Gunsmithing Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

[MikeeBooshay]

Gentlemen,

First time fitting an AICS with a short Surgeon 591. My difficulty is, when fitting the magazine, the forward ( muzzle ) end of the mag is hitting under the feed ramp, cocking it, preventing the latch from engaging. The aft end of the mag sometimes hits the bolt if you try to cycle the bolt while holding the mag in. I can't really get a decent picture, I have tried!

Is it normal to remove maybe .1" to .15", in order to get the mag to seat properly? I have already dealt with the Jewell trigger clearance thing, easily enough, but before cutting something I have to TIG back on, I thought I should ask someone that has been here before.

Got a lot of hope for this thing, setting it up to shoot 115 DTAC, my old .243 is a hammer with sub 100 grain bullets, but shot about 18" group with DTAC, not enough twist. Just about ready to test shoot this weekend if I get time to fix this, between actual work, etc.... then time to coat.

Also trying to rebuild a salt water soaked Officer's model 45, what a mess! Thanks Hurricane Rita.

Anyway, would appreciate the benefit of your experience, thanks in advance,

Mikee

 

[81sfo]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

Mike have you called Surgeon im sure theyll have the answer your looking for.good luck

 

[MikeeBooshay]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

Work has been so busy, no, but yes that was first idea. It's 2100 now, and just sitting down... good problem to have in this day though thank you Lord!

 

[jasonk]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

How many mags have you tried? I wouldn't grind/cut/change anything without trying at least one more mag.

What kind of mag is it? AICS/AW/Morta/Accurate?

Very likely you just have an out of spec mag.

 

[Hateca]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

The front of the mag will hit the bottom of the receiver this is why the front of the mag has a half moon cut into the top of the front plate, but if the bottom metal is at the right depth or distance from the receiver there should be some up and down movement even after the mag is locked.

From your explanation it sounds like the inlet of the stock isn't right for the bottom metal, maybe too deep.

 

[jasonk]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: HateCA</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

From your explanation it sounds like the inlet of the stock isn't right for the bottom metal, maybe too deep.

</div></div>

It's an AICS stock.

 

[Hateca]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jasonk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: HateCA</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

From your explanation it sounds like the inlet of the stock isn't right for the bottom metal, maybe too deep.

</div></div>

It's an AICS stock. </div></div>

My bad didn't see that, I assumed he was talking about the AICS mag not the stock.

Now it makes me wonder about this one mag then.

 

[MikeeBooshay]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

It is an AICS mag. And it is two of them, I have another rifle with different DBM that uses AICS mags.

That half moon cutout is where it is hitting, I pretty sure I could blend it, but was asking who had done it before and what they did there.

I will call Surgeon today too.

 

[Hateca]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mikee Booshay</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It is an AICS mag. And it is two of them, I have another rifle with different DBM that uses AICS mags.

That half moon cutout is where it is hitting, I pretty sure I could blend it, but was asking who had done it before and what they did there.

I will call Surgeon today too. </div></div>

Are you also using the AICS chassis system or are you using a stock with bottom metal?

If you are using an AICS chassis system and two mags are hitting the front bottom of the action not allowing the mag to lock there is something seriously wrong and I don't think it's the mags. If this is a stock with bottom metal I'll go back to my original reply, the bottom metal is too deep or the action and bottom metal are sitting too close to each other.

 

[Terry Cross]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

Mikee,
What stock are you trying to run on this rifle?

If an Accuracy International Chassis System stock, then you need to have someone take a peek at the stock frame and receiver. Something is not where it should be.

If you are using any stock other than the Accuracy International and using a DBM system that accepts AICS type magazines, I will bet money that the Z-axis is screwed up on the bottom metal install / stock inlet.

If you can advise some more information, you could probably get some usable info on here on how best to proceed. Stephen, over at Surgeon could probably point you in the right direction also.

Best,
Terry

 

[MikeeBooshay]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

Thanks for the help ya'll, I just spoke with Stephen at Surgeon.

FYI, it is an AICS stock, chassis etc whole nine yards. I'm at the office right now, can't try what he recommended, he thinks that the mag latch is perhaps a little long or that the mag latch slot on the mags is a little high. I'll file the mag a bit first, He said the mag feed lips should not be touching the reciever, and they definately are. It is possible, the way it is now, to get the mag to latch with FORCE, but then the bolt hangs a bit on the empty mag follower.

Not so good. If this farks up the mag at least I can TIG it back and make it like it was. I'd rather do that than the reciever. I'll try to do something with it tonight, and take some kind of a picture to share.

Thanks for the help guys. By the way, anyone in Houston have a Surgeon action wrench?

Mikee

 

[81sfo]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

Try the stock and mag with a rem700 action see if your get same problem w mag hitting action? Just a thought.

 

[81sfo]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

One more thing Mike,is the stock the older version w small recoil lug inlet and modified? If inlet was milled it could be off just a bit ,making action sit too far back but just enough to where bolts up ok.?

 

[MikeeBooshay]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

Nope, Jose, brand new with a deep recoil lug slot.

 

[Hateca]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

What round capacity mag are you using?

 

[MikeeBooshay]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

10 round. I have a five rounder too not sure that would work at all.

 

[Hateca]

Re: Fitting mag into Surgeon w/AICS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mikee Booshay</div><div class="ubbcode-body">10 round. I have a five rounder too not sure that would work at all. </div></div>

Ok this makes more sense. The 10 rounder will push up through the stock and contact the action, put is normally stopped by the bottom front receiver ring and the front of the mag long before the rear would hit the receiver. The 5 rounders will not because the floor plate of the mag will keep it from doing this by hitting the skins of the stock.

Before you go to grinding on anything check and be sure everything is as it should be. Check the stock with 5 round mags. I have not experienced an AICS stock with a too long of a mag catch.

You said you had Jewell trigger fitting issues as well with the stock. Be sure enough material was removed and the action is sitting perfectly straight in the stock. You can actually rotate the action side to side and still be able to torque the action screws.