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Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
Sorry, too many variables involved for anyone to tell you how long your barrel will last. I think one who worries about barrel life is not enjoying life. Do the things you can to keep from shortening a barrel's life but don't fret over something a replacement can be easily had for.
Sorry, too many variables involved for anyone to tell you how long your barrel will last. I think one who worries about barrel life is not enjoying life. Do the things you can to keep from shortening a barrel's life but don't fret over something a replacement can be easily had for.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
Barrel Life is a silly discussion. Some of the fun calibers out there are barrel burners. 500-1200 rounds and the barrel is smooth bore.
This is comparable to telling a Ferrari dealer you want the most badass car they have as long as they can put a governor on the throttle because you don't want to burn up your Pirelli's. You don't buy the most badass car out there for its tire wear. You buy it to wear out the tires...
Rifles are the same. After a few boxes of ammo the barrel has paid for itself.
Barrel Life is a silly discussion. Some of the fun calibers out there are barrel burners. 500-1200 rounds and the barrel is smooth bore.
This is comparable to telling a Ferrari dealer you want the most badass car they have as long as they can put a governor on the throttle because you don't want to burn up your Pirelli's. You don't buy the most badass car out there for its tire wear. You buy it to wear out the tires...
Rifles are the same. After a few boxes of ammo the barrel has paid for itself.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
Barrel life is NOT a silly discussion. For people who shoot a lot and don't like to send their gun away, it is very relevant. Determined having to work up a new load for a new barrel. Barrel life is the reason that David Tubb moved away from 243.
Barrel life is NOT a silly discussion. For people who shoot a lot and don't like to send their gun away, it is very relevant. Determined having to work up a new load for a new barrel. Barrel life is the reason that David Tubb moved away from 243.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Carter Mayfield</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Barrel life is NOT a silly discussion. For people who shoot a lot and don't like to send their gun away, it is very relevant. Determined having to work up a new load for a new barrel. Barrel life is the reason that David Tubb moved away from 243. </div></div>
Correct. He moved to the 6XC so he could sell dies, bullets and brass and tell everyone he had his "own" cartridge that blew all the stupid shit we had been shooting away.
Barrels are expendable. I don't want to replace an action or stock every 3000 rounds but don't mind replacing a barrel. I recently took my 7MM08 to one of the more respected gun gurus on this site and requested he rebarrel it. He could have just taken my $$ and did what I asked but he didn't. He took a good long look inside and told me to keep shooting the one I had for at least another match season. This told me barrels last even longer than we think they do. It has a lot of fire cracking and throat wear but still shoots right at 1/2MOA and I won or placed high in several matches with it over the last few months.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Carter Mayfield</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Barrel life is NOT a silly discussion. For people who shoot a lot and don't like to send their gun away, it is very relevant. Determined having to work up a new load for a new barrel. Barrel life is the reason that David Tubb moved away from 243. </div></div>
Correct. He moved to the 6XC so he could sell dies, bullets and brass and tell everyone he had his "own" cartridge that blew all the stupid shit we had been shooting away.
Barrels are expendable. I don't want to replace an action or stock every 3000 rounds but don't mind replacing a barrel. I recently took my 7MM08 to one of the more respected gun gurus on this site and requested he rebarrel it. He could have just taken my $$ and did what I asked but he didn't. He took a good long look inside and told me to keep shooting the one I had for at least another match season. This told me barrels last even longer than we think they do. It has a lot of fire cracking and throat wear but still shoots right at 1/2MOA and I won or placed high in several matches with it over the last few months.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Barrel Life is a silly discussion. Some of the fun calibers out there are barrel burners. 500-1200 rounds and the barrel is smooth bore.
This is comparable to telling a Ferrari dealer you want the most badass car they have as long as they can put a governor on the throttle because you don't want to burn up your Pirelli's. You don't buy the most badass car out there for its tire wear. You buy it to wear out the tires...
Rifles are the same. After a few boxes of ammo the barrel has paid for itself. </div></div>
It's easy for someone to make a statement like this when money is clearly NO ISSUE for them.
When money is an issue, or even the time without your rifle when it's out to get rebarreled, barrel life is <span style="font-weight: bold">not</span> a silly question.
The OP is curious about different levels of performance between 3 cartrdiges, and approximate asscociated barrel life. He is choosing between a Camaro, a Corvette and a Viper. He is rightly asking about them first, rather than complaining about poor barrel life after building it.
Moving on...
OP, as mentioned, there's a lot of variables in predicting barrel life, but if you don't abuse it you should expect about 4000 rounds from a 708, 2500 rounds from a 280. Not sure on the 7RM. I'd guess 1000-1500, but that's only a guess.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Barrel Life is a silly discussion. Some of the fun calibers out there are barrel burners. 500-1200 rounds and the barrel is smooth bore.
This is comparable to telling a Ferrari dealer you want the most badass car they have as long as they can put a governor on the throttle because you don't want to burn up your Pirelli's. You don't buy the most badass car out there for its tire wear. You buy it to wear out the tires...
Rifles are the same. After a few boxes of ammo the barrel has paid for itself. </div></div>
It's easy for someone to make a statement like this when money is clearly NO ISSUE for them.
When money is an issue, or even the time without your rifle when it's out to get rebarreled, barrel life is <span style="font-weight: bold">not</span> a silly question.
The OP is curious about different levels of performance between 3 cartrdiges, and approximate asscociated barrel life. He is choosing between a Camaro, a Corvette and a Viper. He is rightly asking about them first, rather than complaining about poor barrel life after building it.
Moving on...
OP, as mentioned, there's a lot of variables in predicting barrel life, but if you don't abuse it you should expect about 4000 rounds from a 708, 2500 rounds from a 280. Not sure on the 7RM. I'd guess 1000-1500, but that's only a guess.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
I don't think KYS338 or myself are flaunting our "money". It is a fact that barrels wear out. It is also likely the OP could have a barrel, in any caliber, chambered that never shoots well.
I honestly don't think your numbers are valid. If you shoot max loads and/or heat a barrel up frequently it will go away faster. I have one 22-250 barrel (everyone thinks they burn up barrels fast) that has over 4K hot rounds thru it. It is still MOPD (minute of prairie dog). I have seen many a 6PPC BR barrel tossed after less than 1,000 rounds because they stopped providing the shooter with gnat's ass groups. "Worn out" for a barrel is, to a point, a subjective decision on the shooter's part.
I don't think KYS338 or myself are flaunting our "money". It is a fact that barrels wear out. It is also likely the OP could have a barrel, in any caliber, chambered that never shoots well.
I honestly don't think your numbers are valid. If you shoot max loads and/or heat a barrel up frequently it will go away faster. I have one 22-250 barrel (everyone thinks they burn up barrels fast) that has over 4K hot rounds thru it. It is still MOPD (minute of prairie dog). I have seen many a 6PPC BR barrel tossed after less than 1,000 rounds because they stopped providing the shooter with gnat's ass groups. "Worn out" for a barrel is, to a point, a subjective decision on the shooter's part.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
My 7RM running "warm" loads in match conditions lasted 1100ish before it was toast.
My 7RM running "warm" loads in match conditions lasted 1100ish before it was toast.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"Worn out" for a barrel is, to a point, a subjective decision on the shooter's part. </div></div>
+1. Up until 3 years ago, I never worried about bbl. life. (Still don't but for different reasons. At my age and point in life, the fact that bbls. are expendable is a comfort that I justify by accepting that I usrd a LOT of trigger time to get there). My 7RM killed everything I pointed it at. Last elk at 408yd. in 2007 and last deer at 426yd. in 2006. THEN my smith had to fix a small problem w/ my 7RM and he had just bought a new bore scope and let me look. Heh, it's a shotgun for 2.5 inches! NO RIFLING! Still shot 3 Fed. premium Factory ammo 160 Partitions into an inch at 100 yds. I'd still be shooting that rifle but had the bug for a wildcat 7-300WM. It did what I wanted it to do. Period. ESTIMATED bbls. life from people that have shot the same bbl., caliber, bullet, velocity, frequency of fire, temperature, etc. etc. etc. MAY help w/ choosing a caliber for competition. When a rifle stops doing what you want it to do, change something. Usually the bbl. Deal with it. Cost of doing business. my .02 Good luck.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"Worn out" for a barrel is, to a point, a subjective decision on the shooter's part. </div></div>
+1. Up until 3 years ago, I never worried about bbl. life. (Still don't but for different reasons. At my age and point in life, the fact that bbls. are expendable is a comfort that I justify by accepting that I usrd a LOT of trigger time to get there). My 7RM killed everything I pointed it at. Last elk at 408yd. in 2007 and last deer at 426yd. in 2006. THEN my smith had to fix a small problem w/ my 7RM and he had just bought a new bore scope and let me look. Heh, it's a shotgun for 2.5 inches! NO RIFLING! Still shot 3 Fed. premium Factory ammo 160 Partitions into an inch at 100 yds. I'd still be shooting that rifle but had the bug for a wildcat 7-300WM. It did what I wanted it to do. Period. ESTIMATED bbls. life from people that have shot the same bbl., caliber, bullet, velocity, frequency of fire, temperature, etc. etc. etc. MAY help w/ choosing a caliber for competition. When a rifle stops doing what you want it to do, change something. Usually the bbl. Deal with it. Cost of doing business. my .02 Good luck.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
Turbo 54, that's what I was looking for, the 280 sounds like it offers a good value proposition. For a 7 RM, in an accurate factory rifle, it's not a bad option either, wear one out, then sell it or replace the bore.
I do like the 708 as well, but thinking how a 280 might offer some good reach, w/reasonable bore life, and a good balance of range, bore life, recoil, and overall utility vs. other 7s inc. the short mags and 284. Thinking in terms of 162 Amax and the like.
Will a 280 w/a 9" ROT spin all bullets one might want to use for LR work? Thanks all.
Turbo 54, that's what I was looking for, the 280 sounds like it offers a good value proposition. For a 7 RM, in an accurate factory rifle, it's not a bad option either, wear one out, then sell it or replace the bore.
I do like the 708 as well, but thinking how a 280 might offer some good reach, w/reasonable bore life, and a good balance of range, bore life, recoil, and overall utility vs. other 7s inc. the short mags and 284. Thinking in terms of 162 Amax and the like.
Will a 280 w/a 9" ROT spin all bullets one might want to use for LR work? Thanks all.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
A 280 or 264 should get around 2000-3000 rounds before the barrel gives out if using hot to moderate loads, you can probably get a lot more if using light loads.
A 280 or 264 should get around 2000-3000 rounds before the barrel gives out if using hot to moderate loads, you can probably get a lot more if using light loads.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't think KYS338 or myself are flaunting our "money". It is a fact that barrels wear out.</div></div>
I wasn't suggesting you or KYS were "flaunting" your money. That said however, we all have different budgets. To some people, ~$500-600 aint no thing to get a rifle rebarreled. Oftentimes, when the cost of rebarreling is no big deal, it's also no big deal to be without the rifle for 6 months and sometimes more, because they have a second, third, or even fourth rifle to use in the meantime. To many folks though, the $500-600 per chambered/fitted barrel is quite a bit of cash, so choosing a cartridge that allows the barrel to have a longer life makes a lot of sense.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
It is also likely the OP could have a barrel, in any caliber, chambered that never shoots well.</div></div>
Not sure where you're going with this comment.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I honestly don't think your numbers are valid. If you shoot max loads and/or heat a barrel up frequently it will go away faster. I have one 22-250 barrel (everyone thinks they burn up barrels fast) that has over 4K hot rounds thru it. It is still MOPD (minute of prairie dog). I have seen many a 6PPC BR barrel tossed after less than 1,000 rounds because they stopped providing the shooter with gnat's ass groups. "Worn out" for a barrel is, to a point, a subjective decision on the shooter's part. </div></div>
As mentioned elsewhere in the thread, barrel life has lots and lots of variables, and is tough to predict. I'm sorry you didn't like my numbers, but I stand by them as being reasonable. I personally know of a 7mm-08 that has over 6000 rounds through it and still easily shoots sub-moa. I wouldn't expect most 708s to go this long though.
There will always be exceptions... The 6.5-284 used for Fclass that went 5000 rounds slinging 142s @ 3050fps... But those are exceptions. Most of these cartridges we're talking about have been used for many years by thousands of different users, so there is pretty decent empirical data to go from.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't think KYS338 or myself are flaunting our "money". It is a fact that barrels wear out.</div></div>
I wasn't suggesting you or KYS were "flaunting" your money. That said however, we all have different budgets. To some people, ~$500-600 aint no thing to get a rifle rebarreled. Oftentimes, when the cost of rebarreling is no big deal, it's also no big deal to be without the rifle for 6 months and sometimes more, because they have a second, third, or even fourth rifle to use in the meantime. To many folks though, the $500-600 per chambered/fitted barrel is quite a bit of cash, so choosing a cartridge that allows the barrel to have a longer life makes a lot of sense.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
It is also likely the OP could have a barrel, in any caliber, chambered that never shoots well.</div></div>
Not sure where you're going with this comment.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I honestly don't think your numbers are valid. If you shoot max loads and/or heat a barrel up frequently it will go away faster. I have one 22-250 barrel (everyone thinks they burn up barrels fast) that has over 4K hot rounds thru it. It is still MOPD (minute of prairie dog). I have seen many a 6PPC BR barrel tossed after less than 1,000 rounds because they stopped providing the shooter with gnat's ass groups. "Worn out" for a barrel is, to a point, a subjective decision on the shooter's part. </div></div>
As mentioned elsewhere in the thread, barrel life has lots and lots of variables, and is tough to predict. I'm sorry you didn't like my numbers, but I stand by them as being reasonable. I personally know of a 7mm-08 that has over 6000 rounds through it and still easily shoots sub-moa. I wouldn't expect most 708s to go this long though.
There will always be exceptions... The 6.5-284 used for Fclass that went 5000 rounds slinging 142s @ 3050fps... But those are exceptions. Most of these cartridges we're talking about have been used for many years by thousands of different users, so there is pretty decent empirical data to go from.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
your numbers and examples are saying exactly what I was trying to convey to the OP. No one can give an good estimate as to just how long a barrel will last. Of the three calibers he listed, my bet would be on the 7MM08.
Choice of barrel maker is important too. I have had barrels from one particular maker go south much faster than they should have. I will say I have had very good results from Bartlein.
If barrel life is the ultimate goal then shoot a 308. Those are usually good for thousands and thousands of rounds. I've heard of quite a few that have over 10,000 thru them.
your numbers and examples are saying exactly what I was trying to convey to the OP. No one can give an good estimate as to just how long a barrel will last. Of the three calibers he listed, my bet would be on the 7MM08.
Choice of barrel maker is important too. I have had barrels from one particular maker go south much faster than they should have. I will say I have had very good results from Bartlein.
If barrel life is the ultimate goal then shoot a 308. Those are usually good for thousands and thousands of rounds. I've heard of quite a few that have over 10,000 thru them.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
Round count is not the priority, but REASONABLE life is, and no doubt the 708 would give the most rounds, next to a BR, I considered at what sacrifice one gives up by going to a larger round, ie. a 280 to straighten the trajectory out.
Turbo, would a 280 offer lower priced equivalent quality brass as a 284? And how fast would one expect a 162 to run in a 24-26" bbl? Or is there another bullet that will do better? Purpose would be shots 400yds and out.
Thanks.
Round count is not the priority, but REASONABLE life is, and no doubt the 708 would give the most rounds, next to a BR, I considered at what sacrifice one gives up by going to a larger round, ie. a 280 to straighten the trajectory out.
Turbo, would a 280 offer lower priced equivalent quality brass as a 284? And how fast would one expect a 162 to run in a 24-26" bbl? Or is there another bullet that will do better? Purpose would be shots 400yds and out.
Thanks.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Round count is not the priority, but REASONABLE life is, and no doubt the 708 would give the most rounds, next to a BR, I considered at what sacrifice one gives up by going to a larger round, ie. a 280 to straighten the trajectory out.
Turbo, would a 280 offer lower priced equivalent quality brass as a 284? And how fast would one expect a 162 to run in a 24-26" bbl? Or is there another bullet that will do better? Purpose would be shots 400yds and out.
Thanks. </div></div>
Not sure on brass costs. WW-Super for 284 runs about 60-65 cents each, and of course, Lapua is available for $1.20 each.
I think you'll see ~2850fps from a 24 or 26" barrel without really pushing it. 2900fps oughtta be doable if you lean on it, but if you're interested in leaning on it - I'd advise you to just get a magnum, run lower pressure, and hit 2900 with absolute ease.
I've been shooting my 284 with 175smk quite a bit lately alongside 7WSMs and 260s. We've got to be out past 1000 before the 7s really start to show their superiority over the 260. The 7WSM doesn't really show up the 284 until 1200-1300 yards. I've been very pleased with my 284, and think the slight difference in performance compared to the magnum is well worth the doubled barrel life.
Prior to actually shooting alongside the magnum, I really had an itch to switch to one. Honestly though, the 284 is doing me really well.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Round count is not the priority, but REASONABLE life is, and no doubt the 708 would give the most rounds, next to a BR, I considered at what sacrifice one gives up by going to a larger round, ie. a 280 to straighten the trajectory out.
Turbo, would a 280 offer lower priced equivalent quality brass as a 284? And how fast would one expect a 162 to run in a 24-26" bbl? Or is there another bullet that will do better? Purpose would be shots 400yds and out.
Thanks. </div></div>
Not sure on brass costs. WW-Super for 284 runs about 60-65 cents each, and of course, Lapua is available for $1.20 each.
I think you'll see ~2850fps from a 24 or 26" barrel without really pushing it. 2900fps oughtta be doable if you lean on it, but if you're interested in leaning on it - I'd advise you to just get a magnum, run lower pressure, and hit 2900 with absolute ease.
I've been shooting my 284 with 175smk quite a bit lately alongside 7WSMs and 260s. We've got to be out past 1000 before the 7s really start to show their superiority over the 260. The 7WSM doesn't really show up the 284 until 1200-1300 yards. I've been very pleased with my 284, and think the slight difference in performance compared to the magnum is well worth the doubled barrel life.
Prior to actually shooting alongside the magnum, I really had an itch to switch to one. Honestly though, the 284 is doing me really well.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Round count is not the priority, but REASONABLE life is, and no doubt the 708 would give the most rounds, next to a BR, I considered at what sacrifice one gives up by going to a larger round, ie. a 280 to straighten the trajectory out.
Turbo, would a 280 offer lower priced equivalent quality brass as a 284? And how fast would one expect a 162 to run in a 24-26" bbl? Or is there another bullet that will do better? Purpose would be shots 400yds and out.
Thanks. </div></div>
Will you shoot 100 rounds per week every week thru this barrel? Will you shoot 100 per month thru this barrel? Will you shoot 100 per year? I would be surprised if David Tubb shoots 100 per week.
IMHO, if you shoot 100 per week the cost of powder, bullets, brass, powder & primers will far outweigh the cost of barrel replacement. The 162 Amax is about $29/100, brass can't be reloaded 52 times, primers area a one shot deal, so is powder. If you shot 200 rounds per month thru this barrel that is 2400 in a year. The 7MM08 will burn less powder and can easily use the 162 Amax in a short action. Not so with 280 or 284. My 7MM08 barrel is at least five years old, is my "go to" gun and still has lots of life left in it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Round count is not the priority, but REASONABLE life is, and no doubt the 708 would give the most rounds, next to a BR, I considered at what sacrifice one gives up by going to a larger round, ie. a 280 to straighten the trajectory out.
Turbo, would a 280 offer lower priced equivalent quality brass as a 284? And how fast would one expect a 162 to run in a 24-26" bbl? Or is there another bullet that will do better? Purpose would be shots 400yds and out.
Thanks. </div></div>
Will you shoot 100 rounds per week every week thru this barrel? Will you shoot 100 per month thru this barrel? Will you shoot 100 per year? I would be surprised if David Tubb shoots 100 per week.
IMHO, if you shoot 100 per week the cost of powder, bullets, brass, powder & primers will far outweigh the cost of barrel replacement. The 162 Amax is about $29/100, brass can't be reloaded 52 times, primers area a one shot deal, so is powder. If you shot 200 rounds per month thru this barrel that is 2400 in a year. The 7MM08 will burn less powder and can easily use the 162 Amax in a short action. Not so with 280 or 284. My 7MM08 barrel is at least five years old, is my "go to" gun and still has lots of life left in it.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
The only barrels I have really shot until they would not clean up or even stabilize bullets at 100 yards were 7 mags and 300 mags.
All loaded hot for hunting. Barrel life was from 700 to a bit over 1000. None were RM but big cased rounds. ie 7/300 Wea 7/375 H&H etc. That is with no long strings fired.
The only barrels I have really shot until they would not clean up or even stabilize bullets at 100 yards were 7 mags and 300 mags.
All loaded hot for hunting. Barrel life was from 700 to a bit over 1000. None were RM but big cased rounds. ie 7/300 Wea 7/375 H&H etc. That is with no long strings fired.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Great info Turbo - thanks much.
Shoot4Fun - what is your bbl length, and speed w/162s? Powder? Thx
</div></div>
7MM08, 168 SMK, H4350,<span style="text-decoration: line-through"> 2850</span>2775 FPS from 26" Bartlein.
I also have a 7WSM. 180 Berger VLD, RL22, 2960 from 26" Broughton.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Great info Turbo - thanks much.
Shoot4Fun - what is your bbl length, and speed w/162s? Powder? Thx
</div></div>
7MM08, 168 SMK, H4350,<span style="text-decoration: line-through"> 2850</span>2775 FPS from 26" Bartlein.
I also have a 7WSM. 180 Berger VLD, RL22, 2960 from 26" Broughton.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
Simply put, if you are worried about barrel life stay away from the 7 magnums. The 284 is an awesome round that will get you decent barrel life and good ballistics.
Simply put, if you are worried about barrel life stay away from the 7 magnums. The 284 is an awesome round that will get you decent barrel life and good ballistics.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">More great info guys thanks. Wow, 2850/168, very impressive - 26" helps no doubt. Any comments on brass and primer? Sure you don't want to post the load, assuming a tad over book max. </div></div>
Lapua 260 brass necked up to 7MM08 and necks turned to match W-W thickness. Also, Nosler 7MM08 brass has worked well. Primer is Federal GMM. 8.3 mils at 1000 yards (100 yd zero). Will keep five in 1/3 MOA easily.
I agree with other posters that the 284 is an awesome round but, as I stated, it needs a long action to realize its full potential. If you use AI mags it will required the ones for 300WM and they, IMHO, need a little tweak to make them 100% reliable. That or the Alpha Mags, which I see about 50-50 pro/con here on how well they work.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">More great info guys thanks. Wow, 2850/168, very impressive - 26" helps no doubt. Any comments on brass and primer? Sure you don't want to post the load, assuming a tad over book max. </div></div>
Lapua 260 brass necked up to 7MM08 and necks turned to match W-W thickness. Also, Nosler 7MM08 brass has worked well. Primer is Federal GMM. 8.3 mils at 1000 yards (100 yd zero). Will keep five in 1/3 MOA easily.
I agree with other posters that the 284 is an awesome round but, as I stated, it needs a long action to realize its full potential. If you use AI mags it will required the ones for 300WM and they, IMHO, need a little tweak to make them 100% reliable. That or the Alpha Mags, which I see about 50-50 pro/con here on how well they work.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
Here's an explanation of overbore cartridges and estimating barrel life:
Overbore
All things being equal and creating an overbore situation on the 7-08 from .308 parent and .280 from .30/06 parent, I'd guess the 7-08 would last longer than the .280 and definitely longer than the 7mm RM. It's still going to vary on how hard you would push each.
Here's an explanation of overbore cartridges and estimating barrel life:
Overbore
All things being equal and creating an overbore situation on the 7-08 from .308 parent and .280 from .30/06 parent, I'd guess the 7-08 would last longer than the .280 and definitely longer than the 7mm RM. It's still going to vary on how hard you would push each.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Lapua 260 brass necked up to 7MM08 and necks turned to match W-W thickness. Also, Nosler 7MM08 brass has worked well. Primer is Federal GMM. Under 8 mils at 1000 yards. Will keep five in 1/3 MOA easily.</div></div>
That is incredible performance. However, those results are not typical, and are likely very high pressure.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I agree with other posters that the 284 is an awesome round but, as I stated, it needs a long action to realize its full potential. If you use AI mags it will required the ones for 300WM and they, IMHO, need a little tweak to make them 100% reliable. That or the Alpha Mags, which I see about 50-50 pro/con here on how well they work. </div></div>
I also agree that 284 is a nice, well rounded cartridge, but contend that a short action does not neuter it. I've had two barrels now, and found that when loaded to a COAL of 2.950", the performance is on-par (or DAMN near) with the long actions. I read a lot of talk about "decreased powder capacity", but at 2.950" and a 175/180smk there is room for 55gr H4831sc at the verge of being compressed. The folks that run these on long actions, where they have more capacity, don't use it because they run into pressure before they do.
My 25" barrel saw ~2750 with the 175/180 bullets, and ~2875 from the 162s. My 28" barrel sees ~2825 from the 175/180s (with a considerably lighter load) and ~2950 from the 162s.
My opinion is the perceived short action "poor performance" of the 284 is more a function of short barrels than powder capacity.
I'd say the bummer of the short action, is you need to pay attention to - and be certain that, you don't have a donut or thick brass at the neck/shoulder junction, as the bullets are seated down way past it.
On the Alpha mags: I have 5 or 6 of them. I used the WSM ones, and did in fact have to tweak the feed lips inward a bit. I only needed to spend ~5 minutes each to get them working correctly. I've had no feeding issues. Action is a CRF FN SPR. I don't think the Alphas are quite as nicely made as the AICS or AIAW mags, but they're ok.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Lapua 260 brass necked up to 7MM08 and necks turned to match W-W thickness. Also, Nosler 7MM08 brass has worked well. Primer is Federal GMM. Under 8 mils at 1000 yards. Will keep five in 1/3 MOA easily.</div></div>
That is incredible performance. However, those results are not typical, and are likely very high pressure.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I agree with other posters that the 284 is an awesome round but, as I stated, it needs a long action to realize its full potential. If you use AI mags it will required the ones for 300WM and they, IMHO, need a little tweak to make them 100% reliable. That or the Alpha Mags, which I see about 50-50 pro/con here on how well they work. </div></div>
I also agree that 284 is a nice, well rounded cartridge, but contend that a short action does not neuter it. I've had two barrels now, and found that when loaded to a COAL of 2.950", the performance is on-par (or DAMN near) with the long actions. I read a lot of talk about "decreased powder capacity", but at 2.950" and a 175/180smk there is room for 55gr H4831sc at the verge of being compressed. The folks that run these on long actions, where they have more capacity, don't use it because they run into pressure before they do.
My 25" barrel saw ~2750 with the 175/180 bullets, and ~2875 from the 162s. My 28" barrel sees ~2825 from the 175/180s (with a considerably lighter load) and ~2950 from the 162s.
My opinion is the perceived short action "poor performance" of the 284 is more a function of short barrels than powder capacity.
I'd say the bummer of the short action, is you need to pay attention to - and be certain that, you don't have a donut or thick brass at the neck/shoulder junction, as the bullets are seated down way past it.
On the Alpha mags: I have 5 or 6 of them. I used the WSM ones, and did in fact have to tweak the feed lips inward a bit. I only needed to spend ~5 minutes each to get them working correctly. I've had no feeding issues. Action is a CRF FN SPR. I don't think the Alphas are quite as nicely made as the AICS or AIAW mags, but they're ok.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
I get a kick out of people who supposedly "know a lot" about guns, and say barrel life is not to be worried about.
I guess it all depends on the shooters intended purpose. I for example am a competition shooter. I am fortunate to have very good friends in D Miller and JFComfort who own a lathe, and can set me up a barrel as well as anyone in the country in an afternoon for the price of some whiskey and a blank. The cost doesn't matter to me, and I don't have to wait 6 months for a smith's turn around time.
Having said all of this, I worry about barrel life. Why? Because I am scared to death of practicing for months just to get to a major shoot that requires 200 rounds and have my barrel go to hell half way through. It is good knowledge to know what to approximately what to expect from a particular cartridge/load.
I shoot 6.5 CM, and due to personal and friend's knowledge I know when to expect it to shit the bed. I keep that in mind when selecting a barrel for a practice session, local shoot, or a major shoot. Your milage may vary, but good on you for seeking the knowledge.
Ty
I get a kick out of people who supposedly "know a lot" about guns, and say barrel life is not to be worried about.
I guess it all depends on the shooters intended purpose. I for example am a competition shooter. I am fortunate to have very good friends in D Miller and JFComfort who own a lathe, and can set me up a barrel as well as anyone in the country in an afternoon for the price of some whiskey and a blank. The cost doesn't matter to me, and I don't have to wait 6 months for a smith's turn around time.
Having said all of this, I worry about barrel life. Why? Because I am scared to death of practicing for months just to get to a major shoot that requires 200 rounds and have my barrel go to hell half way through. It is good knowledge to know what to approximately what to expect from a particular cartridge/load.
I shoot 6.5 CM, and due to personal and friend's knowledge I know when to expect it to shit the bed. I keep that in mind when selecting a barrel for a practice session, local shoot, or a major shoot. Your milage may vary, but good on you for seeking the knowledge.
Ty
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">More good stuff.
Turbo, do I recall that there was a blow up or issues w/action(s) w/those FNs? If so, do you know and can provide any info on the specifics?
Thanks. </div></div>
I have no idea what your'e talking about. Only issue that I can think of regarding FN SPRs was faulty chrome-lining of the bores in some of the ones manufactured during the closing days of production in New Haven, around 2005.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">More good stuff.
Turbo, do I recall that there was a blow up or issues w/action(s) w/those FNs? If so, do you know and can provide any info on the specifics?
Thanks. </div></div>
I have no idea what your'e talking about. Only issue that I can think of regarding FN SPRs was faulty chrome-lining of the bores in some of the ones manufactured during the closing days of production in New Haven, around 2005.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
Originally Posted By: shoot4fun
Lapua 260 brass necked up to 7MM08 and necks turned to match W-W thickness. Also, Nosler 7MM08 brass has worked well. Primer is Federal GMM. Under 8 mils at 1000 yards. Will keep five in 1/3 MOA easily.
That is incredible performance. However, those results are not typical, and are likely very high pressure.
Turbo, You have me thinking now. I hope I didn't pass on some bad numbers. I'll look again when I get back home and check them out. I don't mind posting a correction if I need to.
Originally Posted By: shoot4fun
Lapua 260 brass necked up to 7MM08 and necks turned to match W-W thickness. Also, Nosler 7MM08 brass has worked well. Primer is Federal GMM. Under 8 mils at 1000 yards. Will keep five in 1/3 MOA easily.
That is incredible performance. However, those results are not typical, and are likely very high pressure.
Turbo, You have me thinking now. I hope I didn't pass on some bad numbers. I'll look again when I get back home and check them out. I don't mind posting a correction if I need to.
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">More good stuff.
Turbo, do I recall that there was a blow up or issues w/action(s) w/those FNs? If so, do you know and can provide any info on the specifics?
Thanks. </div></div>
I have no idea what your'e talking about. Only issue that I can think of regarding FN SPRs was faulty chrome-lining of the bores in some of the ones manufactured during the closing days of production in New Haven, around 2005.</div></div>
You might ask around, I am reasonably sure I seen a post where one blew up, or perhaps they had issues - just telling you so you will be aware IF there is any recall/safety issue - but I am sure if you contact the mfg they will confirm. Perhaps CDNN sports can confirm or not if they ever had a recall or issues. It might have been an isolated case, and I thought I saw a post somewhere on this site, but not 100%.
Anyway's, sounds like yours if fine. Appreciate the shared knowledge!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">More good stuff.
Turbo, do I recall that there was a blow up or issues w/action(s) w/those FNs? If so, do you know and can provide any info on the specifics?
Thanks. </div></div>
I have no idea what your'e talking about. Only issue that I can think of regarding FN SPRs was faulty chrome-lining of the bores in some of the ones manufactured during the closing days of production in New Haven, around 2005.</div></div>
You might ask around, I am reasonably sure I seen a post where one blew up, or perhaps they had issues - just telling you so you will be aware IF there is any recall/safety issue - but I am sure if you contact the mfg they will confirm. Perhaps CDNN sports can confirm or not if they ever had a recall or issues. It might have been an isolated case, and I thought I saw a post somewhere on this site, but not 100%.
Anyway's, sounds like yours if fine. Appreciate the shared knowledge!
Re: Barrel Life in 7mm's.....?????
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun
Lapua 260 brass necked up to 7MM08 and necks turned to match W-W thickness. Also, Nosler 7MM08 brass has worked well. Primer is Federal GMM. Under 8 mils at 1000 yards. Will keep five in 1/3 MOA easily.
That is incredible performance. However, those results are not typical, and are likely very high pressure.
Turbo, You have me thinking now. I hope I didn't pass on some bad numbers. I'll look again when I get back home and check them out. I don't mind posting a correction if I need to. </div></div>
Edited with correct numbers. I inadvertently gave dope from another rifle.
7MM08 with 168SMK makes 2775 FPS and drop @ 1000 is 8.3 mils.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun
Lapua 260 brass necked up to 7MM08 and necks turned to match W-W thickness. Also, Nosler 7MM08 brass has worked well. Primer is Federal GMM. Under 8 mils at 1000 yards. Will keep five in 1/3 MOA easily.
That is incredible performance. However, those results are not typical, and are likely very high pressure.
Turbo, You have me thinking now. I hope I didn't pass on some bad numbers. I'll look again when I get back home and check them out. I don't mind posting a correction if I need to. </div></div>
Edited with correct numbers. I inadvertently gave dope from another rifle.
7MM08 with 168SMK makes 2775 FPS and drop @ 1000 is 8.3 mils.
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