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Bad Brass or too hot?

Mareshow

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Minuteman
Mar 14, 2012
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So I’m super confused I have these 308 loads I did up 175 gr smk, federal large rifle match primer and 40.5 gr of IMR 4166. Not hot by any means. And now I have four cases (of about 30 fired) that have split like shown. No heavy bolt
Lift, no mushroomed primers, a little flat but that’s it.
So I have some sako game pro factory ammo that I’ve shot many times before and the cases are started to have marks in the same spot.
So I’m assuming the hornady brass from my reloads is a bad batch (this is all the second firing of it)
The slightly bulged case is a hornady
The pierced case is a hornady
The marked case is a sako
but am I also correct in assuming that my chamber is now cooked?

gun is a desert tech srs A2 worh
5EC98BCA-1606-43C3-BD52-33A29ECB88EA.jpeg
5608288A-3C68-47A9-B71D-5888E3AB0716.jpeg
962EB746-6691-4DCE-BA26-905EE8B53E8E.jpeg
FAB80C9D-C941-4426-8DB6-F16FAD994BEB.jpeg
4BA0C730-F4BD-44A6-B373-A45144FF0948.jpeg
 
2217BCE6-BE1A-4E11-8DEA-0BF852E82770.png

Here’s the chart, I’m at 40.5 which is no where near Max load I don’t get it. I’m thinking it’s gotta be bad brass but I’m worried I may have torched this chamber now
 
Do you have a cartridge headspace gauge? if so, check any remainning unfired rounds from this reloading cycle. You may be setting your shoulder back too far, creating an excessive headspace condition where the bolt face is not supporting the case head during firing. You may also want to make a small hook out of a paper clip and see if you can detect a “ridge” inside any fired cases that have not already ruptured for an “incipient” case head separation. At the very least, I’d shitcan all remaking brass from this lot.

Hope this helps.

Regards
JHC
 
Does that rifle run a prefit? Maybe something moved on it that fucked up the headspace?
 
Do you have a cartridge headspace gauge? if so, check any remainning unfired rounds from this reloading cycle. You may be setting your shoulder back too far, creating an excessive headspace condition where the bolt face is not supporting the case head during firing. You may also want to make a small hook out of a paper clip and see if you can detect a “ridge” inside any fired cases that have not already ruptured for an “incipient” case head separation. At the very least, I’d shitcan all remaking brass from this lot.

Hope this helps.

Regards
JHC
It could definitely be possible that this is happening, I FL size all my brass with a hornady die, I don’t have a head space gauge but it’s leaving a mark even with factory brass now which it never did before 🤦🏻‍♂️
 
Don’t see how that could happen you lock the bolt in place in the barrel then tighten the barrel in place. The barrel has a spacer on the end of it and this is a factory barrel
Just wondering because if your getting case head separation after 2 firings either the chamber is running long or your sizing die is severely over sizing. If you have a go, no go gauge check it and rule it out. My best guess is that the headspace is off.
 
Ditto a headspace issue. Especially since it is every round. If it was sporadic, then I’d say load or brass issue. Take a paper clip and make a small 90 degree bend on one end. Put that bent end in your case and scratch the head close to where the others have split. See if you notice any type of lip or anything that feels like it is grabbing. If you google or youtube checking 50bmg ammo for case head separation, it will walk you through that check as well.
 
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Borescope the bore to see if you have torch marks. You probably didn’t anneal your brass and over sized it. Did you feel lots of tension while loading your bullets in the brass?

Weakened brass plus high spike in pressure. That’s what I’m guessing.
 
Not sure of the breech style of a desert tech?........the chamfer at the chamber mouth may have been cut too deep and leaves the case unsupported just forward of the web area. Are other factory rounds splitting or leaving bulges in the same place? If factory ammo is OK then most likely you are re-sizing WAY too far and causing a situation that mimicks excessive HS (although HS is fine) and causes case head separations.

Just my $.02

Ern
 
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Borescope the bore to see if you have torch marks. You probably didn’t anneal your brass and over sized it. Did you feel lots of tension while loading your bullets in the brass?

Weakened brass plus high spike in pressure. That’s what I’m guessing.
No extra tension than usual, it’s not ever case I’ve only had four of about 30 , I’m going to check my sizing die as I’ve never had this issue before, I also usually use a rcbs die, Redding or other and this is my first hornady die .

there is definitely a cut in the chamber now as the factory sako brass had a mark in it , im cleaning the barrel as we speak and I’m going to reassemble it and try again
 
Only 2, the remaining ones were fine. I combined a bunch of factory hornady boxes together for this batch of ammo, I’m almost wondering if I’m going to have a box (20) of them
 
I’m using a hornady resizing die and full length resizing, reason being is some of this ammo was shot through different guns as as I have a couple 308s I don’t want to size the brass specifically to a single gun
How much are you bumping back?
 
reason being is some of this ammo was shot through different guns as as I have a couple 308s I don’t want to size the brass specifically to a single gun
This sounds like the cause of your problems or at the very least, contributing to them. You ALWAYS size brass specifically to a given rifle based on that rifle’s chamber.

I use one sizing die for each rifle i load for as it’s easier vs trying to adjust a single die for multiple rifles chambered for the same cartridge.
 
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When you say “full length sizing,” what does that entail? Are you crushing the brass back down to minimum dimensions with cam over on the press? Adjusting the die such that the ram “kisses” it at full stroke? Adjusting the die such that it pushes the shoulder back to some measurement based on fired brass? All are “full length re-sizing.” You are not telling us what you are doing.
 
image.jpg

I agree its likely a head space issue. Using the exact same components,I recently ran into this and found I was bumping the should too far back Using a Hornady Case length gauge.
image.jpg


Some as far as 1.620. Bought a headspace comparator And according to the comparator I am using, fired brass comes out around 1.640

Since I started paying more attention to headspace and coming closer to 1.630 Which is right in the middle of a suggested sami spec, have not had a case had separation. I know a lot of people say .002 bump, But I don’t wanna run into Chambering or extraction issues with a semi auto

41.5 4166 with a 175 should be okay.

Thats my $.02 Take it for what it’s worth
 
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View attachment 7731682
And according to the gauge I am using fired brass comes out around 1.640

Since I started paying more attention to headspace and coming closer to 1.630 Which is right in the middle of a suggested sami spec, have not had a case had separation.
To clarify, 1.630” is minimum saami for .308 Winchester (1.630-1.634). Are you referring to the measurement on your comparator (which is a reference measurement) or the chamber’s actual length?
 
When you say “full length sizing,” what does that entail? Are you crushing the brass back down to minimum dimensions with cam over on the press? Adjusting the die such that the ram “kisses” it at full stroke? Adjusting the die such that it pushes the shoulder back to some measurement based on fired brass? All are “full length re-sizing.” You are not telling us what you are doing.

View attachment 7731682
I agree its likely a head space issue. Using the exact same components,I recently ran into this and found I was bumping the should too far back Using a Hornady Case length gauge. View attachment 7731690

Some as far as 1.620. Bought a headspace comparator And according to the gauge I am using fired brass comes out around 1.640

Since I started paying more attention to headspace and coming closer to 1.630 Which is right in the middle of a suggested sami spec, have not had a case had separation. I know a lot of people say .002 bump, But I don’t wanna run into Chambering or extraction issues with a semi auto

41.5 4166 with a 175 should be okay.

Thats my $.02 Take it for what it’s worth
Ok so I’m pretty sure this chamber is F’d, I just checked it after cleaning with some factory rounds and it’s leaving some pretty good marks

So it’s a new barrel for me.

also when I full length size it’s just barely a touch, I’ve done it this way in every other rifle I reload with magnum or not with multiple firings on each with our issue. I’m definitely going to find a head space gauge and measure for futures sake but in the mean time it’s a new barrel for me

now I started exploring all my brass (the twice fired, once fired and resized once and here is what I found, multiple brass with little bulges at the base in the same location. These are brass that have never even seen this gun. Very disappointing to say the least. One in hornady these are once fired factory that were shot out of a factory AI AT, two in myself for not properly checking all the brass more thoroughly even though it was factory loaded and three that I didn’t cAtch this sooner, coulda saved myself money for a new barrel. I’m still going to check head space, I’m probably going to switch to Peterson brass for this gun as I have some already.

heres some pics the first of the factory sako ammo the ones on the right are pre cleaning the ones on the left are post cleaning and gun reassembly I’ve noticed that the marks are not as bad after cleaning but still not worth the risk

D6D2B246-795E-40FA-97A0-947072ABA90A.jpeg

The next is a sized and primed cartridge that has only been loaded at factory

F7407BB7-570A-4126-B8EE-8E73B8183A3E.jpeg

There are several like this. Wow is all I can say.

I’m going to invest in a bushing die I think as well and start bushing sizing these now too I think
 
To clarify, 1.630” is minimum saami for .308 Winchester (1.630-1.634). Are you referring to the measurement on your comparator (which is a reference measurement) or the chamber’s actual length?
I was referring to this number, 1.634-.007. Which I referenced off the case size spec. I might be interpreting this wrong.
image.jpg

I sammi chamber spec is 1.630-1.640

image.jpg


So excuse me if I misspoke and welcome a correction.

Setting My headspace longer I haven’t run into a case at separation since. To clarify fired brass comes out of my chamber at 1.640 ish, And I aim for 1.630 when I size. Which is .008-.010 longer(edited) in some cases compared to the case length gauge I was using before I bought the comparator.
 
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View attachment 7731682
I agree its likely a head space issue. Using the exact same components,I recently ran into this and found I was bumping the should too far back Using a Hornady Case length gauge. View attachment 7731690

Some as far as 1.620. Bought a headspace comparator And according to the comparator I am using, fired brass comes out around 1.640

Since I started paying more attention to headspace and coming closer to 1.630 Which is right in the middle of a suggested sami spec, have not had a case had separation. I know a lot of people say .002 bump, But I don’t wanna run into Chambering or extraction issues with a semi auto

41.5 4166 with a 175 should be okay.

Thats my $.02 Take it for what it’s worth
That is likely your problem.
 
I was referring to this number, 1.634-.007. Which I referenced off the case size spec. I might be interpreting this wrong.
View attachment 7731705
I sammi chamber spec is 1.630-1.640

View attachment 7731707

So excuse me if I misspoke and welcome a correction.

Setting My headspace longer I haven’t run into a case at separation since. To clarify fired brass comes out of my chamber at 1.640 ish, And I aim for 1.630 when I size. Which is .008-.010 longer(edited) in some cases compared to the case length gauge I was using before I bought the comparator.
Saami chamber spec for .308 is 1.630-1.634. Saami spec for 7.62 Nato is 1.635-1.640. That said, ive seen a variety of chamber lengths over the years within that range irrespective of the stamp on the barrel.

I use Forster’ headspace gauge set to determine a given .308 or 7.62 Nato rifle’s headspace then stick the applicable gauge in my Hornady comparator, zero the comparator then adjust the die until the comparator reads -.002 ( the shoulder is .002” less than the actual gauge that corresponds to my rifle’s chamber length).

If you are bumping .010” after every firing that’s too much IMO. I would not continue to size your brass like that as it will likely shorten brass life(and elevates case head separation risk).

You just need .002-.004 at most.
 

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Saami chamber spec for .308 is 1.630-1.634. Saami spec for 7.62 Nato is 1.635-1.640. That said, ive seen a variety of chamber lengths over the years within that range irrespective of the stamp on the barrel.

I use Forster’ headspace gauge set to determine a given .308 or 7.62 Nato rifle’s headspace then stick the applicable gauge in my Hornady comparator, zero the comparator then adjust the die until the comparator reads -.002 ( the shoulder is .002” less than the actual gauge that corresponds to my rifle’s chamber length).

If you are bumping .010” after every firing that’s too much IMO. I would not continue to size your brass like that as it will likely shorten brass life.

You just need .002-.004 at most.
Appreciate that advice.
 
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Remove all doubt re headspace with a Whidden gauge. They're available from a few places. With this gauge, you can see the headspace of a fired case and set your size die to bump back .002" with a high degree of confidence. Then, after resizing, you can trim to overall length.

I also have Wilson gages (their spelling) for 9mm and .223. They're great for insuring loaded rounds will chamber in a semi-auto, but, for precise determination of headspace and OAL, the Whidden gauge and a good caliper set the bar.
 
Ok so I’m pretty sure this chamber is F’d, I just checked it after cleaning with some factory rounds and it’s leaving some pretty good marks

So it’s a new barrel for me.

also when I full length size it’s just barely a touch, I’ve done it this way in every other rifle I reload with magnum or not with multiple firings on each with our issue. I’m definitely going to find a head space gauge and measure for futures sake but in the mean time it’s a new barrel for me

now I started exploring all my brass (the twice fired, once fired and resized once and here is what I found, multiple brass with little bulges at the base in the same location. These are brass that have never even seen this gun. Very disappointing to say the least. One in hornady these are once fired factory that were shot out of a factory AI AT, two in myself for not properly checking all the brass more thoroughly even though it was factory loaded and three that I didn’t cAtch this sooner, coulda saved myself money for a new barrel. I’m still going to check head space, I’m probably going to switch to Peterson brass for this gun as I have some already.

heres some pics the first of the factory sako ammo the ones on the right are pre cleaning the ones on the left are post cleaning and gun reassembly:

View attachment 7731708
The next is a sized and primed cartridge that has only been loaded at factory
You posted this twice.
 
Upon further review I checked all my brass

here’s the results:
Five boxes of hornady all with some sort of bulge on the side

this consisted of three boxes of hornady white tail 150 gr, one box of superformance and one box of match.

two boxes of Berger factory with lapua brass no issues

five boxes of federal match premium no issues

two boxes of nosler match no issues

the one box of sako I have fired has no issues and this new box has issues but I would attribute that to the existing chamber damage. All previous factory was fired before any reloads so no issues there
 
Your die is crushing that brass down. Do you feel resistance when you are resizing your brass? Like on the upstroke do you feel a drag or hard resistance?

Send your barrel to a GS before saying it’s done for.
 
Your die is crushing that brass down. Do you feel resistance when you are resizing your brass? Like on the upstroke do you feel a drag or hard resistance?

Send your barrel to a GS before saying it’s done for.
The brass I’m mentioning is factory nothing I’ve reloaded yet. I’m not crushing it and would fully admit that had I found evidence of that
 
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Looks like headspace problems to me. Oversizing? Get a headspace comparator and check your fired brass from the rifle you're loading for vs resized brass. 0.004" is all the clearance you need for reliable feeding. Some people will tell you 0.002" is plenty (and they are probably right).

The brighter rings near the case head could indicate the brass is stretched too thin there. Try the paper clip check that others already mentioned.

If you're getting brass that is stretched thin there on the first firing of a factory load your rifle may have a very long headspace. You will not be able to safely load ammunition for that rifle and a tight chambered rifle with the same die settings. Brass will have to be kept separate for the different guns, if the long headspace rifle is safe to keep firing at all.

When you use the headspace comparator keep in mind that they are not manufactured with particularly tight tolerances (at least mine isn't). They're useful for comparing things that are measured on that same instrument. You can't compare your measurements to SAAMI specs, etc.

Having brass that was fired in different guns makes it harder to diagnose the problem. Maybe it's not a problem with this rifle, but one of the other ones?
 
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How much is the “factory brass” growing upon firing?

And by “factory” do you mean you bought a bag of brass and loaded it with your secret sauce recipe? Or, factory loaded ammo fired and resized?
 
Your posts are very confusing. Trying to determine if this is factory new or reloaded ammunition is not clear at times.
This

@Mareshow and I have noticed this with your other posts elsewhere on here. You’re all over the place talking about the barrel, factory ammo, your sized brass, fired/unfired brass all types of brass from multiple different rifles, lol.

You also mention that you’ve been sizing your brass “just a touch” for years - what exactly does that mean in context of shoulder bump?

You need to organize your thoughts better and be more clear in your presentation of those thoughts.
 
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How much is the “factory brass” growing upon firing?

And by “factory” do you mean you bought a bag of brass and loaded it with your secret sauce recipe? Or, factory loaded ammo fired and resized?
Not sure I'll have to check that. By factory I mean I purchased factory loaded ammo and the case bubbles I found were all from those. Not resized. not reloaded. by factory I mean factory, by reloads I mean reloads.

The only reloads that have done this are 1 fired brass where the original firing was a factory purchased cartridge. not put together by me.

Apologies for being unclear I'll back up to the beginning.

I first noticed this issue when firing my load development reloads. These cases were once fired (I buy factory loaded ammo because for the cost of brass up here its cheaper (and more fun) if I get to shoot it once. The seating depth for these isn't dictated by chamber but instead by magazine length. I ladder test for load development first by jumping up half a grain at a time (usually starting about 10% above minimum recommended load) then Honing in my load in .2 gr increments till I find the preferred one. I'll try several bullet and powder combinations during this. The first instance of this happening was at 40.5 gr of IMR 4166 with a 175 gr SMK.

Now all of this Hornady brass was once fired in the AI AT originally but FL sized which I then used for load development in the DT. I don't have a measurement for how much of a shoulder bump this brass got because quite frankly I've never measured or had the tools to measure. How I was taught to reload is keep it simple and the 1/4 to 1/2 MOA results I've been getting have been adequate for my uses. The process I go by for FL sizing using is set the die by using the locking ring. This position is to raise the shell holder, touch the base of the die and then back it up a 1/4 turn and lock in place with the set screw on the locking ring. That way its in the same place every time. I realize I could definitely get more technical and wanting to try some PRS next year, I probably should look at neck tension and shoulder bumping more closely. I've sized all my brass this way from .223, 6.5x47 Lapua, 6.5 Creedmoor, 260 Remington, 300 win mag, 300 PRC, 300 norma and 338 Lapua and never had an issue like this before (I understand that just because I didn't experience an issue doesn't mean there isn't a problem).

Once I started the thread on here I then went into an in depth analysis of all my brass, I checked the inside of cases with the paper clip, inspected ALL brass, once fired, and twice fired. The ONLY ones I could find with issues prior to my chamber being damaged were the Hornady brass. Which I believe the majority were damaged in the AI (if not all). These were all factory cartridges that were purchased in a store and not reloaded.

Where my problems originally stemmed from I believe was the AI rifle. I think the headspace on that rifle was indeed long as some of you had said on here, and I never noticed the brass being damaged. I also will say I never checked thoroughly enough because it was factory brass.

That inaction cost me the chamber on my DT. As it has a definite line on it that will damage brass from here on out.

Some of this brass was from my previous 308 rifle (an AI AT) which I hadn't noticed any issues (doesn't mean it wasn't happening.)

I think going on from here I'm going to throw out all the brass fired in the AI ( I don't want to take the risk) and buy new. This definitely opened my eyes to head spacing/ shoulder movement and I'm going to keep my eye out for that going forward.

I also think that @TheNatural21 is correct in saying that I can't use the brass from the AI in anything else. I'll be sad throwing out 200 pieces of brass. Good thing I just have the DT left.
 
Not sure I'll have to check that. By factory I mean I purchased factory loaded ammo and the case bubbles I found were all from those. Not resized. not reloaded. by factory I mean factory, by reloads I mean reloads.

The only reloads that have done this are 1 fired brass where the original firing was a factory purchased cartridge. not put together by me.

Apologies for being unclear I'll back up to the beginning.

I first noticed this issue when firing my load development reloads. These cases were once fired (I buy factory loaded ammo because for the cost of brass up here its cheaper (and more fun) if I get to shoot it once. The seating depth for these isn't dictated by chamber but instead by magazine length. I ladder test for load development first by jumping up half a grain at a time (usually starting about 10% above minimum recommended load) then Honing in my load in .2 gr increments till I find the preferred one. I'll try several bullet and powder combinations during this. The first instance of this happening was at 40.5 gr of IMR 4166 with a 175 gr SMK.

Now all of this Hornady brass was once fired in the AI AT originally but FL sized which I then used for load development in the DT. I don't have a measurement for how much of a shoulder bump this brass got because quite frankly I've never measured or had the tools to measure. How I was taught to reload is keep it simple and the 1/4 to 1/2 MOA results I've been getting have been adequate for my uses. The process I go by for FL sizing using is set the die by using the locking ring. This position is to raise the shell holder, touch the base of the die and then back it up a 1/4 turn and lock in place with the set screw on the locking ring. That way its in the same place every time. I realize I could definitely get more technical and wanting to try some PRS next year, I probably should look at neck tension and shoulder bumping more closely. I've sized all my brass this way from .223, 6.5x47 Lapua, 6.5 Creedmoor, 260 Remington, 300 win mag, 300 PRC, 300 norma and 338 Lapua and never had an issue like this before (I understand that just because I didn't experience an issue doesn't mean there isn't a problem).

Once I started the thread on here I then went into an in depth analysis of all my brass, I checked the inside of cases with the paper clip, inspected ALL brass, once fired, and twice fired. The ONLY ones I could find with issues prior to my chamber being damaged were the Hornady brass. Which I believe the majority were damaged in the AI (if not all). These were all factory cartridges that were purchased in a store and not reloaded.

Where my problems originally stemmed from I believe was the AI rifle. I think the headspace on that rifle was indeed long as some of you had said on here, and I never noticed the brass being damaged. I also will say I never checked thoroughly enough because it was factory brass.

That inaction cost me the chamber on my DT. As it has a definite line on it that will damage brass from here on out.

Some of this brass was from my previous 308 rifle (an AI AT) which I hadn't noticed any issues (doesn't mean it wasn't happening.)

I think going on from here I'm going to throw out all the brass fired in the AI ( I don't want to take the risk) and buy new. This definitely opened my eyes to head spacing/ shoulder movement and I'm going to keep my eye out for that going forward.

I also think that @TheNatural21 is correct in saying that I can't use the brass from the AI in anything else. I'll be sad throwing out 200 pieces of brass. Good thing I just have the DT left.
You got rid of the AI rifle and just have the DT now? You might have solved your problem without trying to.

Your method is similar to what I used to do too. If you only have tight chambers you might be pretty close to properly sizing, but theres a good chance you're working the brass more than you need to. Measuring and bumping the shoulder only enough to chamber the round reliably really increases the life of the brass, whether it makes a difference on target or not.

Having a rifle with a properly sized chamber sure helps too. I'm surprised that an AI would have a problem there. If you still have any unsized brass that was fired in the AI, or if you sold it to a shooting buddy, it might be a good idea to check the dimensions when your new headspace comparator comes in the mail. If it confirms the long headspace theory you'll have some added peace of mind.
 
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Don't take this wrong. Where are you from and is English your primary language? If it's not well all cut you a little more slack. Still though, your thoughts and description is not well presented.

My guess is you have a few issues that will persist if you continue on the current path.

Running multiple small lots of factor or reloaded ammo is a recipe for disaster if you aren't comparing it to as fired size so you resize correctly.
Annealing can help this but it can still be a problem.
If loading bulk ammo its not as much of an issue for something like an AR.
Load performance will vary brass to brass also because of internal size etc.

Headspace comparator is a referenced measurement not an absolute.

Hope this helps.
 
No amount of annealing is going to save CHS from oversizing. Annealing and CHS are completely unrelated, unless you heated the case head, and made it soft. Then annealing could cause you to blow the case head off.

I have seen a chamber that would close on a field gage +.002 have brass last three firings bumping .007. There is more than one bad thing happening here, thus compounding the problems.
 
I use this tool from Innovate Reloading:

01A84944-16D3-4618-9663-775D5179919C.png

That said, I started to have premature signs of impending case head separation with my last run of 280AI has hunting rounds. A preliminary measuring with the above tool shows that I had erroneously bumped the shoulder .009” 😳 instead of my normal .001-.002

EF459F7D-EDD8-457E-B4BA-FCBC6183FD2E.jpeg

Obviously I am vexed at how I made such a rookie mistake and grateful to not have had any actual separation or cracking. My current guess is that I forgot to use the Redding Competition Shell Holder that I spec-ed for this rifle. I have not rechecked my head space yet but I do put witness marks when I install my barrels and nothing has moved.

Part of my reloading process is snapping pictures of powder used, weight etc. as I double check. This also gives me a reference to look back on should there be an issue. The sizing process will now get the same treatment. Match grade 280AI is just too expensive to be toasting it prematurely........
 
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And there it is.......

Base of the die to the shellholder.

Killer of brass and the biggest rookie mistake since the first rockchucker was sold. You need to buy the right gauges and actually learn to use them.
 
No amount of annealing is going to save CHS from oversizing. Annealing and CHS are completely unrelated, unless you heated the case head, and made it soft. Then annealing could cause you to blow the case head off.

I have seen a chamber that would close on a field gage +.002 have brass last three firings bumping .007. There is more than one bad thing happening here, thus compounding the problems.
Agreed and that's not what I was trying to get across.
 
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You got rid of the AI rifle and just have the DT now? You might have solved your problem without trying to.

Your method is similar to what I used to do too. If you only have tight chambers you might be pretty close to properly sizing, but theres a good chance you're working the brass more than you need to. Measuring and bumping the shoulder only enough to chamber the round reliably really increases the life of the brass, whether it makes a difference on target or not.

Having a rifle with a properly sized chamber sure helps too. I'm surprised that an AI would have a problem there. If you still have any unsized brass that was fired in the AI, or if you sold it to a shooting buddy, it might be a good idea to check the dimensions when your new headspace comparator comes in the mail. If it confirms the long headspace theory you'll have some added peace of mind.
That’s correct I sold the AI and let the now owner know of my issues

I’m going to order a new barrel and see if the problems persist.
 
Remove all doubt re headspace with a Whidden gauge. They're available from a few places. With this gauge, you can see the headspace of a fired case and set your size die to bump back .002" with a high degree of confidence. Then, after resizing, you can trim to overall length.

I order one in 6.5 cm from Brownells (free Edge Member 2 day shipping) and a custom one for my 280AI from Whidden directly. Sent off my Go-gauge yesterday. 6-8 weeks on that one. Before mailing it, I double-checked my rifle’s headspace. As suspected, no change.

These will be nice for double-checking on the fly with no setup.....Thanks for the tip!
 
Remove all doubt re headspace with a Whidden gauge. They're available from a few places. With this gauge, you can see the headspace of a fired case and set your size die to bump back .002" with a high degree of confidence. Then, after resizing, you can trim to overall length.

I also have Wilson gages (their spelling) for 9mm and .223. They're great for insuring loaded rounds will chamber in a semi-auto, but, for precise determination of headspace and OAL, the Whidden gauge and a good caliper set the bar.
I received the Whidden 6.5 cm Case Gauge today.

A strange twist though. The Forster Go-Gauge that I used to set my barrel measured -.003” SAMMI on their Gauge.

I called and spoke to John. His recommendation was that I send both their Case Guage and the Forster Go-Guage to him for inspection. He said is was a 50/50 chance that it was their Gauge or the Forster.😳

I have to say I found that distressing say the least. I wonder if Forster would feel the same way? I just assumed that tools like these were held to a very high QC regiment that would include multiple checks and verifications before they went out the door.

Less than one hour after receiving the tool it was package to go right back out the door, on my dime......Frustrating.
 
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Whidden also claimed my Manson 280AI Go-Guage is also +.0045 over SAMMI specs😳. l spoke at length with Manson & Forster.

Suffice to say, I canceled the Whidden Case Gauge .280AI order and returned the 6.5 CM to Brownells. Ugh....

Ordered the comparators from Short Action Customs instead.
 
Whidden also claimed my Manson 280AI Go-Guage is also +.0045 over SAMMI specs😳. l spoke at length with Manson & Forster.

Suffice to say, I canceled the Whidden Case Gauge .280AI order and returned the 6.5 CM to Brownells. Ugh....

Ordered the comparators from Short Action Customs instead.
Interesting! My Hornady comparator said my forster 308 go gauge was 0.004" shorter than SAAMI, but I know that tool is only good for comparing rather than an absolute measurement. I thought those widden gauges would be better the way people talk about them.

The SAC comparator looks nice.
 
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