Building my first custom hunting rifle: weight question...

[Infinity]

Hi All,
I'm getting ready to build my first custom hunting/target rifle in .308 with Phoenix Custom Rifles. It looks like I'll be using a trued Rem 700 short action and a Bartlein #5 contour 20" barrel. I'm also looking at a 1.5-2 lb. H-S Precision Pro Series Stock. I would like for the rifle to be as handy as possible. What is the lightest I could get this rifle built at? Is it possible for this rifle to weigh 8 or 9 lbs. pre-scope? Like I said, this is my first custom build. Please feel free to recommend alternative stocks, etc. I'm pretty much set on my smith but am open to recommendations there as well. Keith at PCR said that 10 lbs would be pushing it but I'd like to go as light as possible without sacrificing accuracy. I know he's the expert and I'm willing to respect the 10 lb minimum unless you all tell me I can trim it down. What difference does barrel/bolt fluting make? I thought I might be able to get rid of some weight in the stock. I'm open to any advice you may have to offer. Thanks,
Adam

 

[long range newbie]

you could get the rifle to weigh 6lbs but it won't be as accurate and you could shoot about 3 rnds before its too hot to shoot. Also my dad has a hs precision rifle built by them and it weighs 5.75lbs its a 270wsm, its crazy light but it gets hot fast. barrel fluting makes it less rigid (less stiff) and bolt fluting makes it get the grit out of the gun when it gets in the bolt area instead of binding, carbon fiber stocks also weigh like nothing so those might be a good option too. Carbon fiber wrapped barrels are light and accurate but cost like 800+, manners composite stocks sell a nice carbon fiber stock which is super light and their company is well known so you should be good. I know you decided on rem 700 action but to make it lighter you could go with the titanium rem 700 action or go with a custom action, that would save a lot of weight but to build a high end light weight target rifle cost lots of $ the lighter you get the more money it costs you.

 

[VJJPunisher]

under 10lbs is definatley doable easily enough. My .308 is only 16 inches but is a Bartlein #7 contour in an HS stock and it weighs 8.4 lbs before scope, with the USO ST-10 it weighs 10.2 lbs. So your 20 inch on a #5 should even out or even be a hair lighter id thingk. Ive been told buy a known builder that fluting does not really reduce much weight at all unless you really cut them flutes extra deep. here is my rifle for reference

http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...on-rifles/134463-crescent-customs-beiber.html

 

[Infinity]

LRN, thanks for your contribution. I'm pretty set on the barrel and action choice but I very much appreciate you taking the time. I'm starting to wrap my head around the rifle weighing in a hair under 10.5 lbs with scope. I'm not really sure how much balance I want to give up if I make the stock super light. Please feel free to contribute anything else you think I need to know. Thanks all,
Adam

 

[Infinity]

Senor Punisher,
That's the type of info I was looking for. Thank you. Nice looking rifle btw. Any idea how many rounds I can fire in a group before shots start to wander with that #5 contour? 10 doable? I can keep to 5 round groups if need be. The rifle will pull double duty: hunting and target... Thanks again...

 

[long range newbie]

no problem, all I can say now is you can't go wrong with a rem 700 build (unless you get one of the really messed up actions)

 

[vtb]

1. Action with bolt and barrel will weight around 7,0-7,2lbs which leaves you (roughly) 3 lbs on scope, rings, base and stock.
2. rings + base (all titanium) from Murphy precision will weight = 88+79 grams = 168 grams or 0,37 lbs - it leaves you 2,6 lbs on scope and stocks.

Mcmillan HTG weights 1,85 lbs. it leaves you 18,4 oz on scope
So - either you choose hunting scope, or you change barrel profile or make barrel fluted.

Or you can make lighter stock. but i will not recommend go lighter than 1,4 lbs - it could affect rigridity.

 

[Frank Green]

I don't agree entirely with all the comments.

Can it be done? Yes. The straighter the barrel blank and the more uniform the twist and bore and groove dimensions and the more stress free the blank is the more forgiving the barrel is going to be. The old statement of a heavier barrel shoots better is only partially correct because of what I just said.

I picked up a couple of years ago a older Browning Sako Safari in .243win. for my wife as a hunting rifle and the bore of the barrel was junk from pitting and not being taken care of properly. This barrel contour has the double radius sporter Browning contour and a .550" muzzle at 22". We duplicated the contour but I made the muzzle .600" at 22" and made the new barrel in .260 Rem. With out the NF 2.5-10 scope on it the rifle only weighs 7.5#. With the scope it weighs 9#. The iron sights on the gun are for back up in case there is ever a problem with the optics. The rear sight is the original Browning sight and the front sight is a New England Custom Guns ramp front sight. I bedded the stock. The barrel is made out of c.m. steel and has been blued. With my handloads the gun will shoot 1/3 moa consistently. Couldn't ask for anything more.



Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels

 

[Bangin_steel]

Another stock option is a manners elite hunter. Weighes in around 26 ounces will def have some added benefit as far quality goes.

 

[E. Bryant]

Here is my "lightweight" setup:



It's built on a Rem700 with 26" Bartlein #5 barrel, Manners MCS-T with 90% carbon fill, and Surgeon DBM bottom metal. The bare rifle (with Seekins aluminum rail and empty Alpha magazine, but no optic/rings/bipod/pack/sling) weighs right around 10lbs according to my bathroom scale.

The stock and barrel choices will pretty much determine the weight of the bare rifle, and of course you need to watch the stuff you hang on it (especially the scope). With a .308, I'd probably err on the shorter side for the barrel, which makes hitting the weight target a lot easier.

 

[FN in MT]

My Winchester M-70 Safari grade in .375 H&H with a 1.5-5X Leupold in Talleys, w/irons, a sling and 3 rds of 300 gr ammo weighs in at 10.5 pounds. Carried that rig up and down Mtn's here in Montana for many years as it's simply a great elk rifle. But as I got older my 7 pound .280 Rem started getting more and more use. Light rifles CAN shoot very well. And they are a hell of a lot easier to CARRY.

OP...You mentioned this build is a "Hunting/Target" build. How much hunting do you intend to do? Where and for WHAT?

If you take an ATV to a stand, then sit there all day with shots possible out to 400 or 500 yds, that's one situation.
If your in deep woods with shots at 75 yds the max...that's something else. If you are a walk and stalk hunter thats yet another scenario.

In my opinion these DUAL PURPOSE builds generally turn into compromises. I don't like to compromise.

FN in MT

 

[tylerw02]

Go light with your glass. Look at perhaps a Leupold Mark 4 3.5-10x40 or Mark 6 3-18x44, or perhaps a compact NF NXS 2.5-10x. That'll be your best way of saving weight while maintaining functionality.

 

[bluto77]

Russell at Scout Supply Company is building a 300 WSM for me to take on an elk hunt. It's my first custom rifle of any kind. I wanted to keep it light, but I also wanted to be able to use it at the range after the hunt. I was overly concerned with it weighing right at 10 lbs without scope, but I've gotten over it. It's going to come in closer to 12 now (if I remember correctly). I'm using a Manners T5, but going with the carbon fill stock instead of mini chassis, no adjustable in order to save more weight. Getting the deep flutes in the barrel because i didn't want to skimp too much on barrel. Broughton 5.75 at 26" is going to weigh around 5.6. The detachable mag will add a little weight too. Now I have to decide on hunting or "tacticool" scope. I can go 15 oz or 30 oz. I'm thinking the mark 6 3-18. I may be cursing quite a bit when I'm lugging it around a mountain though.

 

[mlh29]

I have a couple rem 700 builds that are super light, they have pencil barrels and get hot quickly making shots wander. I also have a rem 7 that does the same. In hindsight I wished I would have went with a heavier contour as I can deal with another 1lb. You should be able to keep weight in check by using lighter weight components, if you dont need the latest tactical DBM, scope, base and rings... etc dont get them
You may check into:
PTG Aluminum BDL bottom metal, bolt shroud,etc.
flute what you can if you want.. bolt, barrel, holes in bolt handle
chop the barrel to 18 or less
lightweight stock, mcmillan, manners, maybe evena B and c TI stock( hunting rifle)
scopes: if it isnt a tactical rig... look at other quality scopes.. you may not need a 22oz or more 10x scope
talley rings 4.4 oz per set and they are tough.
Good luck

 

[E. Bryant]

Here is another example of a mid-weight Rem700 build:



This example uses a Rem factory varmint contour barrel cut to ~17.5", another Manners MCS-T stock (standard 35% carbon shell, I believe - I bought the stock used so I don't know for certain), and PTG M5-pattern bottom metal. The rifle weighs about 9.5lbs with Seekins aluminum rail and empty magazine; with steel Weaver rings and an inexpensive Leupold 3-9x40mm scope, it ends up right around 10.5lbs on my bathroom scale.

This is a good example of the influence of barrel length on overall weight; despite this rifle having a heavier barrel profile than the previous one that I posted, the 8.5" difference in length more than makes up for it.

 

[Barney88PDC]

That #5 contour is still pretty stout for a hunting rig. I would go Rem Varmit to split the difference. Still plenty enough meat for a longer string of fire and you would save almost 1.5 pounds in weight.

 

[E. Bryant]

That #5 contour is still pretty stout for a hunting rig.

In hindsight, I probably wouldn't make the same choice again. It's a bit too heavy for hunting, while still being too light to support extended paper-punching sessions.

 

[Infinity]

Thank you all for your contributions. I think my mind is at ease now regarding end weight. I will be shooting enough targets with the rifle to be okay with the barrel being a touch heavier. I'll try to make up the majority of weight in the stock and scope. If I remember, I'll post a picture of the final product when it gets to that point in a couple months. Thanks again all,
Adam

 

[Hawk45]

Doing a lightweight hunting/target gun is pretty hard. As mentioned the thinner the contour, the fewer shots in a string before you get drifting (usually around 3-5 shots every 10-15min depending on caliber). Adding weight to the profile gets you more heat dissipation for longer strings, but you are adding weight. About the only way to accomplish this is to cut the barrel super short, but then you lose all your velocity and most cartridges become very inefficient.

I say get a 6lb Tikka for hunting and build a middle weight gun as it seems your building as a utility rifle.. not really a long distance hike gun, but not a heavy bench either. Something you can do 3-4 miles with and it won't break your back. I'd say that's about 10-12 lbs.

Just my .02

 

[Infinity]

Hawk,
Thank you for contributing. I ended up building a hunting rifle with a brux #5 @ 20". It is exactly what I wanted. Thanks again,
Adam

 

[long range newbie]

pics please

 

[Infinity]

Arm twister ;D

http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...10372-my-new-phoenix-custom-rifles-build.html

 

[Infinity]

I get it Tuesday or Wednesday...going to have a little photo shoot for her so more pics coming...