Am looking to purchase a third scope in the 5-25 variety, I currently have two S&Bs. Was considering a premier this go around,they have been out for awhile now and the teething process of a new product should be almost over. Have not had access to one to look through it,but by all accounts the glass is excellent. More concerned wiyh durability and tracking, my S&bs have been terrific in this catagory. Would like to keep the discussion between these two scopes.USO makes a fine scope, have a 1.8-10x44 on a m1a and think I could have made no better choice. Damn thing built like a tank ( a good thing btw). To the people who have or who own both, should I give the premier a try or stay withe S&Bs. The XR recticle looks pretty good!
Rifle Scopes A question for Premier and S&B owners
- Thread starter sgj2025
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Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
Why change from S&B?? If it ain't broke, don't fix it................
Why change from S&B?? If it ain't broke, don't fix it................
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
What Buckey said ^^^
What Buckey said ^^^
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
Having heard from several people with both it's a harder decision than that. I mean, a few hundred bucks is a few hundred bucks and to talk to people with both the are of equal quality and performance. I say try the Premier and see what you think. Only you knows what you like so give it a try. After all, it's not like you're going the other way and trying to stretch that extra few hundred bucks to make a S&B happen.
Having heard from several people with both it's a harder decision than that. I mean, a few hundred bucks is a few hundred bucks and to talk to people with both the are of equal quality and performance. I say try the Premier and see what you think. Only you knows what you like so give it a try. After all, it's not like you're going the other way and trying to stretch that extra few hundred bucks to make a S&B happen.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
if you can make ut to Houston, Missouri this Sunday, you can check out mine.
if you can make ut to Houston, Missouri this Sunday, you can check out mine.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
Give the premier a shot worse comes to worse, you put it back up for sale on here. Im sure it wont last more than a day or two in the for sale section.
Give the premier a shot worse comes to worse, you put it back up for sale on here. Im sure it wont last more than a day or two in the for sale section.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
I'd say give the Premier a go. I have two and love them both.
I'd say give the Premier a go. I have two and love them both.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
i have both, and they are very similar overall. I just feel like the PH glass is HAIR sharper to my eye.
i have both, and they are very similar overall. I just feel like the PH glass is HAIR sharper to my eye.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
The Prem is available as a FFP only option. It doesn't parrallax down close like the PM2. Its more expensive.
It is great glass and a superb reticle, but then so are the PM2 and P4LF rets on the S&B
I did import the Prems but they are simply at a cost disadvantage to the S&B and have less desireable features for most?
The Prem is available as a FFP only option. It doesn't parrallax down close like the PM2. Its more expensive.
It is great glass and a superb reticle, but then so are the PM2 and P4LF rets on the S&B
I did import the Prems but they are simply at a cost disadvantage to the S&B and have less desireable features for most?
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
i compared the 2 side by side this weekend and i would say roll with the s&b. glass is beyond great on both. i like the knobs on the schmidt alittle better, it is half a pound lighter. it also has a better reputation for reliability which means alot to me.
i compared the 2 side by side this weekend and i would say roll with the s&b. glass is beyond great on both. i like the knobs on the schmidt alittle better, it is half a pound lighter. it also has a better reputation for reliability which means alot to me.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
3 of us Team B%^^%$&& guys have 5-25 PRH, none of us have had any issues what so ever, one road around in the bed of a truck for 2 week, was beaten on a phone book every night after work until bed time, had its knobs turned stop to stop countless times, and more abuse before it was mounted, all 3 three track perfect, hold zero, and the glass is dam good, my only complaintsis the lack of marking on the paralex knob(which has been taken care of), and the reticle, I wish the GEN2XR was more like a NF MLR, get rid of the dots and use just hash marks, but when you consider my scope was 1K less than a S&B with out the GEN2XR I can live it.
3 of us Team B%^^%$&& guys have 5-25 PRH, none of us have had any issues what so ever, one road around in the bed of a truck for 2 week, was beaten on a phone book every night after work until bed time, had its knobs turned stop to stop countless times, and more abuse before it was mounted, all 3 three track perfect, hold zero, and the glass is dam good, my only complaintsis the lack of marking on the paralex knob(which has been taken care of), and the reticle, I wish the GEN2XR was more like a NF MLR, get rid of the dots and use just hash marks, but when you consider my scope was 1K less than a S&B with out the GEN2XR I can live it.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
I say give Premier a try. I love mine. S&B is GTG also but I like the Gen 2 XR reticle and with Premier you get an American company with outstanding service. Not saying that S&B doesn't offer great CS but I prefer American made products when I have a choice.
I say give Premier a try. I love mine. S&B is GTG also but I like the Gen 2 XR reticle and with Premier you get an American company with outstanding service. Not saying that S&B doesn't offer great CS but I prefer American made products when I have a choice.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
Have owned both. Ditched the Premiers and returned to using nothing but S&Bs. I've not once regretted my decision and doubt I ever will.
The P4 fine is a great alternative to the Gen II XR, actually like it a little better.
Have owned both. Ditched the Premiers and returned to using nothing but S&Bs. I've not once regretted my decision and doubt I ever will.
The P4 fine is a great alternative to the Gen II XR, actually like it a little better.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
Just as a note, the Premier is not "half a pound heavier" but a mere 20 grams (thats about two thirds of an ounce). Feature-wise there's MTC turrtes, locking illumination knob, toolless zeroing of the turrets, locking diopter adjustment and a bunch more FOV on 5x (no tunneling effect.
Regarding reliability and features, the Marine Corps tested ten pieces of the the 3-15x50, which is the same mechanical construction as the 5-25x and they met the specifications and passed their extensive tests, so the scope was accepted as the new SSDS. Can't bullshit those guys.
Btw, I'm obviously biased so I'll just stick with the technical facts here.
Just as a note, the Premier is not "half a pound heavier" but a mere 20 grams (thats about two thirds of an ounce). Feature-wise there's MTC turrtes, locking illumination knob, toolless zeroing of the turrets, locking diopter adjustment and a bunch more FOV on 5x (no tunneling effect.
Regarding reliability and features, the Marine Corps tested ten pieces of the the 3-15x50, which is the same mechanical construction as the 5-25x and they met the specifications and passed their extensive tests, so the scope was accepted as the new SSDS. Can't bullshit those guys.
Btw, I'm obviously biased so I'll just stick with the technical facts here.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
I have looked through both, I think they are both right there with each other. I think it comes down to looks and features.
GG
I have looked through both, I think they are both right there with each other. I think it comes down to looks and features.
GG
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
I would choose a Schmidt over a Premier most days of the week, and im not a fan of SB either
I would choose a Schmidt over a Premier most days of the week, and im not a fan of SB either
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
well i have never owned a S&B i have never felt the need to. i love my premier.
well i have never owned a S&B i have never felt the need to. i love my premier.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sgj2025</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Am looking to purchase a third scope in the 5-25 variety, I currently have two S&Bs. Was considering a premier this go around,they have been out for awhile now and the teething process of a new product should be almost over. Have not had access to one to look through it,but by all accounts the glass is excellent.</div></div>
I have owned a loaded SN-3 3.2-17X 44mm, a PMII 5-25X CM Gen 2 XR CCW, a Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR, and now a second (for a total of two) PMII 5-25X CM Gen 2 XR CCW. In a nutshell I traded-in my SN-3 for the Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR, then sold the Premier in order to help finance the purchase of my second PMII 5-25X CM Gen 2 XR CW. While my SN-3 and Premier were great scopes I prefer the PMII 5-25X over both to the extent that I went to considerable expense to purchase my second PMII, as well as to send them both to S & B to have the turrets converted to CCW rotation.
I wanted the Gen 2 XR reticle, and at the time I bought my first PMII 5-25X Gen 2 XR the Premier wasn't out yet, so choosing the PMII Gen 2 XR was easy. When the Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR became available I decided to get one to compare to my PMII Gen 2 XR (which I had sent to S & B to convert to CCW). When I found that I preferred my PMII Gen 2 XR CCW over my Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR I decided to sell my Premier and get another PMII 5-25X Gen 2 XR, <span style="font-style: italic">if I could find one</span>.
Even though there was close to a $1,000.00 price differential between a PMII 5-25X CM <span style="font-style: italic">Gen 2 XR CCW</span> and a Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR, for me it was worth it to get what I wanted. For some insight about why I prefer the PMII 5-25X over the Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR read <span style="font-weight: bold">my reply to Goldie in Goldie's <span style="font-style: italic">"Premier or S & B"</span></span> thread from 8/26/09.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sgj2025</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> More concerned wiyh durability and tracking, my S&bs have been terrific in this catagory. Would like to keep the discussion between these two scopes.USO makes a fine scope, have a 1.8-10x44 on a m1a and think I could have made no better choice. Damn thing built like a tank ( a good thing btw).</div></div>
Both of my PMII 5-25Xs' track perfectly, and the clicks are very definite and audible. While I only had my Premier 5-25X mounted for a short period before I sold it to help finance my second PMII 5-25X Gen 2 XR, but it tracked well while I did have it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sgj2025</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> To the people who have or who own both, should I give the premier a try or stay withe S&Bs. The XR recticle looks pretty good!</div></div>
I prefer the PMII over the Premier, but that doesn't mean you will. Your preference of one over the other - if you actually develop a preference, will depend largely upon the weight you give to the features, strengths, and weaknesses that the scopes have or don't have over the one another. And some of these "strengths" and "weaknesses" are subjective.
Also, as Premier prices have increased and S & B prices have receded the price differential between the two is almost zero. Recent PMII sale prices and Group Buys have offered CCW PMII 5-25Xs' for around $2,900.00 shipped (thats' Liberty Optics Premier 5-25X territory, and Liberty has excellent pricing).
However, due to the rift between S & B and Premier, obtaining a NIB Gen 2 XR-equipped PMII 5-25X will prove to be next to impossible. Finding someone who is willing to part with a PMII 5-25X Gen 2 XR is akin to finding a particular piece of straw in a haystack.
Keith
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sgj2025</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Am looking to purchase a third scope in the 5-25 variety, I currently have two S&Bs. Was considering a premier this go around,they have been out for awhile now and the teething process of a new product should be almost over. Have not had access to one to look through it,but by all accounts the glass is excellent.</div></div>
I have owned a loaded SN-3 3.2-17X 44mm, a PMII 5-25X CM Gen 2 XR CCW, a Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR, and now a second (for a total of two) PMII 5-25X CM Gen 2 XR CCW. In a nutshell I traded-in my SN-3 for the Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR, then sold the Premier in order to help finance the purchase of my second PMII 5-25X CM Gen 2 XR CW. While my SN-3 and Premier were great scopes I prefer the PMII 5-25X over both to the extent that I went to considerable expense to purchase my second PMII, as well as to send them both to S & B to have the turrets converted to CCW rotation.
I wanted the Gen 2 XR reticle, and at the time I bought my first PMII 5-25X Gen 2 XR the Premier wasn't out yet, so choosing the PMII Gen 2 XR was easy. When the Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR became available I decided to get one to compare to my PMII Gen 2 XR (which I had sent to S & B to convert to CCW). When I found that I preferred my PMII Gen 2 XR CCW over my Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR I decided to sell my Premier and get another PMII 5-25X Gen 2 XR, <span style="font-style: italic">if I could find one</span>.
Even though there was close to a $1,000.00 price differential between a PMII 5-25X CM <span style="font-style: italic">Gen 2 XR CCW</span> and a Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR, for me it was worth it to get what I wanted. For some insight about why I prefer the PMII 5-25X over the Premier 5-25X DT MTC Gen 2 XR read <span style="font-weight: bold">my reply to Goldie in Goldie's <span style="font-style: italic">"Premier or S & B"</span></span> thread from 8/26/09.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sgj2025</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> More concerned wiyh durability and tracking, my S&bs have been terrific in this catagory. Would like to keep the discussion between these two scopes.USO makes a fine scope, have a 1.8-10x44 on a m1a and think I could have made no better choice. Damn thing built like a tank ( a good thing btw).</div></div>
Both of my PMII 5-25Xs' track perfectly, and the clicks are very definite and audible. While I only had my Premier 5-25X mounted for a short period before I sold it to help finance my second PMII 5-25X Gen 2 XR, but it tracked well while I did have it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sgj2025</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> To the people who have or who own both, should I give the premier a try or stay withe S&Bs. The XR recticle looks pretty good!</div></div>
I prefer the PMII over the Premier, but that doesn't mean you will. Your preference of one over the other - if you actually develop a preference, will depend largely upon the weight you give to the features, strengths, and weaknesses that the scopes have or don't have over the one another. And some of these "strengths" and "weaknesses" are subjective.
Also, as Premier prices have increased and S & B prices have receded the price differential between the two is almost zero. Recent PMII sale prices and Group Buys have offered CCW PMII 5-25Xs' for around $2,900.00 shipped (thats' Liberty Optics Premier 5-25X territory, and Liberty has excellent pricing).
However, due to the rift between S & B and Premier, obtaining a NIB Gen 2 XR-equipped PMII 5-25X will prove to be next to impossible. Finding someone who is willing to part with a PMII 5-25X Gen 2 XR is akin to finding a particular piece of straw in a haystack.
Keith
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: David S.</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<span style="font-weight: bold">Regarding reliability and features, the Marine Corps tested ten pieces of the the 3-15x50, which is the same mechanical construction as the 5-25x and they met the specifications and passed their extensive tests, so the scope was accepted as the new SSDS. Can't bullshit those guys.</span>
</div></div>
David, the Premier site does not mention it, is it fairly recent news?
So you confirm that the PH 3-15x50 is in service now by the USMC as their SSSDS?
How long have they been in service now (not the ten test units, but production ones)?
Could you give us the approximate number of the new scopes they are buying?
Thanks!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: David S.</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<span style="font-weight: bold">Regarding reliability and features, the Marine Corps tested ten pieces of the the 3-15x50, which is the same mechanical construction as the 5-25x and they met the specifications and passed their extensive tests, so the scope was accepted as the new SSDS. Can't bullshit those guys.</span>
</div></div>
David, the Premier site does not mention it, is it fairly recent news?
So you confirm that the PH 3-15x50 is in service now by the USMC as their SSSDS?
How long have they been in service now (not the ten test units, but production ones)?
Could you give us the approximate number of the new scopes they are buying?
Thanks!
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TiroFijo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">David, the Premier site does not mention it, is it fairly recent news?
So you confirm that the PH 3-15x50 is in service now by the USMC as their SSSDS?
How long have they been in service now (not the ten test units, but production ones)?
Could you give us the approximate number of the new scopes they are buying?
Thanks! </div></div>
TiroFijo,
we got the test approval around SHOT show and we are working on the order. Can't give you a number, but it's going to take us some time to fulfill. Civilian orders will be fulfilled in parallel though.
Here's what the Marine Corps is up to:
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TiroFijo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">David, the Premier site does not mention it, is it fairly recent news?
So you confirm that the PH 3-15x50 is in service now by the USMC as their SSSDS?
How long have they been in service now (not the ten test units, but production ones)?
Could you give us the approximate number of the new scopes they are buying?
Thanks! </div></div>
TiroFijo,
we got the test approval around SHOT show and we are working on the order. Can't give you a number, but it's going to take us some time to fulfill. Civilian orders will be fulfilled in parallel though.
Here's what the Marine Corps is up to:
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
heres one for ya!
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...965#Post1885965
heres one for ya!
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...965#Post1885965
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 427Cobra</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I work for Southwest Airlines, I never ever say fly us because this airline........................., former employees of Premier should learn those morals. </div></div>
Nothing wrong with my morals, simply answering the OPs question.
Maybe you should read your own sig line before submitting your next post.
<span style="font-size: 11pt">I say it again, my vote goes to S&B.</span>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 427Cobra</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I work for Southwest Airlines, I never ever say fly us because this airline........................., former employees of Premier should learn those morals. </div></div>
Nothing wrong with my morals, simply answering the OPs question.
Maybe you should read your own sig line before submitting your next post.
<span style="font-size: 11pt">I say it again, my vote goes to S&B.</span>
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: David S.</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TiroFijo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">David, the Premier site does not mention it, is it fairly recent news?
So you confirm that the PH 3-15x50 is in service now by the USMC as their SSSDS?
How long have they been in service now (not the ten test units, but production ones)?
Could you give us the approximate number of the new scopes they are buying?
Thanks! </div></div>
TiroFijo,
we got the test approval around SHOT show and we are working on the order. Can't give you a number, but it's going to take us some time to fulfill. Civilian orders will be fulfilled in parallel though.
Here's what the Marine Corps is up to:
</div></div>
THERE ARE NO Premier 3-15s in service with the USMC, people leave out pretty decent details of the Contract.The contract states that the USMC has the option when a SB SSDS is unrepairable that it will be replaced with the PH, not that the USMC is gonna yank all the SB SSDS's will replace them with the PH.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: David S.</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TiroFijo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">David, the Premier site does not mention it, is it fairly recent news?
So you confirm that the PH 3-15x50 is in service now by the USMC as their SSSDS?
How long have they been in service now (not the ten test units, but production ones)?
Could you give us the approximate number of the new scopes they are buying?
Thanks! </div></div>
TiroFijo,
we got the test approval around SHOT show and we are working on the order. Can't give you a number, but it's going to take us some time to fulfill. Civilian orders will be fulfilled in parallel though.
Here's what the Marine Corps is up to:
</div></div>
THERE ARE NO Premier 3-15s in service with the USMC, people leave out pretty decent details of the Contract.The contract states that the USMC has the option when a SB SSDS is unrepairable that it will be replaced with the PH, not that the USMC is gonna yank all the SB SSDS's will replace them with the PH.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
Thanks David S.
deadly 0311, thanks a lot. So it seems that the PH scope has passed the tests but:
<span style="font-weight: bold">"THERE ARE NO Premier 3-15s in service with the USMC"</span>
Do you know if the USMC has <span style="font-weight: bold">actually</span> made an order for PH new SSDS scopes, other than (I would guess not more than a few by now?) for replacement of unrepairable S&B scopes?
Thanks David S.
deadly 0311, thanks a lot. So it seems that the PH scope has passed the tests but:
<span style="font-weight: bold">"THERE ARE NO Premier 3-15s in service with the USMC"</span>
Do you know if the USMC has <span style="font-weight: bold">actually</span> made an order for PH new SSDS scopes, other than (I would guess not more than a few by now?) for replacement of unrepairable S&B scopes?
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Buckey</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why change from S&B?? If it ain't broke, don't fix it................</div></div>
Exactly. Had both and like the knobs on the S&B much better.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Buckey</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why change from S&B?? If it ain't broke, don't fix it................</div></div>
Exactly. Had both and like the knobs on the S&B much better.
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
Thanks guys for your answers and keeping it on topic. Will be a few months before I make the purchase. Maybe someone will show up at the range with one and I can get the feel of the clicks and a hands on evaluation. Stores in my area, because of the small market, just dont carry high end optics. So when I am at the range and someone is looking, I always let them get behind the rifle and take a look, people are curious, me included. I have made a few new friends and shot some rifles I probably never would have gotten to shoot. My poor DTA was a range whore for a month or so, but in turn got to shoot a noveske 21 inch 308,some kind of buffalo rifle that just kicked the shit out of you,and One of the guys just called and his AIAW 308 topped with a new nightforce is in, an now will get to shoot my first AI and look through a nightforce scope for the first time.
thanks Steve
Thanks guys for your answers and keeping it on topic. Will be a few months before I make the purchase. Maybe someone will show up at the range with one and I can get the feel of the clicks and a hands on evaluation. Stores in my area, because of the small market, just dont carry high end optics. So when I am at the range and someone is looking, I always let them get behind the rifle and take a look, people are curious, me included. I have made a few new friends and shot some rifles I probably never would have gotten to shoot. My poor DTA was a range whore for a month or so, but in turn got to shoot a noveske 21 inch 308,some kind of buffalo rifle that just kicked the shit out of you,and One of the guys just called and his AIAW 308 topped with a new nightforce is in, an now will get to shoot my first AI and look through a nightforce scope for the first time.
thanks Steve
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
You have a couple of S&Bs , Short answer is stick with these .
Standardise on them , so you should have the same direction knobs on all your S&Bs , make it & keep it simple .
That way you hopefully , never crank the knobs the wrong direction whne putting dope on the scopes .
Hope that makes sense .
Later Chris
You have a couple of S&Bs , Short answer is stick with these .
Standardise on them , so you should have the same direction knobs on all your S&Bs , make it & keep it simple .
That way you hopefully , never crank the knobs the wrong direction whne putting dope on the scopes .
Hope that makes sense .
Later Chris
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
Have had both--
PH is definitely the better value. That said, I'm running S&B 5-25 XRs because:
1) I can adjust S&B parallax down to about 15Y so I can dry-fire inside, PH can't go that low.
2) Rear focus ring of the PH is a little too coarse for me--I couldn't get the PH reticle in the sweet spot for my eyes.
3) I can feel the adjustments better on the S&B.
4) I like the marks on the S&B's parallax turret so that I can get close on the adjustments when I'm switching between targets.
Optically, I can resolve bullet holes and trace a little better with the S&B, but that may be because I am more comfortable with the adjustments.
I'd go with a PH again if they marked the parallax turret and changed the rear ring to something that was easier to adjust with fine increments.
The only other scope that could get me off of the S&Bs would be the March's if they come up with a decent reticle/knob combination. The BR folks are onto something with those scopes.
Now, if I can ever find another S&B CCW MIL XR 5-25...
Have had both--
PH is definitely the better value. That said, I'm running S&B 5-25 XRs because:
1) I can adjust S&B parallax down to about 15Y so I can dry-fire inside, PH can't go that low.
2) Rear focus ring of the PH is a little too coarse for me--I couldn't get the PH reticle in the sweet spot for my eyes.
3) I can feel the adjustments better on the S&B.
4) I like the marks on the S&B's parallax turret so that I can get close on the adjustments when I'm switching between targets.
Optically, I can resolve bullet holes and trace a little better with the S&B, but that may be because I am more comfortable with the adjustments.
I'd go with a PH again if they marked the parallax turret and changed the rear ring to something that was easier to adjust with fine increments.
The only other scope that could get me off of the S&Bs would be the March's if they come up with a decent reticle/knob combination. The BR folks are onto something with those scopes.
Now, if I can ever find another S&B CCW MIL XR 5-25...
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
I'm very happy with my 3-15 PH. Happy with the tool-less zeroing, glass quality and XR reticle.
I do not have and never looked through a PM II, however after having read the above posts now may be I have to look around for a PM II to find out...
I'm very happy with my 3-15 PH. Happy with the tool-less zeroing, glass quality and XR reticle.
I do not have and never looked through a PM II, however after having read the above posts now may be I have to look around for a PM II to find out...
Re: A question for Premier and S&B owners
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CubeWarrior</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
PH is definitely the better value. That said, I'm running S&B 5-25 XRs because:....
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No trying to argue or bash on ya but I'm curious as to why you think the PH is a better value overall since you prefer the parallax, focus ring, adjustments etc. on the S&B and it's only a hundred dollars more? Are there other things the PH does better than the S&B that make it a better overall value?
Back when a PH was a $2000 scope that might have been the case but now dealers are listing the PH at $3000 for the 5-25.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CubeWarrior</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
PH is definitely the better value. That said, I'm running S&B 5-25 XRs because:....
</div></div>
No trying to argue or bash on ya but I'm curious as to why you think the PH is a better value overall since you prefer the parallax, focus ring, adjustments etc. on the S&B and it's only a hundred dollars more? Are there other things the PH does better than the S&B that make it a better overall value?
Back when a PH was a $2000 scope that might have been the case but now dealers are listing the PH at $3000 for the 5-25.
