30 sherman

[jcwarrior87]

So I am looking for some real world info on the 30 sherman. I am looking to build a 30 cal elr rig for 1 to 2k to just primarily smash rocks and steel. I know there are bigger 30 cal cases. What I am wanting to know is does it really give you an advantage over the prc when using matching brass. I am looking for real world data. I am also looking for how the case handles under max pressure.

Side note. I think this is the right forum but if not mods pleasr move it to the right one

 

[gnochi]

Rich Sherman started a thread for that on LongRsngeHunting, and it seems to be the repository of choice:

30 sherman magnum

This was formally the 300 PRC S.I. for those who missed it. I got out a couple days ago to do some more testing and the mirage shooting over the bright snow was terrible so I couldn't really accomplish as much as I wanted to. I did get some velocities and enough data to make another run on a...

www.longrangehunting.com

 

[Dschapp44]

Awesome case. It’s the largest non lapua bolt face 30 cal you can build. I’ve got a 26 inch carbon gun and it’s fast. 215 hybrids at 3100 and 230s at 3k. Brass is the current problem. Hornady has weak primer pockets and adg is better but still has a softer case head. Lapua coming out with it is awesome. Should be shipping Q1-Q2 of 2021 and you can back order at grafs

 

[Marcthebean]

I have been shooting a 30sm for a while now. I run a 30” kreiger barrel and use the Berger 230’s. I have pushed the 230’s to 3100fps but Hornady brass life was short. I slowed it down to 2975fps and it’s a laser beam and the brass is holding up now.
I have no issues so far out to 2100 yards with it.

 

[locotrician]

Awesome case. It’s the largest non lapua bolt face 30 cal you can build. I’ve got a 26 inch carbon gun and it’s fast. 215 hybrids at 3100 and 230s at 3k. Brass is the current problem. Hornady has weak primer pockets and adg is better but still has a softer case head. Lapua coming out with it is awesome. Should be shipping Q1-Q2 of 2021 and you can back order at grafs

Definitly not the largest 30 cal non lapua bolt face , not sure where you got that info .

 

[Steel head]

Definitly not the largest 30 cal non lapua bolt face , not sure where you got that info .

It’s not even close.

 

[kupper]

i've had 3 30 sherman barrels spun up. in my opinion its worth doing over the standard PRC. I dont typically start load development until i have 100 rounds down the tube anyhow due to barrels speeding up so its not the end of the world to fireform just loading standard 300prc loads. you can also shoot factory 225gr eld match 300 PRC ammo in a pinch, others have had really good results with that but i havent personally shot a factory round out of any of my barrels. as far as speeds go on my last 215 berger target hybrid velocity test i hit 3247 before i had any indication of pressure (primer started to flatten, no sticky bolt or extractor marks) with N570 in a 28" barrel with adg brass. with the 230gr a tip match i took it to around 3120fps before primers started to flatten. Im running an accuracy node at 3100fps with the 215's and 3027fps with the 230's and while you may be able to achieve this with a 300PRC you will do so with more pressure.

 

[Sandow the Heretic]

I must be missing something. Why the religion around sticking to 30 cal?

-Alex

 

[gnochi]

I must be missing something. Why the religion around sticking to 30 cal?

-Alex

Off the top of my head:

• Range caliber restrictions
• Lower cost than stepping up a notch
• Friendlier to the shoulder
• There might be some meat left if you hunt with it

 

[JB.IC]

I must be missing something. Why the religion around sticking to 30 cal?

-Alex

Doesn’t take a dump truck load of powder. They’re like 30-50% less powder than say a 33XC or 375Cheytac. Everything in between is cheaper.

Using them as trainers to bigger cartridges is economical. You need less distance to have similar training effect. Think a 30SM at 1800yds verses say a 33XC at 2100yds.

it’s easier for me to find a 1.25” 30cal barrel than it is a 1.35-1.60” Lapua or cheytac barrel. They’re also more likely to have the 30cal barrel in a twist I want. At least my LGS anyways.

it’s sometimes just quicker, mostly cheaper, supply seem easier to get, and they preform decently at distances easier to come by.

 

[Sandow the Heretic]

Doesn’t take a dump truck load of powder. They’re like 30-50% less powder than say a 33XC or 375Cheytac. Everything in between is cheaper.

Using them as trainers to bigger cartridges is economical. You need less distance to have similar training effect. Think a 30SM at 1800yds verses say a 33XC at 2100yds.

it’s easier for me to find a 1.25” 30cal barrel than it is a 1.35-1.60” Lapua or cheytac barrel. They’re also more likely to have the 30cal barrel in a twist I want. At least my LGS anyways.

it’s sometimes just quicker, mostly cheaper, supply seem easier to get, and they preform decently at distances easier to come by.

I think the second you are in wildcat territory, the ship has sailed on any economic arguments.

If you are building a gun for the purpose of long range shooting, building a less capable gun for economic training use makes no sense if you then need to build another gun for actual ELR. How many thousands of rounds do you need to fire to make that break even? If you are burning through barrels to fire all that will it ever break even?

Don't know about you guys but the most expensive part of reloading is my time. Even at the currently insane powder prices, the difference of 50 grains doesn't make that much difference.

To address Gnochi's points. Put a break on it, use a bullet that has limited expansion and a 338 RUM is pretty cheap to get started with. As a 50 shooter I've seen plenty of ranges that restrict me but I've never seen one that cared about 30 vs 338 or 375.

-Alex

 

[JB.IC]

I think the second you are in wildcat territory, the ship has sailed on any economic arguments.

If you are building a gun for the purpose of long range shooting, building a less capable gun for economic training use makes no sense if you then need to build another gun for actual ELR. How many thousands of rounds do you need to fire to make that break even? If you are burning through barrels to fire all that will it ever break even?

Don't know about you guys but the most expensive part of reloading is my time. Even at the currently insane powder prices, the difference of 50 grains doesn't make that much difference.

To address Gnochi's points. Put a break on it, use a bullet that has limited expansion and a 338 RUM is pretty cheap to get started with. As a 50 shooter I've seen plenty of ranges that restrict me but I've never seen one that cared about 30 vs 338 or 375.

-Alex

You’re thinking way too far into it. I own a bunch of guns I don’t need for any other reason besides it’s my money and I’ll buy what I want. I shoot a 30cal for those reasons mentioned. I also have a 338 & 375cal. They’re on standby until parts or upgrades come in.

I shoot different things because I like shooting. I shoot certain things based off component availability that are dependent on the season or economics constraints. If I can find dual purposes for whatever I spend my money on I will do it.

Most people in the LR/ELR don’t compete. They don’t do it for business. It’s just a hobby for most. There is not ROI.

More importantly it’s a waste of time trying to battle of the wits with others opinions that just don’t matter

30SM is hardly a wildcat. They have their own brass, reamers, and dies. Added benefit is you can shoot factory 300PRC ammo. The cost of chambering a 30SM is no different than the cost of chambering a 300PRC.

 

[jcwarrior87]

I have had that 30 vs bigger battle in my head more than once. For me it was ultimately the fact I have a tb 9 ultra i wanted to use.

But I relate shooting farther like drag racing. How far you want to shoot is the same as how fast you want go go? Why doesnt everyone drag nitro cars?


It is all driven buy money. My 300 prc(thay is what I ended up building) should be right around 1.7$ a round when you factor barrel life smith work brass all the costs in to price. Figure that over 1500 for the life of the barrel equals about 2550 for that barrel. Go up to a 338 and that final price goes up about 500$. Now I know that doesnt seem like much but there is a breaking spot for every one. I would love to shoot 375 or 416 I just cant afford it at the end of the day. For me a 30 cal will get me in to the game, at the lowest level. Just how it played out in my head.

 

[Sandow the Heretic]

You’re thinking way too far into it. I own a bunch of guns I don’t need for any other reason besides it’s my money and I’ll buy what I want. I shoot a 30cal for those reasons mentioned. I also have a 338 & 375cal. They’re on standby until parts or upgrades come in.

I shoot different things because I like shooting. I shoot certain things based off component availability that are dependent on the season or economics constraints. If I can find dual purposes for whatever I spend my money on I will do it.

Most people in the LR/ELR don’t compete. They don’t do it for business. It’s just a hobby for most. There is not ROI.

More importantly it’s a waste of time trying to battle of the wits with others opinions that just don’t matter

From the perspective of, its just another gun in my already big pile of guns, you are absolutely correct. I'm tossing a 338 together just to have a gun isn't fie feet long and doesn't weight 35 pounds so I can fly with it without getting murdered on fees. I just hate to see people that have limited resources put them towards something that isn't going to get them where they want to be. I've had the unfortunate experience of having to tell dozens of shooters that I can't let them into Ko2M because their 28 or 30 Whatever Magnum simply can't achieve the distances we are shooting. More than once I've gotten pleading letters in reply saying they put everything they could budget into their gun already. My point is simply, for the price of an exotic 30, you can move up in caliber without really spending more and If you move up in caliber after squaring away an exotic 30, you are definitely going to spend more.

-Alex

 

[Steel head]

I have had that 30 vs bigger battle in my head more than once. For me it was ultimately the fact I have a tb 9 ultra i wanted to use.

But I relate shooting farther like drag racing. How far you want to shoot is the same as how fast you want go go? Why doesnt everyone drag nitro cars?


It is all driven buy money. My 300 prc(thay is what I ended up building) should be right around 1.7$ a round when you factor barrel life smith work brass all the costs in to price. Figure that over 1500 for the life of the barrel equals about 2550 for that barrel. Go up to a 338 and that final price goes up about 500$. Now I know that doesnt seem like much but there is a breaking spot for every one. I would love to shoot 375 or 416 I just cant afford it at the end of the day. For me a 30 cal will get me in to the game, at the lowest level. Just how it played out in my head.

I went the 7mm route instead of 30 cal and was really impressed at the performance for the $$$

Checked off a lot of personal distance goals with it.
Now I’m building a 338 to go a bit further.
I’m more of hanging with friends or shooting solo out in the wilderness shooting across valleys enjoying a cigar and coffee
The competition thing isn’t really appealing to me.
I just need enough horse power to have fun.

 

[kupper]

I went .30 because mine is mainly hunting oriented that I sometimes shoot to extended long range (2200 and under). For a dedicated elr rig I would for sure go .375 or bigger. I understand that a 30 Sherman is a wildcat but in the grand scheme of wildcatting it’s extremely easy. If you desired you could run it as a standard 300PRC for the entire life of the barrel. It didn’t cost me a bent nickel more to chamber it in 30 Sherman than it would have 300PRC.

 

[JB.IC]

I went .30 because mine is mainly hunting oriented that I sometimes shoot to extended long range (2200 and under). For a dedicated elr rig I would for sure go .375 or bigger. I understand that a 30 Sherman is a wildcat but in the grand scheme of wildcatting it’s extremely easy. If you desired you could run it as a standard 300PRC for the entire life of the barrel. It didn’t cost me a bent nickel more to chamber it in 30 Sherman than it would have 300PRC.

I agree. It’s basically a sudo factory supported cartridge. You can get the head stamped brass from Rich or you can fire factory 300PRC or reloaded ammo. Seems to be pretty versatile in that regard.

 

[Steel head]

I went .30 because mine is mainly hunting oriented that I sometimes shoot to extended long range (2200 and under). For a dedicated elr rig I would for sure go .375 or bigger. I understand that a 30 Sherman is a wildcat but in the grand scheme of wildcatting it’s extremely easy. If you desired you could run it as a standard 300PRC for the entire life of the barrel. It didn’t cost me a bent nickel more to chamber it in 30 Sherman than it would have 300PRC.

I wouldn’t even classify it as a wildcat.
More like an ackley improved.

 

[BCX]

Anyone have the Amp manual code for ADG brass?

 

[Dschapp44]

Anyone have the Amp manual code for ADG brass?

im almost done with a batch of dasher and then I’ll test one of mine and let you know

 

[Texasflyer]

I quit counting what i have into my 338 lm.... its way less than most people have into their optics on here but its expensive for me. But its magic when we shoot.

 

[b6graham]

i expect to push 215s at 3300 or 230s around 3200 from mine at max load

really wanna throw some 212 Seneca's down range though and see what they can do

 

[Evlshnngns]

i expect to push 215s at 3300 or 230s around 3200 from mine at max load

really wanna throw some 212 Seneca's down range though and see what they can do

Are you expecting that out of an improved 300prc? Sounds more like what I would expect from an improved 300 Norma.

 

[b6graham]

Are you expecting that out of an improved 300prc? Sounds more like what I would expect from an improved 300 Norma.

33" tube with N570

 

[BCX]

Fire forming load, N570 and Berger 220 averaged 3099 for 40 rounds 28 inch Bartlein. 100 rounds down the tube.

 

[BCX]

AMP Aztec generated codes

Hornady fire formed brass code 0144
ADG 30 SM head stamped fire formed brass code 0142