22 BR Barrel Length and Twist Rate

[6.5x61Super]

My next build will be a 22 BR Norma/Lapua. I have read most of the 22 BR threads via the search feature!

My intended targets:

Steel out to 1,000 yards.
Coyotes at night out to 400 yards.
Groundhogs out to 600 yards.

Remington 700 S/A Clone
McGowen Precision Barrel
Diligent Defense Enticer LT-i suppressor

What barrel length and twist rate would you recommend?
I already have a 22-250AI 1:7 twist so I do have a decent supply of heavy for caliber .224 bullets.

I may want to shoot mid-weights for our Ohio groundhogs.

Thanks!

 

[TylerN]

1:7 is my preferred twist rate in my 22 BRA for shooting Berger 85.5gr LRHT.

 

[Kiba]

If you're going for max speed my preference is 28-30" for a 22BR... but since you mentioned suppressed that's going to make for a very long rifle. You can go shorter, but you'll give up speed. For long range use I really like the Berger 85.5 and it's very happy in a 7 twist, that's what I'm using in my 22GT.

Twist is very dependent on what bullet you're going to use. Fast twist is obviously for heavies and long bullets, but if you are thinking of also using lighter varmint bullets for groundhogs a 7 twist spec'd for the 85-90gr bullets can easily overspin the light jacketed bullets and they can come apart in flight.

The 22BR has enough powder capacity for 75s easy, and 80s-90s high BC bullets for 1k use are also no problem... but a 7/7.25/7.5 twist needed for the 80-90gr heavies may not play nice with the 40-60gr lightweight jacketed bullets for varmints at the velocities a 22BR can push them to. 300k rpm is sort of the beginning of the "danger zone" for thin jacketed varmint bullets, and while some brands may take up to 340-350k rpm without jacket failure, you are starting to push your luck above 300-310k rpm especially as the barrel gets some rounds down it and the throat gets rough.

I'm having this same issue with a 6 Dasher with a 7.7 twist; It runs 87s-105s great and when the barrel was new I could also use it send 55gr ballistic tips @ 3800 (355k rpm, wheeee!), but with around 2000 rounds on the barrel now and firecracking in the throat I'm now starting to lose about 10% of the 55s en route to the target from jacket failure. I've having a slower twist barrel chambered right now specifically for the light 55gr varmint bullets to avoid jacket failure and have another 7.5 twist barrel ready to go for the heavies... it's on an AI so barrel changes are quick and easy.

Sure you can use light weight monolithic bullets for groundhogs to avoid jacketed bullets coming apart at high muzzle velocities in a fast twist barrel that was spec'd for heavies, but do you really want to be sending $1/ea copper monolithics at groundhogs at high volumes? Been there, tried that, worked well but got very expensive quick, lol

If you really want to go dual purpose heavies for 1k target and also lighter varmint bullets, I've found that the 75 Amax and 75 ELDM actually blow up small varmints like ground squirrels and groundhogs quite well; they do much better in the wind than your standard lightweight low BC varmint bullets, and they'll handle a 7 or 7.5 twist barrel just fine since the velocity and RPM is lower than a 50-62gr varmint bullet. Before the lead ban for hunting went into effect here I used to use the 75 Amax at 3200fps out of my 22BR and I exploded a lot of squirrels with that combo. The explosions weren't as spectacular as a V-max, but they still got plenty of air time with the Amax.

I've had the same issue with a 7 twist in my 223 Ackley... runs amazing with 75gr bullets, but blew up about 40% of the 50 grain varmint bullets from overspinning and jacket failure.

The 62gr ELD-VT may do great for you in a 22br for your "midweight" varmint bullet, but I have not tried them. They are long for their weight and thus need a faster twist to stabilize. Looks like you might be able to push them to 3400ish in a 22BR, and that would be 350k rpm in a 7 twist barrel... that's a lot. Given Hornady has somewhat of a reputation for throwing jackets above 300K rpm with certain bullets they might not work in a 7 twist... but I would certainly try them. An 8 twist at 3400 would be a much safer 306k rpm (4dof says that's stable at sea level and 59F) and that should hold together, but an 8 twist isn't ideal for the 85-90gr .224 heavies. Found quite a few posts saying the 62 ELD-VT will hold together in a 7 twist at 22BR / 22 BRA / 22 ARC velocities of 3300-3400fps, but also found a few posts about them coming apart in fast twist 22 Creedmoors at 3850fps.

Another good mid weight bullet for .224 that will take a lot of RPM is the Lehigh 72gr Controlled Chaos. That's what I currently run in my 22BR and 22GT for squirrels and coyotes after the lead ban for hunting went into effect and I had to stop shooting the 75 Amax. They used to be pretty reasonable at $36/100, but now they're $70/100. Being lathe turned copper they will take a ton of RPM out of a fast twist barrel and not come apart though, and they blow up small critters quite well. The 62 ELD-VT beats the Lehigh easily in price though and also has a better BC, so I would try the 62 ELD-VT first.

IMO, after having issues with both my 6 Dasher and 223AI having bullets come apart trying to get them to do 2 jobs shooting both heavies for longer range steel/paper use and also send light varmint bullets out of the same fast twist barrels that I spec'd for heavy bullets, personally I'd build 2 rifles or have 2 barrels chambered-- 1 fast twist for heavies for 1K target use and the other slower twist for fast/light bullets for varmint use... but I understand that's not convenient and not an option for everyone.

 

[6.5x61Super]

If you're going for max speed my preference is 28-30" for a 22BR... but since you mentioned suppressed that's going to make for a very long rifle. You can go shorter, but you'll give up speed. For long range use I really like the Berger 85.5 and it's very happy in a 7 twist, that's what I'm using in my 22GT.

Twist is very dependent on what bullet you're going to use. Fast twist is obviously for heavies and long bullets, but if you are thinking of also using lighter varmint bullets for groundhogs a 7 twist spec'd for the 85-90gr bullets can easily overspin the light jacketed bullets and they can come apart in flight.

The 22BR has enough powder capacity for 75s easy, and 80s-90s high BC bullets for 1k use are also no problem... but a 7/7.25/7.5 twist needed for the 80-90gr heavies may not play nice with the 40-60gr lightweight jacketed bullets for varmints at the velocities a 22BR can push them to. 300k rpm is sort of the beginning of the "danger zone" for thin jacketed varmint bullets, and while some brands may take up to 340-350k rpm without jacket failure, you are starting to push your luck above 300-310k rpm especially as the barrel gets some rounds down it and the throat gets rough.

I'm having this same issue with a 6 Dasher with a 7.7 twist; It runs 87s-105s great and when the barrel was new I could also use it send 55gr ballistic tips @ 3800 (355k rpm, wheeee!), but with around 2000 rounds on the barrel now and firecracking in the throat I'm now starting to lose about 10% of the 55s en route to the target from jacket failure. I've having a slower twist barrel chambered right now specifically for the light 55gr varmint bullets to avoid jacket failure and have another 7.5 twist barrel ready to go for the heavies... it's on an AI so barrel changes are quick and easy.

Sure you can use light weight monolithic bullets for groundhogs to avoid jacketed bullets coming apart at high muzzle velocities in a fast twist barrel that was spec'd for heavies, but do you really want to be sending $1/ea copper monolithics at groundhogs at high volumes? Been there, tried that, worked well but got very expensive quick, lol

If you really want to go dual purpose heavies for 1k target and also lighter varmint bullets, I've found that the 75 Amax and 75 ELDM actually blow up small varmints like ground squirrels and groundhogs quite well; they do much better in the wind than your standard lightweight low BC varmint bullets, and they'll handle a 7 or 7.5 twist barrel just fine since the velocity and RPM is lower than a 50-62gr varmint bullet. Before the lead ban for hunting went into effect here I used to use the 75 Amax at 3200fps out of my 22BR and I exploded a lot of squirrels with that combo. The explosions weren't as spectacular as a V-max, but they still got plenty of air time with the Amax.

I've had the same issue with a 7 twist in my 223 Ackley... runs amazing with 75gr bullets, but blew up about 40% of the 50 grain varmint bullets from overspinning and jacket failure.

The 62gr ELD-VT may do great for you in a 22br for your "midweight" varmint bullet, but I have not tried them. They are long for their weight and thus need a faster twist to stabilize. Looks like you might be able to push them to 3400ish in a 22BR, and that would be 350k rpm in a 7 twist barrel... that's a lot. Given Hornady has somewhat of a reputation for throwing jackets above 300K rpm with certain bullets they might not work in a 7 twist... but I would certainly try them. An 8 twist at 3400 would be a much safer 306k rpm (4dof says that's stable at sea level and 59F) and that should hold together, but an 8 twist isn't ideal for the 85-90gr .224 heavies. Found quite a few posts saying the 62 ELD-VT will hold together in a 7 twist at 22BR / 22 BRA / 22 ARC velocities of 3300-3400fps, but also found a few posts about them coming apart in fast twist 22 Creedmoors at 3850fps.

Another good mid weight bullet for .224 that will take a lot of RPM is the Lehigh 72gr Controlled Chaos. That's what I currently run in my 22BR and 22GT for squirrels and coyotes after the lead ban for hunting went into effect and I had to stop shooting the 75 Amax. They used to be pretty reasonable at $36/100, but now they're $70/100. Being lathe turned copper they will take a ton of RPM out of a fast twist barrel and not come apart though, and they blow up small critters quite well. The 62 ELD-VT beats the Lehigh easily in price though and also has a better BC, so I would try the 62 ELD-VT first.

IMO, after having issues with both my 6 Dasher and 223AI having bullets come apart trying to get them to do 2 jobs shooting both heavies for longer range steel/paper use and also send light varmint bullets out of the same fast twist barrels that I spec'd for heavy bullets, personally I'd build 2 rifles or have 2 barrels chambered-- 1 fast twist for heavies for 1K target use and the other slower twist for fast/light bullets for varmint use... but I understand that's not convenient and not an option for everyone.

I am seriously considering 1:8 twist. I have some of the older Lehigh 62gr CC , and Hammer 68gr HHT. I have some Lehigh prototype 32gr and 38gr CC's.
Finally, I have the older Hornady 75gr AMAX.

I see that Midway has the Hornady 62gr ELD-VT on sale.

I'll save the Hammer 80gr HHT, Berger 85.5gr, and Sierra 90gr for my 22-250AI.

I wonder how light can I go with the traditional lead core/copper jacket with a 1:8 twist?

 

[Potsy]

I’m running a Bartlein 1:7 24”. All I do is shoot steel matches out to 1,000.
75 ELDM’s will get to 1,000 and my rifle loves them. Had good luck with 88’s as well. Trying to get it to love Berger 85.5’s at the moment.
As far as barrel length, my next one will likely be 26”+suppressor, but it’s pretty much a bench princess. 20” should get 75’s to 3,000fps.

 

[Kiba]

I am seriously considering 1:8 twist. I have some of the older Lehigh 62gr CC , and Hammer 68gr HHT. I have some Lehigh prototype 32gr and 38gr CC's.
Finally, I have the older Hornady 75gr AMAX.

I see that Midway has the Hornady 62gr ELD-VT on sale.

I'll save the Hammer 80gr HHT, Berger 85.5gr, and Sierra 90gr for my 22-250AI.

I wonder how light can I go with the traditional lead core/copper jacket with a 1:8 twist?

Depends on the bullet.

Even though 300k rpm is considered the start of the danger zone by many including the bullet manufacturers, I've never had a bullet fail at 300k. 340-350k and above though, absolutely, but it's very bullet and barrel dependent.

In my 223 Ackley I had the 50 nosler btlf start to experience about a 40% failure rate at 362k rpm, but if I dropped the speed down 150fps which dropped the rpm to 340k they held together.

My 6 dasher with nosler 55 btlfs ran at 3800 / 355k rpm great until around 2500 rounds on the barrel, now it's popping about 10% in flight... But that barrel is getting very rough in the throat and starting to damage the jackets. 87s-105s still shoot great out of it though and haven't lost velocity yet.

The other issue is a bullet may hold together at crazy rpm with a new, clean, smooth barrel, but they may start shedding jackets as the barrel gets dirty or as the barrel gets older and the throat gets rough.

Run the numbers for the bullet and twist you want to use and see. Personally, I don't worry too much until things start to get above 320k rpm, and at 340k rpm and above you are really starting to ask for trouble in my experience, but there's also a good chance it *might* work.

Monos seem to hold together regardless of rpm as there is no jacket to shed. I tried some really light monos in my 6 dasher, 22br, and 223 Ackley and they all worked even at 400k+ rpm, but I wasn't happy with accuracy and the cost was too high for me for high volume ground squirrel blasting.

Back to the 8 twist, you'll need to run the numbers, while it will run the mid weight bullets ok, 8 twist is somewhat borderline for the 75 eldm, and the 8 twist may not stabilize the 85s-90s especially at low altitudes in the cold.

With the 8 twist, 3800fps is 340k rpm, and that's well into the "pushing your luck" zone with a jacketed bullet but my experience is most bullets will hold together at that rpm. 3800fps is "book safe" loads for 40gr bullets in a 22br.

The safest choice is always the slowest twist that provides adequate stability for your bullet / velocity / environmental combo, but if you want to run multiple bullets in the same barrel you have to find a happy compromise, and you need to decide if that compromise is a slower twist to run the light bullets but a borderline stability with heavies, or a faster twist to stabilize the heavies and a risk of over spinning the light bullets and having them come apart.