About to purchase Sinclair expander mandrel. Question on the Expander vs Turning

[Randy_Lahey]

I've started to drink the Kool-Aid on the Sinclair mandrel vs using an expander ball.

I do load on a Hornady LnL AP and generally use Hornady full length sizing dies with the expander ball. I'm under the impression that removing the expander ball in the full length die and adding the Sinclair mandrel after sizing will help with concentricity and SD's. I have however read various different threads where some use the expander mandrell and some use the turning neck mandrel. I know the turning neck is 0.02 under bullet diameter vs 0.01 for the expander.

I want to buy the carbide mandrels, as I assume I won't have to lube the inside of case mouths in that case. Am I right there? Do you think I'd be ok with going wtih the expander mandrel in carbide for the calibers I wish to load, or do you buy one of each the expander/turning and then measure different case brands to gauge spring back etc.... I'd prefer to get started and thought I'd just get the die and the expanders at first, and maybe add the turning if needed at a later date if I run into spring back issues on certain brands of brass etc... Sound ok?

P.S. Eager to start loading 6.5 Creedmoor and .224 Valkarie this week as dies and bullets are incoming.

 

[ken4570tc in WY]

Randy,
I'm right in the kool-aid with you. I purchased a Sinclair mandrel expander for my .243 project but am a couple of weeks from using it. I'ts my understanding from what I read that they recommend light lube even with the carbide, preferably dry. The brass will begin to build up on the carbide mandrel if you do not use lube.

 

[Randy_Lahey]

dry lube? Like Hornady one shot or ???

 

[ken4570tc in WY]

Graphite, tungsten-di-sulfide or HBN powders. Stay away from moly. You can leave the residue in the neck to make bullet seating smoother and more consistent. NECO makes a kit. Or you can make your own using small steel shot in a container. The only clean up required is to wipe off the outside of the necks after expanding. Some shooters using the dry powder lube have reported improved es/sd's.

 

[Onyx Z]

Use Imperial Dry Lube and you won't need to clean it after sizing. Helps with more consistent bullet seating as well.

 

[Threadcutter308]

I wouldn't spend the money on the carbide version. The mandrel is not subject to much in the way of linear or rotary loading and afterall, the case is brass and is much softer than the standard steel mandrel. As Onyx says, use Imperial and you'll be all set. I only ever use my expander once, which is when the brass is new, in preparation for/just before neck turning. Once the brass prep is completed, I use L.E. Wilson neck sizing dies for sizing the necks only. On my .223 and .308's, I don't need to bump the shoulders any more frequently than about every 10 reloads. I've got about 20 reloads on my .308 bras and its still going strong. I don't think I've ever full length re-sized any of this brass.

 

[Randy_Lahey]

Thx for the info.

I am running all gas guns right now(AR15/AR10 platforms-5.56, .224 valkarie, 6.5 Creedmoor, .308). AFAIK I will need to keep full length sizing but can use the mandrel to then set neck tension on each reload which should in theory still decrease working the neck/shoulder as much as an expander ball would???

I got the carbide expanders for .224, 6.5 and 0.308. If I get the turning mandrels I'll go with the steel. Figured I'd buy once cry once here, but as usual I spent $ when not needed, and down the road I'll cheap out and have to rebuy something more $$$ lol. It's how I roll!

 

[Threadcutter308]

Thx for the info.

I am running all gas guns right now(AR15/AR10 platforms-5.56, .224 valkarie, 6.5 Creedmoor, .308). AFAIK I will need to keep full length sizing but can use the mandrel to then set neck tension on each reload which should in theory still decrease working the neck/shoulder as much as an expander ball would???

I got the carbide expanders for .224, 6.5 and 0.308. If I get the turning mandrels I'll go with the steel. Figured I'd buy once cry once here, but as usual I spent $ when not needed, and down the road I'll cheap out and have to rebuy something more $$$ lol. It's how I roll!

Yeah, I should have mentioned that I'm also talking in the context of my bolt guns. Semi's are a different matter.

 

[Randy_Lahey]

Once I get my gassers tuned how I want, I do plan to buy a nice bolt gun as for my purposes it would be a very fun and probably more practical option. For w/e reason though I just love the AR platform and have some idiot obsession with making accurized versions

 

[Randy_Lahey]

Ok guys! Another ? if you don't mind. And sorry if this is a dumb question.

But eventually I want to get a Dillon RT1500 E case trimmer setup for 5.56. I am considering this setup for my progressive press(either Dillon 650 or Hornady LNL AP-not sure yet on which one I wanna use). Station one, universal decapper. Station 2- Dillon case trimmer(Will neck size/shoulder bump). Station 3, Sinclair die with TURNING mandrel, and Station 4 possibly with Sinclair die with carbide expanding mandrel if I have too much neck tension with only doing the turning die. The reason, I rationalize the turning die first is to decrease the drag of the slight burrs that will be present after the dillon trimming. I hear it's pretty decent, but I also hear people recommend neck sizing after the Dillon case trimmer. Am I wrong to assume that running the Sinclair dies like I propose would possibly be superior to the neck die setup due to possibly enhanced neck concentricity etc...

The goal being to be able to turn out 2000-3000 cases per year in a prep session etc... Doing these cases by hand now is driving me NUTS. Am I unrealistic in putting my once fired LC Nato brass through this prep, beburr the necks and be able to find a near 1 MOA load with 73 gr ELD or 75 gr Hornady HPBT? I don't need to shoot sub MOA in my gas guns, but I do like to ring steel at 400 yards at my current range, and soon to have some farm ground I'll be able to run longer ranges.

 

[Pvt.Donut]

I would suggest the carbide. I started with the cheaper steel mandrels and no matter what I did I got gauling. Switched to Carbide and haven't had any issues, slick as snot (I use Imperial Dry lube to expand the neck prior to seating).

 

[Randy_Lahey]

Well I ended up getting carbide expanders, and steel turning mandrels. I figure if I find a combo that needs more neck tension I'll try the steel and see how they do etc.... Can always upgrade later. I've used both and both seem to work pretty well.

 

[LANCER]

I would use the turning mandrels myself, as you will get better neck tension. But expanders work well also, especially if you do a light crimp.

 

[Milo 2.5]

I'd spring for carbide if myself if you can find the right matchup. Expander balls in dies are carbide for a reason.

Scroll down on this page to the mandrels, all steel but varying sizes, gives options under standard expander and turning sizes. You are making custom ammo for your rifle, may as well have a custom neck tension too.

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Click reloading equipment ^^^^^

 

[Afkirby]

I like my titanium nitride mandrel from 21st century shooting, it’s smooth

 

[LANCER]

I like my titanium nitride mandrel from 21st century shooting, it’s smooth

Indeed. I have 3 calibers set up using 21st century TiN expander and turning mandrels. I went full retard on their site and bought pretty much everything they offer. LOL. Good stuff especially their hand-priming tools.