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Suppressors 3gun and IPSC pistol????

G

Glen Seekins

Gunny Sergeant
Commercial Supporter
Full Member
Minuteman
Jan 28, 2004
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lewiston, ID
www.seekinsprecision.com
i know nothing about pistols other than i need lots of practice So, knowing that school me on what i want so i can start shooting these comps. For now i want to run iron sights and want to be in a class where there are the most competitors.

I already have a nice 1911 single stack and i am looking for a higher capacity pistol. Glocks dont fit me and i would like to stay with the 1911 feel. I was thinking about building my own off of a STI frame kit.
What caliber is most common? What length barrel do i want? Anything else i need to know?
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

You really should shoot more matches before you even consider spending several thousand dollars on a pistol.

What you really meant is USPSA. IPSC is not common in the USA and USPSA has different rules.

It sounds like what you want is a Limited gun. Limited is a <span style="font-style: italic">division</span>, not a <span style="font-style: italic">class</span>. Your shooting skill determines your class, while equipment determines your division.




Here is my limited gun. It would cost you about $2600 to duplicate my setup, including belt, holster, gun, sights, four mags, pouches, etc.

In other words, shoot more and then decide. I shot single stack for several years. I'm just getting started in limited and it is a whole different ball game.

My opinion is that you'll learn to break down stages into arrays of 8s and shooting the skinny gun will teach you how to reload properly. After that, the limited gun changes the game just a little bit, allowing you to speed up a little bit and take advantage of certain things that go along with having more than 8 rounds in the magazine.

USPSA is all 8 shot neutral. Learning to shoot with a low cap gun has given me a jump start in limited. YMMV.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: heatseekins</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i know nothing about pistols other than i need lots of practice So, knowing that school me on what i want so i can start shooting these comps. For now i want to run iron sights and want to be in a class where there are the most competitors.

I already have a nice 1911 single stack and i am looking for a higher capacity pistol. Glocks dont fit me and i would like to stay with the 1911 feel. I was thinking about building my own off of a STI frame kit.
What caliber is most common? What length barrel do i want? Anything else i need to know?
</div></div>
There are a lot of options and you probably should give some a try. But I can give you a bit of info, at least some things to think about.
I would stick with a 5" gun, the sixes are popular in USPSA but you will want to run a holster like the blade tech for 3-gun and the shorter barrel and holster combo works well and is secure enough, also if you want to shoot an IPSC match, the 6" guns are not allowed. From there your choices are huge, slab slide and full length dust cover, tactical length, or regular. Bushing barrel, bull barrel or Schuemann ribbed barrel with the front sight mounted on it?
You'll want to run .40 S&W, since it is the smallest caliber to make major and give you max rounds in the mag.
A Bo-Mar type sight is standard and steel or fiber front.
An STI frame is a really good way to go or a Hi-Cap Caspian is a good alternative. I've shot both as well as Para and Tangfoglios in Open class and I would prefer The STI. If you like to have a metal frame, well STI makes an Aluminum grip and SVI makes steel and Aluminum grips for the modular frames...or just go Caspian.
You'll want 140mm mags for USPSA and 126mm Mags if you plan to shoot IPSC (IPSC Standard class guns must fit in a box, which pretty much means a 5" gun with 126mm mags)
Blade tech holsters work pretty good across the board for any type of IPSC or USPSA match. A Velcro over and under belt and some mag pouches and you are good to go. Consider one or two magnetic pouches for stages where you start with ammo off your body, it's a nice thing to have but not mandatory. I bought one because I hit a bunch of stages that I could have used it, but haven't shot a stage where it was an advantage since I got it...lol
Feel free to PM me if you have any specific questions
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

Hi Glen,

The Eagle 5.0 in 40 S&W pictured above was the one that I chose (w/bushing barrel). In USPSA Limited and Limited-10 divisions, 40 cal is minimum for "Major" power factor; this pistol is also legal for IDPA Enhanced Service Pistol (ESP) division, provided it has a <span style="font-style: italic">bushing barrel</span> and your magwell fits the IDPA box. If USPSA only, bull barrel and large magwell....

Your other option would be a "service" type pistol (take your pick). You would be in "Production" division in USPSA, and Stock Service Pistol (SSP) in IDPA. This division is scored as "minor" in USPSA, regardless of caliber or power factor, so almost every body shoots 9mm. I used an M&P9 before I got the Eagle.

(Edited to add) USPSA's "Open" division is a whole 'nother animal....

Hope it helps,

Bill
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WRM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">


(Edited to add) USPSA's "Open" division is a whole 'nother animal....

</div></div>
laugh.gif
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

Open is a lot of fun, it isn't as easy as it looks. For starting off I would recommend going into production, there is quite a bit of competition there and you can get a production rig for pretty cheap.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

Looks like i just need to get a few
smile.gif


Here locally they shoot IPSC, but im sure i will want to shoot uspsa as well when they are held. The Springfield 1911 i have now will get me shooting. Right now its killing me in the tactical matches where hi capacity mags are needed. Also being 45 it recoils a bit so i am slow.

All of the above also standard for 3 gun? Who's rules do they follow?

.40 is good. TONS of ammo at my friendly CCI/Speer just down the road
smile.gif
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

Build up that STI in 40, get a fistfull of STI or SV mags and get out there. I like fixed sights instead of adjustables. One less thing to break.

For 3-gun your new STI will be fine.

For rifle, a low powered scope on a 18-20 inch gun should work good as well.

For a shotgun a Benelli or a FN SLP is very common.

I like kydex holsters for 3-gun. There can be a lot more running around with a hot pistol than there normally is in IPSC/USPSA.

For IPSC/USPSA matches I use a CR Speed holster.

My 3-gun rifle is a 18 inch with a S&B Short Dot and my shotgun is a Bennie Hill 21 inch Benelli. My pistol is a STI fat gun in 9x19.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: heatseekins</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

All of the above also standard for 3 gun? Who's rules do they follow?
</div></div>

A pretty big majority of 3-gun matches are run under IMGA/Outlaw rules.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Hoser</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: heatseekins</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

All of the above also standard for 3 gun? Who's rules do they follow?
</div></div>

A pretty big majority of 3-gun matches are run under IMGA/Outlaw rules. </div></div>

USPSA eliminated its 3 gun rules so check out its rules for "multi gun."
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

'You'll want to run .40 S&W, since it is the smallest caliber to make major and give you max rounds in the mag.'

Not true, you can run a .38 super, it'll hold more rounds in a mag and still make "major". It's all about power factor.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Saito</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
'You'll want to run .40 S&W, since it is the smallest caliber to make major and give you max rounds in the mag.'

Not true, you can run a .38 super in major, it'll hold more rounds in a mag and still make "major". It's all about power factor.
</div></div>
I Open division, yes, but not in Limited or Standard division. I understand that .357sig might be allowed now in Limited, but same capacity and more violent to fire.
BTW I run a .38 SuperComp gun
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Saito</div><div class="ubbcode-body">'You'll want to run .40 S&W, since it is the smallest caliber to make major and give you max rounds in the mag.'

Not true, you can run a .38 super, it'll hold more rounds in a mag and still make "major". It's all about power factor.
</div></div>

.38 super is not legal in limited.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

You could run a 9mm, 9mm Major, or 38 Super in Lim/Lim 10 (not "illegal"), but even if the PF was 165,000+, it would still be scored "Minor". And you want to shoot Major = 40 S&W = more rounds than 45 ACP.

9mm Major, and 38 Super can be scored "major" in Open, but not Limited/Limited 10.

(Edited to add) See Appendix D2 item 5. USPSA Rulebook.

Bill
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downzero</div><div class="ubbcode-body">.38 super is not legal in limited. </div></div>

It *is* legal in Limited, but it can not be scored major in any division other than Open or Revo.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

You guys have my head spinning. Here is what im going to get.

XDM - 9mm (for when i CAN shoot a 9 and the tactical comps around here)

STI - 40

I already have a kick butt 1911 in .45

The three pistols should get me where i need to be. After i start playing a bit i will adjust from there.

Anyone have a XDM they want to trade
smile.gif

Thanks
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

Your good to go.

It will all make more sense after a while.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

Not a Glock guy Glen?

A G35 is pretty versatile for pistol games....

I'm a CZ guy myself, but often wish I liked Glocks better. The logistics are impossible to beat.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

Glen, If you are going to go with a wide body 1911, you should take a look at SV Infinity. Very nice weapons. They make the finest side arm I have ever shot. A little more price but worth every penny.

http://www.sviguns.com/
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

i got an xdm and love it for three gun. 19 plus one is very nice. very accurate, decent trigger for a producion/duty style gun. would highly recommend a trigger job from springer precision. i stippled mine and had a trigger job done, the plain fixed white dot sights are ok but i want to get the truglo ones. but i paid 600 even for mine, got a decent paddle holster, 2 mags and a kydex mag holder good deal. ready to go from the store

good luck
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Hoser</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downzero</div><div class="ubbcode-body">.38 super is not legal in limited. </div></div>

It *is* legal in Limited, but it can not be scored major in any division other than Open or Revo.

</div></div>

Sorry, I meant for major. Minor is not competitive in limited, but is certainly legal.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

In most multi-gun (outlaw) matches the minor/major doesn't come into play like in USPSA/IPSC. I used a Glock for a few years (17,24, & 21 for heavy metal). Now I use a STI. I don't have a drop/offset kydex rig yet but the CR Speed World Shoot locks the pistol tight enough I trust it for 3-Gun. While it holds great, it does stick out too far so I'm still going to pick up a kydex.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

If minor/major doesn't matter, a .40 caliber limited gun can still do the job and be loaded down to minor.

Do they make 170 mm mags for a limited gun? They're not legal in USPSA limited but they might be useful in some kind of "outlaw" match. They'd hold 24-25 rounds at least!
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

Agree with Adam. My recommendation where major/minor is no concern is a Glock 34. If you dislike Glocks you could go with a polymer alternative like the XD in 9mm or a 9mm in a 1911 framed handgun (STI is a big player in the gaming world of 1911's).

Edit to add: Glenn with your specs, go with the STI in 9mm for ammo savings or high cap frame for .45 if you have plenty of components already.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

I am not a fan of SV, not that there is anything wrong with them I just don't think a factory gun is worth that kind of money. They do have a real winner with their interchangeable breech face slide. You could buy one of their slides with a 40, 9mm and 45 barrel/breechface and all you need to do is swap out the breechface and barrel and recoil spring and you are off and running with a new caliber on the same frame and slide.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mavrick10_2000</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Edit to add: Glenn with your specs, go with the STI in 9mm for ammo savings or high cap frame for .45 if you have plenty of components already. </div></div>

Which class is this 9mm 2011 supposed to be competitive in?...

If you're worried about pinching pennies, maybe this game is not for you.

Cheers,

Bill
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WRM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Which class is this 9mm 2011 supposed to be competitive in?...

If you're worried about pinching pennies, maybe this game is not for you.</div></div>

I am shooting a STI in 9x19, Limited minor, and hold my own. Even win a USPSA match now and again against other solid master class shooters. I also use this gun in IDPA matches and 3-gun.

I dont mind shooting minor. My mags hold 22-23 rounds and the recoil is minimal. And with most 3-gun matches there is no power factor so 9x19 is no handicap at all.

But for a pure USPSA/IPSC limited or single stack gun, minor is not a good way to go.

For 3-gun, IDPA and Steel Challenge, you cant beat a STI 2011 in 9x19.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

That breechface is only cool until it come loose and punches you in the ass with a locked up gun. The solution to this is loctiting the shit out of it effectively making it a noninterchangeable breechface.

YMMV
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WRM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Which class is this 9mm 2011 supposed to be competitive in?...
</div></div>

Equipment puts you in a <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">division</span></span>. Your shooting skill, not equipment, puts you in a <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-style: italic">class</span></span>.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Adam B</div><div class="ubbcode-body">40 minor get pretty expensive, you compare it to 9mm </div></div>

2.5-3 cents a shot difference on my end. Not much if you ask me.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Adam B</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am not a fan of SV, not that there is anything wrong with them I just don't think a factory gun is worth that kind of money. They do have a real winner with their interchangeable breech face slide. </div></div>

SV doesn't make factory guns. Each and every one is custom built for every customer.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

Thanks Hoser. I thought I deleted that post right after giving it a little thought, but guess it didn't "take". If you hit all A's and it puts steel steel down, doesn't matter which you use.

And I appreciate the correction on Division/Class, I do know the difference, but just use the wrong term sometimes.

Cheers,

Bill
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Adam B</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am not a fan of SV, not that there is anything wrong with them I just don't think a factory gun is worth that kind of money. They do have a real winner with their interchangeable breech face slide. </div></div>

SV doesn't make factory guns. Each and every one is custom built for every customer. [/quote]


Yea didnt get that about "factory" gun. They are all made to order. not out of a slide or frame that they purchased but from the bar stock sitting on the shelf when you place the order. As custom as it gets...as far as I know.
 
Re: 3gun and IPSC pistol????

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Hoser</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WRM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Which class is this 9mm 2011 supposed to be competitive in?...

If you're worried about pinching pennies, maybe this game is not for you.</div></div>

I am shooting a STI in 9x19, Limited minor, and hold my own. Even win a USPSA match now and again against other solid master class shooters. I also use this gun in IDPA matches and 3-gun.

I dont mind shooting minor. My mags hold 22-23 rounds and the recoil is minimal. And with most 3-gun matches there is no power factor so 9x19 is no handicap at all.

But for a pure USPSA/IPSC limited or single stack gun, minor is not a good way to go.

For 3-gun, IDPA and Steel Challenge, you cant beat a STI 2011 in 9x19. </div></div>

There's a guy that knows what he's talking about!
 
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