Rifle Scopes Dilemma - WMLRF on older scope vs new Scope & and HHLRF

[taseal]

Hey guys,

so I am getting back into the hobby after being away from it since 2013... Things have changed. My last rifle was a Blueprinted R700 30.06 that could shoot half moa or better if I did my part. it was paired with a Bushnell DMR 3-21 Horus H59 reticle. I got it in 2011 I think when Bushnell was looking for people to "beta test" their new tactical line of scopes. I was one of the original beta testers for it with the H58 reticle. After we finished testing it, I had it swapped out for a newer H59 version. The scope is great, but it's a 1st gen DMR scope from Bushnell. for me it does a great job.... but no zero stop, 5 mil turrets and I'm sure with the advancements in technology the glass is outdated and there are better stuff out there now.

That being said WMLRF really wasn't a thing back then. We were taught to range with mils (or an LRF I guess). Times have changed.

I just recently purchased a Seekins SP10 in 6.5 creedmoor and now there are actually couple PRS matches in my state I'd like to attend (this didn't exist back then either in my area).

I am contemplating of getting a scope in the ~$1500-2000 range but sticking to a tradtional LRF (I have an older from 2011 and it sucks bigtime).

ORRRR

Getting a nice diveboard style rings on my Bushnell DMR and getting one of the WMLRF offerings (prefering Tango 4000 or Maztech 2k with AB).

I've also considered maybe a Vortex offering for around 1000 bucks, and look for a used WMLRF in the 1000 range.

What do you guys think? is my Bushnell too outdated and there are better things out there that I can benefit from? or is the future now and I get a new scope?

I've been strongly eyeing the Buris XTR-PS and getting a WMLRF in the future for it, or getting the eliminator 6 and have a new glass and a WMRLF all built into one. I know it has it's downsides, but I think it can be mitigated after some practice and training. Also saw some Leupold Mk4/5 for around $2000 in the marketplace or a Razor Gen III for around $2300 as well. I do love the idea of XTR-PS where you just dial your distance and shoot away. what's even better is the eliminator 6 where you don't even need to lift your head.

 

[RandoPracticalShooting]

If it’s PRS match driven, I would start with an optic upgrade and handheld LRF for the time being.

If you’re already looking at scopes in that 2k range I think you’re on the right track as there’s quality options.

Regarding the LRF, I offer the thought of increasing your scope budget and getting a monocular style LRF. The reality is you’ll want to get all 3, new scope, bino LRF, and weapon mounted. The scope is what you have to look through the most when shooting compared to the other two so that’s where I would start. The only reason I bring up the monocular LRF is cost, you gain some capability without a large entry since odds are you’ll want a nice set of LRF binoculars in the future vs settling now.

If you’re shooting legitimate PRS matches then you won’t have to range on the clock, and even if you had a weapon mounted one I wouldn’t recommend trying to use it during the CoF. If you’re shooting field sniper team matches or something where you DO have to range on the clock, then the WMLRF could be more beneficial. I still don’t think it wouldn’t ever entirely replace a handheld LRF though.

Hope this helps.

 

[taseal]

I appreciate your input. I’ve been looking at vortex lht. The razor is little over budget….

We will see. I don’t want to buy then regret what I got so I’m taking my time.

Yeah there are so many wants. I’m trying to do this the right way without going way over budget. I figured a wmlrf is pretty important if I ever do need it in different styles of shooting and a basic quality mono lrf will do the handheld portion.

Honestly my Bushnell elite from 2013 is in great shape and pretty sharp. I’m curious how much better 2k glass will be. I guess its obvious at distance

 

[RandoPracticalShooting]

Even in matches where you range on the clock there are still positions or stages that may make it very challenging to use a WMLRF. For instance I have seen some where there is a window or spider hole to shoot through and it doesn’t have enough vertical height to let the WMLRF hit the target because it’s blocked. Just fold for thought. They have a place, just important to understand pros and cons of both.

 

[dgheriani]

Figure out what your primary use case is and go from there. A WMLRF is useless for PRS but great for certain kinds of field matches (albeit as an ancillary, not primary, means of ranging).

If it were me, I'd upgrade your rifle optic first, even the HDMR2 was a big step up from the HDMR, both in terms of features (10 mil locking turrets) and glass quality and they are onto HDMR3 now, or Pro... Pretty much any recent scope in the $1500-2000 range will vastly outperform your HDMR.

Then I'd upgrade my LRF to a good set of LRF binos.

The last LRF purchase would be the WMLRF. I have an Impact 4000 and it's been great but by all accounts so are the Fire 4k and the new Maztech unit looks pretty impressive as well.

 

[taseal]

Figure out what your primary use case is and go from there. A WMLRF is useless for PRS but great for certain kinds of field matches (albeit as an ancillary, not primary, means of ranging).

If it were me, I'd upgrade your rifle optic first, even the HDMR2 was a big step up from the HDMR, both in terms of features (10 mil locking turrets) and glass quality and they are onto HDMR3 now, or Pro... Pretty much any recent scope in the $1500-2000 range will vastly outperform your HDMR.

Then I'd upgrade my LRF to a good set of LRF binos.

The last LRF purchase would be the WMLRF. I have an Impact 4000 and it's been great but by all accounts so are the Fire 4k and the new Maztech unit looks pretty impressive as well.

Gotcha. I guess glad tech has come a long way. I remember locking turrets was a new thing when I got mine. It had just come out and people were bummed bushnell didn’t include it. Also the 5 mil turrets…

 

[camocorvette]

Take all that wmlrf money and add it to your scope budget.

Then go in the px here and buy any flavor of used 7x lrf.

Unless you are specifically wanting it for field matches. Then disregard.

 

[taseal]

Take all that wmlrf money and add it to your scope budget.

Then go in the px here and buy any flavor of used 7x lrf.

Unless you are specifically wanting it for field matches. Then disregard.

Well it's either WMLRF with old scope or new scope and no WMLRF, but a budget LRF like Sig Kilo 3 or sm. lol

so around 1500 for scope and 400ish for LRF (plus rings). there goes 2k

 

[diggler1833]

I know that there are times when a WMLRF is going to help. If this new SP-10 is only going to be a match rifle, it might not be a bad option down the road. However, I'd definitely upgrade the optic first.

 

[taseal]

I know that there are times when a WMLRF is going to help. If this new SP-10 is only going to be a match rifle, it might not be a bad option down the road. However, I'd definitely upgrade the optic first.

Honestly, I just want it as an all around long distance rifle. That being said, sounds like priority should be new scope then WMLRF.

 

[diggler1833]

Honestly, I just want it as an all around long distance rifle. That being said, sounds like priority should be new scope then WMLRF.

Some of the guys who have invested in WMLRF are going to "boo" me for this, but I do believe that it is a very nice piece of equipment to have... However, a necessity it is not.

I hunt, kill a bunch of critters, and recreationally shoot quite a bit. For hunting and killing critters, I find it much easier to scout opposing treelines or even look at deer that are closer with a small handheld 6x LRF. That way I'm not swinging both arms around, or a weapon, or both and creating more movement to be seen.

I keep a Vortex Fury 5000 as well, but to be honest... by the time you carry one of those around, you are just about better off with a WMLRF. YMMV.

 

[taseal]

Some of the guys who have invested in WMLRF are going to "boo" me for this, but I do believe that it is a very nice piece of equipment to have... However, a necessity it is not.

I hunt, kill a bunch of critters, and recreationally shoot quite a bit. For hunting and killing critters, I find it much easier to scout opposing treelines or even look at deer that are closer with a small handheld 6x LRF. That way I'm not swinging both arms around, or a weapon, or both and creating more movement to be seen.

I keep a Vortex Fury 5000 as well, but to be honest... by the time you carry one of those around, you are just about better off with a WMLRF. YMMV.

I think the idea for me is speed. That's why I have been so torn with the Eliminator 6.

Whether it's a NRL, PRS, team match, or hunting, or warzone. if you want to take a shot, and you need to be fast because target is moving (changing distance), or you're timed on an unknown distance situation, nothing is going to beat taking a quick peek and ranging vs using high quality Bino LRF by getting on the gun, off the gun, ranging, back on scope, find target, etc etc.

It could be any of the above. you're going to be signitcantly faster with something that can range quickly and accurately.

It isn't a necessity, but it could give you an advantage and make up for lack of skill by taking alot of steps out.

It's just my thought, which is why I asked...