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Anyone Getting Their LMT Orders In???

Woollymonster

Woollymonster

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Minuteman
Jul 31, 2011
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I know there is a dedicated LMT .308 MWS thread and some of you have your rifles. I have had one on order from V1 Tactical since October 2020. Promised delivery date was June 1, 2021. I still don't have the rifle.

I have talked to John several times at V1 Tactical. He can give me no updates and LMT is not providing updates either.

This would not be of major concern for me had I not already paid for the rifle LAST YEAR. Typically, when you order a product that is not in stock, you pay for it when it ships.

My fear is that V1 is over extended on these orders. Money has been collected and money most likely has been spent. When buyers start requesting/demanding refunds for undelivered products that have already been paid for, the company could file for bankruptcy and we are all screwed. I have seen it before. Anyone remember Tactical Precision Rifles?

So what do you guys think? Has anyone gotten their LMT order from V1????

Thanks,
Wooly
IMG_0656.jpg
 
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I pre-ordered 2 LMT rifles last year. I wouldn’t do it again; however, I am happy I did. I was able to lock in pre-insanity prices. I bought mine because I wanted factory complete rifles. LMT has a presence on social media and discredits individuals building rifles using LMT parts, then produces far more parts than complete rifles. When people complain about not receiving their rifles, LMT suggests they should just purchase the parts and build a rifle. That’s frustrating to me and I did not garner a lot of respect for LMT. If it wasn’t for their multi caliber ability and reasonable prices, I would have just bought Knights or some other quality AR.
As hard as it is, just sit back and wait at this point, otherwise you will forfeit a considerable percentage to “restocking” or whatever they call it. V1 seem like good people and I suspect you will be fine, although they could close the doors at anytime. I believe I ordered in August 2020 and I just received the MLC. I still have a 308 on order and suspect the heavys will be produced shortly.
 
I'm an LMT dealer and even I don't get stuff too often. I've been waiting on 308 BCGs for over a year.

I think the pandemic, election, and gov't contracts have played a toll on some of these OEMs and they are having trouble keeping up.
 
It’s funny, I need to excel what I have ordered and stuff. I have a BCG and a barrel I ordered from Titan at the beginning of this year. I suspect we will get our stuff when ray guns come to market.
 
hlee said:
What do I think? Life is too short to pre-pay for out of stock items. If the wait is unacceptable, ask for a refund. Or, continue to extend the interest free loan.
Click to expand...
Right here ^^^^ is the answer to your question.

If the dealer does not have the product why the fuck am I paying for it.
 
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unclemoak said:
I'm an LMT dealer and even I don't get stuff too often. I've been waiting on 308 BCGs for over a year.

I think the pandemic, election, and gov't contracts have played a toll on some of these OEMs and they are having trouble keeping up.
Click to expand...
If anything , we are all finding out how the supply chain works when China is a few hundred of the links in the chain.

It’s not that LMT stuff is made in China. Far from it. But here is a theoretical situation:

LMT buys threaded inserts for their clamping bolts from Jims Threadserts.

Jim’s makes these entirely in the USA. On a machine that has one Chinese part.

That broke last month, and isn’t made in the US anymore by anyone and isnt something you could have made in less than 100k quantity.

See where this is going? It brought products to our shelves for a long time, but now it’s keeping them off the shelves. It was always going to end this way.
 
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The funny thing is when you call V1 to cancel an order that was never filled he charges you 20%! I had an LMT bcg on backorder for I think 11 months now and I called last week to cancel it and he said sure but I have to charge you 20% re stocking fee! He was all nice about it but why would you charge 20% for something that was never in stock?? Anyway- just a heads up for those of you wanting to place something on backorder with them. He does give you store credit for the entire amount.
 
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hitman said:
The funny thing is when you call V1 to cancel an order that was never filled he charges you 20%! I had an LMT bcg on backorder for I think 11 months now and I called last week to cancel it and he said sure but I have to charge you 20% re stocking fee! He was all nice about it but why would you charge 20% for something that was never in stock?? Anyway- just a heads up for those of you wanting to place something on backorder with them. He does give you store credit for the entire amount.
Click to expand...

Charging a restocking fee for something that was never in stock is pure BS, and should be insulting to the consumer.
 
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I've considered ordering one through V1, until I found out you pay 100% up front and wait.:oops:
 
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Desert_Racer said:
Call your credit card company and dispute it for a full refund. You can’t charge a restocking fee for something that was never in stock. I don’t care what his fine print says.
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A lot of these backorder type vendors just want to measure the semen capacity of your asshole.

I will say that V1Tactical at least seems to be pretty on the up/up. You will get it when they do.
 
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Desert_Racer said:
Call your credit card company and dispute it for a full refund. You can’t charge a restocking fee for something that was never in stock. I don’t care what his fine print says.
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And, if enough people demand a charge back, they (the vendor) could lose their card processor. Credit card companies are generally more than happy to side with the customer.
 
It’s likely been way too long for a credit card dispute.

hitman said:
The funny thing is when you call V1 to cancel an order that was never filled he charges you 20%! I had an LMT bcg on backorder for I think 11 months now and I called last week to cancel it and he said sure but I have to charge you 20% re stocking fee! He was all nice about it but why would you charge 20% for something that was never in stock?? Anyway- just a heads up for those of you wanting to place something on backorder with them. He does give you store credit for the entire amount.
Click to expand...
Came here to mention this. It’s a fairly predatory practice, especially in a time where there is no stock and nothing to charge a restock on as everything sells out more or less within minutes now.
 
I just took the store credit- but I agree 100% it is a shit policy. I was pretty aggravated because then you have to hope they have something you want or eat 20%. I needed some random things so I did not care to argue with them. He gives 100% refund as a store credit only. But if you do not need or want anything you loose out. He is a nice guy for what that is worth haha! I can see this policy on custom built firearms where they are in the process of your build or something but not for parts.
 
We are an LMT direct dealer. We get shipments in every month. The problem is they are from orders placed between October, 2019 and June, 2020, and we never know what will be sent and when. LMT stopped taking orders 13 months ago and we do not know when they will start up. Last I heard they had most of 2022 production planned.

So, yes, deliveries are coming in. No, not as much as we would like. No, we cannot order more yet.
 
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The bigger question I ask myself is why do I like KAC and LMT enough to give my 1k to just sit on a product that I might not get in 2022?
 
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whatsupdoc said:
Right here ^^^^ is the answer to your question.

If the dealer does not have the product why the fuck am I paying for it.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I know it is fucked up. Especially the part about him charging a 20% "restocking fee" for an item that was never in stock and is months overdue.

The more important question was; has anyone started to get their orders in on LMT Rifles from V1 Tactical????

I am trying to decide wether to wait it out or fight this scoundrel for a full refund.
 
dbransco said:
I pre-ordered 2 LMT rifles last year. I wouldn’t do it again; however, I am happy I did. I was able to lock in pre-insanity prices. I bought mine because I wanted factory complete rifles. LMT has a presence on social media and discredits individuals building rifles using LMT parts, then produces far more parts than complete rifles. When people complain about not receiving their rifles, LMT suggests they should just purchase the parts and build a rifle. That’s frustrating to me and I did not garner a lot of respect for LMT. If it wasn’t for their multi caliber ability and reasonable prices, I would have just bought Knights or some other quality AR.
As hard as it is, just sit back and wait at this point, otherwise you will forfeit a considerable percentage to “restocking” or whatever they call it. V1 seem like good people and I suspect you will be fine, although they could close the doors at anytime. I believe I ordered in August 2020 and I just received the MLC. I still have a 308 on order and suspect the heavys will be produced shortly.
Click to expand...
There are no parts available anywhere either. I have a complete lower and multiple barres. There are no receivers or BGC's anywhere to be had.
 
All,

I don't have any personal experience with V1 Tactical, but I have dealt with Titan Defense when it comes to getting an LMT 6.5CM DMR on order. Russel, the owner of Titan Defense, made the the process very transparent when I placed an order for my LMT back in May 2021. He let me know there was zero ETA on the delivery and that there would be a deposit required upfront. He explained that his company maintains a deposit position to prevent customers from canceling matching orders placed between competing companies. Apparently, people would place orders between two competing companies and then cancel the orders that didn't fulfill first, if that makes sense. He indicated that all cancelled backorders would lose the deposit. Personally, I didn't have a problem with his company's lack of ETA and deposit, mainly because I was dead-nuts set on getting an LMT. My theory was that it would be better to wait in "line" with a backorder than try to perfectly time the purchase of an in-stock item.

Lucky for me, Titan had my DMR order filled in less than 2 months. Unfortunately, I'm still waiting on the fulfillment of the 7.62 16" LW barrel that I put on backorder at the same time as the firearm. LOL there are zero signs in the world that show that the barrel will come anytime soon, especially since it is a LW.

Although I have heard great customer experiences from V1 Tactical, I think their business model of providing customers with allocation dates is a cause for false hope. LMT has mentioned on their live-streams that they don't provided any of their dealers with allocation numbers/dates, so that would indicate that the whole allocation business is an in-house V1 Tactical thing.

These are just my opinions and experiences. Good luck to those who are still waiting on their LMTs, they're worth the wait. Stay strong kings!
 
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If I were a seller of these items I for sure wouldn't be concerned about a deposit or anything. Why?

It will sell at retail in exactly 60 seconds for almost all of it. I certainly wouldn't lose my ass on most of it.
 
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dbransco said:
I pre-ordered 2 LMT rifles last year. I wouldn’t do it again; however, I am happy I did. I was able to lock in pre-insanity prices. I bought mine because I wanted factory complete rifles. LMT has a presence on social media and discredits individuals building rifles using LMT parts, then produces far more parts than complete rifles. When people complain about not receiving their rifles, LMT suggests they should just purchase the parts and build a rifle. That’s frustrating to me and I did not garner a lot of respect for LMT. If it wasn’t for their multi caliber ability and reasonable prices, I would have just bought Knights or some other quality AR.
As hard as it is, just sit back and wait at this point, otherwise you will forfeit a considerable percentage to “restocking” or whatever they call it. V1 seem like good people and I suspect you will be fine, although they could close the doors at anytime. I believe I ordered in August 2020 and I just received the MLC. I still have a 308 on order and suspect the heavys will be produced shortly.
Click to expand...
I'm curious on how LMT holds a stance that discredits people from building up an LMT rifle? How are they specifically discrediting people? Like you said, LMT has suggested to customers that they should piece together a rifle when factory assembled rifles aren't available. I've heard them offer this same advice on their live-streams.
 
The King said:
If I were a seller of these items I for sure wouldn't be concerned about a deposit or anything. Why?

It will sell at retail in exactly 60 seconds for almost all of it. I certainly wouldn't lose my ass on most of it.
Click to expand...
King,

You're not wrong! Unfortunately though any business owner is usually entitled to run their business on their own terms, so we the customer have to either accept or go elsewhere. You know what I mean?

Dude stripped lowers and various stripped uppers sell like hotcakes! It's absolutely bananas. I was playing around with the idea of building a MARS-L, but the market $319 is a bit too rich for me on a AR-15 platform lower.
 
MNtadpole said:
I'm curious on how LMT holds a stance that discredits people from building up an LMT rifle? How are they specifically discrediting people? Like you said, LMT has suggested to customers that they should piece together a rifle when factory assembled rifles aren't available. I've heard them offer this same advice on their live-streams.
Click to expand...
Fair question and keep in mind this is only my perspective; however, I’ve come across numerous posts on LMT FB pages where individuals have pieced together rifles with LMT parts and have had issues. The comments from LMT staff state more or less “well that’s happening because you pieced that rifle together.” (My words). I also see comments to photos of individuals rifles with barrel-hand guard interface issues (barrel or hand guard crooked) and comments similar to “quit worrying about it and shoot it”.
I, like you am overall curious to LMTs stance on a lot of things. If I bought a new car and the steering wheel was positioned in the middle of the car, I wouldn’t give a shit that it drove fine. I’d want the wheel where it was suppose to be.
I’m new to LMT and I purchased LMT rifles because of their supposed quality, reasonable pricing and options unique to the industry. I just received my first rifle and have yet to build my own opinion. I am well aware that I am not privy to the inner goings on at LMT, but from an outside perspective, their operations and/or stance seems odd at times.
 
dbransco said:
Fair question and keep in mind this is only my perspective; however, I’ve come across numerous posts on LMT FB pages where individuals have pieced together rifles with LMT parts and have had issues. The comments from LMT staff state more or less “well that’s happening because you pieced that rifle together.” (My words). I also see comments to photos of individuals rifles with barrel-hand guard interface issues (barrel or hand guard crooked) and comments similar to “quit worrying about it and shoot it”.
I, like you am overall curious to LMTs stance on a lot of things. If I bought a new car and the steering wheel was positioned in the middle of the car, I wouldn’t give a shit that it drove fine. I’d want the wheel where it was suppose to be.
I’m new to LMT and I purchased LMT rifles because of their supposed quality, reasonable pricing and options unique to the industry. I just received my first rifle and have yet to build my own opinion. I am well aware that I am not privy to the inner goings on at LMT, but from an outside perspective, their operations and/or stance seems odd at times.
Click to expand...
I’m pretty uncaring about the “you rolled it yourself” response. It’s a solid answer.

I was a designer who worked with the Stoner platform turning raw metal blocks into guns in machining centers, not looking at an armorers wrench in amazement at how far I had come.

I still think the upper we made that had a square ejection port and a ruler instead of a picatinny rail that was used for high speed camera work was the coolest thing. The BCG had a metal pointer screwed to the side that pointed at the ruler and allowed for perfect measurement of bcg velocity curves.

People come in a bunch of flavors, from sophisticated machine-friendly mechanics and machinists to borderline homeless cretins that monkeys look at like they are stupid.

All of these people build AR15s from parts.

I have had shit come back to me as “repairs” in my past life where I learned the exact consequences for example of putting the buffer in an AR before you put in the spring.

Or where someone put their 6.8 bolt in their 556 because they were cleaning both guns at the same time.

Or the one time that guy came in with a home built rig that had a 9mm bolt and it was a .300 BO build.

He said, I kid you not, “It don’t shut good.”

If you built this with all factory parts exactly the way the factory gun was built with torque wrenches and action blocks and you staked the buffer tube and and and let’s talk.
 
I finally gave up and requested store credit for the cost of the rifle via email. John from v1tactical was very nice about it and gave me store credit that I used to buy two new colt mid length rifles in place of what I had on order. I had purchased a lmt battle rifle back in Feb of 2020, and who knows when lmt will ever get around to delivering it.

He also said to tell everyone that he wished he could move lmt along faster, but they won't even give updates or estimates anymore. John requested that anyone curious about their place in line or needing any info at all about their orders give him a call and he will be happy to talk with you. I think he handled the situation about as well as possible given the circumstances.
 
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The 20% restocking fee is bullshit, although it’s his priority to do what he likes with his own business. It’s not like he’s going to be stuck with a rifle that people are beating down his door to get. This just makes the guy sound like an asshole or a fucking retard IMO. Maybe both 🤷‍♂️
 
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db2000 said:
The 20% restocking fee is bullshit, although it’s his priority to do what he likes with his own business. It’s not like he’s going to be stuck with a rifle that people are beating down his door to get. This just makes the guy sound like an asshole or a fucking retard IMO. Maybe both 🤷‍♂️
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I couldn't have said it any better, well done!!!
 
hitman said:
The funny thing is when you call V1 to cancel an order that was never filled he charges you 20%! I had an LMT bcg on backorder for I think 11 months now and I called last week to cancel it and he said sure but I have to charge you 20% re stocking fee! He was all nice about it but why would you charge 20% for something that was never in stock?? Anyway- just a heads up for those of you wanting to place something on backorder with them. He does give you store credit for the entire amount.
Click to expand...
In that event why not contest the charge on your credit card?
 
I would have but It was almost a year ago and I just ordered an altus bipod I needed anyway with the store credit. I have some store credit now just sitting there but I'll use it at some point.
 
I ended up backing out of my LMT order with V1 Tactical. Unfortunately, because the owner's "20% restocking fee" policy is what I would consider to be both dishonest and lacking in honor, I had to click through over 100 pages of their non-user friendly website, until finally coming to something worthwhile that wasn't out of stock. I purchased something of slightly higher value to obtain a full refund on my LMT deposit (they will only give a full refund in the form of store credit). Had I asked for a refund to my card, I would have paid this company $640 to literally do nothing.

The reality of doing business with V1 Tactical, is their "allocation" verbiage and business model is extraordinarily misleading and seemingly predatory, in my opinion. Coupled with the restocking fee (for items that aren't actually in stock to begin with), it left me with a very uneasy feeling as the customer to have $3200 of my money sitting in their bank account for an indefinite amount of time. In today's current economic climate, this is not something I am comfortable with. I have personally witnessed a few gun shops with very similar business models eventually go bankrupt and walk away with the money of many customers. Every one of them turned out to be a "robbing Peter to pay Paul" situation. I am not saying this is what is happening here, or going to happen with V1; the truth is I don't know and I am not trying to slander them. It is just not a chance I'm willing to take for that amount of money.

I will say that both the owner and his wife were kind to me on the phone, easy to work with when changing my order for another item, and they shipped quickly. Of course, they still got my money either way...more of it, in fact. Personally, I will not be doing business there in the future, and I will not be referring anyone there either.
 
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Desert_Racer said:
I ended up backing out of my LMT order with V1 Tactical. Unfortunately, because the owner's "20% restocking fee" policy is what I would consider to be both dishonest and lacking in honor, I had to click through over 100 pages of their non-user friendly website, until finally coming to something worthwhile that wasn't out of stock. I purchased something of slightly higher value to obtain a full refund on my LMT deposit (they will only give a full refund in the form of store credit). Had I asked for a refund to my card, I would have paid this company $640 to literally do nothing.

The reality of doing business with V1 Tactical, is their "allocation" verbiage and business model is extraordinarily misleading, in my opinion. Coupled with the restocking fee (for items that aren't actually in stock to begin with), it left me with a very uneasy feeling as the customer to have $3200 of my money sitting in their bank account for an indefinite amount of time. In today's current economic climate, this is not something I am comfortable with. I have personally witnessed a few gun shops with very similar business models eventually go bankrupt and walk away with the money of many customers. Every one of them turned out to be a "robbing Peter to pay Paul" situation. I am not saying this is what is happening here, or going to happen with V1; the truth is I don't know and I am not trying to slander them. It is just not a chance I'm willing to take for that amount of money.

I will say that both the owner and his wife were kind to me on the phone, easy to work with when changing my order for another item, and they shipped quickly. Of course, they still got my money either way...more of it, in fact. Personally, I will not be doing business there in the future, and I will not be referring anyone there either.
Click to expand...
Sir, out of curiosity, what had LMT product did you order, and which product did you replace it with?
 
So, I am the OP and the original question was, "Has anyone been getting orders in on LMT Rifles ordered from V1 Tactical?

Looks like only one person has and his order took more than a year. I think we are screwed.
 
I'll say all this here,

I'm a customer of V1 and I also run a business in this industry.

I ordered a LMT MLC in April 2020 and received Jan 2021. I think that was fair considering how everything is freaking crazy right now.

At my work, we order KAC stuff.
Customers pay up front, we reach out, we then pay up front. If a customer backs out, we effectively eat it until we actually get the rifle/parts. In the end we'll sell the rifle, but margins aren't great selling these high end rifles as a retailer. It's not worth $300 profit [hypothetical competitive price] to tie up $3000+ for a year. Now scale that times fifteen or so at any given time. That's how you go out of business unless you have a lot of capital.

So I understand why these handful of other smaller companies that are willing to risk their business to offer these extremely sought after products have their "restocking fees"... it only makes sense.
It's not selfish. It's survival.

These companies, like V1, are doing everything they can to get you what you want. I wouldn't hate on them.
If anything hate on KAC and LMT. Hate on the forges and casting plants. Hate on the mills and metal factories. Hate on the states and governments that are restricting the flow. You see where I'm going with this....
That's all I'll say for now.

Cheers friends
 
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OP, I'd never heard of that LMT reseller, but I'm glad you educated us. TY
 
Milf Dots said:
OP, I'd never heard of that LMT reseller, but I'm glad you educated us. TY
Click to expand...
They are LMT’s largest distributor and also a large retail dealer.

Frankly, LMT’s whole dealer network kinda stinks. I don’t blame them that much though because look at LMT. They’ll bring out new products and sell at full MSRP direct-to-consumer before they even *consider* delivering a few units to dealers.
 
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TheOE800 said:
They are LMT’s largest distributor and also a large retail dealer.

Frankly, LMT’s whole dealer network kinda stinks. I don’t blame them that much though because look at LMT. They’ll bring out new products and sell at full MSRP direct-to-consumer before they even *consider* delivering a few units to dealers.
Click to expand...
He's free to choose a five or ten percent 'restocking fee' on items that were never in stock- the 20 percent is his choice, and IMHO ridiculous. If it's true that LMT gives him no ETA and yet he offers customers an opinion on when he thinks LMT special orders will arrive- he should cease that immediately.

What LMT does is a separate convo.
 
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db2000 said:
The 20% restocking fee is bullshit, although it’s his priority to do what he likes with his own business. It’s not like he’s going to be stuck with a rifle that people are beating down his door to get. This just makes the guy sound like an asshole or a fucking retard IMO. Maybe both 🤷‍♂️
Click to expand...
How can he charge that when its an on order rifle? Id call the cc company as there is no way that aligns to their agreement
 
Woollymonster said:
There are no parts available anywhere either. I have a complete lower and multiple barres. There are no receivers or BGC's anywhere to be had.
Click to expand...

There some that pop up on arfcom but you will pay extra. Reddit is a little better for price but that place is also a cesspool for retards that like to dock each other.
 
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