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Rifle Scopes PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

Fustle

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Minuteman
Sep 15, 2012
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Pearland, TX
After much research, head scratching, window shopping, etc., I've settled on these choices for a scope going on an AR in 308:

<span style="text-decoration: line-through"> Vortex Viper PST 2.5-10x44</span> <--- dropped due to fixed parallax
Vortex Viper PST 4-16x50 <--- added per recommendations below (haven't seen the glass but wonder about comments elsewhere it's not up to Bushy; 6-24x50 not in play due to 100 yd FOV less than I want)
Sightron Siii SS 3.5-10x44
<span style="text-decoration: line-through">Burris MTAC 3.5-10x42</span> <--- eye relief lower than expected
Leupold Mark 4 LR/T <span style="text-decoration: line-through">2.5-10x44</span> 3.5-10x40

Added to the mix:
Weaver Tactical 3.5-15x50 mil/mil (how did I miss listing?!)
Bushnell Elite Tactical 2.5-16x42 Mil Dot
Bushnell Elite Tactical 3-12x44 Mil Dot
Bushnell Elite Tactical 3-12x44 BTR-Mil
Bushnell Elite Tactical 3-12x44 G2DMR
(Thanks for inputs on Bushy. They niggled at me all night. I must have confused them with another brand! I did check HDMR - like the reticle, but want more 100 yd FOV @ 10x than the 3.5-21 has.)

What I'd like to know - based on your personal experience using any or all of the above - is whether any are more likely or less likely than the others to have any issues working well through:

2,000+ rounds fired (gotta know it will last a while)
High heat and humidity (Houston area gets >100 degrees F and >90% humidity with regularity during May-Sep)

Thanks,
Prep for Zombies
----------------
It's not pertinent to the above, but based on responses I've seen to other specific questions it's gonna come up:

What am I shooting? Various ranges from 100 to 1,000+, target / fun / skill development in case of SHTF.

Why 308? - wanted 30-06 but it's tough to find in tactical auto loaders (no big bucks available for a Cobb MCR). 308 is reasonably cheap to shoot, has pretty decent range, and won't kick me or wife on ass (like 458 SOCOM probably would)

Why those scopes? - want fully tactical knobs, Mil Dot or similar calibrated ranging reticle that does not limit it's useful range (such as Z-600 does), SF or AO, 80+ MOA adjustment, keep max mag to 10x so mirage is not a major problem, need variable mag for FOV in case of near-CQB situation. I can appreciate what NF or USO offer, but am not in position now to go that expensive. As it is I am searching for used on the above. Yes, I've looked at <span style="text-decoration: line-through">Bushnell (only a couple ET have good MOA - for me that puts their design quality in question since they seem to have trouble getting >50 on most),</span> IOR - SWFA - S&B - Hensoldt - PFI - Horus (pricey), Meopta - Nikon (low MOAs), Zeiss (like the glass, hate the ranging reticles). Others missed the cut for Made in China, no US warranty, glass (needs to be equal to or better than Leupold VX3 for my taste), and other things that led to "nah, don't wanna do that."

Why an AR? - for faster follow-up shots than a regular bolt action, and more flexibility than a BAR for future changes.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

I've been to Houston so I understand why you'd mention CQB that place is a war zone.

TBH I liked my IOR 3-18 on my 308 AR the best and followed by an IOR 10X. The glass is great and the reticule works well for practical holds on a 308. SWFA 3-9 was a good scope too and I hear nothing but good about the sightron 3-10 mil mil.

edit: USO 10X is another great optic for a 308 AR if you can handle a fixed 10X.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hlwpt</div><div class="ubbcode-body">No IOR 3-18 on the list?? </div></div>

As noted in the background after my question, IOR is out of my price range.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Yasherka</div><div class="ubbcode-body">USO? </div></div>

As noted in background after question, USO is out of my price range. Really wish it wasn't.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Nuttshooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">No Bushnell HDMR? </div></div>

Understand some folks love Bushnell. Almost went there myself. But found that few versions of their tactical scopes had good elevation adjustment (above 50). I have no issue with folks choosing them. For my use though, seeing a range of a particular design type having difficulty hitting high MOA tells me either their design approach, or their manufacturing process control, is too close to the limits of their capability in areas that trade off for it. I'd rather not have to wonder what 'feature' I might discover later. Some call me picky (or worse).
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

I know you don't want to go over 10x however I would say my vote goes towards the PST if it were the 6-24x. . . If you are looking at a Leupold, a very overlooked option is the 4.5-14x 40mm LR/T Mk 4, and to upgrade to the M5(mil) dials it's only $160 for their custom shop to do. I own the Mk 4 and gotta say the only thing I don't like about it is that it's not a Nightforce. Also based on my past experience with Burris can't forget to mention them either. Although with the MTAC I would say get the 6.5-20x. Just keep in mind you can always dial down to 10x if you get a higher power.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BCP</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've been to Houston so I understand why you'd mention CQB that place is a war zone.

TBH I liked my IOR 3-18 on my 308 AR the best and followed by an IOR 10X. The glass is great and the reticule works well for practical holds on a 308. SWFA 3-9 was a good scope too and I hear nothing but good about the sightron 3-10 mil mil.

edit: USO 10X is another great optic for a 308 AR if you can handle a fixed 10X. </div></div>

Yeah, parts of H-town are rough. Rarely see just one bubble gum machine make a stop anywhere around here.

Like what I've seen of IORs. Thought about 10x fixed, but don't have the peripheral vision or tactical experience to feel good about FOV for movement inside of 300 yards. Don't have good mobility for evading baddies if they get that close, so need all the advantage I can get.

Thanks,
P
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Nuttshooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">No Bushnell HDMR? </div></div>

Understand some folks love Bushnell. Almost went there myself. But found that few versions of their tactical scopes had good elevation adjustment (above 50). I have no issue with folks choosing them. For my use though, seeing a range of a particular design type having difficulty hitting high MOA tells me either their design approach, or their manufacturing process control, is too close to the limits of their capability in areas that trade off for it. I'd rather not have to wonder what 'feature' I might discover later. Some call me picky (or worse). </div></div>

I own their 2.5-16 tactical... The only gripe I have with it is that the turrets are MOA. Its solid for what it is. This model has 120 MOA elevation. I'm pretty sure as said above you shouldn't have problems with any of their current offerings, including the lower power mil/mils.

If planning on shooting from various distances quickly (as you mentioned above), having an AO and capped turrets like the MTAC line would frustrate me personally. Also, the g2 reticle is nice but in my opinion eye relief was pretty critical in the model you are looking at.

Good luck with your search-
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> ...

2,000+ rounds fired (gotta know it will last a while)
High heat and humidity (Houston area gets >100 degrees 90% humidity with regularity during May-Sep)

...

Thanks,
Prep for Zombies

...

Why an AR? - for faster follow-up shots than a regular bolt action, and more flexibility than a BAR for future changes. </div></div>

What's your EIACPSM (estimated infected ambulatory cadavers per square mile)?

crazy.gif
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

For a 10x scope in your price range, I wouls pick the SS 10x42HD. You will not have any let downs with it.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Veer_G</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> ...

2,000+ rounds fired (gotta know it will last a while)
High heat and humidity (Houston area gets >100 degrees 90% humidity with regularity during May-Sep)

...

Thanks,
Prep for Zombies

...

Why an AR? - for faster follow-up shots than a regular bolt action, and more flexibility than a BAR for future changes. </div></div>

What's your EIACPSM (estimated infected ambulatory cadavers per square mile)?

crazy.gif
</div></div>

The applicable Combined Metropolitan Statistical Area (CMSA) official population demographic for July 2010 is 5,891,999. Let us assume total human deaths to date are equal to the current population. Infected ambulatory cadaver rates, based on multiple documentaries issued by Hollywood, appear to typically be 80% of available corpses, and for small towns (population under 5,000) appear to typically be 50% of live population . Since highly infectious disease rates accelerate with population density, let us assume a 10% increase with each order of magnitude increase in population. Log(5,891,999 / 5,000) = 3.07 x 10%, or a total EIAC rate from living population of 50%+31= 81%. EIAC total is (80% x 5,891,999) + (81% x 5,891,999) = 9,486,118. Assuming random distribution of EIAC motion, with 50% outside Loop 610 moving inward and 50% inside 610 moving outward, at Beltway 8 the linear EIAC density per perimeter mile is 50% x 9,486,118 / 83.128 miles = 57,057 EIAC per mile. Beltway 8 distance through Pearland is approximately 10 miles, for a total EIAC volume of 570,570 on 47.5 square miles, for an EIACPSM of 12,012! And that's just the average - doesn't account for time varying function. If they are optimized IACs, their time varying distribution will be controlled to a 6-sigma function. Assuming 2 miles per hour ambulatory rate, +/- 3 sigma must be no more than +/- 1.5 miles per hour (else statistical outliers are non-mobile, which are already accounted for in the 80% corpse ambulatory rate), +/- 1 sigma (67%) will be roughly +/- 0.5 miles per hour. IAC travel time to 4 miles outside Beltway 8 (my location - everyone else can do their own math) is 2 hours +/- 24 minutes. Within that 67%, the earliest IAC travels an additional 1 mile at the 2 hour mark, and the slowest travels 1 mile less. This creates an IAC peak area 2 miles in depth and 10 miles long. 67% x 570,570 / 20 sq mi = 19,114 EIACPSM peak average for 48 minutes. I'm gonna need more bullets...
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dogman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">what the fuck </div></div>

Literally LMFAO. This is what happens when people give their TI graphing calculators damned nicknames.

laugh.gif
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dogman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">what the fuck </div></div>

You said it I thought it.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

Of the choices given, I have a Vortex Viper PST 2.5-10 power, a Sightron SIII 6-24 power and a Leupold Mark 4 LRT 6.5-20 power. I know the powers don't match up exactly, but I'll tell you my experiences.

I'm disappointed in Leupold because they do some "rounding" in their stated powers. With them, a stated 2.5 power might actually be a 2.8 and their 10 power might actually be a 9.7 or something. Not crazy about that rounding. Otherwise, quality is great. This was originally mounted on my DPMS LR-308, but changed because it didn't have the internal adjustment range the Sightron has. The reticle lines are on the thicker side.

My Sightron SIII is great. Have no complaints. The internal adjustment range is ridiculous (mean impressive), but I don't know what it is on the lesser powered version. This is the only scope of the 3 I have listed that isn't illuminated. Don't know if you want yours to be illuminated or not. The reticle lines are thickest on this scope of the 3. This is the one that is currently mounted on my 18.5 inch barreled DPMS LR-308.

My Vortex PST is great. Can't beat their guarantee. A company can match it, but they can't beat it. If ANYTHING happens to the scope, Vortex will make it right without question. Surprisingly, the reticle lines are thinnest on this scope. Seems it is more for precision, but if the lines aren't lit and you have a dark background, they are difficult to see.

If they were in the same price range (within approximately $50-$75), I'd probably go with the Vortex. They are all sealed against humidity and excellent quality, but the tie-breaker for me would be Vortex's guarantee.

Hope this helps.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BobD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

If planning on shooting from various distances quickly (as you mentioned above), having an AO and capped turrets like the MTAC line would frustrate me personally. Also, the g2 reticle is nice but in my opinion eye relief was pretty critical in the model you are looking at.

Good luck with your search- </div></div>

I missed the MTAC having capped turrets! No love for that here.
Thanks,
P
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

The OP mentioned price being a concern, that's why USO wasn't mentioned as a choice. The PST will be all the scope you need for your intended application. Lifetime warranty if you ever need it and glass as good as any.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hewlett260</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I know you don't want to go over 10x however I would say my vote goes towards the PST if it were the 6-24x. . . If you are looking at a Leupold, a very overlooked option is the 4.5-14x 40mm LR/T Mk 4, and to upgrade to the M5(mil) dials it's only $160 for their custom shop to do. I own the Mk 4 and gotta say the only thing I don't like about it is that it's not a Nightforce. Also based on my past experience with Burris can't forget to mention them either. Although with the MTAC I would say get the 6.5-20x. Just keep in mind you can always dial down to 10x if you get a higher power. </div></div>

+1 on Mark 4 turret options. Also high on my list since almost every review / commentary about anything less than NF / S&B / USO uses Mark 4 as the gold standard ("glass as good as Mark 4").

Starting to look like I need to eat cheap for a bit to get what I want.

Thanks,
P
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

Longrangehunting is Full of old fat guys who love leupolds and hate everything else. Id take it with a grain of salt.

edit: FWIW my mk4 4.5-14 definitely has some lens glare, probably more than my bushnell 3-12s have, but it's not a make or break sort of thing and it is still a fine scope. Also I still vote that you buy a super sniper 3-9.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Discussion linked below talks about glare issues with PST and Siii.

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f18/viper-vs-siii-99749/

Agree / disagree? Does Mark 4 have the same issue?

Thanks,
P </div></div>

Don't believe everything you read- I wouldn't let one persons comment in that article deter you from buying either scope.
Problem with glare compared to what? High end glass will have better contrast, but they were talking about fading and washing out at higher magnifications (20x+ and that can become a problem for most scopes when their are light issues) you should not encounter that at 10x. In light of what was said there are plenty of people who are satisfied with the 6-24 pst.

What scope are you using now? It may be helpful to know what expectations you have.
You mentioned skill building; I would think the pst or mark 4 would be suited fine for that and capable of performing better than most of those who use them. Either will last a long time.

I think much of this boils down to what features you need and would like to spend money on. Again, if I was in your shoes and choosing an all purpose scope for distances that varied that much I would seek for greater range and slightly higher magnification. You mentioned issues with the climate, maybe it would be helpful to have more magnification and learn more when it needs to be dialed back (embrace the conditions you have) opposed to attempting to avoid it. Just a thought

Good luck, don't settle for less than you're looking for-
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<span style="text-decoration: line-through">Burris MTAC 3.5-10x42</span><--- out of play (capped turrets! Thanks BobD)</div></div>

FYI- the Burris does NOT have standard capped turrets, they have target turrets that can be capped- meaning you can remove the caps and run it like standard exposed turrets or cap them when you want to make sure they won't turn. Best of both worlds, IMO. I can take pics if you'd like.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Red_SC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<span style="text-decoration: line-through">Burris MTAC 3.5-10x42</span><--- out of play (capped turrets! Thanks BobD)</div></div>

FYI- the Burris does NOT have standard capped turrets, they have target turrets that can be capped- meaning you can remove the caps and run it like standard exposed turrets or cap them when you want to make sure they won't turn. Best of both worlds, IMO. I can take pics if you'd like. </div></div>

^^^ That's correct, they are not standard as one would normally associate that style. They are target style/finger adjustable underneath and from my understanding still rated to withstand weather. Burris suggested using the caps in more extreme weather but said they were still sealed well enough to not use the caps. They are different from the tactical style as on the XTR so ...That's my miscommunication...

I have handled that specific model was not aware that they were intended to be used optionally without the caps.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hewlett260</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I know you don't want to go over 10x however I would say my vote goes towards the PST if it were the 6-24x. . . If you are looking at a Leupold, a very overlooked option is the 4.5-14x 40mm LR/T Mk 4, and to upgrade to the M5(mil) dials it's only $160 for their custom shop to do. I own the Mk 4 and gotta say the only thing I don't like about it is that it's not a Nightforce. Also based on my past experience with Burris can't forget to mention them either. Although with the MTAC I would say get the 6.5-20x. Just keep in mind you can always dial down to 10x if you get a higher power. </div></div>

I hear you. Trying to range with SFP reticle, and avoid mirage problems when ranging, makes me think I need to cap at 10x so that I'm calibrated there. If I could pop for FFP, I'd go for higher mag like you suggest.

Thanks,
P
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Red_SC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<span style="text-decoration: line-through">Burris MTAC 3.5-10x42</span><--- out of play (capped turrets! Thanks BobD)</div></div>

FYI- the Burris does NOT have standard capped turrets, they have target turrets that can be capped- meaning you can remove the caps and run it like standard exposed turrets or cap them when you want to make sure they won't turn. Best of both worlds, IMO. I can take pics if you'd like. </div></div>

That is fantastic news! Pics would be great but not necessary. They'll be on my short list for this weekend's GS.

You anywhere near Goose Creek? Wife's family is out that way.

Thanks,
P
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LocoGringo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Of the choices given, I have a Vortex Viper PST 2.5-10 power, a Sightron SIII 6-24 power and a Leupold Mark 4 LRT 6.5-20 power. I know the powers don't match up exactly, but I'll tell you my experiences.

I'm disappointed in Leupold because they do some "rounding" in their stated powers. With them, a stated 2.5 power might actually be a 2.8 and their 10 power might actually be a 9.7 or something. Not crazy about that rounding. Otherwise, quality is great. This was originally mounted on my DPMS LR-308, but changed because it didn't have the internal adjustment range the Sightron has. The reticle lines are on the thicker side.

My Sightron SIII is great. Have no complaints. The internal adjustment range is ridiculous (mean impressive), but I don't know what it is on the lesser powered version. This is the only scope of the 3 I have listed that isn't illuminated. Don't know if you want yours to be illuminated or not. The reticle lines are thickest on this scope of the 3. This is the one that is currently mounted on my 18.5 inch barreled DPMS LR-308.

My Vortex PST is great. Can't beat their guarantee. A company can match it, but they can't beat it. If ANYTHING happens to the scope, Vortex will make it right without question. Surprisingly, the reticle lines are thinnest on this scope. Seems it is more for precision, but if the lines aren't lit and you have a dark background, they are difficult to see.

If they were in the same price range (within approximately $50-$75), I'd probably go with the Vortex. They are all sealed against humidity and excellent quality, but the tie-breaker for me would be Vortex's guarantee.

Hope this helps. </div></div>

Thanks, those are good puts. I wondered about Luepy mags, just hadn't checked the Mark 4 calibration info to see if its odd values would work somehow.

I don't need illumination, except maybe for the PST per your comments. If it is dark enough I can't see the reticle, I probably can't see any target either without NV (illumination will wash it out for me; understand may not be true for everyone).

Mucho gracias,
P
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

[quote/BobD]
... What scope are you using now? ...

... helpful to have more magnification and learn more when it needs to be dialed back (embrace the conditions you have) opposed to attempting to avoid it. Just a thought

Good luck, don't settle for less than you're looking for-
[/quote]

Good perspective on learning the tool. This is actually my first build. Been researching most of this year. Started out headed to a standard bolt action. Then my wife - bless her heart for real - asked me why I wasn't looking at ARs cuz they look badass (her words!). After very little digging found LR308 and LAR-8 and their accuracy, and I was sold.

She took me to a range for my b-day, got to shoot a full auto AK47. Fun! Didn't care the stock or forend, but AR is another story.

Thanks,
P
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
That is fantastic news! Pics would be great but not necessary. They'll be on my short list for this weekend's GS.

You anywhere near Goose Creek? Wife's family is out that way.

Thanks,
P </div></div>

Cell phone pic of turrets

2AA3BB7D-9424-4051-80E2-EF57BC5CC1CE-6922-000005D3562CA5B8.jpg




I've had the scope since early summer, but just after receiving it I sent the rifle off to be rebarreled. It's on the way back now, so I should have some actual input before too long.

I'm about 2.5 hours from Goose Creek, I have family in that area as well. Charleston has some fascinating history to explore.
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

Maybe this can clarify a bit.

Here's the Mtac with caps off...
55929a67e1cad238a1b2714a3ed5c271.jpg


Burris xtac
7bfdd35555c001fdb884fbbb3a8009a0.jpg


More traditional capped
8be42940267f2bdb1008d94ec83a333e.jpg


Pst exposed
db21a3daa109a8cbb08eab3139dd35fb.jpg


Mark 4 lrt
89cf95110b9aedfb2b1d54659c1fe57e.jpg


Although the mtac are able to use without caps, I see them a bit different than traditional exposed turrets. I do not remember if the mtac's turrets wear indexing marks.
Hope this clears a bit up-
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

Good comparison, here are the MTAC and Leupold Mark 4 together for size comparison. The MTAC does have index marks.

BE389A50-F86B-452C-A298-06C2F773189C-6922-000005D8AD7EC65B.jpg
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

You guys rock!

Like the turrets on all, but +1 for PST and LR/T. Hope to get hands-on this weekend and make a decision.

Thanks,
P
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Yeah, parts of H-town are rough. Rarely see just one bubble gum machine make a stop anywhere around here.

Like what I've seen of IORs. Thought about 10x fixed, but don't have the peripheral vision or tactical experience to feel good about FOV for movement inside of 300 yards. Don't have good mobility for evading baddies if they get that close, so need all the advantage I can get.

Thanks,
P </div></div>

Maybe you should consider adding a red dot for close in work. I was using this set up on my AR15 with the dot zeroed at 50 yards. Beyond that I used the Burris with balistic plex reticle out to 500 yards and it worked great.


Arwithscopeandreddot_zps9022775d.jpg
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Luky</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Maybe you should consider adding a red dot for close in work. I was using this set up on my AR15 with the dot zeroed at 50 yards. Beyond that I used the Burris with balistic plex reticle out to 500 yards and it worked great.

</div></div>

Good suggestion. I'll have a look at it.
Thanks,
P
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

To keep in perspective :

2012-09-01_22-17-34_715.jpg



090112003021.jpg
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

Appreciate your help. Sorry for being dense - which scope is this? What am I not noticing in the picture?

Thanks,
P
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Appreciate your help. Sorry for being dense - which scope is this? What am I not noticing in the picture?

Thanks,
P </div></div>

Forgot to label-
Noticed you threw Bushnell on your list, this is what the elite tactical look like (in MOA). For comparison to the others you were looking at.

The pic above is from my 2.5-16x42 elite tactical
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BobD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Appreciate your help. Sorry for being dense - which scope is this? What am I not noticing in the picture?

Thanks,
P </div></div>

Forgot to label-
Noticed you threw Bushnell on your list, this is what the elite tactical look like (in MOA). For comparison to the others you were looking at.

The pic above is from my 2.5-16x42 elite tactical</div></div>

Got it! Thanks for the pics, they do help fill in some of the blanks I had. Is the low light performance as good as it seems? What has been your experience ranging with it, since it is MOA/MIL and SFP? I love the 120 MOA, and the ranging issue is my lone issue at this point.

Thanks,
P
 
Re: PST vs MTAC vs Siii vs Mark 4 for an AR in 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BobD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prep for Zombies</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Appreciate your help. Sorry for being dense - which scope is this? What am I not noticing in the picture?

Thanks,
P </div></div>

Forgot to label-
Noticed you threw Bushnell on your list, this is what the elite tactical look like (in MOA). For comparison to the others you were looking at.

The pic above is from my 2.5-16x42 elite tactical</div></div>

Got it! Thanks for the pics, they do help fill in some of the blanks I had. Is the low light performance as good as it seems? What has been your experience ranging with it, since it is MOA/MIL and SFP? I love the 120 MOA, and the ranging issue is my lone issue at this point.

Thanks,
P </div></div>

This particular model's reticle is correct at 10x (most commonly used) and can be divided at different magnification when necessary (it's marked in red on the mag ring). Eye relief is a constant 4 inches and quite forgiving in my opinion.
I wish they offered this model in mil/mil and/or the g2 reticle but unfortunately their is usually a trade off in this price range. It is not as intuitive to have MOA adjustments on a mil reticle but you can still be proficient with it. To be honest, I haven't had the scope long enough to provide any comprehensive feedback and have recently switched it into a different mount. All of my initial impression have been very positive.

I took these pics a while back, with the scope laying on a table... Little over a month ago, approx. 7:45pm with only a minute or two between pics. I actually sat on a bench and waited for the sun to completely set. It was usable beyond my expectations. Pay no mind to the focus, it was beyond the ability of my phones camera in low light. I could still see the reticle and focus just fine, meant more to demonstrate how little light loss there is through the scope.
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I did a quick overview of it here http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...471#Post3543471

I'm pretty sure you will be happy with any of the choices on your list, they are all solid scopes. Pick one that has the features that best fit your needs, which may change... Different tool for different job