CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

[bm11]

OK,

I got bit by the ".22 bug" a bit back and started with my 10/22, which soon progressed to a "need" for a bolt gun. I ended up ordering all of the following:

CZ 455 Precision Trainer
Lilja drop in (21" straight taper)
Timney trigger
DIP 25 moa rail
DIP bottom metal (backorder)
DIP 25 moa extended rail (backorder)

The 455 came in yesterday, and the barrel, rail and trigger were already here. So I pulled it apart. I installed the trigger first, then the barrel, and I found that after the Lilja barrel was installed, I could no longer close the bolt. The instructions posted by CZ said nothing at all about the barrel "headspacing" off the bolt, but logic prevailed and I reinstalled the barrel, this time with the bolt in place. Now the barrel is in and the bolt will close.

Does this all seem correct to everyone? The gun will cycle ammo now, and I will be firing it today.

For the record, as I never got an answer to my question: the stock did not require inletting for the barrel, it is floated and centered just fine as-is. The stock did need inletting for the trigger. The only inletting required was that the trigger inlet in the stock needed to be extended rearward about 1/2 or so (no measurement taken, I just continued to remove material until it fit.)

And the Timney trigger is very crisp but it feels more like 4 pounds to my finger than 2 pounds. I'll need to get a scale on it. Yes, I adjusted it, just the weight screw, until it was all the way to the lightest setting.

 

[justin amateur]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Something went hinky on you.
My typical install requires removing the bolt,
loosening the rear mag well screw so the bolt quide wiggles
and sliding the barrel tenon in place to fit against the bolt guide.
Then installing the barrel cup screws and torquing to 32 inch-lbs,
snugging the mag well screws to contact, plus 1/8th turn. Don't over torque
the mag well screws, been there, split that. On my first installation
I used a tip offered by Canuck, using plasti-guage to check headspacing.

http://www.rimfireaccuracy.com/Forums/showthread.php/2506-HEADSPACING-slightly-different-approach

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Thanks Jaia! It was the "loosening up the magazine well" step that I was missing. I took it all apart and did it the way you suggested, and it went back together well.

I took it to the range today, and it shot really well. I tried CCI standard velocity, Wolf Match Extra, RWS in a couple varieties, SK Jag, and Lapua Center X. It REALLY preferred the Lapua (no surprise.)

Obligatory rifle:

First Center X group of the day:

Fantastic Center X group at 100 yards (the bullet hole you can see in the 1" shoot and see is from my AX .308)

Last two groups of the day:

Next step is bedding. A friend (jbell) will be installing a rear pillar and bedding the stock for me. Jaia: based on how it is shooting so far, do you think the barrel should be bedded up to the balance point also?

 

[justin amateur]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">do you think the barrel should be bedded up to the balance point also?</div></div>

Try some test shims under the barrel to see if/where a shim makes a difference.
I use gasket material for most of my test shims, but I've also used folded aluminum foil.
Fast and easy way to check if a permanent barrel pad/bedding will work for your rifle.

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

what about a stack of business cards?

 

[justin amateur]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Business cards, end flaps torn off of ammo boxes, newspaper, match book covers,
anything that will solidly fill and fit the gap between the barrel and stock.
The idea is to try it first, without the expense of epoxy bedding.
You'll know right away when you find the sweet spot.

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Actually kind of felt bad bedding it at all because it shot so damn good. But there always is the pursuit of "better."

 

[jbell]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Just a note if anyone is intrested. I have BM11's rifle and am in the process of bedding it. The action fit for the Manners stock is VERY good! I was being fooled by the Timney trigger into thinking we had to press the action into the stock (like the fit was too tight). However it was the body of the trigger housing slipping down in the cut out in the stock. I will open this up too so it will float. But the inlet for the action is pretty good as is. I have already opened the inlet up so I dont have a picture of it as new, but I may snap a few along the way. If I do Ill post them up here and show you guys how I do it, and hopefully NOT how not to do it

Here is a pic of the trigger in the stock. You can see how tight it is in the stock, it is just sitting there due to the press fit. (This pic was taken after I have already opened the inlet up in preperation for bedding it.)

 

[jbell]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

OK so here we go. First I opened up the inlet to make sure the action was only resting on the front pillar and on the centerline of the rear tang. This was a bit easier because the factory inlet was flat for the rear tang and the action is round. You can see the contact path of the tang (its the darker strip that is centered on the rear action screw hole). This is going to act as a guide for the depth of the action whial I install the rear pillar. These stocks come with a front pillar installed, although its a bit thin I think it will work just fine for this application.

Next it was time to make a rear pillar. I went to work and scrounged around and found this steel fitting. I drilled it out to give plenty of clearance for the 6mm action screw and cut it to length after measuring the stock.

I then threaded the length of it to give the Marine Tex some more to adhear to. With the die still on the new "pillar" I used the die as a guide to file each end flat and square to the length.

Here is what I ended up with for a pillar.

Last I drilled the stock out so the pillar would fall through the hole (if I remember correct I used a drill that was 0.060" larger than the pillar).

 

[jbell]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

To install the pillar I used a peice of 6mm X 1.0 threaded rod and cut it in 2 sections a few inches long to act as guides to help keep everything centered. I wrapped them in tape until they were a press fit into each pillar. I installed the new rear pillar on the action after coating the tang with release agent. I heald the pillar snug against the bottom of the action with a nut.

I then mixed up some Marine Tex and coated the pillar (after test fitting). Also note I am not bedding the action right now or other wise I would have the action prepped more.

Then just set it in the stock. I heald it in place with zip ties and has the barrel wrapped in tape to center it in the barrel channel. But I was careful to not use somuch tape that it heald the actionup off the front pillar.

 

[jbell]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Here is how the pillar install turned out. This is just after I took the action out.

This it the under side. It is not only important for the pillar to contact the action but also the bottom metal as well.

Here it is after I cleaned up the excess so I could have a very solid bedding with no air pockets. Notice there is a large air pocket in the stock its self on the right side of the pillar. Its no big deal as I will fill the void in with Marine Tex.

Here is the action prepped for the bedding job.

Action and stock ready to bed.

The stock with Marine Tex mixed and in place ready to install the action.

Here is the action set in the stock before I cleaned the excess Marine Tex off. I used washers that fit just inside the bottom metal inlet snugged up finger tight with nuts to hold the action aginst the pillars whial the bedding set up.

 

[jbell]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Well its all done. Here are a few pics after I cleaned up the excess a bit. I do wish I had a mill it would make for a cleaner looking job (nice straight lines), but I dont think it would work any better.

The matte areas in the bedding is where the clay was to allow for clearance for parts of the action that dont need to be flaoted. If I had a mill I would go ahead and cut this area out but it would serve no functional purpose. So to prevent me from damaging the bedding when cutting it by hand I leave it. You can see how very little contact there is at the front of the action. I have wandered why this action has such a large heavy tang, I guess now I know. It will help make up for the lack of support up front. Also this may be why those who have modified this rifle for max accuracy have found bedding the barrel helps. I chose to leave the barrel floating for now because it shot so well before any modifications were made. If need be Ill go back and bed it up to the balance point.

Here are all the parts together and cleaned up ready to assemble.

Also whial the bedding was setting up I decided to smooth up the bolt a little. The uncocked bolt lift was very heavy and gritty from the factory. As was the inital closing of the bolt. To remedy this I disassembled the bolt and polished the cocking ramp and the portion of the firing pin that contacts the ramp. I reassembled and found it was smoother but still had a very heavy detent at the start of each direction (bolt opening and bolt closing). So I disassembled it again and reprofiled the start of the cocking ramp and closing detent with a needle file and then repolished everything. Now the bolt cycles much smoother with no grit or heavy spots. This should be helped even more with a longer/larger bolt knob (more leverage). I did not take any pics of the bolt assembly before but here are some of it after the mods.

Here is the cocking ramp on the bolt knob (after I modified it):

Here is where I reprofiled the detent that made it hard to open the bolt:

Here is where I reprofiled the detent that made it hard to close the bolt:

Here is the firing pin where it contacts the cocking ramp after I reprofiled it (rounded it and took off the burrs and polished it):

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

damn, good progress so far!

I ordered some good ammo today to try out after its done. I orderdd more Laoua Center X along with some Eley Tenex, Eley Match, Lapua Midas +, and Federal Gold Medal Ultra Match. If we manage to get it shooting even tighter between the bedding and the ammo, I think we'll have a winner!

 

[jbell]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

I think you had a winner before eighter...

 

[Sc0]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Installing a larger bolt knob?

I ordered a DD Ross blued steel knob for my 455. A little bit of extra weight "should" keep the knob from moving when firing. I have an old BRNO #4 which has a ball-detent installed on the bolt handle, I am sure it was added for a reason on an old Match rifle.
(455/452's bolt knob jumps a wee bit when firing)

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jbell</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think you had a winner before eighter... </div></div>For sure! But there always is the pursuit of "better!"

 

[jbell]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Oh I know

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sc0</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Installing a larger bolt knob?

I ordered a DD Ross blued steel knob for my 455. A little bit of extra weight "should" keep the knob from moving when firing. I have an old BRNO #4 which has a ball-detent installed on the bolt handle, I am sure it was added for a reason on an old Match rifle.
(455/452's bolt knob jumps a wee bit when firing)
</div></div>Yes I am planning on a knob. I need a longer handle more than a bigger knob, the handle doesn't protrude much from the stock.

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Up for the finished bedding job!

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Range report/update:

Went to the range today, and unfortunately the rifle wasn't shooting as tight as it was before the bedding. Here were the CTC group measurements today in inches at 50y:
Lapua Center X: .477", .799", .719"
15 year old Eley Tenex: .595", .554"
CCI Standard Velocity: .640", .649", .759"
Wolf Match Extra:.511", .586"

The Lapua was shooting in the .2's and .3's before, so I will need to comprehensively analyze what could have gone wrong. Possibilities:

1: Jesse removed the barrel while working on the rifle. He reinstalled it using a different procedure than Jaia outlined and what I used before I shot it. Additional headspace may cause accuracy issues.

2: The barrel may require a dry patch at this point. 8 or so different ammo's have been shot through it at this point.

3: A pressure pad may be required between the stock and barrel as outlined in another thread here.

In any case, the bedding looks very good and I can't see how bedding curing an improper fit between the stock and action could have caused the accuracy to decrease?

The bolt and barrel were shipped out to Chad Dixon at LongRifles Inc today so progress will be on hold for a bit. If anyone has any theories they would like to throw out, I will be open to hearing them.

Thanks,

-Bob

 

[justin amateur]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

I blame the loss of accuracy on the new trigger...

Drop that rifle in a test rest so no skill is required to squeeze the trigger.
That is the only way I can correctly diagnose, when chasing a problem.
Then eliminate the possibilities one at a time.
Start with a clean action and barrel, make sure headspace is within tolerance.
Cycle the bolt very slowly and watch how rounds feed into the chamber.
If they are scraping the sides of the breech on the way in,
then they may be getting dinged and that affects aerodynamics.
Mag and mag well may be slightly out of position causing feed errors (dings).
I use a single shot adapter and manually feed one round at a time to prevent that problem.
Make sure to test under calm wind conditions, no way to diagnose correctly otherwise.
In a bedded/pillared stock, I'm using approximately 28 inch lbs torque on the stock/action screws
and 30 inch lbs torque on the barrel cup screws. Over tightening the cup screws
has been reported to distort the firing chamber from circular to oval.
Check rifle stability in the test rest, movement leads to inaccuracy.
Check barrel movement by pressing against side of barrel at end of forestock.
Watch the gap between barrel and stock for width change.
Try some shims in different spots to dampen barrel vibration/stock flex.

Watchin' for a follow up

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Thanks jaia. It's driving me nuts that I can't go back and diagnose until my barrel and bolt handle gets back. A few things of note:

1: I followed the barrel installation instructions you outlined before the first range session. Jesse followed cz's instructions which puts the barrel torque higher.

2: Action torque was set somewhere around 25 in lbs the first time, 50 or so the second time.

3: I didn't clean the rifle but it hasn't seen too many rounds.

4: I know what you are saying about the mechanical rest, and I would offer the same advice to a shooter I was helping. That said, I am a pretty consistent shooter with quite a bit of precision rifle experience, and I am confident the issue wasn't me. But, if I can get my hands on a rest, I'll go that route, out of respect.

Thank you,

-Bob

 

[justin amateur]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Regarding torque...those values are from an engineer
and have been superceded by anecdotal evidence!

Torque values are usually determined for a dry installation, not lubricated!
Use of lubricants on threads, means torque values need to be cut by 30 to 40%.
From the CZ 455 specs 6Nm on the barrel screws and 5 Nm on the stock screws
ends up being overkill. (1 Nm = 8.85 inch lbs) I lightly oil my receiver,
after cleaning to prevent rust, that's why I use 28 inch lbs
on the stock screws and 30 inch lbs on the barrel cup screws.

http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/torque-lubrication-effects-d_1693.html

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am a pretty consistent shooter with quite a bit of precision rifle experience</div></div>

I'm an amateur with a garage full of tools, who has to tinker with every mechanical gadget I own.
No skill whatsoever in shooting, except that needed to put squirrels and rabbits on the dinner menu.

 

[jbell]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

I too think the torque on the barrel scerws were a bit too snug, but I wanted to try it as per mfg specs (its the only way you will know for surewhat works and what dont). I can confidently say the loss of accuracy was not due to the shooter, I have put many thousands of rounds down range with BM11 and know how he shoots. I am looking forward to getting this rifle back and running and systematically determining the cause of accuracy loss. I do like the idea of checking the alignment of the mag for a feeding problem and that will be #1 after assembling the rifle back how we did it the first time (how jaia outlined). I also want to see if the Lilja's chamber is engraving the bullets or not (formy own curiosity). BM11 and I will give a report of out findings after he gets the barrel back.

 

[justin amateur]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I also want to see if the Lilja's chamber is engraving the bullets</div></div>

It does.

Drop a round into a CZ factory barrel,
it ends up like this, shell wobbles in the chamber.

Drop a round in the Lilja chamber and this is where it stops.
Brass is tight to chamber walls, have to press hard to force the round into the rifling.

After chambering, unless the round is fired,
it won't extract, not without some serious effort.

 

[D_Lamz]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Who's doing your bolt knob?

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: D_Lamz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Who's doing your bolt knob? </div></div>Chad Dixon, Longrifles Inc

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Got my barrel back from Longrifles, man Chad is fast! Made it to the range today for more shooting. The rifle was shooting better for sure (this time assembling it using 36 in/lbs on both the barrel screws and action screws.)

Group averages were as follows (all 5 shots, all at 50.)

7x unsuppressed groups of Lapua Center X,.413"
4x suppressed groups of Lapua Center X, .730"
6x unsuppressed groups of Lapua Midas +, .563"
5x unsuppressed groups of Eley Match, .493"

I am hoping to be able to tighten these groups up a bit more. There were a couple of really good groups with the Center X, .279", .313", and .330".

Best groups are as follows with each ammo:
Lapua CX: .279"
Lapua CX w/suppressor installed: .677"
Lapua M+: .510"
Eley Match: .463"

I ordered up 1,000 rounds of Center X, and I still have yet to try using the Tenex and the Federal Ultra Match I bought.

Hoping to mess with some variables and drop .1" off my 50y groups with the Center X.

I'm starting a different thread about my suppressor issues.

 

[gehrm]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Wow, that is some great shooting and thanks for posting all of your experiments. Quite helpful!

Would you mind posting pictures of your new bolt knob?

Thanks!

 

[BigJimFish]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Group averages were as follows (all 5 shots, all at 50.)

7x unsuppressed groups of Lapua Center X,.413"
4x suppressed groups of Lapua Center X, .730"
6x unsuppressed groups of Lapua Midas +, .563"
5x unsuppressed groups of Eley Match, .493"</div></div>

This still doesn't seem right to me. I expect more from a rig with the parts and pieces you have used, assembled in that manner. I expect that, with a Lilja in it, you would be able to average in the .2's with something. Heck, I have a stock Kimber 82G that will average in the .3's at 50yds with Eley Match and it isn't half the rifle you have built.

I don't like the look of that lack of support under the front half of the action and the barrel. I wouldn't stop trying things until you have a combination that will average in the .2's at 50 yards. That rifle is not shooting to potential.

 

[justin amateur]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I expect more from a rig with the parts and pieces you have used</div></div>

May not be the rig...shooting at an outdoor range can be problematic at times.
No indicator of weather in his post. Wind, temperature, type of bench
all can have detrimental effects on the ability to put a round on target.
Shooting for accuracy requires optimal conditions for optimal results.
If he was shooting in a 15 knot crosswind, he was doing purdy good.

If he was shooting from one of the older wood benches, as are found at my local range,
It's a wonder he was keeping it on paper, due to the shifting of the table top.

If it was biting cold, then he did really well, considering gloves
and how much he had to be shivering while trying to make an accurate, controlled shot.
I've been to Maine in January!

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BigJimFish</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

This still doesn't seem right to me. I expect more from a rig with the parts and pieces you have used, assembled in that manner. I expect that, with a Lilja in it, you would be able to average in the .2's with something. Heck, I have a stock Kimber 82G that will average in the .3's at 50yds with Eley Match and it isn't half the rifle you have built.

I don't like the look of that lack of support under the front half of the action and the barrel. I wouldn't stop trying things until you have a combination that will average in the .2's at 50 yards. That rifle is not shooting to potential. </div></div>Agreed, and I am not done working on it yet. For what its worth, most of the shooting has been in the 18-25 degree F range on breezy days, the coldest being 5f, so I don't think we are seeing the full potential yet. Jaia, I was shooting prone with a rear bag.

 

[justin amateur]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

There's the answer, at least as far as I'm concerned.
Bipod and bag isn't the same as bench rest shooting.
My prone skills don't produce groups as tight as those shot
from the bench with a solid, fully adjustable front rest.
And no way are my groups going to be that good in windy, sub freezing weather!

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

I get pretty consistent results with bipod and a bag. I can average in the .4's at 100y off a bipod and a bag with my centerfire AX with a good load. Meaning if I am the limiting factor, the rifle being unlimited, would be averaging in the .2's at 50.

 

[jbell]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bm11</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I get pretty consistent results with bipod and a bag.</div></div>

Its not the shooter or position, I can attest to that.

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Update: shot today. Huge improvement! Some breeze and 32 degrees, I think the "warmth" helped.

The average group size was .414, but taking away 3 total fliers the average drops to .312 (8 total groups shot at 50 yards.)

Best groups:

This last one was shot by jbell. It would have been .107 if it weren't for the first shot, which he said he pulled.

 

[jbell]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

For the record I did not pull the 1st shot, the dipoter on the scope was a bit out of focus (for my shitty eyes) and it took me a bit to get the correct sight picture

. But none the less I knew the shot was off. Also a note that group I shot was during a little shoot off Bob and I were having and it was not good enough to win... He beat me with my own rifle...

The rifle was shooting very well today, and not just a few good groups but all of them. I cant wait till warm weather, gonna be fun!

 

[TOP PREDATOR]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

damn fine shooting. pull or no pull. wish i can pull 'em that good!

 

[bm11]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Jesse's Sauer smoked me today. It AVERAGED .296" at 50 yards.

*All were 5 shot groups for the record.

 

[BigJimFish]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">18-25 degree F range</div></div>

Ahh, Eley hates the cold. Laupa is a bit more tolerant. I hear their polar biathlon stuff is the best but really I don't have any experience as shooting in sub zero temps is not my idea of a good time and, more importantly, the range is closed anyway. Perhaps you really don't have any problem aside from the weather. I would definitely wait until you get some testing in decent conditions before you monkey with anything major.

Oh, and I forgot to say the first time. I like the rig.

 

[gehrm]

Re: CZ455/ Lilja installation questions...

Nice setup! Thanks for sharing the steps and your results. Very encouraging!

 

[KIDGLOCK]

You people are the spawn of the DEVIL. I just pick up a 455 Tacticool. Then said... " Hey lets check the Hide and see what those crazy fucktards are doing with them". Well now a 400 dollar shooter will turn into a 6000 dollar POS.

Thanks, off to order parts >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

 

[1slow01z71]

Thanks for the in-depth posts on bedding jbell. Any particular reason you use MarineTex instead of Devcon?

 

[jbell]

I can get it easier (local marine supply) as opposed to having to order the Devcon 10110. I have used the Devcon and dont feel it gives any better of a finished product. I have used the Marine Tex for years and have had very good results. If mixed and applied properly it gives very good results. I am a Diesel Engine mechainc (I work for a Caterpillar dealer and work in tractor trailer engines) I use the Marine Tex to repair the cylinder blocks from time to time duing an overhaul. I have done engines with the Marine Tex and then torn the same engines back down years later with 500,000 to 800,000 more miles on them and the Marine Tex is just fine, so it must be pretty good. Also I am not the only one using it, if you check around. Now this is not to say that there isnt more than one way to skin this cat, Devcon 10110 works well as does Bisonite. Just my 2 pennies

 

[Hammertime]

Tag for new rifle debate

 

[yoteman]

Something went hinky on you.
My typical install requires removing the bolt,
loosening the rear mag well screw so the bolt quide wiggles
and sliding the barrel tenon in place to fit against the bolt guide.
Then installing the barrel cup screws and torquing to 32 inch-lbs,



snugging the mag well screws to contact, plus 1/8th turn. Don't over torque
the mag well screws, been there, split that. On my first installation
I used a tip offered by Canuck, using plasti-guage to check headspacing.

HEADSPACING, slightly different approach

justin mine does the same thing tried your way, an still bolt really tight to close, what am i missing, history, factory CZ 455 22mag instaling 22lr lilja barrel, bolt will close with lilja but i have to fight it
HELP!!!!!!!!!! yote

 

[jbell]

Is the bolt hard to close when chambering a round or even on an empty chamber? At what point is it hard to close, when dropping the bolt handle (cocking the action) or the last few thousandths of forward bolt travel? If it is just when cocking the firing pin (lowering the bolt handle) with a round in the chamber then how does it close on an empty chamber? If it hard to chamber a round then try a different brand of ammo/bullet. Or if it is hard on an empty chamber try it with the trigger removed and see how it feels. How was it with the factory barrel? I assume it was ok.

keep us up to speed on this, I am happy to help (if I can) PM me if you need to...

 

[justin amateur]

justin mine does the same thing tried your way, an still bolt really tight to close, what am i missing, history, factory CZ 455 22mag instaling 22lr lilja barrel, bolt will close with lilja but i have to fight it
HELP!!!!!!!!!! yote

Remove the bolt. Remove the barrel. Remove the mag well and bolt guide.
Make sure all surfaces are clean then reinstall the mag well and bolt guide
leaving the rear mag screw loose enough so the bolt guide wiggles a touch.
Install the barrel and torque the barrel screws to 30-32 inch lbs. Snug the rear mag screw.
Install the bolt and check for smooth operation. If it's still binding without a round in the chamber
seems to me that something is a thousandth or two out of spec either on the length of the barrel tenon,
or on the bolt itself. Time to do a close visual inspection to find the bind point.
Mike the tenon length on the CZ 22WMR barrel and compare to the Lilja tenon length.
Lilja's tolerances are a bit tighter than CZ's and that may be the problem. The bolt may have
been fitted during assembly to an out of spec tenon length on the CZ factory barrel.

Lemme check something here, going to swap barrels real quick.

Nice thing about the 455, ya' can get real fast doing a barrel swap.

On my 455 Varmint there is noticeably more effort to close the bolt on the Lilja 17 hmr
than there is on the factory 22wmr barrel. Same with my 455 American with Lilja 22lr.

 

[yoteman]

Is the bolt hard to close when chambering a round or even on an empty chamber? At what point is it hard to close, when dropping the bolt handle (cocking the action) or the last few thousandths of forward bolt travel? If it is just when cocking the firing pin (lowering the bolt handle) with a round in the chamber then how does it close on an empty chamber? If it hard to chamber a round then try a different brand of ammo/bullet. Or if it is hard on an empty chamber try it with the trigger removed and see how it feels. How was it with the factory barrel? I assume it was ok.

keep us up to speed on this, I am happy to help (if I can) PM me if you need to...

thanks j for postin
on factory 22mag barrel every thing ok, on lilja 22lr barrel empty camber just as hard as loaded round, as i close the bolt the last 1/4" REALLY TIGHT.
i have not tried with trigger out.(yo dave kit on factory trigger).
any help is needed, i have some time to get this rig up an running,(for my son to shoot TSC next year,)

ps welcome to the old german rifle world. shoot us a picture.when you can. i had one of thoses many years ago, an still cant remimber why i let it go,but damm it shot good

 

[yoteman]

Remove the bolt. Remove the barrel. Remove the mag well and bolt guide.
Make sure all surfaces are clean then reinstall the mag well and bolt guide
leaving the rear mag screw loose enough so the bolt guide wiggles a touch.
Install the barrel and torque the barrel screws to 30-32 inch lbs. Snug the rear mag screw.
Install the bolt and check for smooth operation. If it's still binding without a round in the chamber
seems to me that something is a thousandth or two out of spec either on the length of the barrel tenon,
or on the bolt itself. Time to do a close visual inspection to find the bind point.
Mike the tenon length on the CZ 22WMR barrel and compare to the Lilja tenon length.
Lilja's tolerances are a bit tighter than CZ's and that may be the problem. The bolt may have
been fitted during assembly to an out of spec tenon length on the CZ factory barrel.

Lemme check something here, going to swap barrels real quick.

Nice thing about the 455, ya' can get real fast doing a barrel swap.

On my 455 Varmint there is noticeably more effort to close the bolt on the Lilja 17 hmr
than there is on the factory 22wmr barrel. Same with my 455 American with Lilja 22lr.

thanks will try, an do some mikeing to see were i am at, but can tell ya now every thing was clean, maybe i am thinking wrong here after jbell an yourself post more,the bolt on the lilja 22lr barrel will close,
might be what i think tight maybe the norm.head space with plastic gauge shows to be ok.
talked to CZSHOOTER today at range, he said his lija was hard to close for about 200rd but runs ok now
will tear down an try again
now if i could learn to post pictures on here will post a few