Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

[Outerspace]

I'm, not sure which forum this should go in...

I'm wondering if anyone here would chime in on stockpiling issues. A neighbor and I are thinking of going in on a progressive loader for the purposes of stockpiling a few thousand rounds of 223 or whatever may come up, including doing some for friends and family. Eg, I am thinking of converting to 6.8 SPC and/or running a FAL.

I got to thinking about it, if trying to stockpile, what kind of things would you take into consideration in determining the number of rounds.

For example, combat vets, how many rounds do you go through in a combat situation? Do you have any sort of intuitive sense or gut reaction toward this question?

Obviously more is always better but realistically there must be some cost/benefit consideration.

Any ideas, references, outside commentators are welcome.

 

[ShtrRdy]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

As much as you can carry with the other equipment you need.

 

[vinsonr]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

At this point I wish I had been reloading .223 for a year or more and had 10k+ stockpiled. That might not even be enough to weather the ammo drought that has hit us. Properly packed, 10,000 rounds of .223/5.56 does not take up a huge amount of room.

I carried 10-12 magazines for dismounted patrols. If I knew I was moving to contact I'd have traded 15+ pounds of other kit for more magazines filled to the brim or just carried more weight. It just wasn't that type of fight in Iraq in 2005, even in the Sunni triangle.

Each type of firefight will require different tactics and thus different amounts of ammo consumed. Holding off intruders across a field from cover and concealment is much different than being caught in an ambush.

I recommend having as much as you can without sacrificing other essentials and carry as much as you can without hindering your movement or ability to carry water.

 

[Outerspace]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

Thanks Vinson, my in law who was in country used to carry 7 mags on his body, but he was bomb dude, so 10-12 mags that's news to me.

10k is an interesting number, that's going to be a few grand reloading so that might be a good investment. We'd been thinking up to 3k, but really who knows what we're in for.

 

[armorpl8chikn]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

Sweet titty fucking christ!

Here this may help:
<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/evr_tP9cJWY"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/evr_tP9cJWY" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>

 

[Outerspace]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

Speaking of Jesus Christ, he says in the last days that Kingdom shall rise against Kingdom, and ethnicity shall rise against ethnicity (the Ainglish translations used the word Nation in place of the Greek Ethnos, but we can read between the lines) so we all take our chances.

If you are like the average forum participant here any future gov't panel would consider you a stockpiler like me I'm sure with your 3+ guns, so welcome to the loon community hope you enjoy the company.

I say if you're going to do something then do it right. So let's get to stockpiling.

 

[GentleBen]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

As a Marine 0311 grunt in Vietnam, I usually humped 12 full mags (about 230 rounds) plus 200-300 rounds on stripper clips in cardboard boxes. We didn't have the luxury of quick re-supply in the northern I Corps and we got loaded down pretty heavy with gear. Probably 80+ pounds when fully loaded.

Keep in mind, we also had to hump one can of gun ammo (200-7.62) for the M-60, one 60mm mortar round, one LAAW, 6 grenades (4 frags, 1 smoke, 1 illum), 1 pound of C-4, 6 canteens of water, 3 days of C-rats, a poncho liner (poncho optional according to time of year), a flak jacket, frame pack with assorted personal items, your M-16 of course, one heavy-ass helmet, and whatever else our squad leader deemed necessary.

I don't know how we ever made it up 700- to 1,200-meter steep mountains.

Oh, and if it was your two-week turn to hump the skipper's 25-lbs PRC-25 radio, they cut you some slack and took away the can of gun ammo. (not a very good trade)

To the original question, just make sure that when you start reloading for the entire family that you take rifle types (AR vs. bolt) and chamber-to-chamber specs into consideration. Then there is bullet types, etc. It's not just a matter of "how much" to load up. Plus some neighbors may not like you having a reloading/arsenal going on in your home or garage, so don't advertise. Not these days anyway ... there are soccer moms on every block.

 

[GentleBen]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

I have just a bit more than 3,500 pieces of good brass in .223 and .308 combined (Lapua, Winchester and Lake City). I can't/won't divulge how many primers, bullets and pounds of powder I have to reload those 3,500 pieces of brass because my buddies will continue to hit me up for more supplies.

 

[MosesTheTank]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

My perspective is this, a competition can eat up between 60 and 200 rounds of 223 in a single day (depending on whether it's silhouette, tactical rifle, or a 3 gun). Practice is usually a bit less. 10,000 rounds will not only be eaten up quickly, but it takes up very little space.

And someone made an important good point on here about keeping bolt gun and semi-auto reloads separate. I have a separate reloading station for each. One for volume (Dillon XL650) and one for precision (Redding T-7).

For my non-shooting family and friends I put it like this, when I used to play hockey I would shoot about 300 pucks 4x/week AFTER practice.

 

[bigjohn451]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

When I was in the Infantry in the late 80's, our basic load was 7 30 rnd mags with the understanding that if things went to crap we would be carrying every round we could get our hands on.

As a Prepper type you better hope you never get in the situation of burning through 10000 rounds in fights cause your odds are not good of coming out of them. I doubt many military riflemen burn that many in all there deployments. (M60 or SAW gunners are another story.) Also if you end up in that many fights and prevail, resupply won't be an issue.

As for me, I plan on staying the hell out of fights if I can help it.

 

[Wildwillalaska]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

Cool thing with a quality progressive press, you can always roll more. Powder and primers keep wonderfully if stored right and those cute boxes of bullets don't take up space at all. You can keep a few to 10,000 rounds made up, and supplies for much, much more without taking up too much space.

Problem with presses are they are like rabbits and multiply. I have a Dillon and few single stage presses and honestly want to make room for another Dillon so I can have one for large and one for small primers. Changing calipers is easy and quick, but primer size an additional pain.

My problem with stockpiling is I like to burn them as fast as I make them.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

I am not planning/prepping, and I'm not really inclined to participate in any Apocalyptic fight for survival. At 66, I've had all the real deal combat I could handle. I'll sit the next one out, my participation would likeliest be more of a hindrance than a benefit to anyone whose side I'd be on.

When I was overseas, I carried a standard loadout of six 20rd M14 mags. After a couple of months I almost became accustomed to living with X amount of ballast everywhere I went. There are several good reasons why our loadout was established at the specified capacity..

Anyone of us getting into a protracted engagement would have needed an ammo resupply in under an hour; assuming they had survived that long and already relieved their incapacitated comrades of their unused ammo.

Most of these questions are generally the product of fertile, but underexperienced minds.

They presuppose a highly optimistic view of the conditions under which the ammo cache in question will be carried and expended. As Marines in 'Nam, once you've weathered your first ambush (from the wrong end), you realize that ammo loadouts are predicated on a highly optimistic individual survival estimate. Marines tend to get sent to places where such is the common rule.

If you are asking such questions, you're also likely not to have received the sort of combat training a Marine gets as a matter of course. Trained Marines don't ask, they do as they are told; they have learned from experience that Sergeants do the thinking, and it's pointless for private soldiers to be cogitating at a strategic or even tactical level.

Greg

 

[gimpy]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

As an ex 11B, I believe ammo is like money; hard to have too much. There's a reason my soldiers called me Tackleberry. Sure, there's a limit to how much you can reasonably carry, but only you can determine that number. I was a fan of establishing superiority of firepower (something us civies have little need for or likelihood of doing). If you're lucky enough to live long in a fight, you can be sure you will be carrying a much lighter load away with you.

 

[Outerspace]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

I'm actually in the financial industry (derivatives) and the debt bomb we're living under is a matter of when not if as far as an explosion is concerned. It will be biblical.

I really don't have any idea what kind of stuff specifically will fall out, just the more you think about it the better you'll do. This year we should be food independent in terms of what can be grown.

I don't want to go into rabbit holes here but was just trying to get a sounding. I appreciate the comments on how much ammo you carry, and how much you have at home. Good starting points.

 

[Aimsmall55]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: armorpl8chikn</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sweet titty fucking christ!

Here this may help:
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</div></div>


That is the funniest shit I have seen in a long time!!

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

I think there can be downsides to stockpiling ammo.

First, stockpiling handloads, for some reason I cannot figure out, seems to be fraught with a phenomenon where the bullet and case neck become bonded. I have encountered this in ammo that is as recently loaded as two months. For some reason, the pull force of factory ammo does not exhibit this same trait, and I'm very unclear about why this difference exists.

I find this to be perplexing, because excessive pull force disrupts properly consistent neck tension and makes handcrafted ammo lose its inherent accuracy; which is the main reason I handload in the first place.

To this end, I prefer to keep my stock of finished ammo small and young, and preserve my components efficacy as separate components. Besides, kept separate, their effectiveness cannot be turned against me and mine. As I consume my own, I can replace my own.

Then, from a prepper standpoint, I would envision a stockpile of ammo as putting a premium attraction for do-badders to visit one's domicile. Having such a resource in abundance simply makes one a more attractive target. Following such reasoning, one has to accept at least some risk that one's resources might end up on wrong hands, increasing the misery factor that prevails in times of anguish.

Finally, such stockpiles could also attract the attention of authorities in times of extremes, when the rule of non-Constitutional law could trump the rights of individuals. Why should I maintain resources simply to end up providing those resources to an oppressor?

This is another reason why I often choose to shoot fewer 'standard' chamberings. My firearms and ammo would be of only limited and short-term value in less friendly hands, while 'runs' on available ammo should affect me less, or perhaps not at all. How many might find a stock, of any size, of say, .280 Rem, or .260 Rem, or 7.62x54R, or .30BR of any personal value beyond mine? Sometimes, unconventional reasoning can be of signal value.

Greg

 

[Deadshot2]

Re: Loading question for Preppers/Combat Veterans

I am of the school that believes there are only two kinds of ammo. "Some" and "More". There is no such thing as "enough".

For my AR's I have several 50 cal cans with bandoleers that are carefully folded, tucked in, along with a dessicant pack and adaptor "spoon".

For my long rifle I have a number of 30 cal cans that have the .308 rounds secured in plastic holders such as what Federal packs their commercial ammo in. These holders are then placed in the 30 cal can on end. Can get about 180 rounds per container.

If I am unable to have suitable transportation available any of the ammo can be transferred quickly for personal carry.

It's very possible for one to load enough "stash" ammo with simple equipment, it just takes a long time to build any quantity. I am fortunate to not only have a high volume progressive, I also have components that I restock after each "panic" has ended and the shelves are restocked.