338 Caliber Solids - Badlands or Cutting Edge

[harry_x1]

Hi all,

I have been shooting 338 300 Gr Berger OTMs for a while but now plan to shift to solids. One reason is better ballistics (Velocity and BCs) and I am told that solids perform better pass trans sonic speeds.

I am contemplating between 285 gr Badlands ICBMs and corresponding bullets from Cutting Edge. Anyone has any experience with both of these brands/bullets in 338? If yes, request share your experience. Seems majority is using cutting edge, but on paper the BC of Badlands looks significantly better.

thanks for sharing your knowledge.


Harjeet (Harry)

 

[Geno C.]

In the wind, the badlands blows the CE out of the water. I’ve had good results from the 285 and 265 badlands

 

[DIBBS]

@Geno C.

Will a 9.3 twist stabilize the badlands in a 338 AI, or do they require something faster? Website suggests 1 in 8 and 1 in 9

 

[Dogtown]

Yeah, be sure to check the twist rate requirements. Comparable mass solids will generably be longer and require faster twist rate than jacketed bullets in the same mass range. Also, I’ve found solids can be a bit finicky to use, which is annoying because it tends to result in a lot more trial and error with expensive bullets. Some I’ve found require a pretty narrow seating range while others just prefer to be seated in tight necks - it’s weird. They’re the smoking hot but super crazy woman at the party.

 

[Geno C.]

For a 285, 8 is what you want.

 

[harry_x1]

For a 285, 8 is what you want.

@Geno C. I have a 7 twist barrell, will it be too fast or will make the cut in your view.

 

[Centurion123]

The vast majority of Ko2m shooters are using CE Lazers, albeit in 375/416 caliber. As mentioned the Badlands have the best BC, so I figure there must be a reason why the Lazers are most used despite this?

 

[cameljockey230]

The vast majority of Ko2m shooters are using CE Lazers, albeit in 375/416 caliber. As mentioned the Badlands have the best BC, so I figure there must be a reason why the Lazers are most used despite this?

BC and velocity mean absolutely nothing when it comes to winning matches.
You want a bullet that shoots very small groups and the 375 with a 400 grain Cutting Edge does exactly that.
O.P.
Don't forget that Warner Tool also makes a 256 and 285 Flatline that both work in 9 twist barrels.
Buy a box of every bullet and pick the one your gun shoots into the smallest groups.
If BC won matches we would all be shooting GS Custom bullets.

 

[Geno C.]

@Geno C. I have a 7 twist barrell, will it be too fast or will make the cut in your view.

7 will be fine. Solids don’t mind being over spun like lead core.

 

[Geno C.]

The vast majority of Ko2m shooters are using CE Lazers, albeit in 375/416 caliber. As mentioned the Badlands have the best BC, so I figure there must be a reason why the Lazers are most used despite this?

From what I’ve seen, it’s because they’re easier to make shoot small. Like a Sierra match king vs a Berger vld.

 

[Taylorbok]

BC and velocity mean absolutely nothing when it comes to winning matches.
You want a bullet that shoots very small groups and the 375 with a 400 grain Cutting Edge does exactly that.
O.P.
Don't forget that Warner Tool also makes a 256 and 285 Flatline that both work in 9 twist barrels.
Buy a box of every bullet and pick the one your gun shoots into the smallest groups.
If BC won matches we would all be shooting GS Custom bullets.

I mean velocity and BC definitely play a factor in reducing group size at distance due to wind changes but you need both to also be extremely consistent at the same time.

 

[cameljockey230]

I mean velocity and BC definitely play a factor in reducing group size at distance due to wind changes but you need both to also be extremely consistent at the same time.

Low velocity variation or extreme spread and low BC variation bullet to bullet equals smaller groups.
An inaccurate load that gets to the target sooner is still an inaccurate load when it gets there.

I would rather shoot a 3000 fps load with a 0.950 bc bullet at 3000 yards that shoot a quarter inch than a half inch load at 3200 fps with 0.980 BC.

OP
I have been holding 2 matches a month for over 10 years now yes that is longer than KO2M has been in existence and we start at over 2000 yards and accuracy trumps velocity and BC 99 and 44/100% of the time.
The problem with the bullets your currently using is they need to be sorted before you load them. Finding 0.020 variation in the bearing surface alone is very common. Get yourself 2 338 comparators that fit on a dial caliper and I can explain how to shrink your groups with your current bullets.
If your already sorting your bullets for bearing surface,diameter and ogive length and seating them to 0.001 variation ignore my post.
I have not shot any Badlands bullets but I have shot most 338 bullets including warner cutting edge gs customs berger sierra hornady peregrine and the ones that group the best always seem to win more matches
Also if a bullet doesn't like your barrel you can't force it to work just use whatever works and try the super bullets again in your next barrel.

 

[Taylorbok]

Low velocity variation or extreme spread and low BC variation bullet to bullet equals smaller groups.

You telling me you've never had a load that meets bc and es requirements that doesn't shoot dots?

I would rather shoot a 3000 fps load with a 0.950 bc bullet at 3000 yards that shoot a quarter inch than a half inch load at 3200 fps with 0.980 BC

that's starting to split hairs. How about the 3200 fps with .980 bc at half inch vs a 2800 fps with a .820 that shoots 1/4"?

 

[cameljockey230]

You telling me you've never had a load that meets bc and es requirements that doesn't shoot dots?

that's starting to split hairs. How about the 3200 fps with .980 bc at half inch vs a 2800 fps with a .820 that shoots 1/4"?

What I'm telling everyone watching is after holding more ELR matches than anyone else in the United states the guns that win generally shoot the best regardless of BC and velocity.

A great shooting 338 Lapua Ackley Improved will beat a poorly shooting 375 Cheytac even though the cheytac is ballistically superior.

 

[badassgunworks]

@Geno C. I have a 7 twist barrell, will it be too fast or will make the cut in your view.

No it wont be to fast. on the badlands they need a little more then what they recommend on there web sight. I alway go 1" fastser

 

[badassgunworks]

Let's look at facts not hype and propaganda. Bcsd has very very little to do with bullet manufacturer it has more to do with Barrel condition and muzzle devices all manufacturers have seen horrible and phenomenal bcsd results if anyone tells you it has to do with the bullet there full of shit. Especially when considering the consistency of Lathe turned monolithics. Accuracy is accuracy precision is precision if you have phenomenal results with low standard deviations producing super accurate groups requardless of bullet manufactor then somthing is going right for you. Accuracy and low sd's are the easy part with any make of bullet. Now consider you have all the above... Conditions and your ability to read those conditions . Thats what separates each competitor
Now having a high bc high velocity stable accurate well transitioning bullet Is a advantage.. and any one that states otherwise. Just does not see the big picture. . Yes cutting edge is the most winning bullet. But it only due to the fact that the market if flooded with there bullets and that they have some of the best shooters Using them. Now guys claim. Consistancy is the reason. will ill tell you this much . Out of cutting edge, warner and badlands. Cutting edge has the most run out, weight variations and o.d. variations and have the roughest mechined surface of the three.

 

[cameljockey230]

I agree 100% let's stick with the facts and drop all the hype and BS.
The 400 cutting edge is the premier ELR bullet as of today.
Easy to load easy to tune shoots small groups and wins matches.

 

[harry_x1]

In the wind, the badlands blows the CE out of the water. I’ve had good results from the 285 and 265 badlands

what seating die do you use for 285 badlands? I have have the Tubb dies, but the bullet kid of sticks out on top of the die.

 

[Geno C.]

A honed Redding

 

[BCX]

what seating die do you use for 285 badlands? I have have the Tubb dies, but the bullet kid of sticks out on top of the die.

I load BL 285 in my Tubb die w no issues.

 

[Sandow the Heretic]

There are very few shooters using solids in light gun now. In Conquer the Castle, I'd say less than 20% were using solids based upon the impact marks I was seeing.

Bigger than 338 and it is the other way around. The long engraving band of a lead core bullet ends up gimping velocities. Look at a 750 .510 amax and they have a full inch of full bore diameter vs .150" on a brass solid and they end up about 400 fps slower as a result.

375 might be on the edge of where lead core bullets still make sense. One thing is fairly certain though, jacketed bullets do tend to splash more on a miss.

-Alex

 

[harry_x1]

I load BL 285 in my Tubb die w no issues.

I see the bullet ever so slightly sticking out of the top of the stem… does it not do so for you?

 

[BCX]

Idk my seating it spot on, round to round is on the money when I measure CBTO. I’m currently out of of BL 285 to ck. My BL 285 load is 4.675 OAL.