I've been wondering this for awhile now. Most of the results I see posted for the tactical competitions never have any info on what type of gun, caliber, bullets, scope, etc, the shooters used. Obviously gear is only as good as the person using it. It would be a nice reference however, to see what the competitors are using. I don't see where it would be too difficult to acquire the info, it would be as simple as a quick questionaire when checking in for the match or when registering. Just wondering if there's any reason that people holding the matches dont do this.
- Thread starter tofst4u2no
- Start date
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
Check out PRS Season Finale - Action, Caliber and Scope are included for the best of the best.
Check out PRS Season Finale - Action, Caliber and Scope are included for the best of the best.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
great post tofst! been wanting the same thing
great post tofst! been wanting the same thing
M
milo 2.0
Guest
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
I think it's because it's irrelevent, even if we bought the shit, we couldn't shoot as well.
We need to start with the basics, like what underwear do they wear.
Yes, that's the starting point.
What underwear do you guys wear?
I think it's because it's irrelevent, even if we bought the shit, we couldn't shoot as well.
We need to start with the basics, like what underwear do they wear.
Yes, that's the starting point.
What underwear do you guys wear?
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
With rare exception, the guys that win are shooting either Surgeon or GAP rifles in some 6 or 6.5 mm caliber...
That about covers it.
The problem is, it is hard to keep track of. Its one more thing for MDs to have to do and really, not all that important in the grand scheme of things.
With rare exception, the guys that win are shooting either Surgeon or GAP rifles in some 6 or 6.5 mm caliber...
That about covers it.
The problem is, it is hard to keep track of. Its one more thing for MDs to have to do and really, not all that important in the grand scheme of things.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
I wouldn't want to see the MD burdened by trying to keep track of all of this. At best, the competitors could post it up in the match results.
Realistically, what does it matter? As stated above, the top shooters are probably shooting high end rifles with top end glass. But I bet if you had them compete with a basic rifle they'd still finish at the top. Knowing your gear inside out (and how it responds to environmental changes) is worth more than top notch gear.
I wouldn't want to see the MD burdened by trying to keep track of all of this. At best, the competitors could post it up in the match results.
Realistically, what does it matter? As stated above, the top shooters are probably shooting high end rifles with top end glass. But I bet if you had them compete with a basic rifle they'd still finish at the top. Knowing your gear inside out (and how it responds to environmental changes) is worth more than top notch gear.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
It matters because it first gives great publicity to the manufacturers. Second, someone like me wanting to learn about these competitions would love to know calipers and equipment that tends to be towards the top. Any and all publicity these competitors and sponsors get the better!
It matters because it first gives great publicity to the manufacturers. Second, someone like me wanting to learn about these competitions would love to know calipers and equipment that tends to be towards the top. Any and all publicity these competitors and sponsors get the better!
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gugubica</div><div class="ubbcode-body">With rare exception, the guys that win are shooting either Surgeon or GAP rifles in some 6 or 6.5 mm caliber...</div></div>
And JP Enterprises!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gugubica</div><div class="ubbcode-body">With rare exception, the guys that win are shooting either Surgeon or GAP rifles in some 6 or 6.5 mm caliber...</div></div>
And JP Enterprises!
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
WE will have the most in depth equipment results posted after the PRS Finale
WE will have the most in depth equipment results posted after the PRS Finale
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: milo-2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think it's because it's irrelevent, even if we bought the shit, we couldn't shoot as well.
We need to start with the basics, like what underwear do they wear.
Yes, that's the starting point.
What underwear do you guys wear? </div></div>
^^^
This
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: milo-2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think it's because it's irrelevent, even if we bought the shit, we couldn't shoot as well.
We need to start with the basics, like what underwear do they wear.
Yes, that's the starting point.
What underwear do you guys wear? </div></div>
^^^
This
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pete Sake</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: milo-2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think it's because it's irrelevent, even if we bought the shit, we couldn't shoot as well.
We need to start with the basics, like what underwear do they wear.
Yes, that's the starting point.
What underwear do you guys wear? </div></div>
^^^
This </div></div>
I normally wear boxers, but on match day I wear boxer briefs. Never know when you might need a little extra support.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pete Sake</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: milo-2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think it's because it's irrelevent, even if we bought the shit, we couldn't shoot as well.
We need to start with the basics, like what underwear do they wear.
Yes, that's the starting point.
What underwear do you guys wear? </div></div>
^^^
This </div></div>
I normally wear boxers, but on match day I wear boxer briefs. Never know when you might need a little extra support.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
I have never went to a match so I don't know what to wear! Good point huh! I do wish to go to one and compete one day!
I have never went to a match so I don't know what to wear! Good point huh! I do wish to go to one and compete one day!
M
milo 2.0
Guest
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
PM,
I've seen some tactical breifs out there, hell they might even be made out of kevlar, comfy!
PM,
I've seen some tactical breifs out there, hell they might even be made out of kevlar, comfy!
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
Like I said clearly in my first post. Gear is only as good as the person using it. That being said I'm still interested in what everyone's using. Internet comedians aside the only person that offered a legit reason against it was Sled. I can see how it could put extra burden on already busy match directors.
Like I said clearly in my first post. Gear is only as good as the person using it. That being said I'm still interested in what everyone's using. Internet comedians aside the only person that offered a legit reason against it was Sled. I can see how it could put extra burden on already busy match directors.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
At the monthly matches I run, I include the caliber to the results. But that is far as I take it.
At the monthly matches I run, I include the caliber to the results. But that is far as I take it.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
It is put out there for some of the larger matches. Jacob Gottfredson has written an article on the last few Rifles Only matches where he has gathered the equipment list from the top 10 finishers. They were published in Precision Shooter.
It is a rather cumbersome task, having watched him do it.
Also, many of the comedians are generally correct. The top finishers have done so with a wide variety of equipment over the years, and they remain generally on top. The Rifles Only/ Snipers Hide CoreBon match was a good example. Limited to 308, issued CoreBon ammo, and a box- stock Glock. In general, the same people finished in the top 10. I have finished in the top 10 with 3 different guns in as many calibers. Likewise, I have watched the people finishing above me do so with a variety of calipers, scopes, etc.
Recently, you will see everything from a heavy .223 to .300 HCM on the line with good shooters.
Sean
It is put out there for some of the larger matches. Jacob Gottfredson has written an article on the last few Rifles Only matches where he has gathered the equipment list from the top 10 finishers. They were published in Precision Shooter.
It is a rather cumbersome task, having watched him do it.
Also, many of the comedians are generally correct. The top finishers have done so with a wide variety of equipment over the years, and they remain generally on top. The Rifles Only/ Snipers Hide CoreBon match was a good example. Limited to 308, issued CoreBon ammo, and a box- stock Glock. In general, the same people finished in the top 10. I have finished in the top 10 with 3 different guns in as many calibers. Likewise, I have watched the people finishing above me do so with a variety of calipers, scopes, etc.
Recently, you will see everything from a heavy .223 to .300 HCM on the line with good shooters.
Sean
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
Matches aren't won by the best gear, or by the best shooters. They are won by the best competitors.
The shooters who are winning or routinely finish high could care less what anybody else is using.
Maybe take a page out of that book.
--Fargo007
Matches aren't won by the best gear, or by the best shooters. They are won by the best competitors.
The shooters who are winning or routinely finish high could care less what anybody else is using.
Maybe take a page out of that book.
--Fargo007
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fargo007</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Matches aren't won by the best gear, or by the best shooters. They are won by the best competitors.
The shooters who are winning or routinely finish high could care less what anybody else is using.
Maybe take a page out of that book.
--Fargo007</div></div>
One of the very best posts I've ever read! Volumes could be written as to why this is so true.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fargo007</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Matches aren't won by the best gear, or by the best shooters. They are won by the best competitors.
The shooters who are winning or routinely finish high could care less what anybody else is using.
Maybe take a page out of that book.
--Fargo007</div></div>
One of the very best posts I've ever read! Volumes could be written as to why this is so true.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
Thanks,
They really are won and lost between the ears, not behind the gun.
It is the people who are constantly in the top finish spots to observe. Any one of them are capable of having their "Any Given Sunday" Each time they come out. It's their plan and their thought process you want to dig into, not their gear.
To do well time after time, there is a very high level of situational awareness you need to maintain, a level of strategy and mindset you need to employ, and familiarity with the gear you do have, whatever it is, keen observation skills, and a series of good habits that prevent you from making stupid mistakes. Bring all this to the match and then we can talk about how either shooting skills or gear matters. I'm putting together a course for 2013 that will cover competition specifics. It is a difficult topic to take on because it really is such a mental game.
--Fargo007
Thanks,
They really are won and lost between the ears, not behind the gun.
It is the people who are constantly in the top finish spots to observe. Any one of them are capable of having their "Any Given Sunday" Each time they come out. It's their plan and their thought process you want to dig into, not their gear.
To do well time after time, there is a very high level of situational awareness you need to maintain, a level of strategy and mindset you need to employ, and familiarity with the gear you do have, whatever it is, keen observation skills, and a series of good habits that prevent you from making stupid mistakes. Bring all this to the match and then we can talk about how either shooting skills or gear matters. I'm putting together a course for 2013 that will cover competition specifics. It is a difficult topic to take on because it really is such a mental game.
--Fargo007
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
If that is the case why are the top shooters shooting similar products? Of Course the shooter is the most important part. But some people want step two. Or to use their products as stepping stones. The more people use a product and the more pub it gets, the more sponsorships and products sell. It is not only the gun for which people are looking at! It is scopes, rings, actions, and so on. For someone new to the art of shooting, these factors create a great base for them to start with.
If that is the case why are the top shooters shooting similar products? Of Course the shooter is the most important part. But some people want step two. Or to use their products as stepping stones. The more people use a product and the more pub it gets, the more sponsorships and products sell. It is not only the gun for which people are looking at! It is scopes, rings, actions, and so on. For someone new to the art of shooting, these factors create a great base for them to start with.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
That is not the case.
They are using GOOD QUALITY products, not at all the exact same rifle, scope, bipod and rings, built the exact same way.
Ask how many shooters are seen to show up with brand new AI's or top shelf custom rifles with Schmidt & Benders on them and proceed to miss their 500Y cold bore by three feet, crossfire on somebody else's target at least two stages, and go home with a page full of zeroes, and a burning question as to why eight thousand dollars wasn't enough. This club doesn't need any more members.
My point is that if success in these comps is your goal, you are asking the wrong question.
You should be watching what experienced shooters are doing, not what they are buying.
Best of luck in your journey. I'm off to the night suppressor match.
--Fargo007
That is not the case.
They are using GOOD QUALITY products, not at all the exact same rifle, scope, bipod and rings, built the exact same way.
Ask how many shooters are seen to show up with brand new AI's or top shelf custom rifles with Schmidt & Benders on them and proceed to miss their 500Y cold bore by three feet, crossfire on somebody else's target at least two stages, and go home with a page full of zeroes, and a burning question as to why eight thousand dollars wasn't enough. This club doesn't need any more members.
My point is that if success in these comps is your goal, you are asking the wrong question.
You should be watching what experienced shooters are doing, not what they are buying.
Best of luck in your journey. I'm off to the night suppressor match.
--Fargo007
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
How many times do I have to say that I REALIZE THAT IT GEAR IS ONLY AS GOOD AS THE SHOOTER. That being said if gear doesn't matter why dont you see any of the "Top" shooters, shooting .308 anymore? Not too long ago .308 was the go to cartridge but has now been surpassed by flatter shooting ones. For someone new to competition shooting that wants to be competitive. It's good to know what's working for the guys at the top. All of you "Buy once cry once" proponents can agree that it's better to buy good gear from the beginning and grow your skill into it. Than to buy crap that you'll end up having to swap out to be competitive in the future
How many times do I have to say that I REALIZE THAT IT GEAR IS ONLY AS GOOD AS THE SHOOTER. That being said if gear doesn't matter why dont you see any of the "Top" shooters, shooting .308 anymore? Not too long ago .308 was the go to cartridge but has now been surpassed by flatter shooting ones. For someone new to competition shooting that wants to be competitive. It's good to know what's working for the guys at the top. All of you "Buy once cry once" proponents can agree that it's better to buy good gear from the beginning and grow your skill into it. Than to buy crap that you'll end up having to swap out to be competitive in the future
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
Quality gear is correct, highest price gear is not always correct. I agree with Fargo007 about seeing quite a few shooters show up and have the best money can buy but not be in the top of the field. New shooters should look at what the top place finishers are using and I bet you'll be surprised.
From what we've seen at our local matches and seeing who the top place finishers are they all are using good equipment but you don't see the $3500 scopes, $1200 actions, $1000 stocks built by the top prices builders controlling everything. We do have those that use top name guns/equipment but so far the majority of the winners and top place finishers aren't using it.
I have never bought into the "buy once, cry once" theory and go overboard buying components but did the research, watched what was working and always at the top of the list and so far it's been working. It's easy to get caught up and spend big bucks and most of the time you'll get what you pay for with a good quality build that will perform well.
Do the research first, go to matches and talk to the guys that are shooting every week somewhere. See how their equipment is performing, ask other shooters about someone you've been watching and see what their comments are about his week to week performance with his guns.
Might take a few weeks or couple of months but you'll start to see what works and what doesn't and what you can spend your money on without wasting it on overpriced eye candy or substandard stuff you'll have to spend a lot on to upgrade later.
I'd like to see equipment listed on the match report but also realize how much work it is just to keep track of weekly/monthly scores and get the match report sent out. I've also seen shooters at our matches that didn't want others to know what they were shooting, have no clue as to why but some are that way. Heck we're more than happy to share our equipment list, it's just full of middle of the line stuff but it works.
Good luck
Topstrap
Quality gear is correct, highest price gear is not always correct. I agree with Fargo007 about seeing quite a few shooters show up and have the best money can buy but not be in the top of the field. New shooters should look at what the top place finishers are using and I bet you'll be surprised.
From what we've seen at our local matches and seeing who the top place finishers are they all are using good equipment but you don't see the $3500 scopes, $1200 actions, $1000 stocks built by the top prices builders controlling everything. We do have those that use top name guns/equipment but so far the majority of the winners and top place finishers aren't using it.
I have never bought into the "buy once, cry once" theory and go overboard buying components but did the research, watched what was working and always at the top of the list and so far it's been working. It's easy to get caught up and spend big bucks and most of the time you'll get what you pay for with a good quality build that will perform well.
Do the research first, go to matches and talk to the guys that are shooting every week somewhere. See how their equipment is performing, ask other shooters about someone you've been watching and see what their comments are about his week to week performance with his guns.
Might take a few weeks or couple of months but you'll start to see what works and what doesn't and what you can spend your money on without wasting it on overpriced eye candy or substandard stuff you'll have to spend a lot on to upgrade later.
I'd like to see equipment listed on the match report but also realize how much work it is just to keep track of weekly/monthly scores and get the match report sent out. I've also seen shooters at our matches that didn't want others to know what they were shooting, have no clue as to why but some are that way. Heck we're more than happy to share our equipment list, it's just full of middle of the line stuff but it works.
Good luck
Topstrap
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
It's also about what fits YOU and works best for YOU.
Because Jocko Johnson uses a Fu-Cockted chassis and does very well with it doesn't mean it's going to be comfortable for YOU.
Same with optics. No two eyes are the same, and it may take a couple tries to get things right. It did for me. The right scope or even the reticle for Jocko is very often not the right one for you.
Look through scopes on the firing line. 99% of the time you will find people accommodating to let you have a peek. The time somebody refuses this respectfully posed request, post their name here.
If you can get to a point where you are in communion with the platform, the gear stones in your success pyramid are solid. Now it's time to train.
Oh yeah - my match guns are .223, .308, .260, and 300 Win Mag. I am not new to this, and have been beaten by .308's while shooting each of them.
Come diesel, focused, in communion with your platform, and ready to invest properly into the planning and preparation and you will smoke people.
Caliber don't matter. Hits do.
--Fargo007
It's also about what fits YOU and works best for YOU.
Because Jocko Johnson uses a Fu-Cockted chassis and does very well with it doesn't mean it's going to be comfortable for YOU.
Same with optics. No two eyes are the same, and it may take a couple tries to get things right. It did for me. The right scope or even the reticle for Jocko is very often not the right one for you.
Look through scopes on the firing line. 99% of the time you will find people accommodating to let you have a peek. The time somebody refuses this respectfully posed request, post their name here.
If you can get to a point where you are in communion with the platform, the gear stones in your success pyramid are solid. Now it's time to train.
Oh yeah - my match guns are .223, .308, .260, and 300 Win Mag. I am not new to this, and have been beaten by .308's while shooting each of them.
Come diesel, focused, in communion with your platform, and ready to invest properly into the planning and preparation and you will smoke people.
Caliber don't matter. Hits do.
--Fargo007
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
Consider this about caliber selection: A lot of sponsored shooters are running barrel burner calibers and finishing in the top tier of the matches. To them, putting on a new barrel every winter is no big deal. They either have friends that can do the work for a good price or a sponsor is doing it. Now, a new shooter comes along, sees the top guys using those calibers, and goes out to get one without doing more research. Think he might be disappointed when he shoots his barrel out and he is not yet winning matches?
This is not bench rest. The best equipment/caliber does not get you in the top places.
There are plenty of threads on here with people asking for advice on equipment selection. For anyone unsure about what to buy, reading those and asking specific questions about their personal situation will yield much better results than buying what ever the match winners are using.
Consider this about caliber selection: A lot of sponsored shooters are running barrel burner calibers and finishing in the top tier of the matches. To them, putting on a new barrel every winter is no big deal. They either have friends that can do the work for a good price or a sponsor is doing it. Now, a new shooter comes along, sees the top guys using those calibers, and goes out to get one without doing more research. Think he might be disappointed when he shoots his barrel out and he is not yet winning matches?
This is not bench rest. The best equipment/caliber does not get you in the top places.
There are plenty of threads on here with people asking for advice on equipment selection. For anyone unsure about what to buy, reading those and asking specific questions about their personal situation will yield much better results than buying what ever the match winners are using.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
I dont know why people constantly act like I'm suggesting that people run out and buy exactly what "Shooter X" is using and then be able to compete on the same level with them. IT'S A REFERENCE NOT A SHOPPING LIST. Just like this site is a reference. Nothing more, nothing less.
I dont know why people constantly act like I'm suggesting that people run out and buy exactly what "Shooter X" is using and then be able to compete on the same level with them. IT'S A REFERENCE NOT A SHOPPING LIST. Just like this site is a reference. Nothing more, nothing less.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
agree, like any sport. What shoes MJ wore doesnt get someone to the NBA. What tennis racket John Macenroe used didnt win me a championship. But it is nice to get familiar with different equipment. If it were just the shooter, then certain companies wouldnt be at the top all the time! Take it for what it is, some people enjoy using or having knowledge of what top notch shooters use. It ok!
agree, like any sport. What shoes MJ wore doesnt get someone to the NBA. What tennis racket John Macenroe used didnt win me a championship. But it is nice to get familiar with different equipment. If it were just the shooter, then certain companies wouldnt be at the top all the time! Take it for what it is, some people enjoy using or having knowledge of what top notch shooters use. It ok!
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
Equipmnt list for top 15 places at the PRS Final
1. Wade Stuteville 108 Surgeon Rifle, 6x47 Lapua S&B
2. Jeff Badley 105 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
3. Chase Stroud 103 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Premier
4. Floyd Cook 96 Moon Built,243 Win S&B
T5. Dustin Morris 93* Surgeon Rifle,6mm XC S&B
T5 Patrick Morris 93 Surgeon Rifle,6mm XC S&B
7. Jim See 92 Center Shot, 6mm XC Vortex
8. Bradley Bell 90 GA Precision, 243 Win S&B
9. Francis Kuehl 89 Animal Build, 260 Rem Vortex
10. Tim Long 85 Surgeon Rifle, 260 Rem S&B
11. Joe Walls 84 APA,6mm XC S&B
12. Kevin Elpers 83 Stiller Precision 6.5 Creedmoor Vortex
13. Bryan Yeung 82 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
14. George Gardner 80* GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
15. Bryan Morgan 80 GA Precision, 243 Win S&B
12 of the top 15 shooting 6mm. other 3 6.5mm
Equipmnt list for top 15 places at the PRS Final
1. Wade Stuteville 108 Surgeon Rifle, 6x47 Lapua S&B
2. Jeff Badley 105 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
3. Chase Stroud 103 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Premier
4. Floyd Cook 96 Moon Built,243 Win S&B
T5. Dustin Morris 93* Surgeon Rifle,6mm XC S&B
T5 Patrick Morris 93 Surgeon Rifle,6mm XC S&B
7. Jim See 92 Center Shot, 6mm XC Vortex
8. Bradley Bell 90 GA Precision, 243 Win S&B
9. Francis Kuehl 89 Animal Build, 260 Rem Vortex
10. Tim Long 85 Surgeon Rifle, 260 Rem S&B
11. Joe Walls 84 APA,6mm XC S&B
12. Kevin Elpers 83 Stiller Precision 6.5 Creedmoor Vortex
13. Bryan Yeung 82 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
14. George Gardner 80* GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
15. Bryan Morgan 80 GA Precision, 243 Win S&B
12 of the top 15 shooting 6mm. other 3 6.5mm
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
George
What is the most popular model GAP rifle used in competition ? is there one used above others ? just curious
Hank
George
What is the most popular model GAP rifle used in competition ? is there one used above others ? just curious
Hank
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
Hank, not really, typically it's a Templar withManners T-4 style, heavy Palma/Tubb Countour with a brake, 26" with an AICS or AW mag system.
Hank, not really, typically it's a Templar withManners T-4 style, heavy Palma/Tubb Countour with a brake, 26" with an AICS or AW mag system.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
Thanks George
Thanks George
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
Lots of great advice in this thread.
There is a reason why the top shooters use certain gear. It gives them an advantage and that's why they use it. It doesn't make them good (they're already good) but it does make them do better. You could give a top shooter a .308 and he may still beat most of the field, but he'd have a much harder time beating the other top guys with the .308 if they are running ballistically superior calibers.
Not trying to argue with what has been said in this thread, but I do think there is nothing wrong with a new shooter wondering what guns, gear, etc. the best shooters use. It obviously won't instantly make them the best, but there is a reason why the top guys use what they use, and it may help a new shooter save some money and frustration to follow their example.
Lots of great advice in this thread.
There is a reason why the top shooters use certain gear. It gives them an advantage and that's why they use it. It doesn't make them good (they're already good) but it does make them do better. You could give a top shooter a .308 and he may still beat most of the field, but he'd have a much harder time beating the other top guys with the .308 if they are running ballistically superior calibers.
Not trying to argue with what has been said in this thread, but I do think there is nothing wrong with a new shooter wondering what guns, gear, etc. the best shooters use. It obviously won't instantly make them the best, but there is a reason why the top guys use what they use, and it may help a new shooter save some money and frustration to follow their example.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Equipmnt list for top 15 places at the PRS Final
1. Wade Stuteville 108 Surgeon Rifle, 6x47 Lapua S&B
2. Jeff Badley 105 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
3. Chase Stroud 103 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Premier
4. Floyd Cook 96 Moon Built,243 Win S&B
T5. Dustin Morris 93* Surgeon Rifle,6mm XC S&B
T5 Patrick Morris 93 Surgeon Rifle,6mm XC S&B
7. Jim See 92 Center Shot, 6mm XC Vortex
8. Bradley Bell 90 GA Precision, 243 Win S&B
9. Francis Kuehl 89 Animal Build, 260 Rem Vortex
10. Tim Long 85 Surgeon Rifle, 260 Rem S&B
11. Joe Walls 84 APA,6mm XC S&B
12. Kevin Elpers 83 Stiller Precision 6.5 Creedmoor Vortex
13. Bryan Yeung 82 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
14. George Gardner 80* GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
15. Bryan Morgan 80 GA Precision, 243 Win S&B
12 of the top 15 shooting 6mm. other 3 6.5mm </div></div>
Floyd Cook is running a Surgeon 6xc and Joe Walls is running a Surgeon/Robert Gradous 6xc.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Equipmnt list for top 15 places at the PRS Final
1. Wade Stuteville 108 Surgeon Rifle, 6x47 Lapua S&B
2. Jeff Badley 105 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
3. Chase Stroud 103 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Premier
4. Floyd Cook 96 Moon Built,243 Win S&B
T5. Dustin Morris 93* Surgeon Rifle,6mm XC S&B
T5 Patrick Morris 93 Surgeon Rifle,6mm XC S&B
7. Jim See 92 Center Shot, 6mm XC Vortex
8. Bradley Bell 90 GA Precision, 243 Win S&B
9. Francis Kuehl 89 Animal Build, 260 Rem Vortex
10. Tim Long 85 Surgeon Rifle, 260 Rem S&B
11. Joe Walls 84 APA,6mm XC S&B
12. Kevin Elpers 83 Stiller Precision 6.5 Creedmoor Vortex
13. Bryan Yeung 82 GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
14. George Gardner 80* GA Precision, 6mm Creedmoor Bushnell HDMR
15. Bryan Morgan 80 GA Precision, 243 Win S&B
12 of the top 15 shooting 6mm. other 3 6.5mm </div></div>
Floyd Cook is running a Surgeon 6xc and Joe Walls is running a Surgeon/Robert Gradous 6xc.
Re: Why dont we include gear used in match results
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hank, not really, typically it's a Templar withManners T-4 style, heavy Palma/Tubb Countour with a brake, 26" with an AICS or AW mag system. </div></div>
So to be clear - Most of the guys shooting 6mm are going with 26 inch barrels?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hank, not really, typically it's a Templar withManners T-4 style, heavy Palma/Tubb Countour with a brake, 26" with an AICS or AW mag system. </div></div>
So to be clear - Most of the guys shooting 6mm are going with 26 inch barrels?
