ELi5: Why are Proof SS prefits priced lower than others?

[Senor_Barney]

This is a legit question from a relatively new shooter...

Can someone educate me as to why there is such a wide discrepancy btw a Proof prefit and what I would be quoted from a reputable smith to one-off a non-Proof prefit?

My hunch would be that "well, Proofs are mass produced and therefore have economies of scale?". But I don't know for sure. And, if so, does that come with a QC/QA tradeoff?

Are Proofs a different grade steel? Do they spend less on marketing and don't have to pass that on to the consumer? Something else?

For example, a Proof prefit at this particular smith for an Impact is $509, while a "shouldered prefit" for an Impact starts at $749.99.

This trend is consistent across all smiths that offer both and consistent across calibers and actions where the "Proof prefit" is a few hundred less.

I have no problem going this route given the $ savings I can invest in bullets and powder.

 

[Supersubes]

they make a zillion of them, and very quickly.

 

[spife7980]

There are also places that will make you one for what proof charges as well.

You mentioned the 500 level and the 750, don’t forget there are places that will charge 900 to do it for you too.
There is a price bracket for anyone and everything these days it seems.

 

[waspocrew]

Altus has cerakote included in that price for the non-proof prefit.

 

[Styger]

I think the Prood SS prefits way north of 7 lbs. Meaning they really don’t spend any machine time for profiling which saves in cost as well.

 

[FisherT&C]

Proof Research offers significant discounts to companies that commit to buy a certain number of units per year. Basically the more you buy the better the margin. For Proof, locking in a production quota enables them to forecast their supply and tooling needs. When a shop running millions of dollars worth of equipment and raw materials plus paying a skilled work force one key to being successful is minimal down time for machines. Having forecasted demand enables them to run longer productions before retooling and changing programs, which equals minimal down time. With good production engineering they minimize overhead and can pass on the savings which builds incentive to commit buyers to lock into buying bulk. Proof also has government contracts so they have significant revenue streams. They're good barrels, they're one of the main three I use on a regular basis.

 

[Senor_Barney]

Wow, learned a lot in just 20 min!

 

[FisherT&C]

Wow, learned a lot in just 20 min!

This is the Hide, we know shit.

 

[Mr. Z]

This is the Hide, we know shit.

And we’ll give you a line of shit if we don’t!

 

[TEUFEL820]

This is a legit question from a relatively new shooter...

Can someone educate me as to why there is such a wide discrepancy btw a Proof prefit and what I would be quoted from a reputable smith to one-off a non-Proof prefit?

My hunch would be that "well, Proofs are mass produced and therefore have economies of scale?". But I don't know for sure. And, if so, does that come with a QC/QA tradeoff?

Are Proofs a different grade steel? Do they spend less on marketing and don't have to pass that on to the consumer? Something else?

For example, a Proof prefit at this particular smith for an Impact is $509, while a "shouldered prefit" for an Impact starts at $749.99.

This trend is consistent across all smiths that offer both and consistent across calibers and actions where the "Proof prefit" is a few hundred less.

I have no problem going this route given the $ savings I can invest in bullets and powder.


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I wondered this myself. I decided to try out a Proof prefit to compare to a gunsmith chambering and didn't notice any difference in performance. The prefit was just as accurate as the gunsmith chambering. It's $475 just on labor to chamber and thread the muzzle excluding the cost of the blank through my gunsmith. That's almost the cost of one prefit.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Same for most barrel makers that also do finished barrels. XCaliber for example. Profits start at like $400. A good smith could charge that to spin up a blank that costs the same.

 

[TwistedOneinSeven]

Proof barrels are excellent, I have a number of them and they perform really well compared to others used like Bartlein.
All mine are chambered locally (Australia) as we can't get the Proof prefits here Down Under. Been trying to order a bunch since April 2020........
Proof prefits for the money are a very attractive option.

 

[iceng]

Prefits are (usually) bulk run CNC items.

Gunsmiths (usually) do them per-customer. This happens because you want a 7-300prc with a 0.193" throat. Well, no prefit does that config, so you pay for it.

If its a "normal" thing like 308, 223, creedmoor, winmag, or 30-06, you are good to go with a prefit.

How CNCs work is, they put a barrel in, dial it up, check that the correct reamer is in, click the go button.
They DONT like oddball reamer specs, because the operator has 25 barrels for their shift to complete, and see that 14 of them are 6.5 creedmoor. Well that person will batch those straight up.

They need to (usually) touch off the reamer on a probe, and do secondary checks to ensure its in spec with gauges.

A gunsmith does it all by hand, so it doesnt matter if its a 224valkyrie, 22-250 ackley imp or a 460 weatherby mag. Barrel spins, poke reamer in, check a bunch of times.

Prefits can be economical.

 

[308pirate]

My hunch would be that "well, Proofs are mass produced and therefore have economies of scale?".

As others have confirmed, that is the case

And, if so, does that come with a QC/QA tradeoff?

Not necessarily. Well engineered and well executed mass production processes can and do yield stellar quality levels for less money than less efficient methods can. Notice that I haven't said anything about inspections or inspectors.

Lexus automobiles are mass produced............

 

[buggz]

I think the Prood SS prefits way north of 7 lbs. Meaning they really don’t spend any machine time for profiling which saves in cost as well.

Yeah, I think those competition contour barrels would be very heavy.

 

[Sheldon N]

Proof makes barrel blanks, and excellent ones at that. They were making barrels before they started offering prefits.

Proof can sell a prefit barrel without charging a ton for labor, since they're already making a margin on the barrel blank. Selling prefits at a highly discounted price probably drives up overall barrel sales for them as well.

As to "quality" differences, that's debatable. My understanding is that these are being done on a CNC lathe. CNC's are getting very good and many other high end gunsmiths are using them. However, I don't know if Proof is spending a ton of time indicating each barrel until the runout in the throat is within 1/10,000th like a meticulous small volume gunsmith might do. More likely Proof has a machinist(s) being paid hourly who is chucking them up and pressing "Go" on the CNC with a more basic setup process.

That said, CNC's are very good and I've only heard good things about how their prefits shoot. If you wanted the very best and extreme attention to detail that's where you might want to pay a proper gunsmith for a quality chamber job.

 

[Carl_Ross]

I've been running Proof prefits in 223 and 6 Dasher. They shot as good as any barrels I've ever had, full stop. The only downside to me is just the finite number of SKU's, but as has been mentioned that's a factor in hitting their prefit price point.