Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Just read the article also. Does anyone on here have one of the Cheytac rifles??
Just read the article also. Does anyone on here have one of the Cheytac rifles??
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Not really labeled as Magnum. this cartridge has been around for a while now in their intervention M200 and 400 rifles they were in the beginning made from the EDM Windrunners with a proprietary projectile and rifling in a controlled spin that would keep the BC high at extended ranges by letting the projo nose down at range.
based on a .400 Taylor magnum that was based on a .505 Gibbs. the brass is not just .505 Gibbs it has progressed since then. It stays supersonic past 2200 yards as to a 3000 yard capability that is should I say stretching it a bit? There is a huge amount of info on this here on the hide and the Internet use the search for that. As a side note the Barret .416 seems to have at least as much potential if not more than this along with the .375/.408
Not really labeled as Magnum. this cartridge has been around for a while now in their intervention M200 and 400 rifles they were in the beginning made from the EDM Windrunners with a proprietary projectile and rifling in a controlled spin that would keep the BC high at extended ranges by letting the projo nose down at range.
based on a .400 Taylor magnum that was based on a .505 Gibbs. the brass is not just .505 Gibbs it has progressed since then. It stays supersonic past 2200 yards as to a 3000 yard capability that is should I say stretching it a bit? There is a huge amount of info on this here on the hide and the Internet use the search for that. As a side note the Barret .416 seems to have at least as much potential if not more than this along with the .375/.408
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Oh I believe the .408 has been around since 2000 or 2001 I think
Oh I believe the .408 has been around since 2000 or 2001 I think
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Was my understanding NOMAD that much of the .416 problems are with projo's as was the .408 when it was first produced. I hope that there are some good turned projo's that can make it "catch up" as I am really interested in a .416 barrel for the Windrunner.
Was my understanding NOMAD that much of the .416 problems are with projo's as was the .408 when it was first produced. I hope that there are some good turned projo's that can make it "catch up" as I am really interested in a .416 barrel for the Windrunner.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
John,
Yes the Article header does say 408 Magnum but the article itself says 408 Cheytac. http://www.tactical-life.com/online/special-weapons/cheytac-m-200-408-magnum/
No new round yet lol. This one going on almost 10 years old.
Now as for the 408CT, 375/408, and 416 Barrett----The 375/408 smokes all of them in ballistics and shorter learning curve.
Now saying the problems with the 416 are projectiles and thats why it can't keep up with 375/408 is like saying its the projectiles fault my 300WSM can't keep up with 338LM
. There are lots more than that holding the 416 back such as working kinks out of rifling profile but then that requires a "specific" bullet to be used and built to that profile and then after thats done one needs to the work kinks out of said projectile in regards to powder column, stability range, and rifling profile once again. What it boils down to is that there is no single problem and the solution requires reworking from all different angles. You have to remember that the 408CT was being developed for about 2-3 years BEFORE anyone knew about it. This did not happen with the 416.
Here is link to caliber comparisons that I ran with same ballistic program so people couldnt say program catered to one or the other.
http://www.longrangeresearchinstitute.com/gpage8.html
And please take into consideration of ballistics NOT ONLY of elevation and wind adjustments but the danger space, TOF, amount of error allowed in wind calls, etc.
Thanks
John,
Yes the Article header does say 408 Magnum but the article itself says 408 Cheytac. http://www.tactical-life.com/online/special-weapons/cheytac-m-200-408-magnum/
No new round yet lol. This one going on almost 10 years old.
Now as for the 408CT, 375/408, and 416 Barrett----The 375/408 smokes all of them in ballistics and shorter learning curve.
Now saying the problems with the 416 are projectiles and thats why it can't keep up with 375/408 is like saying its the projectiles fault my 300WSM can't keep up with 338LM
Here is link to caliber comparisons that I ran with same ballistic program so people couldnt say program catered to one or the other.
http://www.longrangeresearchinstitute.com/gpage8.html
And please take into consideration of ballistics NOT ONLY of elevation and wind adjustments but the danger space, TOF, amount of error allowed in wind calls, etc.
Thanks
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
L my brain hurts when I look at your site I think it broke.
L my brain hurts when I look at your site I think it broke.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Yeah unfortunatly when you send your work in you are at the mercy of a editor. They tend to throw some words in places. I never put that in their. My wife just walked in with a copy of the mag so i still havent read it myself to see what they may have tweaked or changed.
I know that they only used 2 of the 20 pics i sent in and they used some others according to Rob01.
Hopefully it was a good read!
Yeah unfortunatly when you send your work in you are at the mercy of a editor. They tend to throw some words in places. I never put that in their. My wife just walked in with a copy of the mag so i still havent read it myself to see what they may have tweaked or changed.
I know that they only used 2 of the 20 pics i sent in and they used some others according to Rob01.
Hopefully it was a good read!
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Yeah the only pics I believe you sent in were the one of me shooting the M200 on the first page of the article and the one of us zeroing the rifles before heading up the pass. All the others look like stock pics they put in. The one of the M200 from behind in the specs might be yours too but not sure. Guess they didn't want any of you in there LOL
Yeah the only pics I believe you sent in were the one of me shooting the M200 on the first page of the article and the one of us zeroing the rifles before heading up the pass. All the others look like stock pics they put in. The one of the M200 from behind in the specs might be yours too but not sure. Guess they didn't want any of you in there LOL
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
So post the pics up here!!! What is your guys' take on the cost of this rifle vs EDM?? Is it really $12000 impressive
So post the pics up here!!! What is your guys' take on the cost of this rifle vs EDM?? Is it really $12000 impressive
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
I way oversimplified and shouldn't have. Just kinda' hoping the .416 bugs get worked out as using a .50 case will sure make the reloading, powder, primers, etc. a whole lot easier and make work up a lot cheaper. I just think it may catch up to the .408 not sure about the .375/.408 as that is such a screamer.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Later</div><div class="ubbcode-body">John,
Yes the Article header does say 408 Magnum but the article itself says 408 Cheytac. http://www.tactical-life.com/online/special-weapons/cheytac-m-200-408-magnum/
No new round yet lol. This one going on almost 10 years old.
Now as for the 408CT, 375/408, and 416 Barrett----The 375/408 smokes all of them in ballistics and shorter learning curve.
Now saying the problems with the 416 are projectiles and thats why it can't keep up with 375/408 is like saying its the projectiles fault my 300WSM can't keep up with 338LM . There are lots more than that holding the 416 back such as working kinks out of rifling profile but then that requires a "specific" bullet to be used and built to that profile and then after thats done one needs to the work kinks out of said projectile in regards to powder column, stability range, and rifling profile once again. What it boils down to is that there is no single problem and the solution requires reworking from all different angles. You have to remember that the 408CT was being developed for about 2-3 years BEFORE anyone knew about it. This did not happen with the 416.
Here is link to caliber comparisons that I ran with same ballistic program so people couldnt say program catered to one or the other.
http://www.longrangeresearchinstitute.com/gpage8.html
And please take into consideration of ballistics NOT ONLY of elevation and wind adjustments but the danger space, TOF, amount of error allowed in wind calls, etc.
Thanks
</div></div>
I way oversimplified and shouldn't have. Just kinda' hoping the .416 bugs get worked out as using a .50 case will sure make the reloading, powder, primers, etc. a whole lot easier and make work up a lot cheaper. I just think it may catch up to the .408 not sure about the .375/.408 as that is such a screamer.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Later</div><div class="ubbcode-body">John,
Yes the Article header does say 408 Magnum but the article itself says 408 Cheytac. http://www.tactical-life.com/online/special-weapons/cheytac-m-200-408-magnum/
No new round yet lol. This one going on almost 10 years old.
Now as for the 408CT, 375/408, and 416 Barrett----The 375/408 smokes all of them in ballistics and shorter learning curve.
Now saying the problems with the 416 are projectiles and thats why it can't keep up with 375/408 is like saying its the projectiles fault my 300WSM can't keep up with 338LM
Here is link to caliber comparisons that I ran with same ballistic program so people couldnt say program catered to one or the other.
http://www.longrangeresearchinstitute.com/gpage8.html
And please take into consideration of ballistics NOT ONLY of elevation and wind adjustments but the danger space, TOF, amount of error allowed in wind calls, etc.
Thanks
</div></div>
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
I will pick this one up as soon as I see it on the shelf. Wish I could write as well as you do. Writing an article like that seems so difficult to get a clear thought across without veering off in one direction or the other. I am jealous. <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NOMAD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well i wrote the article what do you want to know?</div></div>
I will pick this one up as soon as I see it on the shelf. Wish I could write as well as you do. Writing an article like that seems so difficult to get a clear thought across without veering off in one direction or the other. I am jealous. <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NOMAD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well i wrote the article what do you want to know?</div></div>
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: titus7</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So post the pics up here!!! What is your guys' take on the cost of this rifle vs EDM?? Is it really $12000 impressive</div></div>
You can see some pics here
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...Search=true#top
Here's some more pics I had. Red dots show target positions.
As to the price the $12,000 isn't just for the rifle but the whole system. I believe the M200 for just the rifle is around $8000.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: titus7</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So post the pics up here!!! What is your guys' take on the cost of this rifle vs EDM?? Is it really $12000 impressive</div></div>
You can see some pics here
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...Search=true#top
Here's some more pics I had. Red dots show target positions.
As to the price the $12,000 isn't just for the rifle but the whole system. I believe the M200 for just the rifle is around $8000.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Mechanic: If you truly are interested in improvement of the 416B then I would suggest you contact NORMA and see if they will send you the load developement spreadsheet and data from their pressure test barrels. I will see if I can find Pete Forras' contact information for you. The original 416 was his project until he left Barrett. Norma and the Swedes "invented" the 416 and Barrett ran with it prematurely.
There are some solids being made by couple different people but they require complete rifling profile reconfiguration AND they are long long and at this point would have to be single fed because they too long for magazines. But then that leads to the new projectiles taking up powder capacity which will take away the 416s' flare of MV so back to square one.
dmg308: No reason for your head to hurt lol, its just simple information. I am way better at making heads hurt via phone but I do what I can
Titus7: No one besides yourself can answer if ANY rifle is as impressive as the price. The overall ballistic abilities tell no lies and are always held back by the trigger mover.
Thanks
Mechanic: If you truly are interested in improvement of the 416B then I would suggest you contact NORMA and see if they will send you the load developement spreadsheet and data from their pressure test barrels. I will see if I can find Pete Forras' contact information for you. The original 416 was his project until he left Barrett. Norma and the Swedes "invented" the 416 and Barrett ran with it prematurely.
There are some solids being made by couple different people but they require complete rifling profile reconfiguration AND they are long long and at this point would have to be single fed because they too long for magazines. But then that leads to the new projectiles taking up powder capacity which will take away the 416s' flare of MV so back to square one.
dmg308: No reason for your head to hurt lol, its just simple information. I am way better at making heads hurt via phone but I do what I can
Titus7: No one besides yourself can answer if ANY rifle is as impressive as the price. The overall ballistic abilities tell no lies and are always held back by the trigger mover.
Thanks
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
rob01- were are those pictures taken at that show the longrange targets? that looks like a great place to shoot.
rob01- were are those pictures taken at that show the longrange targets? that looks like a great place to shoot.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Thank you Later, have been keeping an eye on your website and you my Friend have jumped into this with both feet without a doubt. Your time and money invested is way beyond what I could ever do.
Danny
Thank you Later, have been keeping an eye on your website and you my Friend have jumped into this with both feet without a doubt. Your time and money invested is way beyond what I could ever do.
Danny
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
What green weapon is the police officer shooting - is that a M310 with a BAT action? I thought LAWTON was building their actions......
What green weapon is the police officer shooting - is that a M310 with a BAT action? I thought LAWTON was building their actions......
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Chris McLoughlin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What green weapon is the police officer shooting - is that a M310 with a BAT action? I thought LAWTON was building their actions...... </div></div>
Chris: Can you scan and post the picture you referring to? I have no way of putting my hands on the magazine to read the complete article and/or view pics you referring to.
But...Yes the Lawton 8000 series is used by Cheytac for the M310 and IIRC the 8500 series are being used some now.
Mechanic: Thanks for what I am going to take as compliment . That is just what happens when you find that being 1 of the only 3 things you are good at lol. And my job allows for lots of time due to 28on/28off schedule. You will begin to see alot more "projects" and "progress" updates now that I single haha.
Thanks
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Chris McLoughlin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What green weapon is the police officer shooting - is that a M310 with a BAT action? I thought LAWTON was building their actions...... </div></div>
Chris: Can you scan and post the picture you referring to? I have no way of putting my hands on the magazine to read the complete article and/or view pics you referring to.
But...Yes the Lawton 8000 series is used by Cheytac for the M310 and IIRC the 8500 series are being used some now.
Mechanic: Thanks for what I am going to take as compliment
Thanks
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: John Shelborne</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The earlier M310's were single shot, using a BAT action in a McMillan stock(A5?). Barrel was by Lawton Machine .
</div></div>
John: Are you referring to pre 05 when Cheytac was "testing" a couple different action manufactures before officially choosing their action of choice? I would be interested from "historical" factor if you could provide any pics and after action reports of those test you might have access to. So that I could compare to reports of today that people have with various action builds.
Thanks
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: John Shelborne</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The earlier M310's were single shot, using a BAT action in a McMillan stock(A5?). Barrel was by Lawton Machine .
</div></div>
John: Are you referring to pre 05 when Cheytac was "testing" a couple different action manufactures before officially choosing their action of choice? I would be interested from "historical" factor if you could provide any pics and after action reports of those test you might have access to. So that I could compare to reports of today that people have with various action builds.
Thanks
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Very much a compliment Later. Sure would like to see that Vulcan of yours go off.
Very much a compliment Later. Sure would like to see that Vulcan of yours go off.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
I believe the M200 costs $12,000 for just the rifle and case ?
I believe the M200 costs $12,000 for just the rifle and case ?
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
The M200's have been listed between $10k-13k for a while. The EDM XM04 they were originally based on have been listed at $7500 for about the same amount of time. Obviously the rifles have their differences (mainly Lawton barrels and much more stable bipod assembly on the M200) but to many this wasn't enough to justify the extra cost. At least that was my thinking when I plunked down the money for an XM04 instead. I suspect Cheytac was pretty confident their platform would achieve wider .mil adoption than it has, hence the higher prices, but that's really just speculation on my part.
Personally, I've come to think that both are a bit overkill for the .408. On top of that, the .375/408 has evolved into a superior cartridge, so the point may be moot if you're looking to hit steel at 2400 yards.
The M200's have been listed between $10k-13k for a while. The EDM XM04 they were originally based on have been listed at $7500 for about the same amount of time. Obviously the rifles have their differences (mainly Lawton barrels and much more stable bipod assembly on the M200) but to many this wasn't enough to justify the extra cost. At least that was my thinking when I plunked down the money for an XM04 instead. I suspect Cheytac was pretty confident their platform would achieve wider .mil adoption than it has, hence the higher prices, but that's really just speculation on my part.
Personally, I've come to think that both are a bit overkill for the .408. On top of that, the .375/408 has evolved into a superior cartridge, so the point may be moot if you're looking to hit steel at 2400 yards.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
The M200 also isnt sold to civilians. There are only a few people that do have them and they know exactly who has them. I will say there is less then 5 M200's in civilian hands.
The M200 also isnt sold to civilians. There are only a few people that do have them and they know exactly who has them. I will say there is less then 5 M200's in civilian hands.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Yea he sure lol, the Knesek Guns site has every model listed for sale.
I am trying to recall where I seen the "announcement" that Cheytac had now "approved" for civilian sale.....I will shoot Dave an email and see if he can send to me and/or provide the info.
Yea he sure lol, the Knesek Guns site has every model listed for sale.
I am trying to recall where I seen the "announcement" that Cheytac had now "approved" for civilian sale.....I will shoot Dave an email and see if he can send to me and/or provide the info.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
m200 on gunbroker.com now. also on gunsamerica.com. Never knew of the civilian only part.
m200 on gunbroker.com now. also on gunsamerica.com. Never knew of the civilian only part.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
The "Civilian M200" offered a while ago simply had a shorter barrel. It was the same weapon(and size)as the M200C. There was the product brochure from CHEYTAC that described it a "detuned".. It was not, only a shorter barrel with maybe a five round mag instead of seven rounds.
The "Civilian M200" offered a while ago simply had a shorter barrel. It was the same weapon(and size)as the M200C. There was the product brochure from CHEYTAC that described it a "detuned".. It was not, only a shorter barrel with maybe a five round mag instead of seven rounds.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Yup, like I said I think they expected larger .mil orders, so they originally had a slightly shorter ranger "civilian" model of the M200 and M200 Carbine (I think very few iterations of the latter were produced). Then in 2008 I believe they made the M200 available across the board. The M310 and similar are conventional rifle builds on that caliber, using Lawton actions if I recall.
Yup, like I said I think they expected larger .mil orders, so they originally had a slightly shorter ranger "civilian" model of the M200 and M200 Carbine (I think very few iterations of the latter were produced). Then in 2008 I believe they made the M200 available across the board. The M310 and similar are conventional rifle builds on that caliber, using Lawton actions if I recall.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
There was no longer or shorter version for just mil or civilian use. That have two different lengths and they sell them to civilian's either way.
There was no longer or shorter version for just mil or civilian use. That have two different lengths and they sell them to civilian's either way.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
My understanding after talking to Dean a couple of years ago that the difference is also the software for the ABC program.
My understanding after talking to Dean a couple of years ago that the difference is also the software for the ABC program.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Thanks Later for the link to the comparison info on your site.
Didn't go through it with a fine-toothed comb but the 375/408 seems to beat all the other cartridges listed in every respect out at the longer ranges. Other than the .50BMG having more energy that is. Still plenty of power in the 375/408 to do a lot of damage though.
I definitely need to spend more time on that site than I have up to this point.
Thanks Later for the link to the comparison info on your site.
Didn't go through it with a fine-toothed comb but the 375/408 seems to beat all the other cartridges listed in every respect out at the longer ranges. Other than the .50BMG having more energy that is. Still plenty of power in the 375/408 to do a lot of damage though.
I definitely need to spend more time on that site than I have up to this point.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
They also i believe offer a training course with a m200 which would also be worth the money.
They also i believe offer a training course with a m200 which would also be worth the money.
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Hey Nomad would the class be beneficial to newbies or be way over my head??
Hey Nomad would the class be beneficial to newbies or be way over my head??
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
K Im saving my pennies to maybe someday own one. Can anybody tell me why they say that the only scope compatible with the m-200 is the nightforce 5.5x22-56??
K Im saving my pennies to maybe someday own one. Can anybody tell me why they say that the only scope compatible with the m-200 is the nightforce 5.5x22-56??
Re: CHEYTAC 408 Magnum
Is this good for $1333? I am in search of 408 ammo
408 CheyTac .419gr. Ammo Can Can of 198 Pictures
Is this good for $1333? I am in search of 408 ammo
408 CheyTac .419gr. Ammo Can Can of 198 Pictures
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