ATF New Ruling? Thoughts?

[Mattrmvpd]

Found this article on my news feed but can NOT verify it. Figured you all could help source it.

ATF ruling changed on stabilization braces on AR type pistols etc...

ATF's gun measurement change now forcing federal registration of popular guns

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) has reportedly changed a key gun measuring standard that is indirectly reclassifying popular

americanmilitarynews.com

 

[hafejd30]

I’m pretty sure I read this elsewhere not long ago.

Sounds like they went to measuring guns in the shorter operable configuration. Much like my state (MI) does where the ar is measured from the end of barrel to end of buffer tube, regardless of stock or brace that goes on it. Also measured to folded Length when a law folding adapter is used. Due to the fact that one round can be fired with it folded.

At least that is my understanding

AK pistols (or the uzi in the pic) would be measured to where the brace attaches to the pistol, same spot a folding adapter would be measured etc. Due to the fact that unlike an AR 15 that uses a buffer tube to operate, the AK does not. Therefore anything behind the AK action doesn’t count as an essential part of the gun and doesn’t count towards the Legth.

This ATF crap makes my head hurt. Just filed for a form 1 for my AR pistol to go sbr and be done with the OAL measuring crap

I’m guessing this is just a legal cluster F*ck for anyone running a folding adapter and forward vertical grip when over 26” in compliance with the old law. Now it goes from “firearm” to AOW from what I’m reading.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

There is a whole thread on it. The main thing seems to be... if your ar pistol has a brace don’t put a vertical fore grip on it. No gangsta grip, no problem. Sirhr

 

[Steel+Killer]

The whole Pistol, SBR, Rifle shit with the ATF is a joke. I will never register anything with the ATF because, one day its legal then the next it's not. I don't need to be turned into a felon overnight because some asshole at the ATF has political motivations from one day to the next. I am sure these stupid laws will prevent the next criminal from committing their next crime.

"Hey Joey what gun did you bring to rob the bank? "I brought my AR with the stabilizing brace" "Ah shit didn't you hear the ATF changed the ruling on those you now have to register them as SBRs" "Ah for fuck sakes turn the van around let me go back and get my legal 16" barreled AR I don't want to shoot anyone with a illegal gun as we rob the bank"

 

[hafejd30]

For me personally I just proceeded with the SBR stamp. It takes away the headache of worrying about what you add to the fore end, the OAL, can I shoulder it, etc etc.

SBR a lower and get whatever uppers you want and run whatever configuration you want with them. Keeping the original of course.

For me $200 for a stamp is a fraction of what I put into my guns and having the SBR will be worth it to ME. Maybe others feel differently

In Michigan an SBR needs to be registered as a pistol. Which is nice because you buy the pistol, leave it in its pistol configuration until stamp comes back, then convert to SBR. Because it’s still a pistol in Michigan my ccw allows me to carry loaded in the vehicle etc just as I do my glock.

Some states you can carry a loaded rifle but Michigan you can’t so this is a nice touch as far as I’m concerned

 

[LawnMM]

I think it's odd we solicit, or even allow, 'opinions' of people at a federal agency to drive an industry with the force of law.

Judges and the judicial branch interpret law not some Poindexter at the ATF.

 

[Veer_G]

And when they rule your lawful, stamp-paid SBR/SBS illegal, then what?

This is law-making by edict and fiat on the part of bureaucrats, and not within the scope of the intent of the Constitution.

 

[Snipe260]

There is a whole thread on it. The main thing seems to be... if your ar pistol has a brace don’t put a vertical fore grip on it. No gangsta grip, no problem. Sirhr

So ur saying I can’t go all al Capone on em?

 

[Stevo86]

So ur saying I can’t go all al Capone on em?

Well u can, just no vertical grip. ?

 

[FS1]

What if you mount it horizontal?

 

[Flyingbullseye]

What if you mount it horizontal?

Just a matter of time until some idiot writes to the ATF and they have to come out with another edict.

 

[Heretoimproveforhunting]

i wouldnt be surprised to learn its gun rights advocates writing them under false pretenses.

 

[Veer_G]

What if you mount it horizontal?

Forget whose it is, but there's at least one weapons light designed for side-mount with an integral mount that allows the shooter to wedge the off-hand thumb and forefinger around it for stability.

You'd be good to go until the ATF illegalizes thumbs and anything out on the business end.

 

[hafejd30]

And when they rule your lawful, stamp-paid SBR/SBS illegal, then what?

This is law-making by edict and fiat on the part of bureaucrats, and not within the scope of the intent of the Constitution.

Then you make the decision:

1) Comply and hand it over
2) Modify to comply
3) Or, Fight for what you want/have/need

I don’t agree that anyone should tell me as a law abiding citizen what I can and can’t have. But I also don’t want or need the headache. I choose to modify and comply. If they take that away then I make my decision then.

I’ll guarantee you there will be much more modifying, complying and fighting for what you want in the years and elections to come. Them going after a sbr or a OAL measurement is the least of my worries. However it is an inch off the mile they intend to take

 

[Nik H]

The new method of measurement is only because of the recent rise of "braces" that are foldable or adjustable for LOP. If you have a fixed length brace, the laws have not changed.

The fact that any of these foldable/adjustable braces haven't gone the way of bump stocks amazes me....I put one on every AR Pistol I own...truly amazing. I just use the angled front grip and no problem for now.

 

[Hollywood 6mm]

That article seems to be coming to some wrong conclusions, unless I am misreading it. They seem to be implying that an AR pistol (no foregrip) with a brace is now an AOW, which is not true. Am I missing something here?

 

[Heretoimproveforhunting]

agree hollywood. i had to go read a better written article to understand what was going on.

 

[Nik H]

If you use a foldable or adjustable brace, the measurement of overall length uses a different reference point. If the barrel is under 16" and the overall length with the new type of brace is <26" AND you add a VFG, then it is an AOW per the existing (and unconstitutional) NFA laws.

The article is one of the worst ones I have read on this subject.

This one is written better

New ATF Ruling

 

[Hollywood 6mm]

If you use a foldable or adjustable brace, the measurement of overall length uses a different reference point. If the barrel is under 16" and the overall length with the new type of brace is <26" AND you add a VFG, then it is an AOW per the existing (and unconstitutional) NFA laws.

The article is one of the worst ones I have read on this subject.

This one is written better

New ATF Ruling

Which is what I suspected (and other people stated) - no VFG, no problem.

 

[hermosabeach]

Simple fix, take the folking mechanism off of your brace

 

[Hollywood 6mm]

Simple fix, take the folking mechanism off of your brace

Or don't run a VFG.