16" gasser. 168gr a-max. 2000mr. yes same powder. 1gr below max.
I've heard great things about 8208xbr with the 155's. </div></div>
That could be, too. Ive been getting outstanding results RE15, but cant find any around here right now.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
I know they aren't producing the powder themselves. I just find it hard to believe that company A would have a third party make a product for them and not write it in a contract that they can't also make the same product for company B. After all, Mr2k doesn't erase copper now does it? ;D
I know they aren't producing the powder themselves. I just find it hard to believe that company A would have a third party make a product for them and not write it in a contract that they can't also make the same product for company B. After all, Mr2k doesn't erase copper now does it? ;D
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
They aren't the same powders but they are made by the same company and charge weights are similar. Powder companies are generally resellers as well many don't 'make' their own powders. They have someone else do it then package and market it.
They aren't the same powders but they are made by the same company and charge weights are similar. Powder companies are generally resellers as well many don't 'make' their own powders. They have someone else do it then package and market it.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
I tried some CFE 223 with some 155 Noslers in my 308 Win. Rifle and it didn't like it.
I then tried 46.5 CFE 223 with a 175 Nosler CC and loaded 10 rounds of test loads. Two 5 shot groups measured .6 and .8 MOA. This is a 1-12 Hart barrel that doesn't like 175's. I'm going to test again, but I'm not too hopeful that CFE 223 is a not temperature sensitive, since it's a double based ball powder.
I just shot some loads with 43.0 gr. of IMR 3031 with 155 Nosler CC's a few days ago in 95º. The load shoots accurately with no signs of pressure in 60º, but at 95º, I stretched the primer pockets. I had to toss the brass.
I'm shooting up all of my older powders and replacing them with powders that are less sensitive to temperature changes. Just doesn't make sense not to.
I tried some CFE 223 with some 155 Noslers in my 308 Win. Rifle and it didn't like it.
I then tried 46.5 CFE 223 with a 175 Nosler CC and loaded 10 rounds of test loads. Two 5 shot groups measured .6 and .8 MOA. This is a 1-12 Hart barrel that doesn't like 175's. I'm going to test again, but I'm not too hopeful that CFE 223 is a not temperature sensitive, since it's a double based ball powder.
I just shot some loads with 43.0 gr. of IMR 3031 with 155 Nosler CC's a few days ago in 95º. The load shoots accurately with no signs of pressure in 60º, but at 95º, I stretched the primer pockets. I had to toss the brass.
I'm shooting up all of my older powders and replacing them with powders that are less sensitive to temperature changes. Just doesn't make sense not to.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
For all of yall experiencing high pressure signs, how does that translate on paper accuracy wise?
I'm assuming groups open up, but how badly?
For all of yall experiencing high pressure signs, how does that translate on paper accuracy wise?
I'm assuming groups open up, but how badly?
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tx_Flyboy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For all of yall experiencing high pressure signs, how does that translate on paper accuracy wise?
I'm assuming groups open up, but how badly? </div></div>
High pressure is not always an accuracy killer so don't use accuracy as a determining factor for pressure.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tx_Flyboy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For all of yall experiencing high pressure signs, how does that translate on paper accuracy wise?
I'm assuming groups open up, but how badly? </div></div>
High pressure is not always an accuracy killer so don't use accuracy as a determining factor for pressure.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
I used the max load in my factory 24inch 700 22-250 using the 50 V-max load.
Chrono read 4200fps and I had to use a mallet to hammer my bolt open. I threw the rest of the loaded rounds away. Varget is the go to powder for my 22-250.
Off Hodgdon Website.
39.8gr 3968Fps 62,600 PSI
I used the max load in my factory 24inch 700 22-250 using the 50 V-max load.
Chrono read 4200fps and I had to use a mallet to hammer my bolt open. I threw the rest of the loaded rounds away. Varget is the go to powder for my 22-250.
Off Hodgdon Website.
39.8gr 3968Fps 62,600 PSI
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: beretta989</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I used the max load in my factory 24inch 700 22-250 using the 50 V-max load.
Chrono read 4200fps and I had to use a mallet to hammer my bolt open. I threw the rest of the loaded rounds away. Varget is the go to powder for my 22-250. </div></div>
Were you not speaking to your bullet puller at the time?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: beretta989</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I used the max load in my factory 24inch 700 22-250 using the 50 V-max load.
Chrono read 4200fps and I had to use a mallet to hammer my bolt open. I threw the rest of the loaded rounds away. Varget is the go to powder for my 22-250. </div></div>
Were you not speaking to your bullet puller at the time?
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
I happen to have a pile of 22-250 brass and I only loaded 5 so I just threw them.
I happen to have a pile of 22-250 brass and I only loaded 5 so I just threw them.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
I was ladder testing some loads for my GAP and I tried CFE223 with 168 SMKs and Fed Match primers in new Lapua brass. At 0.6gr below max I got an extractor mark and at 0.3gr below max I got a blown primer (max is per Hodgdon website). I had loaded some with CCI #34 primers and I got soot rings around the primers around the same spot. I was getting some of the highest velocities I'd ever seen with this gun before the alarms went off and I could feel a clear increase in recoil, too.
Temps were in the mid to high 70's during this testing. Temps are running 20+ degrees warmer now and I'm half-way afraid of this stuff. It's the only powder I've tested in 30+ years that gave me this much pressure when under the max. I might try it with some 155s but I'm gonna be real careful.
I was ladder testing some loads for my GAP and I tried CFE223 with 168 SMKs and Fed Match primers in new Lapua brass. At 0.6gr below max I got an extractor mark and at 0.3gr below max I got a blown primer (max is per Hodgdon website). I had loaded some with CCI #34 primers and I got soot rings around the primers around the same spot. I was getting some of the highest velocities I'd ever seen with this gun before the alarms went off and I could feel a clear increase in recoil, too.
Temps were in the mid to high 70's during this testing. Temps are running 20+ degrees warmer now and I'm half-way afraid of this stuff. It's the only powder I've tested in 30+ years that gave me this much pressure when under the max. I might try it with some 155s but I'm gonna be real careful.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
I noticed roughly a 80 fps difference from a 65 degree day to an 90 degree day...
Original:2650 fps (65 degrees)
Temp altered:2730 fps (90 degree)
I may stick with varget in my gas guns... But this may show promise for my bolt guns and 155's.
I noticed roughly a 80 fps difference from a 65 degree day to an 90 degree day...
Original:2650 fps (65 degrees)
Temp altered:2730 fps (90 degree)
I may stick with varget in my gas guns... But this may show promise for my bolt guns and 155's.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
For my 16" gasser just loaded some with 168 A-Max, win brass most once mane twice fired out of bolt gun & some out of auto, all weight sorted into 5 shot groups within 1 gn spread. Rem #9 1/2 primer, 2.800. Starting charge CFE 223 47.1, .2 gn increments until 48.3 gn ending, seven 5 shot groups worth. Am going to 100 yrd outdoor range with chrono Monday 7/2. I suppose I will post on this forum with results, first time with new chrono.
For my 16" gasser just loaded some with 168 A-Max, win brass most once mane twice fired out of bolt gun & some out of auto, all weight sorted into 5 shot groups within 1 gn spread. Rem #9 1/2 primer, 2.800. Starting charge CFE 223 47.1, .2 gn increments until 48.3 gn ending, seven 5 shot groups worth. Am going to 100 yrd outdoor range with chrono Monday 7/2. I suppose I will post on this forum with results, first time with new chrono.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoFail</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For my 16" gasser just loaded some with 168 A-Max, win brass most once mane twice fired out of bolt gun & some out of auto, all weight sorted into 5 shot groups within 1 gn spread. Rem #9 1/2 primer, 2.800. Starting charge CFE 223 47.1, .2 gn increments until 48.3 gn ending, seven 5 shot groups worth. Am going to 100 yrd outdoor range with chrono Monday 7/2. I suppose I will post on this forum with results, first time with new chrono. </div></div>
I started seeing pressure signs out of my OBR @ 46.2 gn of cfe223.... Be careful man.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoFail</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For my 16" gasser just loaded some with 168 A-Max, win brass most once mane twice fired out of bolt gun & some out of auto, all weight sorted into 5 shot groups within 1 gn spread. Rem #9 1/2 primer, 2.800. Starting charge CFE 223 47.1, .2 gn increments until 48.3 gn ending, seven 5 shot groups worth. Am going to 100 yrd outdoor range with chrono Monday 7/2. I suppose I will post on this forum with results, first time with new chrono. </div></div>
I started seeing pressure signs out of my OBR @ 46.2 gn of cfe223.... Be careful man.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: K_4c</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoFail</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For my 16" gasser just loaded some with 168 A-Max, win brass most once mane twice fired out of bolt gun & some out of auto, all weight sorted into 5 shot groups within 1 gn spread. Rem #9 1/2 primer, 2.800. Starting charge CFE 223 47.1, .2 gn increments until 48.3 gn ending, seven 5 shot groups worth. Am going to 100 yrd outdoor range with chrono Monday 7/2. I suppose I will post on this forum with results, first time with new chrono. </div></div>
I started seeing pressure signs out of my OBR @ 46.2 gn of cfe223.... Be careful man. </div></div>
No shit? Fkg HODGDEN starting load for 168 gn, I think SMK, 46.6!!! Yes first sign of trouble I will stop. Thanks for warning bro.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: K_4c</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoFail</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For my 16" gasser just loaded some with 168 A-Max, win brass most once mane twice fired out of bolt gun & some out of auto, all weight sorted into 5 shot groups within 1 gn spread. Rem #9 1/2 primer, 2.800. Starting charge CFE 223 47.1, .2 gn increments until 48.3 gn ending, seven 5 shot groups worth. Am going to 100 yrd outdoor range with chrono Monday 7/2. I suppose I will post on this forum with results, first time with new chrono. </div></div>
I started seeing pressure signs out of my OBR @ 46.2 gn of cfe223.... Be careful man. </div></div>
No shit? Fkg HODGDEN starting load for 168 gn, I think SMK, 46.6!!! Yes first sign of trouble I will stop. Thanks for warning bro.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
K_4C,
What was the accuracy like on the higher velocity stuff?
Has anyone else tried to shoot at the next lower (powder charge & velocity) accuracy node? Did that result in pressure signs on warm days? were these pressure signs accompanied by decrease in accuracy?
The reason i'm asking is that i'll be running my loads primarily in competitions...I shoot an AR, and won't have the luxury of chasing my brass to examine them for pressure signs as the stages are all timed. Therefore, i'm looking for an alternate indication of pressure signs outside of brass indications.
I'm already planning on seeing where the high and low nodes are, and then using the low node in the summer & the higher node in the winter...
K_4C,
What was the accuracy like on the higher velocity stuff?
Has anyone else tried to shoot at the next lower (powder charge & velocity) accuracy node? Did that result in pressure signs on warm days? were these pressure signs accompanied by decrease in accuracy?
The reason i'm asking is that i'll be running my loads primarily in competitions...I shoot an AR, and won't have the luxury of chasing my brass to examine them for pressure signs as the stages are all timed. Therefore, i'm looking for an alternate indication of pressure signs outside of brass indications.
I'm already planning on seeing where the high and low nodes are, and then using the low node in the summer & the higher node in the winter...
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
Accuracy was consistent with my other data.... No ill affects other then my primers were flaten and my brass pile went to my 1 o'clock.
I prefer the lower node on all my rifles.... Barrel life is more important then an extra 150 fps.
I'm going to switch back to varget for my OBR and keep using cfe223 for my LWRC m6a3 and custom remmy 700 .308.
Accuracy was consistent with my other data.... No ill affects other then my primers were flaten and my brass pile went to my 1 o'clock.
I prefer the lower node on all my rifles.... Barrel life is more important then an extra 150 fps.
I'm going to switch back to varget for my OBR and keep using cfe223 for my LWRC m6a3 and custom remmy 700 .308.
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: K_4c</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> [CFE]
I noticed roughly a 80 fps difference from a 65 degree day to an 90 degree day...
Original:2650 fps (65 degrees)
Temp altered:2730 fps (90 degree)
I may stick with varget in my gas guns... But this may show promise for my bolt guns and 155's. </div></div>
That would suggest 3.2 fps/F.
And that's bad.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Kombayotch:
AR Comp is indeed temperature stable, twice as good as Varget (0.09 fps/F vs. 0.22 fps/F
.. ..
[3031],36 fps change (calculated) going from 0F to 100F [=.36 fsp/F]</div></div>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: K_4c</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> [CFE]
I noticed roughly a 80 fps difference from a 65 degree day to an 90 degree day...
Original:2650 fps (65 degrees)
Temp altered:2730 fps (90 degree)
I may stick with varget in my gas guns... But this may show promise for my bolt guns and 155's. </div></div>
That would suggest 3.2 fps/F.
And that's bad.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Kombayotch:
AR Comp is indeed temperature stable, twice as good as Varget (0.09 fps/F vs. 0.22 fps/F
.. ..
[3031],36 fps change (calculated) going from 0F to 100F [=.36 fsp/F]</div></div>
Re: Anyone using CFE223 in 308?
I forgot about this thread. I did shoot the loads I mentioned above I nmh post and the first time it was 73F, at 48.1 gr and 168 amax 2690 ave fps 16" barrel. Groups were meh... I decided to start over with same test after I got a new SS 12x scope and the day that I shot that next string it was 83F. Fkg pressure signs at 41.7, primers and ejector marks. I had also loaded the powder under 178 Amax and no pressure signs, I used less of a charge for those ones of course, I didn't load to max for the 178's. I'm going to run those again and have another look see, I found an accuracy node with the 178's at 44.7 gr CFE223.
I forgot about this thread. I did shoot the loads I mentioned above I nmh post and the first time it was 73F, at 48.1 gr and 168 amax 2690 ave fps 16" barrel. Groups were meh... I decided to start over with same test after I got a new SS 12x scope and the day that I shot that next string it was 83F. Fkg pressure signs at 41.7, primers and ejector marks. I had also loaded the powder under 178 Amax and no pressure signs, I used less of a charge for those ones of course, I didn't load to max for the 178's. I'm going to run those again and have another look see, I found an accuracy node with the 178's at 44.7 gr CFE223.
