- Thread starter Olen_4504
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I don't think we said one time that the press would have zero friction. Nor did we ever say it would be zero tolerance. What we did say, however, and absolutely stand by, is that we are seriously pursuing those things. I guarantee you, absolutely, that the smooth feeling of running this press will blow you away.
I was not referring to the video but your website. Don't get me wrong, I love your products (funnel system and billet cup for RCBS 1500) but the engineer in me bristles at claims of zero friction in anything (see bolded portion of quote below). It may very well become the best thing since sliced bread but, claims defying physical laws turn me off. From your website on the new press: "As the quality and precision of reloading equipment has advanced in the last few years (AMP Annealers, AutoTricklers, Giraud Trimmers, IDOD Neck Turners, Primal Rights Priming Tools) we have watched companies overlook the core of the bench – the press. In late 2019 we began R&D on perfecting the precision reloading press – and we are happy to introduce the ZERO. It is the embodiment of our pursuit of ZERO tolerance reloading, with ZERO friction. The turret press also works toward ZERO variance in die setup. It will have ZERO equal on the market. "
To be fair, it does say “pursuit.”
I don’t think zero friction is meant to be taken literally. When I read the description it mean buttery smooth. Idk that’s just me.
Me, I like innovation and craftsmanship and entrepreneurship and the pursuit of a better mousetrap.
419 seems to hit all those points.
That they are here on the ‘Hide answering questions and listening to feedback (it’s not all whining) is another plus. As I mentioned.. I’d never even heard of them until yesterday. But I don’t buy much new gear and generally machine/modify/make my own. Keeps me out of trouble.
But when someone says things like repeatability and attention to tolerance... my “like meter”‘goes off in a good way. Repeatability and tenths are what I’ve chased around for years and enjoyed every second of it! And when I see objects like 419 presses where the attention to detail is so complete... well, I know they are kindred spirits.
Next time I need something... their site will be on my go-to list! Long before I buy blow-molded Chinese stuff in particular.
Sirhr
419 seems to hit all those points.
That they are here on the ‘Hide answering questions and listening to feedback (it’s not all whining) is another plus. As I mentioned.. I’d never even heard of them until yesterday. But I don’t buy much new gear and generally machine/modify/make my own. Keeps me out of trouble.
But when someone says things like repeatability and attention to tolerance... my “like meter”‘goes off in a good way. Repeatability and tenths are what I’ve chased around for years and enjoyed every second of it! And when I see objects like 419 presses where the attention to detail is so complete... well, I know they are kindred spirits.
Next time I need something... their site will be on my go-to list! Long before I buy blow-molded Chinese stuff in particular.
Sirhr
It is, but it's not quick index like a T7, sadly. I'm not really sure what the benefits are of having a turret without this. I guess it gives you a place to leave some of your dies.
The upside to the turret being locked in place is the ability to get rid of play that is required for quick-index. To index to another die this is going to require you to turn a t-handle about 1/4 turn to relieve the pressure keeping the turret perfectly seated against the center column.
I can leave 9 dies in one head that (theoretically) will index and behave the same way every time.
Even with my co-ax, anytime I change dies for sizing I need to check shoulder bump. Sometimes I need to tweak and sometimes I don’t.
This eliminates that.
Sizing dies are not repeatable with co-ax?
LOL, mine are exactly the same every time. I don't measure to the micron though.
My buddy has had that issue with his co ax.
We tried a few different lock rings and that was the issue, some lock rings don’t have flats perfectly flat or Perpendicular to the thread axis.
No. They are not perfectly repeatable every time. Co-ax has vertical play.
Quit trying to argue every point without providing anything meaningful to the conversation.
I’m using Forster rings. They are pretty close most of the time.
The design isn’t going to lend to them being perfect every time.
I use Sinclair rings and converted mine to standard shell holders. My dies are repeatable.
This is 100% the reason for us going to the trouble of an indexable head. We don't want the quick-change or play in the head that most associate with a turret, we just want people to be able to stop taking dies out and putting them back in. It's likely the most common place people encounter error, and many don't think about it.
I agree. In my co-ax for example, you have the play in the slot for the ring.
You also only have the small amount of threads in the ring.
Then you have the ring itself. On a normal press, the load is on the threads (and more thread depth). So, the top of the ring is up against the top of the slot.
Then you have play in the linkage.
So, we rely on this to all sync up the same all the time every time. And it does get close.
But, why not try to be better?
I love the people who don’t know what the word tolerance means but throw it around an
Honest.
You seem very defensive. I did not argue about a single thing here. So far the only thing that I said that 1200$ is a lot of money. I also asked what makes this press different/better to free floating model because I am curious and I dont know how this stuff works. So far replies have been pretty shitty and rude.
I am not arguing about anything I am asking about how stuff works because I am genuinely curious. Seems that me asking questions is some kind of affront.
I found some(not the majority) of lock ring must have had some stress in the material or something as at the area where the cut is made they had a slight lock washer profile.
It was only a few thou but then that’s also about what I bump shoulders.
if you had that area engaged in the press surface it would change your settings but if you indexed it out in the open area it was repeatable and GTG.
You started off with a shitty “$1200 for a single stage press” comment. Phrase your questions in a less shitty manner and you’ll get less shitty answers.
You’ve been a member far too long to play the “I’m just asking” card. Cut the shit.
So what I said was: "Single stage press for 1200 bucks? "
And I asked some questions how it work and what makes it superior to other popular presses. I got a bunch of passive aggressive bullshit.
Why are you mad about me asking what makes it worth 1200 dollars?
edit: and I did ass in my follow posts politely about how it works
“A single stage press for $1200” is much different than “What makes this different and worth $1200?”
Again, you get the response in the way you ask.
Last time I will tell you to stop your passive aggressive “questions.”
You missed that little question mark at the end of my stentence. Are you familiar with what a question mark at the end of the sentence denotes?
Fine. Have it your way.
Funny thing is the 419 guy explained this stuff to me and I was curious about the issues with the co-ax inconsistency and asked about it. I wasnt arguing I am trying to understand where the issue is so I can possibly address it on my press.
Dude I spent 2700$ on titanium chainmail so I can run around in a camp with a rubber sword yelling "lightning bolt" at LARP, trust me I am not judging the 1200 dollar price tag I am curious what makes it "tick".
Dude I spent 2700$ on titanium chainmail so I can run around in a camp with a rubber sword yelling "lightning bolt" at LARP, trust me I am not judging the 1200 dollar price tag I am curious what makes it "tick".
If I'm understanding correctly, is it because the slot on the coax is not perfectly square and then the lock ring isn't perfectly flat, so the tolerances stack up?
It lines up pretty good. But you still have a few things relying on each other to line up perfectly.
Its 1960 ish design and while it works well, the 419 guys make a good point. Presses are the only piece of equipment no one has looked into updating.
A turret style press is great. Especially if you want to check for consistency on the fly. And with different calibers all dies setup on one turret head. Once all set, no need to fuck around with them. I always check after sizing and seating every third round for consistency with a spin of the turret. Hits the mark all the time..lol. That’s why I think this 419 press with 9 stages leaves room for more work flow..
Your T7 is way too clean!
Can you provide a description (and pics!) about how your "mounting plate" (is that a cutting board?) for the press connects to your bench?
Agreed. I like this setup.
Lol.. yea one thing about Redding presses, that textured finish gets dirty quick if you touch it with dirty hands. I always use the turret handle. Oh and yea, I always use latex shop gloves from O’Reileys too when I reload.
Nice setup.
I like my turret, I just swap heads and case holders for each cartridge and nothing changes.
Unfortunately my bench is to tight for space and the handle was getting in the way of things.
I routered in some T-tracks on my bench to make room. By removing or sliding my presses. I can even locked down other tools too.. sorry here some old pictures..
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That's a great way to go.
Yea my reloading bench is small. Had to improvise.. lol.
verrrry nice!
Lol
He drives me batty but his setup of awesome!
I have a feeling you'll see a Zero on his bench for review/test before terribly long
I had a feeling it was him when you guys talked about a press reviewer in your release video. I think he does a great job with his reviews and I find them informative. There is something that kinda bugs me about him that I can’t put my finger on, but all in all he does great with good production value.
Just got an IDOD and a CPS. Might as well get a Zero. ?
hes gonna mayzure everything on that puppy
He could start by finding a decent barber. If that’s what you mean.
Otherwise, he seems like a nice guy, reasonably experienced and isn’t annoying to listen to.
OOOHHHH YEAHHHH!!
I can reconcile the cost of an Auto trickler/Fx120 or even a Prometheus against the consistency and speed they provide. However, this one escapes me. I know some masterful people who reload and compete in the long range benchrest game where consistency is everything. I know what they go through to produce consistent ammunition. It is quite the process and they use some of the latest and greatest gear. One uses a Prometheus and it is a pretty amazing piece of equipment. The accuracy, consistency and SPEED it provides is amazing. They can extol the virtues of it all but their presses are nothing special it is one of the only items that is seldom mentioned.
What tangible and measurable reloading metric will it improve?
To be Honest I’m 100% satisfied with my cheap press and see no need to upgrade it especially for $1200.
It gets me consistent seating and sizing and loads them straight for 1/10th the price.
I can 100% see me getting a V3/fx120 because of the speed bonus.
Now if I was swimming in $$$ I’d almost certainly buy the new 419 press because I’m confident it will be fantastic.
