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Rifle Scopes Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

Lowlight

Lowlight

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Minuteman
    • Apr 12, 2001
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    Base of the Rockies
    www.snipershide.com
    Leupold Submits for the Enhanced Combat Optical System and we have one of the only units in non-government hands.

    This is a first look as we just unboxed it today.

    621485_10151268932322953_1693925858_o.jpg


    This is an awesome package being called the DAGR by Leupold.

    Not going to give out too much yet as the official press release was slated for Oct 15th, but we were allowed to leak it a bit early to the folks at SH.

    Details to follow so talk amongst yourselves for a bit
    smile.gif
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    3-18x44 with scaled down knobs? What are the turret adjustments Frank?
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    Wow,very nice indeed. Is it using a Horus reticle or...
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    it does use a Horus but that is a mistake, no two people that talk about the TreMor2 know how to use the reticle correctly and its way too muddled and confusing for most, even the scope companies have no idea.

    I just dial and ignore the mess hanging down below center.

    I think Leupold should make their own simpler version like the NF Velocity only in mils or something, forget trying to overlay 3 different things at the same time.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    Do we have a pic of the reticle at low and high power?
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    Here is the official as someone has released it


    Leupold® Introduces Submission
    for Enhanced Combat Optical Sight – Optimized Trials

    BEAVERTON, Ore. — Leupold® is pleased to introduce the next generation in long-range and close-quarter hybrid battlefield optics with the Dual Aperture Gunsight Riflescope (DAGR™), the next generation of integrated optical aiming system for modern small arms.
    Leupold’s DAGR System integrates the cutting-edge Leupold Mark 6™ 3-18x44mm riflescope with the CQB-proven Aimpoint Micro T-1. American warfighters can go from 1x to 18x in a fraction of a second with this system. With an overall length of less than 12 inches and weighing just 34.2 ounces, the Leupold ECOS-O solution delivers an incredible field of view and rapid target acquisition at an unmatched length and weight.
    “Combat troops have traditionally had to choose long-range accuracy or close-quarter speed when selecting optics,” said Chris Estadt, director of military business development for Leupold & Stevens, Inc. “ Leupold’s DAGR System has responded with a shorter, lighter, and faster optical system with unprecedented magnification range in a compact size.”
    In order to increase the combat effectiveness, Leupold engineering redesigned the elevation turret to reduce the centerline distance between the two optics to 1 ¾ of an inch. This greatly increases the speed of target acquisition for CQB engagements. The DAGR System was recently submitted as the solution for the Miniature Day/Night Sight Enhanced Combat Optical Sight – Optimized (MDNS ECOS-O) government request for proposal. This system will be available for consumers in 2013.
    Built in Leupold’s Beaverton, Ore, facility, the ECOS-O is the latest in the company’s proud military history. Currently, more long-range Leupold tactical optics are in service with the U.S. military than any other brand. Aimpoint has been delivering red dot sights to the U.S. Army since 1997.
    The foundation of the DAGR is the Mark 6 3-18x44mm, which offers a specialized short zero lock 0.1 mil adjustment dial with pop up revolution indicator and an easy-to-adjust ocular housing power magnification adjustment. The system includes a Berry Compliant carrying case, Leupold’s Mark 6® Integrated Mounting System and Sight mount.

    -- More –
    Leupold & Stevens, Inc., the preeminent American-owned optics company, employs hundreds of people in its state-of-the-art manufacturing facility near Beaverton, Ore. Family
    owned and operated, Leupold offers products that are sold worldwide to hunters, competitive shooters, American military warfighters, law enforcement personnel and wildlife observers. The product line includes rifle, handgun and spotting scopes; binoculars; rangefinders; trail cameras; mounting systems; and optical tools and accessories.

    ####

    Leupold & Stevens, Inc., P.O. Box 688, Beaverton, OR 97075-0688, U.S.A.
    (800) LEUPOLD or (503) 526-1400 • Fax: (503) 352-7621 • www.leupold.com
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    So it's simply a Mark 6 3-18x44mm scope with an Aimpoint Micro T-1 on top, right?
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So it's simply a Mark 6 3-18x44mm scope with an Aimpoint Micro T-1 on top, right?</div></div>

    yes and no, the turret is new, it's locking, zero stop, smaller -- doesn't have the ring on it

    Basically a 3-18x with 1-6x turrets
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    Is it single turn elevation like the SB?
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    No double, but 10+ mils per turn.

    There is a pop up indicator by way of the small silver button on top, off-center so you don't see it well in the pix (5'O'clock)
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think Leupold should make their own simpler version like the NF Velocity only in mils or something, forget trying to overlay 3 different things at the same time. </div></div>Now that would be nice.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    When I first saw the pic for just a second I thought this was an attempt at humor. Slap an Aimpoint on a MK6 and give it a fancy name? huh?
    Anyhow I like the MK6 and the T1, both are nice optics on there own. Just seems like an oddly cobbled together solution - especially since Leupold isn't using their own red-dot technology. You'd think they could figure out a way to make more of a built in system.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    I may be too simple minded or I'm missing something. How do you see your elevation knob to make adjustments with that Aimpoint mount in the way? Do you have to look around it or is there some peephole in the mount?
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
    yes and no, the turret is new, it's locking, zero stop, smaller -- doesn't have the ring on it

    Basically a 3-18x with 1-6x turrets </div></div>

    Does this mean that all Mark 6 3-18 going forward will have the new elevation turret? Or just this specialized model will have a different elevation turret?
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: locobob</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When I first saw the pic for just a second I thought this was an attempt at humor. Slap an Aimpoint on a MK6 and give it a fancy name? huh?
    Anyhow I like the MK6 and the T1, both are nice optics on there own. Just seems like an oddly cobbled together solution - especially since Leupold isn't using their own red-dot technology. You'd think they could figure out a way to make more of a built in system. </div></div>

    I disagree. Why reinvent the wheel. Aimpoint already has the reputation and presence in the military. By going with the aimpoint I think it works for both Leupold and Aimpoint. Why spend time and money developing a new sight when the T1 is ready now.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: D Constance</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I may be too simple minded or I'm missing something. How do you see your elevation knob to make adjustments with that Aimpoint mount in the way? Do you have to look around it or is there some peephole in the mount? </div></div>

    you can move the aimpoint to the side it doesn't have to be mounted straight up and down.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
    I think Leupold should make their own simpler version like the NF Velocity only in mils or something, forget trying to overlay 3 different things at the same time. </div></div>

    Kind of like a CMR-W but with mil elevation markings? I could see that being pretty useful.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    Now why couldn't they have put these turrets on the 3-18x44 in the first place
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    Really wish they could have a better choice or reticles in the MK 6
    smirk.gif
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    meh......I kinda like the turret on the MK6. I do like the aimpoint mount. In the age of designer reticles I really hope they decide to do something clean.

    Mount looks like it cantilevers kinda far backward. Is it going to interfere with the magnification ring. Does it take more finger dexterity to manipulate the magnification?*****never mind the whole ocular turns*****
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it does use a Horus but that is a mistake, no two people that talk about the TreMor2 know how to use the reticle correctly and its way too muddled and confusing for most, even the scope companies have no idea.

    I just dial and ignore the mess hanging down below center.

    I think Leupold should make their own simpler version like the NF Velocity only in mils or something, forget trying to overlay 3 different things at the same time. </div></div>

    I have used and like the NF Velocity 1000, but the Horus is good too. It does get busy so you do have to just look through all the stuff.

    Here is another article regarding the DAGR
    http://www.tactical-life.com/online/prod...=products_title

    Lowlight I sent you message, when you get a moment can you let me know what it is you need.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TacticalDillhole</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it does use a Horus but that is a mistake, no two people that talk about the TreMor2 know how to use the reticle correctly and its way too muddled and confusing for most, even the scope companies have no idea.

    I just dial and ignore the mess hanging down below center.

    I think Leupold should make their own simpler version like the NF Velocity only in mils or something, forget trying to overlay 3 different things at the same time. </div></div>

    I have used and like the NF Velocity 1000, but the Horus is good too. It does get busy so you do have to just look through all the stuff.

    Here is another article regarding the DAGR
    http://www.tactical-life.com/online/prod...=products_title

    Lowlight I sent you message, when you get a moment can you let me know what it is you need.</div></div>

    I have no message from you ?

    What do I need and where did you send a message ?
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TacticalDillhole</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it does use a Horus but that is a mistake, no two people that talk about the TreMor2 know how to use the reticle correctly and its way too muddled and confusing for most, even the scope companies have no idea.

    I just dial and ignore the mess hanging down below center.

    I think Leupold should make their own simpler version like the NF Velocity only in mils or something, forget trying to overlay 3 different things at the same time. </div></div>

    Sorry, PM sent

    I have used and like the NF Velocity 1000, but the Horus is good too. It does get busy so you do have to just look through all the stuff.

    Here is another article regarding the DAGR
    http://www.tactical-life.com/online/prod...=products_title

    Lowlight I sent you message, when you get a moment can you let me know what it is you need.</div></div>

    I have no message from you ?

    What do I need and where did you send a message ? </div></div>
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 33shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I disagree. Why reinvent the wheel. Aimpoint already has the reputation and presence in the military. By going with the aimpoint I think it works for both Leupold and Aimpoint. Why spend time and money developing a new sight when the T1 is ready now. </div></div>

    You obviously don't realize Leupolds red dot is also available now. They don't need to spend time and money developing a new sight, they already HAVE one. The Leupold Deltapoint is their much better open style reflex sight. It was packaged in a tactical application before on the HAMR.

    If Leupold had any marketing sense, they would have used it. By picking the Aimpoint (which is inferior IMO), they shot themselves in the foot marketing wise.

    399-leupold-deltapoint.jpg


    leupold_HAMR.jpg
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    I cannot see leupold using the aimpoint over the deltapoint unless something in the contract made them do so.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prebanpaul</div><div class="ubbcode-body">any Idea on Price
    </div></div>

    A lot.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    This Leupold tactical division is sure turning out to be something isn't it. For years Leupold just produced the same Mark 4 stuff year after year with no innovation at all. Now it seems like they are coming out with several new interesting products each year. More importantly, whether you like them or not they are not "me to" products but have genuinely new or unusual features. The quality of these new products also seems to me to be far beyond their previous products.

    To my mind I see some hits and some misses in their new offerings but I am happy to see risks being taken and totally new designs hitting the ground.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it does use a Horus but that is a mistake, no two people that talk about the TreMor2 know how to use the reticle correctly and its way too muddled and confusing for most, even the scope companies have no idea.

    I just dial and ignore the mess hanging down below center.
    </div></div>

    Frank, the requirement for which this scope was developed specifies that the optic will be issued to every operator, for their M4 (obviously this is a SOF initiative and not big Army). As such there is a reason why Horus was chosen, this optic is meant to replace all 1/4x Elcans, ACOGs, and red dots with one common optic. The majority of guys using them won't be sniper qualified, nor will they have the time to be dialing anything.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    Looks like a great combination, Aimpoint T1 and those low pro turrets on the MK 6
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KSwift</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 33shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I disagree. Why reinvent the wheel. Aimpoint already has the reputation and presence in the military. By going with the aimpoint I think it works for both Leupold and Aimpoint. Why spend time and money developing a new sight when the T1 is ready now. </div></div>

    You obviously don't realize Leupolds red dot is also available now. They don't need to spend time and money developing a new sight, they already HAVE one. The Leupold Deltapoint is their much better open style reflex sight. It was packaged in a tactical application before on the HAMR.

    If Leupold had any marketing sense, they would have used it. By picking the Aimpoint (which is inferior IMO), they shot themselves in the foot marketing wise.

    399-leupold-deltapoint.jpg


    leupold_HAMR.jpg
    </div></div>

    There's a reason the military uses Aimpoints and not Deltapoints. If you think the T1 is inferior then you should really do some research. Do a search for Daniel Defense's DDM4 torture test and see what the Aimpoint T1 survived.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    Let's see. A Leupold scope with an RDS mounted to it. What is so innovative about that?

    Its been done many times before.........

    OPTIC1.jpg
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    Looks pretty cool, but nothing earth shattering. I wonder how outragous the price is gonna be on this.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    I dont't think it was meant to be earth shattering, it was meant to fill a request and solve a problem presented to them by Crane. For an a one stop solutions instead of piecing it together.

    The Mark 6 of the system is the change, 3-18x in a package about the size of your 3-10x, paired with the Aimpoint, (clearly a request) and then attached both with Leupold mounts.

    What this does is give the shooter a single solution, is it the absolute perfect earth shattering one, maybe not, but it is still a great solution for a lot of people, including the military not looking to part it out. I am pretty sure if Crane asked for a Red Dot like a Delta Point or RMR it would have been there, but instead an Aimpoint is on there ... that is clue.

    yes we can all point to something done before, got it... but when people ask about Leupold and we talk about the past and present, clearly there is a new distinction here.

    Leupold is listening, Leupold is responding and Leupold is willing to go the extra distance to make this happen before the other guy.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's perfect on a Mk12

    332178_10151270914467953_865476895_o.jpg
    </div></div>

    I don't believe you, please send it to me so I can try it on my HCS MK12 Mod1
    laugh.gif


    I was thinking last night that this set-up would be the sh!t on a MK 12 with a CMR-W calibrated for MK262
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    Nice. Compact, great magnification range, and low profile turrets. Anyone from Kahles taking notes?!?
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    since mk6 doesn't have illumination:
    1. why not to move elevation turret to the left side of the scope completely?
    2. why not embend aimpoint mount into scope body after p.1

    anyway - i like the compact look of mk6

    PS
    mark 6 = $2500 (MSRP),
    aimpoint T1 2MOA = $650 (MSRP)
    aimpoint mount = $150 (estimate)
    overal price - $3300 (estimate MSRP)

    mark 8 CQBSS - price $2999 for MTMR, or $3500 for H27-D...

    something not right in that picture....
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    Frank,

    Can you confirm that the eye relief on this scope doesn't change with magnification change? Leupold's website says it only changes .1 inches which would certainly be different than what they have done in the past.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    I will, most scope will change slightly, the higher the mag, the shorter the eye relief.

    But I will give you an answer
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: vtb</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
    1. why not to move elevation turret to the left side of the scope completely?
    </div></div>

    Now that would be cute to see ANYBODY try. I'm not sure you understand how scope turrets work though, it would be a considerable design challenge (expensive) to have accurate opposing scope turrets.
     
    Re: Sniper's Hide Exclusive First Look, Leupold DAGR

    2 KSwift
    i understand how the turrets work.
    I not propose to move elevation mechanism to the left side (which basically moves inside the scopetube and travel is around 2 mm)
    I propose to move control turret with markings to the left side (which is the bulkiest part sitting on the elevation mechanism and obscuring view)

    Systems when direction of drive from the drive shaft must be turned 90 degrees are used for ages.
     
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