F T/R Competition Cheek and Natural point of aim?

[DropinLead]

I experimented with preloading bi-pod as well as super slick feet allowing it to slide. Did not see much difference really. Only time I noticed any real variation was when I tried to pull the rifle in either with the hand or with fingers on the front of the vertical grip. That sent fliers. I discovered I have a new question. Hope you all can help me out.

Using a light touch, I get the Natural point of aim dead on, close eyes, let go of gun, breath and when I touch the gun again and open my eye the cross hairs are still dead on. Here is the thing...

I get the POA right with a light hold, and then I fully rest the head down on the stock like normal the cross hairs float to the left. If I let up the cross hairs float back to the right to POA. Makes sense, probably Harris bi-pod contributing there, regardless....

I suppose the question for you all is what do you do when shooting for points, light contact to minimize input and find POA and shoot that way or rest the head to take tension off the neck and find POA and shoot that way.

Thanks for the assistance!

 

[LongArm]

good question, I would like to know as well

 

[Denys]

There are many schools of thoughts on this subject and as many opinions as there are shooters and Internet snipers wannabes.

My shooting form has evolved over the decades, and especially after leaving Palma and Service Rifle behind when I got into F class. Some things remained the same or were adapted a little bit, others were just plain revamped.

The biggest difference was the bipod and not having to hold the rifle fore end. That was actually one of the two driving factors in the genesis of F-class, the other being the scope to help fading eyesight.

So, I found that I had to redo my position almost completely due to the bipod usage and where I had originally started with my right knee bent a little bit to push my right side up, now my position is flat on the ground, legs straight back and while I cradle the rifle, or so it seems, I'm actually just holding it easily to my shoulder and have very little cheek pressure on it. Being straight back along the rifle goes a long way to fit that style. I elected to have very little head pressure on the rifle because that would vary from shot to shot and day to day and it would be easier to just eliminate the issue.

When I first started with a bipod, I used a VersaPod, and I found that it worked better when loaded. Of course, loading it the same way every time was the challenge, but one develops muscle memory for that, after a while.

When I switched to the Sinclair Gen 2, I quickly learned that loading such a bipod was not "a good thing." It took a match or two to get used to it, letting the bipod do its work and concentrating on doing a proper follow through. That's when my form evolved to having my legs straight back and removing my noggin from the stock.

I know that some people insist on loading all bipods and some of those curse the Sinclair or similar "ski" bipods. My experience shows that to be counterproductive. I find that putting any pressure on the rifle is counterproductive in F-class. So, if you have to hold the rifle because your head is pushing it, you have an issue.

 

[damoncali]

Just one data point, but I rest my head on the stock. I find muscling it is counterproductive. I get an NPA in that position and it works for me. A bigger adjustment for me was going to a straight back position like Denys described. It didn't feel natural after all that sling shooting, but the ability to follow through the shot and recoil is much better. I still lose a few points here and there to a bad position - it's not yet muscle memory for me. But it's obvious when I screw it up.

 

[SWRichmond]

Too much pressure into the shoulder = bad. NPA = good. I have used Atlas and Harris bipods and preloading for me = bad. Like a previous poster I came to F class from Highpower or some such, for me entirely because of eyesight, and had to get my position much straighter. Too straight pushes my chin into the stock = bad. Horizontal stringing at short range for me is evidence of chinning the stock. I chin them left.

 

[XTR]

Now we are actually talking about what I personally believe to be the biggest most important part of F-TR shooting other than wind reading. (never shot Open so I can't talk about that)

Yep, equipment is nice, and it is much easier to buy a new [insert item here], but how you hold the rifle into your shoulder (or not) and what you do with your nugget is more important that pretty much anything else you do and there is nothing you can buy to fix it. (ever hang around any golfers? If you have, then have you ever met one that hadn't bought at least three different drivers looking for a magic wand?)

The bottom line is that you have to find something that you can do time and time again. There are successful shooters that have the rifle come down 2 targets left after every shot, there are others (I believe Denys has made this comment) that have a position that keeps the rifle on target every shot. Some folks use a a very light hold that amounts to free recoiling, while I read Jim Crofts interview after he won the nationals last yr that he uses a "firm handshake" type grip.

You have to find what works for you, and that takes range time and thinking about what you are doing and what is working so you can tell when you are not doing it the same way. I've only been doing this for three yrs now. I can tell you that after wind this has cost me more points than anything else, and you have to do it, and feel it to know what is going on or working for you, nobody on the internet can do that for you. In one local match this yr as I was about to break a shot it occurred to me that it felt like my shoulder may be lower or "into" the stock more than usual. I broke the shot anyway just to see what would happen. Solid 9 at 1 o'clock.

One thing I've found is that in most cases the less I think about it and let muscle memory take over, the better I do. (which means I still need more work) I had a really hard time with that in the early in the day matches at Raton last yr. I actually shot better against the field last yr in the later matches when I was more tired.

The good thing is that you have identified that there is something going on at the butt end of the rifle that can make a difference, now you need to get out there and practice it and see what works for you.

 

[cdparker]

One thing that will give you good training is to get in position in the morning on your home range before the wind comes up and shoot some 10 shot groups. Try your different ideas and see what really does work for you. Shoot at 200 yards so that you can see each bullet hole as your group develops. As you fire each shot, say your call out loud. That way, you can compare what is showing on your target to what you think that you fired. I know that no one fires a perfect shot every time, but you do have to fire a good enough shot so that it lands where you call it. Adjust your NPA, head, grip and shoulder pressure, leg and body position etc. until your shots land exactly where you called your shot. That will get your mechanics right. Now you have to be able to call the wind and light correctly. Easy, Right?
Follow through and Favor center. Craig

 

[Graham]

The head should rest comfortably on the cheek rest.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Donald]

With a magnum cal eg 7mm WSM shooting with very little pressure on the rifle can get you into trouble with the odd flyer but the lighter cals can shoot great almost free recoil.

 

[Graham]

Cheek and Natural point of aim?

With a magnum cal eg 7mm WSM shooting with very little pressure on the rifle can get you into trouble with the odd flyer but the lighter cals can shoot great almost free recoil.

Other way around: The heavier the recoil the less forgiving they are and the more difficulties present themselves when muscling the rifle.