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AW Mag in Curtis Vector issue with second to last round

_Raining

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Full Member
Minuteman
Feb 14, 2017
439
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It appears that when I try to feed the second to last round in the AW magazine, the last round will nose dive a little and the second to last round will pivot off of that last round and put the nose of the bullet into the right side of the breach.

Any tips?

My AICS mags will cause the bolt to stop if I apply upward pressure on the rear of the magazine (same as with my Defiance). The AW will slow the bolt down a little but I can still force it forward with upward pressure on it. So at this point, I need to fix the AW or have to avoid upward pressure at all costs and use the AICS mags.
 
Probably need to widen or close the lips on the magazine a bit.
 
Agree with Dthomas you likely need to adjust the feed lips. More info would help trouble shoot though.

Has your AW mag always done this, or a recent thing? Have you tried other AW mags? Adjusted the mag catch? How long have you had this rifle? What caliber? Put this together yourself or bought from a 'smith?

Regarding AICS and upward pressure:
  • All AW cut actions leave metal at the front of the mag opening to prevent the narrower AICS mag from over-inserting. With your current set up, when you apply pressure to the AICS mag, the back-end is unsupported and binds against the bolt. The action is stopping the AICS up front, but nothing is stopping it from the rear.
  • Some chassis/stocks will not have this issue as their mag catch opening is smaller and stops AICS mags from over-inserting.
  • For example, I run my Curtis in an MPA chassis. With an out-of-the-box MPA chassis, I experience the same issue- binding against the bolt when applying pressure on an AICS mag.
  • MPA sells a little insert that reduces the size of the mag catch opening. This blocks the mag catch and prevents the magazine from over inserting. With this insert in place, I can now apply full weight of the rifle against the AICS mag and no binding.
  • I've attached a pic to illustrate. (it's not the greatest pic but hopefully you get the idea)
What stock/chassis you running?
Mag Block.jpg
 
Agree with Dthomas you likely need to adjust the feed lips. More info would help trouble shoot though.

Has your AW mag always done this, or a recent thing? Have you tried other AW mags? Adjusted the mag catch? How long have you had this rifle? What caliber? Put this together yourself or bought from a 'smith?

Regarding AICS and upward pressure:
  • All AW cut actions leave metal at the front of the mag opening to prevent the narrower AICS mag from over-inserting. With your current set up, when you apply pressure to the AICS mag, the back-end is unsupported and binds against the bolt. The action is stopping the AICS up front, but nothing is stopping it from the rear.
  • Some chassis/stocks will not have this issue as their mag catch opening is smaller and stops AICS mags from over-inserting.
  • For example, I run my Curtis in an MPA chassis. With an out-of-the-box MPA chassis, I experience the same issue- binding against the bolt when applying pressure on an AICS mag.
  • MPA sells a little insert that reduces the size of the mag catch opening. This blocks the mag catch and prevents the magazine from over inserting. With this insert in place, I can now apply full weight of the rifle against the AICS mag and no binding.
  • I've attached a pic to illustrate. (it's not the greatest pic but hopefully you get the idea)
What stock/chassis you running?

The Curtis Vector is new, I traded a used Trued Up Rem 700 barreled action + $ for it. It was in 260 rem but was rechambered for 6.5 Creedmoor by the guy trying to sell it. It has a proof SS barrel and is in a Manners stock with the gen 2 mini chassis.

From what I can tell, the AW mag is wider then the AICS and thus will bottom out on the Vector action mag cut (mag lip-ish area on the sides of the Vector mag cut). It seems like the spring pressure is not enough to keep the last round from dipping down and the second to last round from pivoting off of it. If you are behind the gun, the second to last is on the left and the last is on the right. So the last dips down and the second to last pivots off of it and the bullet points to the right side of the breach face and gets stuck.

The first, third, 5th, 7th rounds all feed fine as does the 10th, but the spring pressure on #10 is weak and the nose will dip while stripping #9 out and #9 will sort of pivot off the body of 10 since it is now angled down instead of remaining straight. The AW mag seems WAY easier to load to 10 rounds then all my AICS magazines (ARC, AI, Alpha {Alphas fucking bow out when loaded so they are basically paper weights right now}) so I am not sure if a stronger spring might help, and if so who sells aftermarket springs/followers for AW mags (I got it from Area 419).

I had to file down the mag catch on the AW mag a ton, nothing was needed for the AICS so I did not want to mess with the mag catch on the stock since it would make AICS super loose. Right now it takes a small amount of upward pressure to lock in the AW and it is nice and snug. I am not sure opening up the feed lips is a good idea as it would then cause the AW to block the bolt (vs right now I can skip the bolt off the lips and feed over it with the weight of the rifle on the magazine), also the nose dips down on #10 which is yet to be in contact with the feed lips.

Here is a video of what happens:


Later today I can try to get video of the actual thing happening but adjusting the feed lips up in any way will fuck me on running the bolt with upward pressure on the mag, in which case it removes the benefit of the AW over the AICS.
 
There should be no reason that widening or closing the lips on the aw mag prevent it from functioning properly. If it does, there’s something else wrong with it.

This happens a lot with vector and the answer is almost always tweaking the magazine.

It’s typically the front 1/2 or 1/4 of the magazine lips that need tweaking to allow the round to pop out soon enough for the bullet to angle into the chamber.
 
There should be no reason that widening or closing the lips on the aw mag prevent it from functioning properly. If it does, there’s something else wrong with it.

This happens a lot with vector and the answer is almost always tweaking the magazine.

It’s typically the front 1/2 or 1/4 of the magazine lips that need tweaking to allow the round to pop out soon enough for the bullet to angle into the chamber.
I will give it a try tonight but the bolt lugs already contact the feed lips if I rest the rifle on the magazine so I suspect if I widen the feed lips then I will not be able to pull the bolt back after chambering. The front of the lugs contact the rear of the magazine lips when feeding and the back of the bolt lugs contact the feed lips when pulling the bolt back to eject. If I get good momentum I can overcome both but it seems like I am on the razors edge of being able to feed with upward pressure.
 
Looking at your video, you need to bend the front of the lips out slightly. Not much, just a tiny amount will fix that problem. (more likely the left side needs to be bent, try there first)
For comparison, I measure .680" at the front between mine. You know you have fixed the problem when you push that 9th round and it continues straight.

Don't pay any attention to the 10th round dipping. Once you open up the front the 9th round will stay straight and it's normal for the 10th to be pushed down a bit. It will return to its correct position when the 9th round is successfully chambered.

You should not be bending the lips up. Increase the width at the front. Increasing the width should have zero impact on hitting your bolt.
 
Looking at your video, you need to bend the front of the lips out slightly. Not much, just a tiny amount will fix that problem. (more likely the left side needs to be bent, try there first)
For comparison, I measure .680" at the front between mine. You know you have fixed the problem when you push that 9th round and it continues straight.

Don't pay any attention to the 10th round dipping. Once you open up the front the 9th round will stay straight and it's normal for the 10th to be pushed down a bit. It will return to its correct position when the 9th round is successfully chambered.

You should not be bending the lips up. Increase the width at the front. Increasing the width should have zero impact on hitting your bolt.
Well I am sure nobody will be pleased with this but I did not bend anything, I eliminated it :D
I removed the font part of the left side feed lips and the problem is solved. Still longer then the AICS lips so... ya know... it's fineeee.
 
Well I am sure nobody will be pleased with this but I did not bend anything, I eliminated it :D
I removed the font part of the left side feed lips and the problem is solved. Still longer then the AICS lips so... ya know... it's fineeee.
Little late to this party but googled because I’m having same issue on second to last round...got a pic the mage after you fixed it? What did you use to remove that front part?
 
Little late to this party but googled because I’m having same issue on second to last round...got a pic the mage after you fixed it? What did you use to remove that front part?
It has been a while but I believe I still had problems with the mangled magazine (I used a dremel to remove material). I got 2 more mags and the MPA mag adjustment tool and the problem is mostly gone but was still happening every now and then. I don't shoot often anymore and never did PRS so I don't have any recent info on my magazine situation with the Vector.
 
It has been a while but I believe I still had problems with the mangled magazine (I used a dremel to remove material). I got 2 more mags and the MPA mag adjustment tool and the problem is mostly gone but was still happening every now and then. I don't shoot often anymore and never did PRS so I don't have any recent info on my magazine situation with the Vector.

I actually just flared the left lip out on mine slightly and I can’t make it miss now. Runs perfectly.
 
I know this is an old thread but I’m running into the same thing on a different action. This never happened on my deviants because the feed ramp is narrower and kicks the round out of the feed lips prior to the bullet hitting the side of the chamber counterbore.

I’m still working on solutions but essentially we need the round to disengage from the feed lips sooner. So there are 2 options... cut some of the left feed lip off or widen it out.

In the picture I trimmed about 1/4” off the left feed lip with a cutoff wheel and it is feeding that round reliably. This mag has a little too much taper toward the front on the feed lips and the rounds will not seat firmly in lips (they rock). So occasionally the bolt will slide over the top if the back pitches down. Need to get my feed lip tool back from a buddy so I can slightly tweak and get the rounds to make firm contact along the entire lip.

Hope this helps!
 

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