Rifle Scopes SCOPE MANUFACTURER QUALITY RATINGS ( high end scopes only)

[Eric B.]

I'd like to get an idea of what people feel (from firsthand experience ONLY) are the rankings of riflescopes by brand name but considering HIGH END models only from each brand.
This way we are comparing apples to apples. I realize your list may be short due to only using, say four brands' high end scopes. BUT, at least it will be an honest list.

This would include:
1. Glass Quality
2. Mechanical Reliability ->(mainly turret durability and repeatability but parallax, focus, etc. is also important)
3. Ease of Use ->(i.e. is it easier to use Leupold lighted reticle switch or Night Force)
4. Reticle Selection and quality
5. Proprietary features ->(features not found on other brands of scopes)

Just list them in order from highest to lower

EX. (Hold yer water, this is an example only, not my ranking)

Schmidt & Bender
Leupold
NightForce
Swarovski
Bushnell
Burris
Sightron
SWFA
Nikon

 

[JesseSB]

NightForce

Leupold

Vortex

SWFA

S&B would be at the top but I don't own one yet. Shot rifles with them but very limited personal experience.
.02

 

[Fred @ Bison Tactical]

check out Ilya's reviews I think he pretty much covers all of that - just wish they were a bit more currently now ...

Ilya - if your listening we want the Heavyweight scope review !!

 

[lazy21]

Some call me nuts but I'll play


USO
Hensoldt
S&B
Premier
Vortex HD *wish they had a better parallax knob

 

[pinzmann]

Schmidt Bender - all around #1 unfortunately also in price
Nightforce - best bang for your buck, love the new ATACR
Premier - all is good except its hard getting use to 2 clicks per hash mark on knobs
USO - best elev. knob in the business, poor quality control and customer service{in my own experience}
IOR - great optics, love the elev. knob and reticle but spotty quality control. Newer models much improved
Leupold - only have the older models. 10yrs+ no complaints

 

[42769vette]

Hendsolt
S&B
USO
(top 3 are all neck and neck)
Preimer
Razor HD
NF

 

[Bounce]

You seriously need to add March to your list,since you already have included much inferior scopes in your "high end" grouping. You should also look at Ilya's reviews. They would answer all of your questions.

 

[RTO]

I will chime in here since I own, have owned and used pretty much all of the top end scopes mentioned.

1.Hensoldt (just bought my first Henny downsides would be choice of reticles and no zero stop)
2. Schmidt Bender (own one and have owned another and used my SB at matches for years. Outstanding products only negative is tunneling between 5-7 power)
3. Kahles (a good friend owns one and we have set them side by side to compare. Glass is a very close second to S&B and parallax is outstanding)
4. Premier (Great glass they had problems with parallax failing when tightening rings for years, I cant count how many I have seen fail. This may have been fixed in past year though not sure)
5.USO (I have owned several USO's, they offer tons of customizations for user which is awesome but comparing glass they just don't match up. The EREK is one of the best turrets IMO)
6 March (I have shot a friends March many times, these are great scopes light weight and good glass, only real downside to the ones I have see were the thickness of the reticles and objective size of 44mm. I know they have larger objectives now and I have heard they are coming out with some smaller reticles as well.)
7. IOR (I haven't owned one of these but spent quite a bit of time behind them. Great scopes good glass, I just feel that USO outweighs them having more options and having the EREK)
8. Night Force ( I have owned two NF 5.5-22x56's and a 3-15x56 F1. Great scopes but glass is nowhere in the ballpark of above scopes)
9. Leopold (I have owned a few Mark IV's and not been happy with any of them. I didn't like the eye box, eye relief, nor was the glass anything impressive at all.)

These are all my opinions and are all very subjective. Ask 20 people and get 20 different answers. I figured I would give a little info about each one since I have experience with all of them. The thing that I hear the most is "I have bad eyes I need more power". Power is not the answer, quality of glass can make a target or fly on a target easier to see than power. I have shot a lot of matches and can not recall ever dialing past 15x even at distances out to 1250. The only time I ever dial past 15 or 16 would be targets past 1200-1300 yards and most of the time mirage wont allow that either. I am not saying everyone needs to get rid of their Night Force and buy a S&B, Henny, or whatever. All I am saying is quality of glass is more important than power and more focus should be put on buying the best scope you can rather than if it is 16X or 25X. Great glass will give you more depth into tree lines or shaded areas, allow you to have a more crisp clean field of view, it is easier on your eyes allowing you to focus your eye on what you are looking to find. With any of these scopes when you have a lot of mirage the higher power is useless. There are times however that great glass with power can be useful. I use my 5-25x56 SB to dial up and spot hits on targets at 300 when running ladder tests so I dont have to get up or stop. There have been days where I can see my 6mm holes at 600 at 25 power as well but these days are few and far between. Conditions have to be just right and mirage usually throws that option out the window.

There are other scopes such as the Razor HD as mentioned above but I am listing what I am familiar with only.
Feel free to disagree or form your own opinion. These are only my opinions. I hope I didn't get to far off topic here.

 

[Longshot38]

Alright my list looks something like this:

Premier
Vortex
SWFA
IOR

In the end Premier just has everything I want in a scope. Vortex falls pretty much in line with then but the glass isn't quite as good. SWFA offers a good product for a resonable price. And IOR makes some good stuff but CS is lacking.

 

[42769vette]

On a side note, Great thread. Its nice to not see a bunch of arguing back and forth with everyone trying to prove they are right (I'm not as guilty as the next guy)

 

[steve123]

S&B- 10Y parallax rocks, best glass I've looked though. Tunneling is a none issue for me.

March- Well built and great action to all controls, love the 10Y parallax, 10 mil knobs. Big numbers 1 mil off the right side of verticle crosshair suck.

NF- Reliabilty unmatched by any other brand. Glass is getting better than it used to be. They just need to upgrade the old style illume.

Bushnell HDMR. Great scopes, great value. Only one small complaint, when dialed "all" the way up the image degrades. Bushnell 3-12, also a good scope but very tight eyebox.

USO- Didn't impress.

IOR- Learned my lesson.

Premier- nunya business, great glass though.

Leupold- Ho hum, haven't owned the MK6 or 8's though.

 

[Niles Coyote]

Glass quality only

My experience:
NF NSX 3.5-15x50
closely followed by
SWFA 5-20x50
Closely followed by
Vortex 5-15x44, IIRC, they are midway exclusives and my Nikon gold models fit here as well. As well as a pre Mk4 (3.5-10x40 m3 veri-x III long range, made in the mid to late 90's)

These next ones can be moved around as glass from one to the next of the same model are not as consistent.
Leupold Mk4's, vortex 4-16 pst, Nikon 2.5-10 tactical and Burris (non tactical models) .

One thing I should add about Leupold Mk4's, I have own 8 or so now and each one is a little different than the other. Some have been great glass and others piss poor, my worst was 3 mils off the center of the reticle there were very noticeable image distortions that continued to the edges.

That's with what I have owned.

I have looked through a Preimer and a Bushnell HDMRg2 (think that's what its called) and I would rank the preimer at the same level as NF and maybe better but I don't have but a few minutes on one. The Bushnell I put at or just below the SWFA on my list, but again that's very limited time on tube with both... and I looked through a 2.5-10x32 viper pst the other day and it would be between the vortex 5-15 and the SWFA.

Mechanical Reliability
All have functioned as they should including tracking with the exception of a couple Mk4's that didn't really move the POI as much as stated on the turret (but no problem doing it consistently) as well as one with a slight cant in the reticle.

Customer service
I have had to send back a luepold, two burris and a vortex viper 4-16 pst for repair.
Viper was back in less than 5 business days
Luepold took a while longer, 2-3 weeks IIRC
Burris took 6-8 weeks
Swarovski (bino's) 3-4 weeks on a pair of used binos I got that were fogged off ebay (non disclosed)... They fixed them for free knowing that and gained a customer for life! Fabulous glass BTW.

 

[Eric B.]

Gents,

Verrrrry interesting. Seems that Schmidt & Bender gets the most votes for the top glass, and the USMC DID chose them for their sniper rifles so they gotta be tough as well.

For budget reasons I went with a Bushnell ERS 3.5 - 21 X 50 and H-59 reticle. I may regret it later but it seemed to have the bells and whistles AND glass that are at this time the best I could afford. I realize I have passed over Vortex because I wanted the Horus reticle.

So far,in terms of my laser rangefinder issues,Bushnell has been good to me. I returned the 10 X 42 ARC 1600 LRF binoculars because I couldn't see the readout in bright desert sunlight. Yesterday I recieved the new ARC Mile version as an exchange and I'm much happier with the new orange readout visibility and better color correction in the glsss.

Here's hoping they stand behind my ERS riflescope just as well.

 

[Cobracutter]

Interested to see where Khales and Steiner fit

Also. How do people feel about S&B's short warranty. Something that expensive should have a lifetime warranty. I have also read on here about some issues on the later models 3-20 and 5-25?

 

[fnfan]

My list looks like this:

US Optics 5-25
Nightforce Atacr

Leupold Mark 6
Vortex Razor
Sightron
Leupold Mark 4


Top two are very close....depends on the day

 

[Hk996]

High end I have S&B 5x25 and Premier 5x25
I also have a Leupold mark IV 4-15

I use the S&B and Premier on my precision AR in 223 and 308 all the time at 500-600yrds. Optically, I really can't tell. And I've looked through both at the same time on the bench to see. I would focus in on the steel at 500 yards with one scope and be like "wow, I can really see the bullet holes" then switch real quick with other scope and see the same thing. Color reproduction and resolution are to similar to tell between the two to me.

Only differences I can tell are the focusing ring on Schmidt is a lot easier to move compared to Premier. I've sent both scopes in for service before... Paul at Premier is great and very helpful. Both scopes are MTC and I prefer the feel of the turrets on the Premier.

Schmidt service was also great and turn around on both was maybe a couple weeks.

 

[BCP]

If I were buying a high end tactical scope right now I'd take a long hard look at Steiner and Kahles.

 

[Pleistarchus]

March has not been in the tactical game for very long and has not been exposed to the measures of S&B, USO etc. But that being said they are rapidly moving to the top. And that's only with one distributor throughout the whole US. I would say worth taking a look before dumping 3K on optics. Also remember to take everyone's opinions with a grain of salt. Just because something works well for someone does not mean it will work for you. Good luck

 

[Dogtown]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the new 2 year warranty issue from S&B was imposed by new EU regulations and not the company specifically.

 

[Eric B.]

C.C.,

I agree that Khales is a high quality scope that needs closer examination. I'd say it's above Steiner by a ways - certainly above my Bushnell ERS.

 

[jbell]

#1 - S&B PMII wins for me in all aspects only down side is the lack of mounting area for some applications
#2 - Hensoldt (very close second) only down side is the lack of reticle options
#3 - Kahles 624I also a very nice scope actually very close to #1 & #2 but the optics were not hardly as good as the 1st 2 and the illumination bled out pretty bad (one of the first models sold, so they may have improved since)
#4 - Nightforce NXS when they were new several years ago they were hands down the best bang for the buck, super tough and reliable with great optics for the price point (I cant wait to check out the ATACR and BEAST, the list may change...)
#5 - Vortex Razor very good well thought out scope with damn good quality

With all this said I would not feel crippled by using any of these scopes listed, all VERY good!

 

[TheGerman]

This thread is pure speculation because there are entirely too many variables that people see differently or rank differently. Just for me alone, US Optics would receive either a 'average to ok' overall rating with their SN 3-17 yet I am very impressed with the 1-8 for the purpose I use it for on my SPR (after getting a replacement because the first one was screwed up). So depending on which USO optic we're talking about, I'd be on almost both sides of a high or low ranking for USO.

Also, a lot of people have NO IDEA what they have or don't have in their optics. We've seen countless posts where totally clueless people have bought the latest and greatest S&B or whatever and had no idea what they had because they bought it based on brand and/or hype. The same goes for people who are on a tighter budget (nothing wrong with that) and don't spend $3k on optics; how the hell are they going to rank S&B against their Vortex/Bushnell/whatever?

 

[dondlhmn]

This thread is pure speculation because there are entirely too many variables that people see differently or rank differently. Just for me alone, US Optics would receive either a 'average to ok' overall rating with their SN 3-17 yet I am very impressed with the 1-8 for the purpose I use it for on my SPR (after getting a replacement because the first one was screwed up). So depending on which USO optic we're talking about, I'd be on almost both sides of a high or low ranking for USO.

Also, a lot of people have NO IDEA what they have or don't have in their optics. We've seen countless posts where totally clueless people have bought the latest and greatest S&B or whatever and had no idea what they had because they bought it based on brand and/or hype. The same goes for people who are on a tighter budget (nothing wrong with that) and don't spend $3k on optics; how the hell are they going to rank S&B against their Vortex/Bushnell/whatever?

This guy is ABSOLUTELY RIGHT!!

Well, we all have our likes and dislikes in scopes. The game I am currently shooting sees guys winning with a lot of different rigs and it seems to me that the REAL question is how much money does a guy have to spend to obtain an optic that he can somewhat "grow into" as his ability to shoot grows and not be limited too much by the optics. As with many sports, the equipment CAN limit the human if it does not meet a certain minimum level of capability, but mostly it is the ability (whether natural or maybe come by due to hard work and PRACTICE) of the HUMAN involved that will be the limiting factor. I see guys with $300 scopes that win matches and I see guys with $4000 scopes that are also-rans. There are guys that can take any gun/optic, as long as it meets a set of "minimum standards" and do pure magic with it.....then there are guys that approach their chosen sport as if it were nothing more than an equipment race, but never attain success, other than burning trough untold amounts of money.

So..for the average guy...it pretty much comes down to a few things: (1) How good a shooter is he (and/or how hard is he willing to work to overcome or develop whatever amount of natural ability he was blessed with); (2) What are the shooter's expectations and needs as dictated by matching the optic to the task, and; (3) How much money he has to spend.

So..going with those last three things in kind of reverse order..if money is NO object (as it would be for me if I ever win the lottery), a guy can just buy the very best scope out there, no matter if it DOES cost 5000 or 6000 bucks! The thing that seems to me to be very important is to be able to REALISTICALLY match the tool (the optics) to the mission without having to throw in the "bling" or the "Hey, look what I'VE got" factors. Then the question is how good am I/how good can I be/how much time or money can I invest in GETTING the PRACTICE to be good?

Seems to me that a person has to be able to answer all of these questions honestly before making a scope choice, but it never hurts to have the data and various opinions/experiences of others at hand when it comes time to make that choice and that data can sometimes come from a forum such as this one. A person does HAVE TO recognize that others' opinions are two things: (1) OTHERS' OPINIONS and (2) Subjective due to many, many backgrounds, experiences and who knows what---. A lot of decisions are made based upon "a guy told me" or "I read somewhere" or "the keyboard commandos on the internet say" rather than upon PERSONALLY looking through, using and experience with various scopes.

Granted, it is kind of fun having a "Picasso of rifle world" if you can afford it and I will admit to owning tools and guns that are capable of performing at a level somewhere above what I can get out of them....but, like a lot of others, I run into the "green ceiling" way before I run out of imagination.....and I DO HAVE a pretty danged good imagination !!!

Seems to me that choosing a scope is more complicated than choosing a spouse!!

My list looks like kind of like this:

Schmidt and Bender
Laura
Susie
Nightforce
Ramona
US Optics
SWFA
Leupold
Nancy
Yoshiko
The Swedish Bikini team
The Dallas Cowboy cheer leading squad

NOTICE: Positions on the above list are only current as of RIGHT NOW and could change based on luck, my date tonight and/or tomorrow playing with/shooting with the optics owned and used by my friends/competitors/neighbors. YMMV

 

[jbell]

This thread is pure speculation because there are entirely too many variables that people see differently or rank differently. Just for me alone, US Optics would receive either a 'average to ok' overall rating with their SN 3-17 yet I am very impressed with the 1-8 for the purpose I use it for on my SPR (after getting a replacement because the first one was screwed up). So depending on which USO optic we're talking about, I'd be on almost both sides of a high or low ranking for USO.

Also, a lot of people have NO IDEA what they have or don't have in their optics. We've seen countless posts where totally clueless people have bought the latest and greatest S&B or whatever and had no idea what they had because they bought it based on brand and/or hype. The same goes for people who are on a tighter budget (nothing wrong with that) and don't spend $3k on optics; how the hell are they going to rank S&B against their Vortex/Bushnell/whatever?

Well put, a lot of truth to what you said. But it is interesting to see other peoples view points on these things.

 

[EasternNChunter]

I really like my Steiner 5-25x56!

 

[Ring]

basicly, about any optic close to 2k or higher is going to be a damn good optic and hard to go wrong with any, what it comes down to is features...what are you getting for your money?...

ZS
FFP
reticul choice
travel
"extras"
warranty


some people are "guchi" shooters, and only buy things for the name, then after they get to see other "things" that have way better futures for their needs, and cost WAY less, then they feel like a ass

 

[Sako man]

This is like asking what super model is the hottest? Well, are you an ass man or do you like boobies? It's very subjective! At some point and to most people they are all a perfect 10 and your gonna kick one out of bed for having a mole on her armpit?...Probably not. I have heard arguments from people why their Sightron is as good as an SnB, though I would argue your gonna get that kinda silliness if you ask this kinda question.

So be prepared is all I'm ah saying