I have been looking at the 28 nosler and the 338LM and it seems they cost about the same to produce ammo for but the barrel life of the 28 nosler is quite a bit less. I know there are tons more choices so is there something that would be recommended instead I should look at? I would prefer barrel life to be >1500 rounds and components not impossible to find.
- Thread starter SleepDoc
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30 Nosler with 225's/.77BC. Long barrel and 3000 fps will do nicely. Or load Warner Flatlines with .85 BC at 3100 fps??? I've got almost 1500 rounds out of my 30-375R which has slightly less capacity and it shoots great.
Well, there's always the 300 norma or the 30 nosler. Or you could neck down the 338 lapua to 30 caliber (kinda what the norma is. They are all very close in terms of performance out to the distances you are interested in. The link below lays out the ballistics and some comparisons for each. I went through this exercise not to long ago which lead me to go with a choice for 338 lapua improved. I think its cheaper IMO to load for the lapua and not as difficult to get your hands on the lapua cases which are readily available from numerous sources. The alternative choices for brass can make availability spotty and in many cases more expensive. They will all "get you there" in terms of performance however. If you want the latest botique cartridge there ya go, but frankly my 338AI outperforms them Imo.
https://www.cleckner.co/300-norma-mag-vs-338-lapua-vs-30-nosler/
https://www.cleckner.co/300-norma-mag-vs-338-lapua-vs-30-nosler/
The 338 AI gets you 375 Cheytac ballistics minus the energy. 338AI with Berger300's vs 375CT with Sierra 350's are pretty much a tie.
338 AI gets you close to 3000 fps with Berger 300's or 3200 fps with Flatline 256's. Brass lasts 10-20 firings too
Good for 2500 yards
338 AI gets you close to 3000 fps with Berger 300's or 3200 fps with Flatline 256's. Brass lasts 10-20 firings too
Good for 2500 yards
So far, I've only been able to manage 2900fps with the berger 300's and still maintain accuracy. The 277 cutting edge do quite well at 3000fps. Just got some flatlines to play with. 3200 fps would be fantastic as it would keep me supersonic all the way in. But yep, 2500 seems to be the limit with repeatable accuracy. Sure is fun screwing around with this stuff
Ok I think I will have to exclude the 338 cause I don't want to buy a xl action. I have a long action sitting around that I was going to use for something else but think I will use it for this rifle instead. Is the bighorn long action enough for using 225gr eld-m's with a 300 norma?
Absolutely. Why do you think it isn't?
You just need a Lapua bolt face for the Norma cartridges. If you have that, you are set.
I use a min taper 40 degree .338 Norma Mag Improved for the ranges you are talking. Berger 300s at 2925 with a 28" Bartlein and I can load from an AICS magazine. I don't have my range card in front of me but it is right around 16 mils to 2k yards. My smith pointed me to the Norma as a more precise alternative to the Lapua, and the results have been incredible. I will say that the mass of a big .338 projectile is much appreciated when trying to spot hits at 2k+.
Or you could do a 338 Edge and stay with a standard long action. Mine shoots 285 ELD-Ms at 2970fps (30" barrel). Still supersonic and grouping well at 2000 yards. I went this this specifically to stay away from the XL actions.
I have no idea what performs at 2500 yards. I think mine goes transsonic around 2100. Working the pits at a match, the 7mms became very difficult for people past about 1700 and the 30s were subsonic not much further, only the 338s stayed supersonic to 2000. But nobody had a 300 Norma or anything like that.
I contacted bighorn and they said there is not enough material to safely make a .585 bolt face so will have to buy a new action anyway.
We shoot simple 300wm out to 2k with reasonably repeatable accuracy. But 300norma would be your answer!
300 rum, edge, the 300 Norma or 338 Norma.
xdeano
xdeano
If you want to stay with a standard magnum boltface, you are looking at 338 Edge, or a 30 cal version running 230 Bergers @ 3,000-3,100 fps.
I love my 338 L.M. Improved, I'm looking at 300 Norma and 338 Norma Improved - but they require a .338 Lapua boltface and action.
Jeffvn
I love my 338 L.M. Improved, I'm looking at 300 Norma and 338 Norma Improved - but they require a .338 Lapua boltface and action.
Jeffvn
So far, I've only been able to manage 2900fps with the berger 300's and still maintain accuracy. The 277 cutting edge do quite well at 3000fps. Just got some flatlines to play with. 3200 fps would be fantastic as it would keep me supersonic all the way in. But yep, 2500 seems to be the limit with repeatable accuracy. Sure is fun screwing around with this stuff
As an update, I've bumped up my load to push a 256 flatline with 102 grs of Retumbo making 3200 fps out of a 32" Kreiger which keeps me supersonic just a few feet shy of 2500 yds. Keeps me up with the friends running their cheytacs. Like Jeffvn, I've been very pleased with the performance & downrange results of the 338AI.
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When I burn out my stock .338 LM barrel, I may go with something longer in the .338 AI. Minimal changes to my loading tools and a decent gain in velocity and stability for those Flatlines. I'm at 2945 fps now with my stock 26" barrel, which is nice, but more is better, lol!
You probably don't get occasional hangfires and the brass lasts 3-4 times longer, righto?
Leahi is going to be coming out with a new 338 bullet(s) that are going to give the one flatline choice a run for their money I believe and at less cost so stay tuned. They currently have a 245 grainer but that is just too light IMO. I'm keeping my fingers crossed & hoping it'll be a bit heavier than the flatline. I've seen some fantastic results with their 375's, hoping the new 338 will be as sucessful!
Ignition has been very reliable, no hang fires or such (215 magnum match). As to brass life, time will tell. I'm still on the original cases (lapua) and they have been through "hell & back" through the process of load development & fireforming with 300 bergers & smk's, 277 CE and now flatlines. Some cases took a beating with hot loads "of discovery" through that with marks and swipes etc but all cases through 4 reloadings so far are doing well (primer pockets still tight, etc). Cases get annealed after each firing (AMP annealer). Case stretch is almost negligible but thats par for improved cases. Went out the other day & got some very satisfying steel hits @ 2500 (36" target), 2000 (24" target) & an 18 incher mile target with the flatline load above and out of 20 cases only one had a very slight ejector mark, some very light swipes on a couple others. I also started from the beginning with a side by side test of 50 Peterson cases. 3 did not survive the fireforming following a hydro form session (Peterson does not recommend fireforming their cases so naturally I had to try it lol). Interestingly enough though, the remaining 47 cases have performed well since then. All the lapua cases did well but are more difficult to hydo form, they are much tougher case shoulders & bodies in IMO but I'm also suspecting the Peterson brass is actually tougher in the Web area than the lapua are. Still farting around with loads but this has been a fun journey. By the time this barrel is gone I'm sure I'll have the perfect load lol....
Yeah, my friend and I had hangfires in both our 375CT's about every 10 shots, maybe it was our Lawton actions??? Friggen Jamison cases lasted 3 firings if we were lucky. That was with 350's at 3150fps out of a 32" barrel.
I should have done what you and Jeff did.
I should have done what you and Jeff did.
I'm unfamiliar with the Lawton actions. Everybody I know are running Stiller Tac 408's in their 375's. I'm sure the problem is fixable, firing pin dragging possibly? The 375 is a great round IMO & alot of fun to shoot, wish I owned one. If I ever build one I'm thinking I'd go 338/375, essentially a Snipetac without the "improved part". You're right about the Jamison cases though. In my observation, the Peterson 375 cases are giving good service & probably cost less. Good luck with the ignition issues, I'm sure it's a problem with a solution!
Had you tried the Peterson .408 brass yet/
This was way back 7-8 years ago. Those 375's long since gone. But back then others were having ignition problems too, I chalked it up to trying to ignite 132 grains of Retumbo with 215M primers.
I just shoot my 30-375RPR with 225's at 2960, it's based off the Ruger 375R case. It shoots crazy good but blows in the wind a heck of a lot more than 375CT. My current group of friends don't shoot ELR so...
I just shoot my 30-375RPR with 225's at 2960, it's based off the Ruger 375R case. It shoots crazy good but blows in the wind a heck of a lot more than 375CT. My current group of friends don't shoot ELR so...
Looks like 375CT has come a long way. I'll keep the RWS primers and Peterson cases in the back of my mind.
I heard rumor back then that Federal had a 216 primer with more blast that wouldn't be released to the public but that did me no good.
I got 870 to ignite pretty well with it's high load density but that is some dirty and temp sensitive crap.
Right after I sold the 375 it occurred to me to try a duplex load with a faster powder close to the primer, a post ignition booster.
Nah, I'm sold, 338AI looks like a good one, maybe someday. Less powder, less recoil, good fps and almost the BC with the solids.
I should try those 198 Flatlines in my 9 twist 30-375R. Probably get 3100 fps.
I heard rumor back then that Federal had a 216 primer with more blast that wouldn't be released to the public but that did me no good.
I got 870 to ignite pretty well with it's high load density but that is some dirty and temp sensitive crap.
Right after I sold the 375 it occurred to me to try a duplex load with a faster powder close to the primer, a post ignition booster.
Nah, I'm sold, 338AI looks like a good one, maybe someday. Less powder, less recoil, good fps and almost the BC with the solids.
I should try those 198 Flatlines in my 9 twist 30-375R. Probably get 3100 fps.
No ELR!?!?!? Steve123 ... I think you need new friends.
You are correct, 3,200fps w/ Flatline 256s is spicy on pressure and the brass isn't going to last long. I ran mine @ 3,100 node w/ no pressure in Vegas in the summer.
Jeffvn
You are correct, 3,200fps w/ Flatline 256s is spicy on pressure and the brass isn't going to last long. I ran mine @ 3,100 node w/ no pressure in Vegas in the summer.
Jeffvn
The one friend I had with the other 375 lost interest and moved away. 2 years ago we had a new year's day party with one of the things to do being a shot or two at 1 mile with my 6.5 Saum on a big buffalo steel. There were probably 40 people there and only five people shot the rifle. We did hit the steel often, just couldn't see hits or hear them and didn't know how well we did till we drove up. I can't even talk the one friend who hit the most to buy a regular long range rifle???!!! Also I sold my old 6x47 to another friend, it's hard to get him to shoot it and he lives at his own shooting range.
I'm always open to invites, hint
LOL subtle I like that... PM Invitation sent... ELR time to shoot!
Jeff,
I got a message from you last night, and responded. Saw your post today and went back to inbox, your message and my response is lost in the matrix somewhere???
Please email me at [email protected]
Thanks
I got a message from you last night, and responded. Saw your post today and went back to inbox, your message and my response is lost in the matrix somewhere???
Please email me at [email protected]
Thanks
interweb weirdness taking over... done.
