Is it better to neck up or down? I want to re-size to 260 rem,is it better to go up with 243 or go down with 7-08 or 308?
- Thread starter J Mackey
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Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
up... going down CAN make for thick necks
up... going down CAN make for thick necks
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
I differ; necking down is always better, IMHO. The difference in neck thickness for what you want to do will only add a tad over a thou to the original neck thickness and that tiny bit will make your cases fit the chamber a little better.
Necking up gets most of the new neck from the thinner side of the necks and that means your necks will be that much more out of line with the center of the bore. That's NOT an aid to accuracy.
Either way, you need to anneal your new necks or they will split pretty quickly.
I differ; necking down is always better, IMHO. The difference in neck thickness for what you want to do will only add a tad over a thou to the original neck thickness and that tiny bit will make your cases fit the chamber a little better.
Necking up gets most of the new neck from the thinner side of the necks and that means your necks will be that much more out of line with the center of the bore. That's NOT an aid to accuracy.
Either way, you need to anneal your new necks or they will split pretty quickly.
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
Neck turning will help with concentricity. Just take off enough to 90% clean up the necks.
OFG
Neck turning will help with concentricity. Just take off enough to 90% clean up the necks.
OFG
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
Unless you are necking down more than about 40 thousandths (depending on your chamber) increased neck thickness shouldn't be a problem. However, necking up will more than likely create donuts in the necks, and unless you load above the donut or turn your necks your rifle will probably shoot like shit.
Unless you are necking down more than about 40 thousandths (depending on your chamber) increased neck thickness shouldn't be a problem. However, necking up will more than likely create donuts in the necks, and unless you load above the donut or turn your necks your rifle will probably shoot like shit.
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
Thanks for the input guys.
Thanks for the input guys.
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
I was a serious Benchrest shooter for the last 5+ years and I have done a lot of necking up. 6mmBR brass to 30BR. Necking up will cause the dreaded doughnut as the shoulder is actually turned into neck. This creates a buldge on the outside of the neck. When you run it through the neck bushing it pushes the buldge to the inside. Then if you seat a bullet it is once again pushed out which causes the round to be potentially tight in the neck area. I say potentially because the tactical type chamber is much looser than the tight necked benchrest chamber. I would typically run .0015" clearance between the neck of the brass and the chamber. Turning the necks would be required in this example. Now, when referring to the tactical chamber it may not be a problem. I have necked down 200 7mm-08 cases to 260 Rem recently and I did not see a perceivable increase in neck thickness. I have not necked up any 243 brass because I knew it would create the doughnut. So my 2 cents says neck down.
I was a serious Benchrest shooter for the last 5+ years and I have done a lot of necking up. 6mmBR brass to 30BR. Necking up will cause the dreaded doughnut as the shoulder is actually turned into neck. This creates a buldge on the outside of the neck. When you run it through the neck bushing it pushes the buldge to the inside. Then if you seat a bullet it is once again pushed out which causes the round to be potentially tight in the neck area. I say potentially because the tactical type chamber is much looser than the tight necked benchrest chamber. I would typically run .0015" clearance between the neck of the brass and the chamber. Turning the necks would be required in this example. Now, when referring to the tactical chamber it may not be a problem. I have necked down 200 7mm-08 cases to 260 Rem recently and I did not see a perceivable increase in neck thickness. I have not necked up any 243 brass because I knew it would create the doughnut. So my 2 cents says neck down.
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
I recommend necking down Win 7-08 to 260Rem, I use a Forster FL die with the expander to form the brass, after it's fire formed I use a Redding type S FL with a .290 bushing, and no expander or Reddings carbide floating expander to remove dents, I anneal every 3-5 firings and have some Win reformed brass with 20+ loadings.
I recommend necking down Win 7-08 to 260Rem, I use a Forster FL die with the expander to form the brass, after it's fire formed I use a Redding type S FL with a .290 bushing, and no expander or Reddings carbide floating expander to remove dents, I anneal every 3-5 firings and have some Win reformed brass with 20+ loadings.
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
Everything Benchman and 427cobra said.
Before commercial .260 brass was readily available I made 6.5-08 (.260) out of most anything I had available. I necked .243's up & .308's down. Bought a 7-08 die set, took the expander plug out of it and used it for an intermediate step in taking .308's to .260. 7-08 to .260 is probably the easiest and least problematic way to go, it is a single, easy step.
My question to the OP is - With the availability of quality .260 Rem brass, why do you want to jack with reforming ?
Paul
Everything Benchman and 427cobra said.
Before commercial .260 brass was readily available I made 6.5-08 (.260) out of most anything I had available. I necked .243's up & .308's down. Bought a 7-08 die set, took the expander plug out of it and used it for an intermediate step in taking .308's to .260. 7-08 to .260 is probably the easiest and least problematic way to go, it is a single, easy step.
My question to the OP is - With the availability of quality .260 Rem brass, why do you want to jack with reforming ?
Paul
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
Because i have a lot of other brass setting around not being used and 260 head-stamped brass is high as giraffe @%&# know what I mean.
Because i have a lot of other brass setting around not being used and 260 head-stamped brass is high as giraffe @%&# know what I mean.
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
Been necking down WW 7-08 brass for our 4 260s for the past year with no problems and just got a bag of WW 243 brass to neck up. Ran 50 of them thru the die, loaded same load and tried it out on the 15" circle at 900 yards with first round hit and continued hits and no problems with any ring on the neck. Looked just the same after firing as the 7-08 brass to all of us that checked them out. Wanted to check them against the 7-08 loads at the 8" at 1000 but it was just too hard to see the target in the shadows back in the woods and would have been a waste of ammo.
Am going to get a few hundred more for next year since they are cheaper and easier to find locally then WW 7-08 brass. From that day of testing so far I can't see any difference in performance. I've never seen a ring or bulge on either the 7-08 or the 243 brass after running them thru my 260 die. Am going to take a few more out this week when we visit Rayners again for some more tweaking and see how they do again on various distance targets.
Someone mentioned "quality Rem brass available", we used it for the first year at the matches and we don't shoot heavy loads and after a few reloadings the primer pockets started to get loose. We've been using the same 100 casings we have for each gun and reloading them all season and also for our practice sessions and we've still not had to toss any due to loosened primer pockets.
Topstrap
Been necking down WW 7-08 brass for our 4 260s for the past year with no problems and just got a bag of WW 243 brass to neck up. Ran 50 of them thru the die, loaded same load and tried it out on the 15" circle at 900 yards with first round hit and continued hits and no problems with any ring on the neck. Looked just the same after firing as the 7-08 brass to all of us that checked them out. Wanted to check them against the 7-08 loads at the 8" at 1000 but it was just too hard to see the target in the shadows back in the woods and would have been a waste of ammo.
Am going to get a few hundred more for next year since they are cheaper and easier to find locally then WW 7-08 brass. From that day of testing so far I can't see any difference in performance. I've never seen a ring or bulge on either the 7-08 or the 243 brass after running them thru my 260 die. Am going to take a few more out this week when we visit Rayners again for some more tweaking and see how they do again on various distance targets.
Someone mentioned "quality Rem brass available", we used it for the first year at the matches and we don't shoot heavy loads and after a few reloadings the primer pockets started to get loose. We've been using the same 100 casings we have for each gun and reloading them all season and also for our practice sessions and we've still not had to toss any due to loosened primer pockets.
Topstrap
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
I would think that the least amount of change would be the best. I have always used win 7-08 brass for my 260. Other than the lapua brass I now have. I had 0 issues with it. I have redding type s bushing dies and I would run it through the die first with no bushing and then with the bushing and had great results. Good luck
I would think that the least amount of change would be the best. I have always used win 7-08 brass for my 260. Other than the lapua brass I now have. I had 0 issues with it. I have redding type s bushing dies and I would run it through the die first with no bushing and then with the bushing and had great results. Good luck
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
Many of my wildcats had no choice except necking up. That said I prefer necking down, Fuzzy and I don't always agree but on this we do.
I had better results from my Whisper necking down(technically) 223 than necking up 221FB. May be because there is only one source for 221, and a pile of great brass for 223. Still prefer necking down for the reason Fuzzy has cited.
Many of my wildcats had no choice except necking up. That said I prefer necking down, Fuzzy and I don't always agree but on this we do.
I had better results from my Whisper necking down(technically) 223 than necking up 221FB. May be because there is only one source for 221, and a pile of great brass for 223. Still prefer necking down for the reason Fuzzy has cited.
Re: Neck Up or Neck Down ?
I have necked up 200 win 243 and 200 lapua 243 to 260 rem, pushed the shoulder an extra .010 thousands and fireformed, bras is perfect, no doughnuts and great accuracy to 1250 yds.
well worth the effort.
hope this helps.
I have necked up 200 win 243 and 200 lapua 243 to 260 rem, pushed the shoulder an extra .010 thousands and fireformed, bras is perfect, no doughnuts and great accuracy to 1250 yds.
well worth the effort.
hope this helps.
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