Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

[TheLion]

So I have been debating on whether or not to get into reloading for my AR15 and am at the point where I'm ready to jump in, I have been looking around a little and this is the basic setup I'm thinking of starting with. I'm not dead set on any of these products, and am hoping some of you will take the time to say yay or nay, make recommendations or offer other solutions perhaps. Thanks in Advance!

223 Full length Die
Full case die

223 Die Set
Another Die Set

Hornady® Lock-N-Load® Classic Deluxe Reloading Kit
Reloading Kit

Consumables:
Lapua Brass
Brass

Remington 7 1/2 Small Rifle Primers
Primers

Hornady 22 cal. 75 gr. A-MAX Rounds
Rounds

Reloader 15 Powder
Powder

 

[MALLARD]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

if you havnt done allot of research , now is the time to start. Im not sure why you picked RL for your AR , i believe most guys use varget , so you probably should as well.

why the amax's ? i'd shoot an smk. Personally , i think amax's suck. They never grouped better then my smks.

eh , those hornady dies. They are ok , they are kind of expensive. I think you should get a redding s type bushing die if you got money to spend. It can size both loaded and unloaded ammo. If your going a cheap route , try the lee RGB dies , they are cheap, .

lapua brass for a semiauto and a newbie reloader ? na , get some cheap shit brass , probably swept once fires , learn to load those. I wouldnt use lapua in a semi auto, my ARs tend to fuck up brass.

i dont reccomend any kit , kits are for suckers. Buy in pieces. I dont even see a fucking trimmer in that kit. The hammer is stupid to. Buy a cam lock die for pulling bullets. Get a trimmer. Depending on the brass you plan on reloading , you might need a swage and primer pocket uniformer/correction tool. Hopefully youll get a trimmer that comes with an optional swage attachment ( brass with crimps in the primer pockets require allot of attention.)

get some hornady 1 shot wax , that is good stuff ( the wax not the spray)

 

[TheLion]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

Gotta love a guy that doesn't mind telling it like he thinks it is...I'm not set on anything I listed, but I wanted to get to a starting point that seemed somewhat reasonable and then ask people that know if I'm close to the mark or way off base.

I'm taking all input seriously on this as I'd prefer to not start buying stuff then realize I'm fubar.

 

[NoFail]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

+ 1 with MALLARD on the Lapua brass, don't start with that anyway it's too expensive for newby with AR.

What are the specs of your AR barrel? More research, if you haven't already, will give better idea about bullet weight choice.

I can't speak for all that other stuff because I don't use it. I like my Forster BR sizing FL die & Forster Ultra seating die in a Dillon 550 press used to feed my AR.

Think about trimmer, case mouth chamfer & debur tool, flash hole duburing tool, powder scale, and all the best gauges you can get.

 

[ksthomas]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

Let's take this one step further here; what else do you have that you can reload for? I'll tell you right now, an AR isn't the place to start for a newbie. Reloading for ARs, or any other gas gun/self loader for that matter, is advanced handloading. If you have a bolt gun, that's where you want to start. Very simple, forgiving of mistakes and far more tolerant of minor misadjustments than a gas gun will be.

Your powder choice is just fine, and RL-15 is one of the most popular choices for heavy weight bullets in the 223. The other is Varget, and competitive shooters are about evenly split between the two. For lighter bullets (those under about 75 grains), go with a faster powder; H322, N135, 748 or something like that.

As far as the brass and other components go, what are you planning on doing with the gun, and how is it set up? The 75s aren't going to work in a slower twist rifle, and you didn't describe the gun beyond its being an AR. A 1x8" twist will be needed for these, or anything heavier (longer), though you might skate by with a 1x9" in some conditions. As far as the brass, I use Lapua in my competitive ammo, but will also use WW and LC for some of my short range stuff. Depends on what you need from the ammo, as to whether or not it's worth it to you. But remember, the GIGO (Garbage In, Garbage Out) principle applies to ammo just as it does computers. I'd suggest starting with some reading material. First, a basic reloading manual that covers the reloading process. Hopefully, one of the ones that has added material relating to reloading for gas guns like the AR. And second, a more advanced book like Glen Zediker's "Handloading for Competition", which contains a wealth of information relating to the gas guns. Worth its weight in gold, especially for someone new to reloading for Service Rifles.

 

[TheLion]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

At this point I have two AR's, one is a 1/7 and the other is 1/8. Both are 16 inch barrels, one is chrome lined (Colt LE6940) the other melonite treated (S&W M&P Sport 15). I'm mainly planning on reloading for my 1/7. I will eventually pick up a higher end AR with a SS barrel, but holding off on that for now.

I am planning on picking up a book or two, but am planning on buying the equipment at the same time since now is a good time financially for that.

The only other gun I have is a H&K USP 40, which I rarely use and wouldn't be handloading for anytime soon.

 

[ksthomas]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

I'd move the books up to the first purchase spot, since this could wind up saving you some money down the road. Buying the wrong equipment (like Neck Sizing dies) for an AR adds up pretty quickly and can be avoided by using the info the books provide. You'd definately be better off starting with a bolt gun of some sort before diving into the deep end of the pool here. You'll need the guidance that Zediker's book will provide, at least where the gas guns are concerned. Don't be afraid to ask questions, but make sure the info is coming from someone who knows the ins and outs of reloading for Service Rifles.

 

[FamilyMan]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

One thing to think about and I don't know if any one mentioned it because I skimmed through their responses, is if I remember correctly the 75 amax won't load to mag length unless you seat them deep in the case which leaves you with quite a jump to the riflings so take that into consideration when you choose the bullet your goon to load. I remember that is what I didn't go with the AMax's when I reloaded for an AR.

 

[rduckwor]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

Though I'm a noob here, I have been reloading for quite a while.

I suggest that you start on the cheap end.

Skip the Lapua brass and get some once fired 223 or 5.56 cases and learn what you are about to go thru reloading for a gas gun.

Believe me, My eyes were rapidly opened when I first started loading for rifle in general.

There is a lot more case prep and general work than running pistol on a progressive press.

My first 223 loads were with Lee dies, (still O.K. by me), Ramshot TAC, range pick-up brass and the cheapest Remington bullets I could find.

While you can crank out plinking stuff in 223/556 on a progressive, I believe that you will be better served running everything for a while on a single stage press. You really have to think about what you are doing on a single stage rather than just yanking the handle on a progressive.

There is a wealth of knowledge here and I'm certain that my way is not necessarily the best way.

These are just my thoughts and experiences. Hope they are helpful.


Good Luck,

 

[mdavlee]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

I have loaded some for ARs and the 69 smk will shoot great at mag length. The 75 a max won't fit at mag length. I used varget and could group 4 shots after a sighter in 3.5" at 400 yards with a 16" bushmaster 1:9 twist. I've got a good deal on brass on here for 223. There was some good prices yesterday for some once fired. I think it was $100 for 1k. I have rcbs stuff for everything but the scale. I picked up a hornady electronic scale and it speeds up the process tremendously compared to a balance beam scale.

 

[The Mechanic]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

Can't believe I am actually going to say this but unless you shoot a lot, and think you will enjoy reloading maybe you should skip reloading. You need to justify the cost of reloading. It will set you back an easy $500 just to get you started without any (advanced) equipment. It is time intensive and unless you are going for specific loading you can get some very accurate factory loads these days. You may even want to see if you have shooting buddies that may want to share expenses. IMHO

 

[pjparker]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

Plenty of good info here for your benefit. I am with the "ditch the Lapua" croud for starters, I would go with new WW brass.

That said, the real savings is in reloading the brass you already have. You will not be saving much by buying new empty brass to start with.

Read everything you can get hold of and read and re-read the getting started posts here on the Hide. Good food for thought in posts above by Kevin Thomas and Mallard.

You will be better off starting off with the 69 grainers as already suggested by mdavlee. Getting heavier is getting into the specialty area for AR's, and only perform up to par when loaded long and single fed in a 1:8 twist barrel. (My opinion, which others may not agree)

Accurateshooter.com has a comprehensive write-up on the .223 cartrige, as well as others. It's worth a look.

After 30 years of buying a bunch of stuff I thought I would need and don't now use, I am firmly in the camp of the believers that say "don't buy The Kit". Do enough research to know what you need and buy only that stuff. Also be aware that reloading can be a tedious chore that can seem to take forever, or it can become an addictive hobby where you find yourself going shooting, just so you have empties to reload....It will depend on your personality.

Good luck, hope some of this helps.

Paul

 

[TheLion]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

I really appreciate the feedback guys. I'm gathering info from multiple sources and taking it all seriously. One response to explain myself a bit in terms of buying brass at the outset. While learning, it seemed prudent to me to start with brass that is already clean, to minimize a step in the process. I would still run it through the sizing, trimming etc, but I wanted to start 'clean' if you will to make jumping in easier. After I am satisfied with the results of my efforts I'll start cleaning and reloading the cases I used during the process.

I know some people say people should jump in the deep end first, and often I do, but this just seemed a logical step for how my brain works.

 

[Deadshot2]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

I agree with those that suggest starting on a single stage. That said, most with AR's sooner or later end up on a progressive.

Here's a suggestion. Take a look at the Dillon 550 Basic. It's in the area of $250-260 for a basic press. In the basic form it operates much like a turret press with all dies installed and adjusted. Rather than moving the dies you just move the cases through by hand. The "Basic" has no automatic primer feeder or automatic powder dispenser but they can be added later if the user wants to upgrade.

The "Basic" is a good way to learn and there's no upgrade penalty like buying a separate single stage then having to buy a complete progressive later.

Just another thought.

 

[sentry1]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

I'm in the same boat as you, OP. The old timer here (locally, I mean), swears by this book:

Lee Modern Reloading, 2nd Ed Revised

In fact, he recommended I buy it, instead of the Hornady and Sierra books he sold in his store, so I bought it from Midway.

Also got a Lee Classic Cast press and a Hornady LnL conversion kit. Good single stage, and if you buy a cheap knife at Midway, you'll get it all for $2 shipping (plus the coupon codes Midway has). I wanted a USMC Ka-bar, so it worked out great for me.

I'll be reloading for my 1:7, 16" AR15, and a .308 bolt gun. Still trying to figure out which powder will work well in the AR. I'm told you need a faster burning powder than you would in a bolt gun.

 

[ksthomas]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

sentry1,

No, the powders are the same regardless of whether they're being loaded for a bolt gun or a gas gun; no difference whatsoever. You'll need a slightly faster powder for lighter weight bullets than for the heavier ones, but this is true all across the board, for any cartridge in almost any rifle.

Only exception here would be in something like an M1 Garand, where the operating system needs a particular burn rate compatible with the gas system. ARs are pretty free in this regard, and work well with any number of powders suitable for the 223/5.56mm.

 

[The Gump]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

Here is a list of what I use for .223:

Brass:
-Winchester w/ 69gr SMK. 99.997% of what Lapua offers for a lot less.
-Mixed once fired crimped range brass for 55gr Hornady.

Primers:
-Whatever works consistently. Currently CCI 400.

Bullet:
-Whatever works consistently. Currently Hornady 55gr and SMK 69gr.

Powder:
-Whatever works consistently. Currently H335.

Dies:
-Redding FL S-Type. Competition seater.

From the RCBS box kit I bought way back when, I use the following:
-Press
-Powder Drop
-Beam Scale
-Funnel
-Case Holder
-Hammer Puller
-Priming Tool
-Calipers
-Powder Trickler

Other stuff:
-2 shell holders. One for the press and one for the priming tool.
-Hornady LNL bushing conversion for the Rock Chucker.
-RCBS case prep station. I only use it and a chamfer bit to cut out the primer crimp.
-RCBS Trimmer w/ 3 Way cutter head.
-Hornady sizing paste wax shit. Not the spray.
-Hornady case bump gauge comparator.
-Big dry media tumbler and media.
-SS media tumbler and media.

I kind of want to get 2 RCBS Charge Masters but I'm leery. I also would like a motor for my trimmer.

When I load for bolt gun I use a Hornady O.A.L. comparator.

I FL Size my cases .001-.002 smaller than the chamber.

I load the bullet to the cannelure, mag length, or to the lands if I want to single feed.

I corn cob tumble before FL sizing size and de-prime.

Stainless Steel tumble after FL size and de-prime.

I trim O.A.L. and primer crimp after SS tumble. Primer crimp 1st then O.A.L.

There are definitely other ways of going about it.

Uniforming primer pockets is a bad idea IMO. Your shit gets loose right off the bat.

The way I go about it <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-style: italic">is</span></span> tedious.

 

[Unknown]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

Hornady dies are OK, as are the RCBS. If they are in your price range, my first choice would be Redding or Forster.

I think you can save quite a bit of money buying many of the parts for your gear separately, and in doing so end up with exactly what you want. Selling kits works better for the manufacturer, but if you hit sales, or even the for sale section here, and post a "reloading gear needed" you might save alot of money.

Using Lapua brass for 99% of the AR15 use is way overkill, and unnecessary. See if you can find a quantity of once fired GI brass all from the same lot that has already been decapped, trimmed, and had the primer pocket swaged. My guess is that you will end up with 3-5 GI cases for each Lapua case you would have bought at 80 cents apiece.

For powder, I would suggest a ball powder because it meters so easily. Powders like W748, TAC, XTerminator, H335(dirty), are all easy to meter. See which powder gives the most velocity with the lowest pressure. Most of the powder manufacturer sites have this data available in their reloading data section.

Amax bullets are fine, but so are Sierra, Nosler and Hornady. For 5.56 casual use, I base my choice on which one I can get the cheapest. Powder valley often has great prices, so shop around.

Most reloading supply sales outlets have loss leaders. By shopping around, you can often find out who has the best price on Sierra bullets, one kind of powder, and so on. Occasionally, manufacturers give large sales outlets a break on price, and the sales outlet uses that price break to get you to start buying. But remember to add in shipping costs. Sometimes it is cheaper to pay extra shipping to 2 or 3 outlets, other times, the shipping makes it more cost effective to pay a little more for one or the other components.

Look at various web sites for used reloading gear like presses, powder measures and so on to save money. Have a buddy get you started so you can lower your learning curve. If you don't know someone who reloads, almost any shooting match has someone local there who can help you get started.

 

[maggitas]

Re: Thinking about getting into reloading. total noob

Here is my .02 cents worth.

First you need to be honest. How much do you shoot and how much time can you devote to reloading. As others have stated reloading is a time consuming event. If you are not shooting alot you will probably save yourself some time, money, & aggrevation by just buying ammo off the shelf.

OK if you decide to reload. Here are my recommendations. Equipment, Equipment, Equipment. I cannot stess it enough proper gauges tools manuals and gear will save you time and hassle either way. Do some research and plan how YOU want to prep your brass. You can use a Giraud Trimmer, Sinclair, Redding, et all for single stage or you can purchase a dedicated trimmer for a progressive. If reloading in bulk definitely go with a dillon. If you are a total noob you may have to seek out someone close to you to help you set up your progressive press as they can be hard to set up. If reloading a gasser you will need small base dies full length sizing dies. there are many good ones out there. Redding, Forster, RCBS are faves on the board. If reloading different weight bullets you will want to invest in a Microseating Die as it will save you time. Setting up your sizing die will be key as you do not want a stuck case on the range. They are a challenge to remove. I have seen it firsthand and it will ruin your trip to the range if you do not size the brass correctly. Hint buy a Wilson case gauge to check your reszied brass and buy a headspace gauge to set up your dies. In my opinion they are worth every penny!!! Like others have stated I would start with some lower grade brass so you can understand what you are doing and gain some experience. Speaking of experience if you can watch someone reload some rounds so you can get an idea of the process. They can even help set up your dies, press, and processing brass. There really is alot to it and the vocaublary of the hobby can be confusing. You will have alot of questions so having someone to bounce ideas and questions off will pay dividends. As always start you loads low and work your way up. Read manuals and as much data as you can. There are plenty of resources out there to help. I love reloading, but can see why some would rather buy commercial and spend more time with the family..