I remember seeing it mentioned here at one time but I couldnt find it after searching. I think it was Chad that said he does it. Any thoughts on chambering without the use of a live pilot. Perhaps Chad might chime in. The reason I ask is because when I recently ordered in a reamer I forgot to get a set of bushings with it and the one that came with the reamer is too big so if I thought I could get by without it then thats what Ill do.
Gunsmithing chambering without a pilot
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Re: chambering without a pilot
i wouldn't do it without a RIGID holder and a tailstock that was absolutely dead nuts aligned.
edit: and by tailstock aligned, not just height and side to side but the ram travel needs to be parallel too.
i wouldn't do it without a RIGID holder and a tailstock that was absolutely dead nuts aligned.
edit: and by tailstock aligned, not just height and side to side but the ram travel needs to be parallel too.
Re: chambering without a pilot
I know it is a pain and stressfull to wait(I just got done with a wk wait on Dave for a reamer that wouldn't cut right while he ground me a new one, geez I love that company
) but I can assure you waiting a week for the correct pilot and the expense is alot less than having to replace that blank you are pondering cramming an unpiloted reamer into!!!!
Cutting a chamber with a fixed pilot reamer is one thing, cutting a chamber without a pilot on a reamer designed for such is another.......Just sayin
YMMV
Also what that studmuffin 300 said....LOL
I know it is a pain and stressfull to wait(I just got done with a wk wait on Dave for a reamer that wouldn't cut right while he ground me a new one, geez I love that company
Cutting a chamber with a fixed pilot reamer is one thing, cutting a chamber without a pilot on a reamer designed for such is another.......Just sayin
YMMV
Also what that studmuffin 300 said....LOL
Re: chambering without a pilot
Yes, you CAN chamber a barrel successfully w/o a pilot on the tool.
As Robert mentioned it requires a few things to be checked, double checked, and then checked again.
If your grabbing your reamer with a tap wrench and "going for it" then I wish you well. The reality is the tool is going to grab, rip the wrench from your hand, and probably break something. In fact, count on it breaking something.
If you have one of the so called "floating" reamer holders then again I'm betting your going to ruin your tool/barrel.
What I do is a bit different because I have some rather sophisticated equipment, holders, etc. The fundementals are pretty simple in theory, execution is another matter.
My machine weight over 7000lbs. Brute mass means it doesn't want to be pushed around.
The turret on my machine is probably over 1000lbs. Again shear mass wins.
IF you rigidly hold onto your tool (remember, the difference between pink and purple is the GRIP ) and you KNOW its aligned both in center position and tangent to the bore then there's no reason not to do it this way. I bore the chamber prior with a single point tool to ensure even tool engagement. The initial "bite" sets the stage for things to come. Get it wrong and its a phone call to the barrel company. Get it right and it's pretty smooth sailing.
FWIW I've never done this on a manual and I'd be hesitant to try on anything less than a premium machine with low mileage. It's not that anything less won't do it. I just think the risk/reward factor is poorly matched when one considers the cost and wait times for barrels and tooling.
Caveat Emptor. . .
Good luck
C.
PS: The last one I did this way was Saturday. Chamber TIR was .0003" at the web and at the shoulder/body junction.
Yes, you CAN chamber a barrel successfully w/o a pilot on the tool.
As Robert mentioned it requires a few things to be checked, double checked, and then checked again.
If your grabbing your reamer with a tap wrench and "going for it" then I wish you well. The reality is the tool is going to grab, rip the wrench from your hand, and probably break something. In fact, count on it breaking something.
If you have one of the so called "floating" reamer holders then again I'm betting your going to ruin your tool/barrel.
What I do is a bit different because I have some rather sophisticated equipment, holders, etc. The fundementals are pretty simple in theory, execution is another matter.
My machine weight over 7000lbs. Brute mass means it doesn't want to be pushed around.
The turret on my machine is probably over 1000lbs. Again shear mass wins.
IF you rigidly hold onto your tool (remember, the difference between pink and purple is the GRIP
FWIW I've never done this on a manual and I'd be hesitant to try on anything less than a premium machine with low mileage. It's not that anything less won't do it. I just think the risk/reward factor is poorly matched when one considers the cost and wait times for barrels and tooling.
Caveat Emptor. . .
Good luck
C.
PS: The last one I did this way was Saturday. Chamber TIR was .0003" at the web and at the shoulder/body junction.
Re: chambering without a pilot
I wouldn't try it without the proper bushing. If you get in a hurry now, you will probably regret it later. You've lived this long without it, what is another week? It's just cheap insurance.
I've chambered 50 or 60 barrels with a floating reamer holder and NEVER hurt the tool or barrel, in fact I've had great success. I can see getting away with not using a pilot if you are going to single point the chamber under the finished dimentions and then clean it up with the reamer but you really have to be careful. Good luck whatever you do.
I wouldn't try it without the proper bushing. If you get in a hurry now, you will probably regret it later. You've lived this long without it, what is another week? It's just cheap insurance.
I've chambered 50 or 60 barrels with a floating reamer holder and NEVER hurt the tool or barrel, in fact I've had great success. I can see getting away with not using a pilot if you are going to single point the chamber under the finished dimentions and then clean it up with the reamer but you really have to be careful. Good luck whatever you do.
Re: chambering without a pilot
OK, I am just hoping to clarify here before I end up doing it wrong as well
To be clear, when I did my first (and only thus far) chamber job, I used the proper size bushing for the pilot. But I made a hydro forming die and a resize die, and on these, I didn't use a pilot per se. Please take a minute and critique my technique on the dies, because I had given thought on using the same for a barrel where I didn't have the proper pilot.
I use a Manson floating reamer holder. First I setup and ensure the first 2.5-3" of the barrel is running dead nuts to the spindle. I use a 4-jaw and a rear spider. Then I run a drill bit into the area that I am going to chamber, I would say I run it in probably somewhere around 1/4" short of the shoulder. I then used a small boring bar, and brought this area out to a couple thous under the shoulder diameter. This ended up cleaning up the entire area that was drilled previously. Then, I 'ass'umed that as I fed the reamer into the bored hole, it would center itself and by the time it started cutting up into the shoulder area, it would be 'established' if that makes sense. I had a pilot on hte reamer, but the 'pilot hole' that I reamed in the dies were oversize for the caliber, and therefore, the reamer acted like there was no pilot.
Both dies I made turned out great, and I don't have any problems chambering sized brass, so again I am 'ass'uming that this method worked properly.
From what I read above, I am now very reluctant to use a reamer without the correct sized pilot.
Any input is always appreciated!!
OK, I am just hoping to clarify here before I end up doing it wrong as well
To be clear, when I did my first (and only thus far) chamber job, I used the proper size bushing for the pilot. But I made a hydro forming die and a resize die, and on these, I didn't use a pilot per se. Please take a minute and critique my technique on the dies, because I had given thought on using the same for a barrel where I didn't have the proper pilot.
I use a Manson floating reamer holder. First I setup and ensure the first 2.5-3" of the barrel is running dead nuts to the spindle. I use a 4-jaw and a rear spider. Then I run a drill bit into the area that I am going to chamber, I would say I run it in probably somewhere around 1/4" short of the shoulder. I then used a small boring bar, and brought this area out to a couple thous under the shoulder diameter. This ended up cleaning up the entire area that was drilled previously. Then, I 'ass'umed that as I fed the reamer into the bored hole, it would center itself and by the time it started cutting up into the shoulder area, it would be 'established' if that makes sense. I had a pilot on hte reamer, but the 'pilot hole' that I reamed in the dies were oversize for the caliber, and therefore, the reamer acted like there was no pilot.
Both dies I made turned out great, and I don't have any problems chambering sized brass, so again I am 'ass'uming that this method worked properly.
From what I read above, I am now very reluctant to use a reamer without the correct sized pilot.
Any input is always appreciated!!
Re: chambering without a pilot
dont do it... take the time and get the right bushing or make one
dont do it... take the time and get the right bushing or make one
