Dropped my Rem 700 bolt on the ground...now what?

[BlkZ06]

Its official, if its gonna happen its gonna happen to me.

New Crescent Customs rifle, and I drop the bolt on the ground and it broke where its soldered together.



So, what now? Send it back to Moon? Can it be fixed?

Better off to send to Moon and have a solid PTG bolt fitted?

 

[jake6547]

aint that a bitch, depends on how money you want to throw at it to make it right. If its a new gun I would probably just get it re-soldered on. Fitting a new ptg bolt isnt cheap and chances are the headspace won't be correct and the bolt will need to be turned.

 

[BlkZ06]

aint that a bitch, depends on how money you want to throw at it to make it right. If its a new gun I would probably just get it re-soldered on. Fitting a new ptg bolt isnt cheap and chances are the headspace won't be correct and the bolt will need to be turned.

Yeah I figured that.

I'm ok with getting it soldered back on....might as well flute it while I'm at it.

Simple job? Any idea?

 

[Raven 6]

Contact Dan Armstrong at Accu-Tig and have it TIG welded back on.

 

[matt2143]

Yup I TIG welded mine back on when that happened. Tons of setup time since I did not have a jig but after it was done I beat the shit out of it to test it's strength, good to go.

 

[dinc]

You can post the question here and have a bunch of idiots answer... Or you can call Moon.

 

[dondick]

I would tig it, but it would have to be by somebody who can do it right. Or ask a competent gum smith you trust.

 

[cal50]

Looks like a clean break and should be easy to line back up.
TIG it and or add a tapped cap screw.


Fixable either way.

 

[300sniper]

That sure looks like it was TIG'd on to me. Many believe a TIG'd bolt handle can't fail. They can.

 

[jcann]

Moon's a really good guy, give him a call, he'll probably take care of it for min $. He took care of me on a trigger problem another builder should have/tried and didn't fix. Turn around time was less than one week. He even called me later to check to see how the rifle was functioning.

 

[Equus]

That sure looks like it was TIG'd on to me. Many believe a TIG'd bolt handle can't fail. They can.

The picture in the OP looks nothing like a TIG weld. It would have to be done purposeful to break a proper TIG welded bolt handle.

 

[The_FNG]

Dropped it on the ground and the handle fell off...wut?

 

[Tac284]

The picture in the OP looks nothing like a TIG weld. It would have to be done purposeful to break a proper TIG welded bolt handle.

Really! It's weird how that bolt looks just like this bolt that was TIG welded and broke off.

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d94/markgor08/Gunsmithing/DSC05811Large.jpg

http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/sniper-hide-gunsmithing/55189-pictures-welded-bolt-handle.html

 

[300sniper]

The picture in the OP looks nothing like a TIG weld. It would have to be done purposeful to break a proper TIG welded bolt handle.

Sorry, but it DOES look exactly like a TIG welded handle that failed. In fact, I will guarantee it was TIG'd on. Metal has been removed from the handle and left on the bolt body. There is no evidence of solder on either part. There is an obvious weld bead on the top, back and bottom of where the handle was, exactly where people TIG them at.

 

[FALex]

You can post the question here and have a bunch of idiots answer... Or you can call Moon.

That's a great way to characterize your fellow Hide members. This site is unlike others. Most folks have fairly knowledgeable input.

 

[TallShot]

What track shoes are you gonna get?





Oh, and i'd just send it back to Moon with some money.

 

[jashmore1234]

See if Phoenix Custom Rifles will tig it and then reinforce it with a bolt.

 

[Tac284]

Sorry, but it DOES look exactly like a TIG welded handle that failed. In fact, I will guarantee it was TIG'd on. Metal has been removed from the handle and left on the bolt body. There is no evidence of solder on either part. There is an obvious weld bead on the top, back and bottom of where the handle was, exactly where people TIG them at.

Spot on!

 

[BillyGoatMachine]

Lol at seeing this thread. It sucks. I had a buddy drop off his bolt for me to install a Badger knob and as soon as the mill touched it, the handle popped off! So it seems this is more common than not. His is definitely soldered. I was going to try and re-solder it myself. Anybody have any tips for me like the op? Thanks and sorry for the hijack

 

[300sniper]

Regardless of the attachment method, if this was a turn key rifle, I've got a good hunch the builder will take care of you.

Contact him before sending it elsewhere.

 

[scpaul]

Excuse my ignorance ,but as a retired tech (electronics) what type of soldering are you talking about? silver solder? paul

 

[jake6547]

That's a great way to characterize your fellow Hide members. This site is unlike others. Most folks have fairly knowledgeable input.

X2

 

[Punisher29073]

Originally the handles are soldered from Remington. I do believe it is silver solder. I peeled a 300wm handle off with a stuck shell in a super tight chamber last year. After having a local guy re-solder it, or it may have been bubble gum, not sure. I peeled it off again.
I then took it ti Mark at Accurate Ordinance and had him fix it. He tigged it and 200 rds later, "No Problems". I took it to his shop in GA to avoid the shipping charges. Was very happy.

Ryan

 

[BlkZ06]

Oh, I definitely can't believe the drop knocked the handle off....but it did.

Its not soldered on there all that well, trust me.

Moon is having me ship the whole rifle back and he will fix it up. Probably going to get the bolt fluted and change a couple things.

And, I don't agree with the one poster saying the Hide members are idiots...anytime I've posted I've always gotten great help here.

 

[Equus]

Sorry, but it DOES look exactly like a TIG welded handle that failed. In fact, I will guarantee it was TIG'd on. Metal has been removed from the handle and left on the bolt body. There is no evidence of solder on either part. There is an obvious weld bead on the top, back and bottom of where the handle was, exactly where people TIG them at.

I guess it may look like a TIG weld to someone that doesn't deal with TIG welding every day of his working life. I am a certified TIG welder, and the original picture (that is not there anymore) did have solder where the bolt once was, it was that cruddy metalic substance that was under where the bolt went. Even a proper silver soldering job doesn't break easily.

 

[300sniper]

I guess it may look like a TIG weld to someone that doesn't deal with TIG welding every day of his working life. I am a certified TIG welder, and the original picture (that is not there anymore) did have solder where the bolt once was, it was that cruddy metalic substance that was under where the bolt went. Even a proper silver soldering job doesn't break easily.

True the picture is gone now but it clearly showed it was welded, not soldered. Certified or not, that IS what it showed. It did NOT show solder where the handle once was, only discolored unfinished metal.

 

[300sniper]

I guess it may look like a TIG weld to someone that doesn't deal with TIG welding every day of his working life. I am a certified TIG welder, and the original picture (that is not there anymore) did have solder where the bolt once was, it was that cruddy metalic substance that was under where the bolt went. Even a proper silver soldering job doesn't break easily.

The picture is back up if you want to take another look at it.

 

[ltfirehunter]

This reminds me of the, I scratched my Night Force thread.

 

[robin78]

I would rather sell it and buy something else like a TRG or AI. Unless the M24, many of rem 700`s are not combat proof.

 

[300sniper]

I would rather sell it and buy something else like a TRG or AI. Unless the M24, many of rem 700`s are not combat proof.

Please educate us how the M24 bolt handle is more "combat proof" than the one showed in the OP.

 

[Graham]

M24s have special powers. I've seen them.

 

[proneshooter]

That has to be a weld. There is NO way a proper solder joint would look like that. And why would Remington solder it when brazing takes just as much effort and is a MUCH stronger joint?

 

[James n TN]

Regardless of what weld was done the rifle and bolt should be sent to your smith so he can time the bolt correctly and properly tig weld it back together.

sent from RAZR Maxx HD using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Furtaker_.223]

got look at PTG for a new one piece.

 

[Equus]

James has about the best answer. IF it was a TIG weld it was done very improperly. At best the blown up picture looks more like 3 tac welds. Even then very lightly done. When I first started school for TIG even my spotwelds, while ugly, would not break. In 3 years of dealing with TIG welds and solder joints I've yet to see a weld break, and solder joints will break exactly as the picture shows. A hard solder joint can bear quite a good deal of load if done properly.

 

[TheGerman]

Combat proof.

Let me get out my sniper notepad.

 

[300sniper]

James has about the best answer. IF it was a TIG weld it was done very improperly. At best the blown up picture looks more like 3 tac welds. Even then very lightly done. When I first started school for TIG even my spotwelds, while ugly, would not break. In 3 years of dealing with TIG welds and solder joints I've yet to see a weld break, and solder joints will break exactly as the picture shows. A hard solder joint can bear quite a good deal of load if done properly.

Solder joints will not break and move steel from one part and deposit it on the other. There is metal transfer the full perimeter of the handle except for the front. Hell, you can even see how the heat tapered into the corner creating a wider bead. I do agree that it probably started with three tacks on the back though. While not a certified weldor, I do have a tendency break stuff and can usually see what, how and why it failed.

While I am convinced this is a TIG welded handle, I'm not convinced a 3 sided fusion TIG weld is better than a quality soldered joint in this application. Personally, my builds get one piece PTG bolts from the get go.

 

[Equus]

Solder joints will not break and move steel from one part and deposit it on the other.
Yes they can. Have seen it more than once


There is metal transfer the full perimeter of the handle except for the front.
No there was not. There was about 1/4 of metal xfer at the front with 2 additional spots and some very, very light edge erosion. I could have chamfered more metal with a swipe of a file.


Hell, you can even see how the heat tapered into the corner creating a wider bead. I do agree that it probably started with three tacks on the back though. While not a certified weldor, I do have a tendency break stuff and can usually see what, how and why it failed.
Yes the front corner was best but still way sub-par

While I am convinced this is a TIG welded handle, I'm not convinced a 3 sided fusion TIG weld is better than a quality soldered joint in this application. Personally, my builds get one piece PTG bolts from the get go.
Yes all edges should have been properly TIGed at the proper setting. Done properly it would not have broken, dressed properly you would have thought it was one piece. While I have never seen a TIG weld look like that it could be one half assed, or should I say quarter assed.

Mine in red

 

[300sniper]

Mine in red

OK then. Carry on with your whole three years of TIG experience. It was obviously a soldered joint that failed. My mistake.

 

[cal50]

Irregardless of how it was attached it failed.

Solder (all) or brazing works great if you have the surface area contact for it to flow. TIG works well regardless of surface area but needs to be welded correctly.
It looks like a clean break so it should be simple to line back up.....

The only downside to brazing / soldering is the large heated area needed for it to flow. TIG can be localized but really is dependent on the operator and the machine setting.
I am not sure what the bolt body material is ( 8620 / 4140 ?) but welding on carbon and especially tool steels without preheating you often get root cracks or the weld holds and pulls up the base metal from poor penetration.

 

[Irokcrawl]

Been there but not from dropping it. I ended up tig welding it due to a match being the next day and it's not going anywhere. I would find someone who could laser weld it so you don't have to undercut so much and potentially have to file it back so the bolt will close. I didn't do that and now the rear of the jeweled bolt looks like crap but it doesn't mess with function so for now I'm OK with it. Also have it pinned then forget about it. I'm also sure the guys who do the bolt knobs will have no problems with fixing it right instead of just using a silver solder job like it's done from the factory..

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk

 

[Equus]

OK then. Carry on with your whole three years of TIG experience. It was obviously a soldered joint that failed. My mistake.

Why butt hurt? I didn't even fully disagree with you. 3 years total? Not hardly. I learned TIG back in 1997, just never certified until the current employer needed it.

 

[scpaul]

Going to have to seperate you two if you can't play nice!

 

[buckey]

Don't matter either way whether it was TIG welded or soldered - the guy fucked up his new rifle & needs it fixed!!

 

[mackdrvr]

Just send it back to the builder to fix it.