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AW mag help for BR cases

Mnash

Mnash

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Minuteman
Oct 18, 2018
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Just picked up a couple AW mags with HRD gear kits to feed 6BRA through a bighorn TL3. Untouched it fed about 50/50. Sometimes the bolt goes over the top of the round and picks it up about halfway down the case body causing it to jam. I figured if I could open up the feed lips a little the round would sit higher and would have no problem getting picked up, but after tweaking with the feed lips for a bit and even the follower spring nothing seems to be changing. Anyone have a fix?
 
ClamHammer747 said:
Uh? Try running a normal size case in the AWs, they don’t work reliably with little bitch calibers
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Damn. What a prick.

he’s not wrong though. It’s pretty well documented that the BR family of cases don’t feed very well in AW mags even with the spacer kits.

matt, is your bighorn cut for AW? Typically you’d want a 3 lug to run AW reliably to begin with, kinda setting yourself up for headaches by running dashers in an AW with a 2 lug
 
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Yeah it’s cut for an AW. Sheldon had said his runs really well with the same setup so I figured I’d give it a try. I think I have it figured out, there’s about a 5 thou window with the feedlips that works. Too wide and the mag doesn’t fit, too narrow and it won’t feed
 
Single stack mags work better in the bighorns,a friend and I tried every mag possible.
 
Mnash said:
Yeah it’s cut for an AW. Sheldon had said his runs really well with the same setup so I figured I’d give it a try. I think I have it figured out, there’s about a 5 thou window with the feedlips that works. Too wide and the mag doesn’t fit, too narrow and it won’t feed
Click to expand...

Not that I'm the authority on any of this, but I've got mine running well. In my current TL3/MPA rig the 6BRA actually feeds better than Dasher for me. AW mags with HRD kits.

I did a write on on how I tuned/set them up in a thread a while back, my comments and photos start on post #39 in the link below.

www.snipershide.com

Favorite Mags for Bighorn TL3???

I'm collecting up the last few parts for my custom build and was hoping to get some input from fellow TL3 (SA) owners on what magazine would best fit my needs. Context: - Rifle will be mainly used for hunting and shooting steel at the moment. - Bighorn TL3 SA AW Cut - Badger M5 DBM - Looking...
www.snipershide.com www.snipershide.com
 
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FUNCTIONAL said:
see if you can get a taller mag catch. sounds like the mag sits too low in the action. I'd look into that before pulling lips apart on an AW.
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this is the first thing that needs to be addressed with AWs in a 2 lug...get the mag as high/tight to the action as possible if not already done
 
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I ran AW mags with my dasher in a TL3 for a while. I switched to the MDT mags and like them better than anything I've had since I started running dashers several years ago. That being said I never had a problem with the AWs as far as feeding. Here is the link to my original ad, these have been sold. Only linking for the pictures. I trimmed the feed lips back so that the case would come up sooner and had no issues with them.

 
After a couple hours of tweaking I got them running pretty good. Did it exactly like sheldon said. Bent the feed lips out to follow the action cut as close as possible, it's a pretty narrow range so it took some time, now its a jam fit but the mag doesn't move at all once locked in. Also bent the follower spring forward to put more pressure on the case head area. Have about a 1/8" case / bolt head overlap and hasn't missed a round yet.
 
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AW's in 2-lugs are tricky to get to work right, and they are almost always going to require some tweaking. Additionally, based on the geometry of your case, the OAL of your round and the angle/shape of your feed ramp, they will always feed a little differently for everyone. The HRD kit is a solid solution and they did a great job, but everyone needs to understand that there is still further tweaking required.

In saying that, I have found that when tuned properly, DSDF magazines (like the AI AW) feed like butter out of a lot of 2-lug and 3-lug actions! Patience and some tinkering will go a long way with them :)

Just some thoughts,
Josh
 
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A no wiggle fit between the mag and action is key, so your latch has to be right as well as the cut on your action. I've never had to tweak feed lips, but that's bc my mags presented the cases well to my bolt on both the left and right side. After that you just need the right length catch to keep things locked up high.
 
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MDT_Josh said:
AW's in 2-lugs are tricky to get to work right, and they are almost always going to require some tweaking. Additionally, based on the geometry of your case, the OAL of your round and the angle/shape of your feed ramp, they will always feed a little differently for everyone. The HRD kit is a solid solution and they did a great job, but everyone needs to understand that there is still further tweaking required.

In saying that, I have found that when tuned properly, DSDF magazines (like the AI AW) feed like butter out of a lot of 2-lug and 3-lug actions! Patience and some tinkering will go a long way with them :)

Just some thoughts,
Josh
Click to expand...

AWs and a Tempest action are an amazing combination, and it was one of the reasons I went with the Tempest.


Now if only we could get some 12-14rd AWs..... (No, I'm not letting go of that bone...)
 
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Since giving AWs another try in the TL3 they've been running pretty damn well.

Have a regular AI mag with extension for 12rd stages though!
 
LawnMM said:
Since giving AWs another try in the TL3 they've been running pretty damn well.

Have a regular AI mag with extension for 12rd stages though!
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My Tempest+Chassis setup refuses to cooperate with single feed mags other than SAUM mags. I might be able to make it work with a (much) shorter mag catch, but it hasn't been worth the headaches for me to screw with it. Instead, I've practiced reloads, and bugged MDT on a semi-regular basis to make us a 12-14rd AW.
 
Hollywood 6mm said:
My Tempest+Chassis setup refuses to cooperate with single feed mags other than SAUM mags. I might be able to make it work with a (much) shorter mag catch, but it hasn't been worth the headaches for me to screw with it. Instead, I've practiced reloads, and bugged MDT on a semi-regular basis to make us a 12-14rd AW.
Click to expand...

We appreciate the feedback and constant "bugging" is how we gauge what you guys are really after ;) I personally run an AW with my Dasher right now and am a big fan of them! Maybe we'll have some better news for you in 2020 ?‍♂️

Josh
 
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Hollywood 6mm said:
My Tempest+Chassis setup refuses to cooperate with single feed mags other than SAUM mags. I might be able to make it work with a (much) shorter mag catch, but it hasn't been worth the headaches for me to screw with it. Instead, I've practiced reloads, and bugged MDT on a semi-regular basis to make us a 12-14rd AW.
Click to expand...


My tempest is in a krg and runs just as well with aics as aw mags. Absolutely love that action.

Id be in for some 12rd mags for sure. Shouldnt be too hard considering you can get 11 in just fine.
 
MDT_Josh said:
We appreciate the feedback and constant "bugging" is how we gauge what you guys are really after ;) I personally run an AW with my Dasher right now and am a big fan of them! Maybe we'll have some better news for you in 2020 ?‍♂️

Josh
Click to expand...

I've been running 6 Creed since I got my Dasher, but I am about to switch to running 308 and later 6GT with it, so nothing that needs mag kits, thankfully. I do get a kick out of teasing you guys about bigger capacity AWs, but I honestly think you're the only ones in a position (and with the willingness) to do it. The fact that you have done Dasher specific 12rd mags and now 224/SPC pattern mags gives me hope.

FUNCTIONAL said:
My tempest is in a krg and runs just as well with aics as aw mags. Absolutely love that action.

Id be in for some 12rd mags for sure. Shouldnt be too hard considering you can get 11 in just fine.
Click to expand...

Like I said, I am sure it's a tolerance stacking thing with my chassis, mag catch, and action. I've never bothered to screw with it since I already had AWs for it, and didn't really feel the need to mess with it just for the rare 13+ round stage. As you mentioned, it's pretty easy to get 11 in there, and I can feed up to two more off the SAP two round holder if I need it. Every now and then I will do a planned reload on a 12rd stage, but it depends on the situation. Either way, a couple of 12rd AWs wouldn't hurt my feelings.
 
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I run 22BR in a TL3 out of unmodified Magpul AICS mags... feeds 100% butter smooth. Of course, the Magpuls aren't as short or as easy to load as the double stack AW mags.
 
For me, at least, I found AW mags with HRD spacers worked very well for 22-250 in my AIAW. I never tried a 6BR sized cartridge in the AW or AT. I did try those mags in my Curtis Vector with 6 Dasher barrel. They feed well up to the last round then a slight hiccup. I was beginning to think the issue was the action more than the mag? I finally tried the Magpul AICS mags and they work much better. BTW, I've also decided I need to make a slight adjustment to my mag latch on the KMW Sentinel.
 
Hollywood 6mm said:
I've been running 6 Creed since I got my Dasher, but I am about to switch to running 308 and later 6GT with it, so nothing that needs mag kits, thankfully. I do get a kick out of teasing you guys about bigger capacity AWs, but I honestly think you're the only ones in a position (and with the willingness) to do it. The fact that you have done Dasher specific 12rd mags and now 224/SPC pattern mags gives me hope.



Like I said, I am sure it's a tolerance stacking thing with my chassis, mag catch, and action. I've never bothered to screw with it since I already had AWs for it, and didn't really feel the need to mess with it just for the rare 13+ round stage. As you mentioned, it's pretty easy to get 11 in there, and I can feed up to two more off the SAP two round holder if I need it. Every now and then I will do a planned reload on a 12rd stage, but it depends on the situation. Either way, a couple of 12rd AWs wouldn't hurt my feelings.
Click to expand...

Yea i did it more to see if i could. No way im running aics over an Aw. Stage planning goes a long way and sap holders also.
 
MDT_Josh said:
We appreciate the feedback and constant "bugging" is how we gauge what you guys are really after ;) I personally run an AW with my Dasher right now and am a big fan of them! Maybe we'll have some better news for you in 2020 ?‍♂️

Josh
Click to expand...
+1 for 12-14rd AW mags. I need several. I got some of the MDT DSSF mags on Black Friday because the price was so good. If I can give MDT more of my money for AW mags that’s even better.
 
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@MDT_Josh @MDT_OFFICIAL Yes, definitely interested in a 12+ round AW magazine. I shoot factory AI actions, and my local MD loves 12 round stages so I'm always a few seconds behind everyone else who has extended mags and don't have to do a mag change or top off.

Hoping to see some good news on this from you guys at SHOT Show...
 
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samb300 said:
@MDT_Josh @MDT_OFFICIAL Yes, definitely interested in a 12+ round AW magazine. I shoot factory AI actions, and my local MD loves 12 round stages so I'm always a few seconds behind everyone else who has extended mags and don't have to do a mag change or top off.

Hoping to see some good news on this from you guys at SHOT Show...
Click to expand...
Likely won't be SHOT if we did it, probably closer to springtime.
 
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12 round AWs woulda been REAL handy at the NRL finale...prolly 50% of the stages were 12 rounds

usually mag changed after position 1 or just loaded 11 and single fed the last...definitely slows you down a few seconds if time gets tight
 
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MDT_Josh said:
I agree that the AW's are noticeably shorter, but the single feeds are MUCH more forgiving from a design standpoint. What have you found that doesn't work in a DSSF?

Josh
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My Tempest. With my chassis (PDC Custom Gen5 Competition, previously PDC X Project and Gen4 Competition) the mags sit up too high, and the bolt hits the back of the feed lips. Even on my SAUM, the mag lips had to be trimmed down slightly to clear the Tempest bolt (GAP offered that with the Alpha SAUM mags before Alpha went under).

I might be able to swap the mag catch out and get AICS low enough to clear the bolt, but then I'm not sure they'd feed right. Besides, an AW feeds WAY better in my experience than any AICS I have tried.
 
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In for a crate full of 15-16 round AW mags.

12 isn’t that much of an increase as they hold 11 anyway and a sap 2 round holder is super fast to toss that 12th round in if a stage needs it
 
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FUNCTIONAL said:
Agreed...aside from the feeding and easy top loading the big benefit for me is the size. Once we start getting near AICS 10rd I start loosing interest. I picked the tempest for easy AW use and 60deg AI style bolt.
Click to expand...

Same reason I picked it. Mine is actually #20 produced (not counting prototypes) and it's got over 10k rounds on it now between 6 Creedmoor and 6.5 SAUM (and about to be 308) with nary a hitch. The only failures I have ever had were from bad primers (One specific lot of Wolf primers) and an AW mag that had a feed lip get bent up.

Biggest down side is the magazine thing due to how fat the bolt is. That said, I can live with that given how much I love everything else about it.
 
Perfect. Then it’s settled.

@MDT_Josh & @MDT_OFFICIAL

On behalf of all AW mag users. We would like 12rd AW mags with removable base plates and the option to run +2 or +4 round extenders.

99D91841-C151-4446-9749-EF5E0F908582.gif
 
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hic28 said:
Damn. What a prick.

he’s not wrong though. It’s pretty well documented that the BR family of cases don’t feed very well in AW mags even with the spacer kits.

matt, is your bighorn cut for AW? Typically you’d want a 3 lug to run AW reliably to begin with, kinda setting yourself up for headaches by running dashers in an AW with a 2 lug
Click to expand...

Also, this dude is correct. Two lugs don't feed as well. Three is best, you'll have to play with the lips (that's what she said!!!).
 
LOL! Yeah, well, they've been talking about it for a while now. To be fair, they've been a little busy (ACC chassis, JAE700 acquisition, and now this new chassis they're releasing). :D
 
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Hollywood 6mm said:
I love how this thread was completely highjacked from getting dashers running in an AW into us browbeating MDT into making us higher capacity AWs....
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? yeah sorry OP. I hope you get them tweaked right!

Can you push the mag up any when it’s locked in? If your bolt isn’t riding close to the feed lips it sounds like the mag itself isn’t sitting high enough, otherwise it sounds like just opening the feed lips or smoothing them up should get you going.
 
What chassis are you running? Iij may have missed that part? I have 3 AW cut TL3's. They run AW mags flawless in a XLR chassis. They didnt feed right in an MPA.

For 6BR I run a 10rd AICS with PVA kit in an MDT ACC and they run flawless. No issues what so ever.
 
M338 said:
Does the TL3 still work as a control round feed with the AW’s ?
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Mine seems to CRF fairly well, though I've not paid close attention. Seems to be under the extractor when I close the bolt, not having to cam the extractor over the case head with bolt close.
 
padom said:
What chassis are you running? Iij may have missed that part? I have 3 AW cut TL3's. They run AW mags flawless in a XLR chassis. They didnt feed right in an MPA.

For 6BR I run a 10rd AICS with PVA kit in an MDT ACC and they run flawless. No issues what so ever.
Click to expand...
I’m running them in an MPA, and no I can’t push them up any further, They’re locked in tight once they’re in. I finally got it figured out though with some mag spring tweaking and feed lip adjustment. Thanks for the help everyone!
 
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