30 Remington AR

[Metalhead0483]

Ok so I just got the April Remington flier in my email today. One of the "new" items in the flier is this ".30 remington AR" for the AR-15 (sorry, R-15

) platform. I'm looking at this thing on the remington website and I just have to laugh. The damned thing looks virtually identical to a 7.62x39 Soviet. A rose by any other name...

 

[Conqueror]

Re: 30 Remington AR

Except that it should feed fine through magazines that fit in an AR magwell. And it looks like a very competent subsonic cartridge could be made with it.

 

[fireball168]

Re: 30 Remington AR

I handled one of the cases at SHOT, here's what I wrote up about it elsewhere:

I just happened to speak to the right person at the Remington booth today.

He pulled out a 30 RAR case and let me go at it.

Case head diameter - .492

Base diameter ahead of the extractor groove - .496

I was beginning to get a scowl, so I put my calipers away before checking shoulder diameter and total case length.

I asked about the 123g factory load, he confirmed that the groove diameter is .308 for the rifle, but that was the .310 bullet used in the 7.62x39. Whether or not they are sizing to .308 prior to loading is an unknown (didn't think to ask).

Case Capacity - Its going to be greater than 30 BR, but quite aways away from the 52.5g capacity of the 300 Savage.

My guess is 44-45g.


If nothing else, the release of these uppers and related parts will allow me to build some wildcats without having to fool with Olympic Arms or their minions.

 

[Falar]

Re: 30 Remington AR

Since that was the parent case for the 6.8 SPC I guess this was a natural next step to get .30 cal bullets in an AR15 sized platform without needing the larger lower receiver/magazines of an SR25/LR308/AR10.

I'll bet the 6.8 mags will work perfectly with this round.

Edit:

Looks like I was wrong, this is an all new cartridge based off the .284 Win. I though they just took the .30 Remington and added "AR" to it so it would sound new.

.30 Remington AR

Looks like I'll stick with .308 Winchester/7.62x51mm NATO

 

[Two Shoes]

Re: 30 Remington AR

Why not just go to 6.5, and get it right.

 

[Metalhead0483]

Re: 30 Remington AR

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Two Shoes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why not just go to 6.5, and get it right. </div></div>

Big +1

 

[fireball168]

Re: 30 Remington AR

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Falar</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Looks like I was wrong, this is an all new cartridge based off the .284 Win.
</div></div>

Look at the measurements I posted again.

 

[MontanaMarine]

Re: 30 Remington AR

I'm glad to see it. It goes further to legitimize the AR platform as a hunting/sporting rifle. Supposedly will start 125s at 2800 fps. That's about 500 fps faster than 7.62x39mm.

 

[Falar]

Re: 30 Remington AR

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fireball168</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Falar</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Looks like I was wrong, this is an all new cartridge based off the .284 Win.
</div></div>

Look at the measurements I posted again.

</div></div>

According to the article I linked, it is a shortened .450 Bushmaster which is an already shortened .284 Winchester. They have the case dimensions in print and state case capacity as 44gr.

 

[ranger1183]

Re: 30 Remington AR

Jense Precision has already built and tested several 30 caliber AR-15's base on necked up 6.5 Grendel brass. It shoots extremely well and is very accurate when loaded appropriately.

My knowledge is first hand. I "spec-ed out" and tested the first two ".30 AR-15" rifles. I did all the funding, testing, trouble shooting and insured reliability on the rifles.

The first barrel is a lightweight 16" barrel used on a quick barrel change system pictured on the Jense Precision website. Reliable, light and .30 caliber deadly.

The second rifle is a Bull Barrel match version of the first with a very precise 1:10 twist. This barrel was specifically designed to shoot 220 and 240 SMK's subsonically. It's an amazing rifle that can blast out 110 grain V-Max's for varmint or deer hunting or shoot 240 SMK's subsonically whisper quiet.

The Hornady 150 grain FMJ bullets shot the best for "everyday inexpensive shooting" and overall did amazingly well. The Hornady 150 FMJ's are not only accurate but also had some of the best penetration I've seen in a .30 caliber in a long time. For every day use, the USGI type 147 grain full metal jacket bullets are also good to go.

The reamers for the ".30 AR-15" (later re-named 30BPC) are available from David Kiff at Pacific Tool and Guage. You need to specify either the bolt gun "match" reamer or the Gas Gun reamer when ordering.

Jense Precision is experienced and excellent at building and testing the .30 AR-15. For those interested, I'd start with Jense Precision first.

http://jenseprecision.com/

 

[Metalhead0483]

Re: 30 Remington AR

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Supposedly will start 125s at 2800 fps. That's about 500 fps faster than 7.62x39mm.</div></div>

Remington's listing 2,278 fps as their fastest factory load, which seems awful close to the 7.62 Soviet to me...

 

[MontanaMarine]

Re: 30 Remington AR

Here's an article with some Remington published ballistics. This data suggests 2800 fps:

http://accurateshooter.wordpress.com/2008/10/15/remington-introduces-new-30-remington-ar-cartridge/

 

[jthyttin]

Re: 30 Remington AR

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ranger1183</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The second rifle is a Bull Barrel match version of the first with a very precise 1:10 twist. This barrel was specifically designed to shoot 220 and 240 SMK's subsonically.
</div></div>

240SMK stabilizes in your 1-10" barrel?

 

[ranger1183]

Re: 30 Remington AR

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jthyttin</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ranger1183</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The second rifle is a Bull Barrel match version of the first with a very precise 1:10 twist. This barrel was specifically designed to shoot 220 and 240 SMK's subsonically.
</div></div>

240SMK stabilizes in your 1-10" barrel? </div></div>

Put it this way, I have NEVER had problems shooting 240 grain SMK's in any barrel I've used them in. Then again, those barrels are almost alway Krieger single point cut rifled barrels that come hand lapped. The only change I do is to send them to ABS to have them carbon fiber wrapped. But I have never used a Krieger 1:10 barrel that won't stabilize a 240 grain SMK.

 

[9H_Cracka]

Re: 30 Remington AR

Interesting. I have a reamer in hand I designed that uses a 6.5 Grendel case necked up to 30 cal and improved. Berger 125 bullets loaded to mag length was going to be by repeater load then 155 SMKs for single load. Never completed the project.

Let's see where this goes and what ends up being the ammo availability. I' still like to play with one in a Service Rifle (M16A2) configuration.

 

[ranger1183]

Re: 30 Remington AR

David Kiff made me both bolt action and Gas Gun reamers from a set of Grendel brass that I expanded the neck on to make it .30 caliber then seated both 150 grain Hornady FMJ and 240 grain SMK's.

I was just toying with the idea at the time and then just ran with it. Seems like several other people have done the exact same thing and just called their cartridge something else. I think something like ".30 caliber Major" was another one of these designs. Not exactly sure though.

The end result in a gas gun is an extremely fun rifle that for civilian use I wanted to take deer hunting. What a hoot!

 

[shane45]

Re: 30 Remington AR

If they get ammo into the pipeline and sustain I think it could have a chance. 458, 50 Beo, 6.5 all seem to suffer from ammo availability issues. I have waited years for this to change but.... it never does.