I putting in a 100 yrs range on my land. I want to build a back stop using cross ties. Does anyone know how many I will need to stop a 300 win mag.
- Thread starter Don-n-Texas
- Start date
I would recommend making a frame/wall and then putting dirt or bulk mulch piled 7-10ft high in front.
I have the terrain to my benefit so I can let it hit dirt to spot misses and then smack up into the telephone poles if anything does bounce.
The local schuetzen range has a railroad tie, a foot of caliche base, and then another railroad tie. It’s overkill but if you are going to stack at least two deep it’s worth it to fill with some dirt inbetween the two for free insurance.
The local schuetzen range has a railroad tie, a foot of caliche base, and then another railroad tie. It’s overkill but if you are going to stack at least two deep it’s worth it to fill with some dirt inbetween the two for free insurance.
dirt works really well in a berm . who don't love a hill of dirt
think of all the joy it will bring to you and your family in your very own back yard .
think of all the joy it will bring to you and your family in your very own back yard .
Backstop of RR ties, pile of gravel in front of it. Gravel is your friend for mag calibers and larger.
2 ways to do it. Stack ties and pile dirt behind them. Stack ties and pile dirt in front of them.
4 feet of dirt will stop anything once it's compacted and settled.
Rent a skid steer for a weekend. It's not a huge job.
4 feet of dirt will stop anything once it's compacted and settled.
Rent a skid steer for a weekend. It's not a huge job.
When I had my own place( sold it 7 yrs ago ) I had a bunch of off road tires , I stacked them three wide and thee deep and filled with dirt , then covered with more dirt , that was my 600yrd backstop worked purty good , till the cows started playing king of the hill on it , still held up for the last 4 yrs I was there.
If you put dirt behind the ties, won't you eventually have dirt in front of the ties? And fairly soon if your targets are in the same place all the time.
Better to make a wall, or better a V or C shaped wall sand put and in front of it.
Better to make a wall, or better a V or C shaped wall sand put and in front of it.
Last edited:
- Nov 3, 2010
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My backstop is a horseshoeish shape with dirt in front of the ties.
Better be over built than underbuilt.
Rocks and other things can cause richochets
Rocks and other things can cause richochets
I am sure RR ties won’t be an issue with rifle fire at 100 yds, but I’ve seen handgun rounds bounce off and come back when fired at RR ties also. Some dirt or gravel in front is a good idea.
I like to thank everyone for their input. Yes my family is looking forward to our new range.
Stacked RR ties, by themselves, do a poor job of stopping projectiles, even from a pistol. My former headquarters range had RR ties protecting the mechanisms controlling the turning target frames. Rounds would find their way between the ties and impact the target frames causing enough damage they became useless and non-working as a result. Pistol or rifle projectiles made no difference.
Crossties are great for framing. 300 WM will start going right through them if you don't put dirt in front like others have mentioned. You'll have to repair them over time if you shoot into the ties, but you could just cover them in plywood as they start getting busted.. I've used tires and dirt, trees, and lumber. A berm of dirt is always your safest bet. I most shoot steel with rifle, so keeping the targets maintained is more of a pain than the backstop, which doesn't get used all that much.
Just pile up dirt and go to town. There's no reason to complicate it or make it more expensive to shoot at something that requires replacement. When you get some good erosion from impacts, push up some more dirt.
As I did earlier, I always recommend gravel. Pretty sure it was here, years ago, that I found/read the write up discussing material. There was penetration data for the different types of materials used.
Wood was obviously not good. The study more detailed different types of aggregate. Like Burt said, larger material can create a ricochet problem. The gravel allowed less than 12" of penetration.
Wood was obviously not good. The study more detailed different types of aggregate. Like Burt said, larger material can create a ricochet problem. The gravel allowed less than 12" of penetration.
NRA used to have a free manual that helped with stuff like this, but their materials section seems to be down and the only one I see is their Range Source Book for purchase (under the FAQ section).
May have more info:
rangeservices.nra.org
May have more info:
Range Services
NRA Range Services offers a number of resources to public and private ranges across the country including on-site assistance, educational seminars, grants and much more. Take an online course, learn from the NRA Range Technical Team and find other educational materials and resources.
I prefer dirt/clay to anything else, so built a 15' high berm on my 250 meter range. Let the trees and brush grow on it, for the root system. Just elevate the targets so the bullet impact is in the face. Nothing goes through it.
A dirt pile is way easier to build or rebuild, just a tractor with a front end loader and a bucket is all you need.
A dirt pile is way easier to build or rebuild, just a tractor with a front end loader and a bucket is all you need.
Geez... 15' high? With a tractor???
I started building a berm with a 40hp Kioti and it's taking forever. Real heavy equipment would have been nice.
I work for a tree service, so I rented our 27' Grapple Truck. Sits 11' high at the seat and will lift 1000lbs at 27'. The worst part was driving it back to my woods. I drove it back after 2 weeks of sub zero temps on bare ground and I still have to mow over the damn ruts in the summer lol.
I need to make mine higher and longer though. You always under estimate how long, tall, and how much dirt is actually needed for a big back stop lol
One thing I can add is to take into account 'compression', settling, etc.
We bought a little more than 40+ acres, in the woods basically, and had about 3-3.5 acres cleared, for the house and basically for a "yard" for my (now-passed, but perpetually beloved) 4-legged-son ... and the professional excavating service we hired had specific instructions ... a certain amount of the trees and Saw Palmetto bushes/roots/etc. were to be used to build up a backstop for my firing range. Well the guy in charge was a firearms fanatic and took to the job with gusto. Within a day or two I think it was almost 30 feet high, extremely thick at the base (obviously got thinner as it got higher, like one of the pyramids) and quite wide. It was great. Well, I think it's down to like 16 feet. I'd say it was about 8.5 years since it was built, and it has settled *tremendously* ... no big deal, still more than adequate and every once in a while, my Dad - who likes to play with his tractor anyway - will "backfill" stuff he's dug up randomly onto the back. But the point is, it settled and got smaller and smaller on a significant basis. No big deal if you start waaaaaay more than you need... but if you make it juuuust enough, you might find down the road, it's no longer capable or safe.
And that brings me to the safety lesson of the day - I know everyone here is a professional, knowledgeable, and safe shooter- but on the off-chance someone reading this doesn't realize - you're responsible for every round you fire ... Contrary to what some believe, it's not "OK" to just "try your best" ... When we moved down here, one of the neighbors joked how he hopes he doesn't hit our house when he shoots - uhh, what now?? "Well yeah we go out on the back porch and shoot into the woods, and we generally try and hope that we hit the trees ... hopefully none get through everything and get down your way! But hey, we try ... that's all you gotta do ... all you can do ... you just gotta TRY not to shoot someone or something, and you'll be fine... "
To this day he and his wife don't seem to understand, that's completely false ... My Dad as a (retired) cop and me as a law student tried to explain ... Every round you fire "has your name on it" ... First-day-law-school-students are taught the difference between "Murder 1" (1st Degree Murder - Premeditated Murder) / "Murder 2 (Murder in the 2nd Degree - you didn't go to the dude who's cheating with your wife's house to kill him, but he mouthed off and you then decided to shoot him in the heat of the moment...) / and what would be called Murder 3 but is popularly known as Manslaughter - and one commonly-used scenario to explain Manslaughter is, you're out back shooting a legal gun on your own property, but you don't have a proper backstop or have taken adequate precautions &/or are shooting negligently or in an unsafe manner or you just didn't have the right "range" in your yard ... and one of your bullets accidentally and inadvertently leaves your yard, goes somewhere and hits & kills some innocent. You absolutely didn't mean to kill them, but you were doing something you shouldn't have been doing - in this case, shooting unsafely, - and someone died as a result. Every round that leaves your firearm "has your name on it" ... They honestly just couldn't accept it ... "Nonon ... as long as you try , everything's fine ... it's not my fault if I shoot randomly into the back yard and someone somehow gets hit ... I wasn't aiming at them!"
Yeah, No. Safety Reminder Of The Day: You own and are accountable for every round you fire. Thank You & Have Good Day.
We bought a little more than 40+ acres, in the woods basically, and had about 3-3.5 acres cleared, for the house and basically for a "yard" for my (now-passed, but perpetually beloved) 4-legged-son ... and the professional excavating service we hired had specific instructions ... a certain amount of the trees and Saw Palmetto bushes/roots/etc. were to be used to build up a backstop for my firing range. Well the guy in charge was a firearms fanatic and took to the job with gusto. Within a day or two I think it was almost 30 feet high, extremely thick at the base (obviously got thinner as it got higher, like one of the pyramids) and quite wide. It was great. Well, I think it's down to like 16 feet. I'd say it was about 8.5 years since it was built, and it has settled *tremendously* ... no big deal, still more than adequate and every once in a while, my Dad - who likes to play with his tractor anyway - will "backfill" stuff he's dug up randomly onto the back. But the point is, it settled and got smaller and smaller on a significant basis. No big deal if you start waaaaaay more than you need... but if you make it juuuust enough, you might find down the road, it's no longer capable or safe.
And that brings me to the safety lesson of the day - I know everyone here is a professional, knowledgeable, and safe shooter- but on the off-chance someone reading this doesn't realize - you're responsible for every round you fire ... Contrary to what some believe, it's not "OK" to just "try your best" ... When we moved down here, one of the neighbors joked how he hopes he doesn't hit our house when he shoots - uhh, what now?? "Well yeah we go out on the back porch and shoot into the woods, and we generally try and hope that we hit the trees ... hopefully none get through everything and get down your way! But hey, we try ... that's all you gotta do ... all you can do ... you just gotta TRY not to shoot someone or something, and you'll be fine... "
To this day he and his wife don't seem to understand, that's completely false ... My Dad as a (retired) cop and me as a law student tried to explain ... Every round you fire "has your name on it" ... First-day-law-school-students are taught the difference between "Murder 1" (1st Degree Murder - Premeditated Murder) / "Murder 2 (Murder in the 2nd Degree - you didn't go to the dude who's cheating with your wife's house to kill him, but he mouthed off and you then decided to shoot him in the heat of the moment...) / and what would be called Murder 3 but is popularly known as Manslaughter - and one commonly-used scenario to explain Manslaughter is, you're out back shooting a legal gun on your own property, but you don't have a proper backstop or have taken adequate precautions &/or are shooting negligently or in an unsafe manner or you just didn't have the right "range" in your yard ... and one of your bullets accidentally and inadvertently leaves your yard, goes somewhere and hits & kills some innocent. You absolutely didn't mean to kill them, but you were doing something you shouldn't have been doing - in this case, shooting unsafely, - and someone died as a result. Every round that leaves your firearm "has your name on it" ... They honestly just couldn't accept it ... "Nonon ... as long as you try , everything's fine ... it's not my fault if I shoot randomly into the back yard and someone somehow gets hit ... I wasn't aiming at them!"
Yeah, No. Safety Reminder Of The Day: You own and are accountable for every round you fire. Thank You & Have Good Day.
Tires, conveyor belts, chopped up rubber tires make excellent backstops. A tall dirt berm behind it and gtg.
Until it all goes up in unstoppable flames one day...
Mix in sodium bicarbonate with granulated rubber. But yes it can catch fire. I guess if you truly want to be safe don't do anything and sit inside and watch tv lol.
Thank You
I've been using dirt (about 22' wide x 6' deep x 8' high, with a natural hill 50 yards behind it) and it has stopped several thousand rounds (22lr, 223, 6mm, 6.5mm, 308, 9mm) no problem. I stacked tires behind it just in case, but nothing has made it through. I compacted it with the tractor bucket as I was making the pile. It erodes a little bit during the winter, but nothing significant. If you have enough dirt that is reasonably compactable, you may not need the rail ties.
RR ties down range are not a great idea though there are ways to mitigate any issues they pose.... They can contribute to ricochets. In general, anything hard -landscape timbers, gravel/rock, RR Ties etc...is to be avoided as part of the impact area.
NRA Spec (From the Range Manual) is a 20' berm, 2/1 slope with the front face 24" with no aggregate larger than 1". You might not like it, you might not agree with it- but that's the recognized standard.
I have attended the NRA Range Development Conference several times. Day one, first morning, the hall is FULL of people who paid $800 plus plane ticket, plus hotel etc... to be there. By 2:00 that afternoon half of them are gone. Why? Because they quickly figured out just having a piece of land and a wheelbarrow full of dirt does not a range make and they could never afford to "do it right".
NRA Spec (From the Range Manual) is a 20' berm, 2/1 slope with the front face 24" with no aggregate larger than 1". You might not like it, you might not agree with it- but that's the recognized standard.
I have attended the NRA Range Development Conference several times. Day one, first morning, the hall is FULL of people who paid $800 plus plane ticket, plus hotel etc... to be there. By 2:00 that afternoon half of them are gone. Why? Because they quickly figured out just having a piece of land and a wheelbarrow full of dirt does not a range make and they could never afford to "do it right".
