Ok I'm new to reloading just got everything together not long ago and just started actually reloading a couple weeks ago... Here's my problem when I'm full length sizing my 308 brass I got my die set up to just bump the shoulder back .002" but with my caliper headspace gauge I'm getting differences in the headspace case to case most are right on with the .002" bump but some are a few thousands under that or above that... Don't know what's going on I'm making sure I go all the way down on the press arm and lubing the cases the same every time.. Any help would be much appreciated
- Thread starter Buster78
- Start date
Re: What am I doing wrong?
Is the brass all the same brand and head stamp ?
Is the brass all the same brand and head stamp ?
Re: What am I doing wrong?
Was all this brass fire formed in your rifle?
Was all this brass fire formed in your rifle?
Re: What am I doing wrong?
Its ok, .001" isn't going to hurt anything. Any little thing can make a differenc in being off .001", the way you measure, the brass, the die, name it. As long as it chanmbers ok your good to go. I take a average headspace measurement of 5 fired cases and set headspace from there. You will see a difference of .001" and sometimes more from that measurment.
Its ok, .001" isn't going to hurt anything. Any little thing can make a differenc in being off .001", the way you measure, the brass, the die, name it. As long as it chanmbers ok your good to go. I take a average headspace measurement of 5 fired cases and set headspace from there. You will see a difference of .001" and sometimes more from that measurment.
Re: What am I doing wrong?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: country888</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Its ok, .001" isn't going to hurt anything. Any little thing can make a differenc in being off .001", the way you measure, the brass, the die, name it. As long as it chanmbers ok your good to go. I take a average headspace measurement of 5 fired cases and set headspace from there. You will see a difference of .001" and sometimes more from that measurment. </div></div>
^ this. I know the directions in my RCBS Precision Mic say when measuring head space to take 5 measurements and use the average (to me this indicates that small variances are normal).
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: country888</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Its ok, .001" isn't going to hurt anything. Any little thing can make a differenc in being off .001", the way you measure, the brass, the die, name it. As long as it chanmbers ok your good to go. I take a average headspace measurement of 5 fired cases and set headspace from there. You will see a difference of .001" and sometimes more from that measurment. </div></div>
^ this. I know the directions in my RCBS Precision Mic say when measuring head space to take 5 measurements and use the average (to me this indicates that small variances are normal).
Re: What am I doing wrong?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Buster78</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok I'm new to reloading just got everything together not long ago and just started actually reloading a couple weeks ago... Here's my problem when I'm full length sizing my 308 brass I got my die set up to just bump the shoulder back .002" but with my caliper headspace gauge I'm getting differences in the headspace case to case most are right on with the .002" bump but some are a few thousands under that or above that... Don't know what's going on I'm making sure I go all the way down on the press arm and lubing the cases the same every time.. Any help would be much appreciated </div></div>
Agree with I haven't seen noticeable differences when shooting the variance. But I did also fight the same issue as I was starting to learn (and still am learning). Some of the things I found that helped me get more consistent though were;
- Found I was using just a bit more lube then was needed so was able to use a little less.
- My press cams over and actually setting the die so that it cams over a small amount helped (despite the directions from the dies)
- Slowing my stroke down and giving a solid 2 to 3 second pause when the ram is at the top to allow the brass to fully form.
Some may be applicable for you or not and you might already being doing these. These were things for me that helped at least. Good luck.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Buster78</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok I'm new to reloading just got everything together not long ago and just started actually reloading a couple weeks ago... Here's my problem when I'm full length sizing my 308 brass I got my die set up to just bump the shoulder back .002" but with my caliper headspace gauge I'm getting differences in the headspace case to case most are right on with the .002" bump but some are a few thousands under that or above that... Don't know what's going on I'm making sure I go all the way down on the press arm and lubing the cases the same every time.. Any help would be much appreciated </div></div>
Agree with I haven't seen noticeable differences when shooting the variance. But I did also fight the same issue as I was starting to learn (and still am learning). Some of the things I found that helped me get more consistent though were;
- Found I was using just a bit more lube then was needed so was able to use a little less.
- My press cams over and actually setting the die so that it cams over a small amount helped (despite the directions from the dies)
- Slowing my stroke down and giving a solid 2 to 3 second pause when the ram is at the top to allow the brass to fully form.
Some may be applicable for you or not and you might already being doing these. These were things for me that helped at least. Good luck.
Re: What am I doing wrong?
All the brass is once fired lake city out of the same bolt gun. Before sizing they all have the same headspace but its after I run them through my sizing die that I'm getting the variances in headspace some as much as .005 over or under my intended mark its driving me nuts how the numbers are all over the place I'm being very careful to do everything the same with all the cases from lube to exact same stroke on the loader handle
All the brass is once fired lake city out of the same bolt gun. Before sizing they all have the same headspace but its after I run them through my sizing die that I'm getting the variances in headspace some as much as .005 over or under my intended mark its driving me nuts how the numbers are all over the place I'm being very careful to do everything the same with all the cases from lube to exact same stroke on the loader handle
Re: What am I doing wrong?
Almost feels as though the expander ball is pulling the shoulder out when the case is coming out of the die... Does that make sense to anybody?
Almost feels as though the expander ball is pulling the shoulder out when the case is coming out of the die... Does that make sense to anybody?
Re: What am I doing wrong?
dump the expander ball and get a full length bushing die.
dump the expander ball and get a full length bushing die.
Re: What am I doing wrong?
Variance in headspace measurement is probably due to the brass being in slightly different states of work-hardness.
You need to anneal the necks and shoulders. Do a search here and the net on annealing. It will most likely solve the problem
Variance in headspace measurement is probably due to the brass being in slightly different states of work-hardness.
You need to anneal the necks and shoulders. Do a search here and the net on annealing. It will most likely solve the problem
Re: What am I doing wrong?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Quickdraw40</div><div class="ubbcode-body">dump the expander ball and get a full length bushing die. </div></div>
Is this something I can add or swap out on my Forster die or is it a completely separate die? And what brand should I be looking at for these bushing dies?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Quickdraw40</div><div class="ubbcode-body">dump the expander ball and get a full length bushing die. </div></div>
Is this something I can add or swap out on my Forster die or is it a completely separate die? And what brand should I be looking at for these bushing dies?
Re: What am I doing wrong?
As my fellow New Mexican Rcamuglia mentioned differences in brass hardness may be the culprit. Annealing is about the only way to address hardness. I would also check the the neck wall thickness in a random sample of brass. Just because it is all LC doesn't mean the neck wall thickness is the same. The expander being drawn through the neck will exert greater force on thicker necks possibly affecting headspace. Variations in neck wall thickness is one of the primary causes of reloading issues.
As my fellow New Mexican Rcamuglia mentioned differences in brass hardness may be the culprit. Annealing is about the only way to address hardness. I would also check the the neck wall thickness in a random sample of brass. Just because it is all LC doesn't mean the neck wall thickness is the same. The expander being drawn through the neck will exert greater force on thicker necks possibly affecting headspace. Variations in neck wall thickness is one of the primary causes of reloading issues.
Re: What am I doing wrong?
An easy way to find out if it's the expander ball being dragged through the neck, you can take the decapping unit out of the die and size some cases without the expander ball in, then take some measurements with you gauge. It could be the expander.
I've even gotten better results by fully F/L sizing, back the ram out of the die out slightly, then rotate the case 180º and running the case through the F/L die again. You can also try lubing the inside of the case necks. The type and amount of case lube can also make a difference. Polishing the expander ball can also help.
An easy way to find out if it's the expander ball being dragged through the neck, you can take the decapping unit out of the die and size some cases without the expander ball in, then take some measurements with you gauge. It could be the expander.
I've even gotten better results by fully F/L sizing, back the ram out of the die out slightly, then rotate the case 180º and running the case through the F/L die again. You can also try lubing the inside of the case necks. The type and amount of case lube can also make a difference. Polishing the expander ball can also help.
Re: What am I doing wrong?
Your expander ball might be sticking to the neck. Maybe your expander ball is a little rough or maybe a little powder residue on the inside of your neck, either one will cause your case shoulders to be pulled out
Your expander ball might be sticking to the neck. Maybe your expander ball is a little rough or maybe a little powder residue on the inside of your neck, either one will cause your case shoulders to be pulled out
Re: What am I doing wrong?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Buster78</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Quickdraw40</div><div class="ubbcode-body">dump the expander ball and get a full length bushing die. </div></div>
Is this something I can add or swap out on my Forster die or is it a completely separate die? And what brand should I be looking at for these bushing dies?
</div></div>
Best would be to buy a new Redding full length sizing die with bushing.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Buster78</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Quickdraw40</div><div class="ubbcode-body">dump the expander ball and get a full length bushing die. </div></div>
Is this something I can add or swap out on my Forster die or is it a completely separate die? And what brand should I be looking at for these bushing dies?
</div></div>
Best would be to buy a new Redding full length sizing die with bushing.
Re: What am I doing wrong?
Ok I think I figured it out..I polished the crap out of the expander ball ran a few cases in the die... HUGE!! Difference no sticky feeling pulling the brass out of the die and all four cases had the same headspace so I guess I had a rough expander ball like you said. Thanks guys for the help
Ok I think I figured it out..I polished the crap out of the expander ball ran a few cases in the die... HUGE!! Difference no sticky feeling pulling the brass out of the die and all four cases had the same headspace so I guess I had a rough expander ball like you said. Thanks guys for the help
Re: What am I doing wrong?
Could be a stop issue on the press as well. Some presses do not have a very positive stop feature. When you are resizing make sure you are using the same amount of force and stopping against something positive
Could be a stop issue on the press as well. Some presses do not have a very positive stop feature. When you are resizing make sure you are using the same amount of force and stopping against something positive
