FL vs Neck Sizing...Truth or Myths?

[M_16_4_REAL]

i recently had a talk with a reloading buddy i trust and when we got to talking about dies, he was shocked to hear that i use a fl sizing die to reload my 308. i shoot a bolt gun and was under the impression that bumping the shoulder back .002 was normal. he said that i could possibly be over working the brass by fl sizing after every firing instead of just neck sizing. he tried to explain to me that after a case has been shot (fire formed) from a specific chamber that it is basically molded to that chamber and will not need to be fl sized only neck sized, and that the brass will not require trimming to length as often.

now if this was some interweb cowboy id just pretend like i didnt hear it but this is a good buddy and if he's doing something incorrectly or if theres a better way id like to pass it on to him. but on the other hand if im doing something wrong or there a chance i could improve my hand loads id like to know also.

please dont post something like "this guy at the range shooting an ar told me..."

im just interested in the facts and the reasoning behind them. if you could give me some insight that would be much appreciated.

 

[bjay]

tag.. i want to hear what others say too

 

[chariotdriver]

I've had problems at both ends of the spectrum; now using the Redding competition shell holders which do a 0.010" or less bump with a bushing for the neck. If neck sizing for every shot you will eventually end up with a round which doesn't fit anymore..........that's why they sell body sizing dies. Your buddy is correct in the custom fit/fire-formed case of neck sizing lasting longer with the possibility of slightly better accuracy; downside is it may not go bang when you need it to.....JMO

 

[Unknown]

or my 300 win mag, I adjust the die by watching the grease get pushed down the neck to just above the shoulder. I do not bump the shoulder. with gas guns, or when I have 2 or more rifles of the same cartridge, I size about .002 on the shoulder to insure chambering when dirty.

Any bolt rifle that doesn't have to share brass gets neck sized only. The bolt has enough caming power to crush fit a round into a dirty chamber. I realize that someday I might get too much dirt, or other tolerance interference to prohibit the round from chambering, but it hasn't happened since I started reloading in the late 70's, early 80's. I think the odds are in my favor.

 

[Graham]

I do not bump the shoulder...Any bolt rifle that doesn't have to share brass gets neck sized only. The bolt has enough caming power to crush fit a round into a dirty chamber.

For a tactical rifle one FL sizes. Every time. Always measure the shoulder, especially of you don't want to set it back, that way you will find out that it almost always needs to be set back. 300WM is a belted case; there are design issues there that require it to be treated differently from a .308. And never use your bolt as a press.

 

[herro_prease]

went from neck sizing only to bushing FL sizing with the comp shell holders. prior to this, had a very inconsistent bolt throw - that is now fixed. neck sizing only may have worked the brass less, but there's much more consistency in the brass now, and I can't imagine that .002 on the shoulder is working the brass that much more, and if you anneal, it won't make much difference...?

 

[Weaselthis]

Real life experience here. Been reloading since 1982. Learned a few things. Some early on, some later. Once upon a time only neck sized. When things got tight, I "partially FLS". Seemed to work for what I was doing. Was only shooting hunting rifles then.

BUT, got into custom sticks and LR 4 yrs. ago. Did the same ole same ole as before (neck size only) till one day at the range, one got "sticky" and I gave it a little extra force to get it into battery.......almost. Stuck a loaded round in the chamber. Almost lost a barrel over that one "screwed the pooch" moment. Got lucky and a very ballsy gunsmith got it out for me without ruining a $4K gun and no one getting hurt or dead. Learned my lesson. Just not worth the risk IMO.

For tactical type comp guns I ALWAYS FLS ( I use Redding bushing dies). For hunting sticks, I will partially FLS if needed, but know this, I will run EVERY round thru the rifle before taking it on a hunting trip to be sure. I COULD do this w/ the comp guns, but for a 60-75 round match it's a pain. Better just to FLS. My .02. Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[Graham]

There's a reason that Benchrest shooters neck size. We don't have that reason.

Overworking your brass comes from setting back the shoulder too far, not from FL sizing.

And there's really no harm to be done in setting the shoulder back a few thou too far... But 'eyeballing' to reload a 300Win Mag, regardless of how the chamber headspaces but with no measuring tools, is a problem waiting to happen.

 

[Unknown]

I agree with what Graham says that the problems come from excessive shoulder set back, not from full length sizing. You have to measure the length of your cases to a datum on the shoulder to figure out how much you want to set it back (if at all). I measure, and find that the grease mark on the shoulder confirms what my measurement tools tell me. Simply turning your die out from the shell holder a given amount will not tell you whether you are setting the shoulder back too much, or not at all.

With my 300, and 260 I use a full length die, but do not set the shoulder back. In over 30 years of competitive shooting, that method has worked for me, so I don't want to fix something that is working well for me. I don't set the shoulders back at all. It doesnt matter to me if people call that neck sizing, or full length sizing when the shoulder is not moved.

I also agree with the notion of not using your bolt as a press, that is way to wreck something. chambering a round where there is slight resistance is far different than forcing an overly long round into the chamber. with a properly sized case, SLIGHT resistance is easily overcome by the camming action of the bolt. That is far different than using a bolt as a press or sizing tool.

People with gas guns, more than one rifle in the same cartridge, or those who have difficulty chambering rounds in dirty conditions usually need to have a bit of shoulder set back.

I don't think that .002 is excessive, but technically, that works brass more than neck sizing only. I had two rifles using the same cartridge, and there was .005 difference between the two chamber lengths. Because I like to set shoulders back .002 on gas guns, I had some cases with .007 slop. I did not like having .007 slop in the one rifle, so both were sent off to get matched up. Now, they have .00125 (averaged) between the two, so I do not work the brass as much.

If you set the shoulders back more than necessary, you can shorten brass life. that can get expensive and/or dangerous if cases rupture. The bottom line is that without proper tools to measure, you are just guessing. Over time, it is far cheaper to buy the tools to measure brass than it is to replace the brass (or rifles) that fail due to oversizing.

 

[milo 2.0]

Ok guru's.
Sunday I set out to size 525 piecs of saum brass, 95-97% of it only needed neck sizing, so I set my fl die to bump the shoulder back on the few. Measuring with a .338 comparator, bumping them to fit, they read the same as the ones that didn't need bumping. So I decide to just run them all through the fl die. The question is, even though I didn't bump the shouder, did I work the brass?
I can tell you I deffinetly felt the case being sized towards the case head.

 

[bjay]

Ok guru's.
Sunday I set out to size 525 piecs of saum brass, 95-97% of it only needed neck sizing, so I set my fl die to bump the shoulder back on the few. Measuring with a .338 comparator, bumping them to fit, they read the same as the ones that didn't need bumping. So I decide to just run them all through the fl die. The question is, even though I didn't bump the shouder, did I work the brass?
I can tell you I deffinetly felt the case being sized towards the case head.

Each time you squeeze the body shoulder grow.i neck size 2-4 then i use body die back to factoru lapua brass spec..i use 3 dies comp type s.this methos been working for me for a while now.i did witness shooter rd stock on chamber didnt ask why or how.but each time o got to 3x neck sizing i feel that geting tite chambering and crosing finger my rd will eject after a shot so far no bad exp.to minimize that holding balls thinking it will get stock specialy on a competition.FL it.accuracy neck sizing is slightly better imo..fl all the time makes me think that going back n fort brass does weakend it

 

[Unknown]

It is possible that while you did not set the shoulder back, you may have felt the die sizing the outside diameter of the shoulder or base of the case. You can measure all dimensions of the cases before, and after sizing to find out where the die is working the case. Or you could try putting layout dye on the case before sizing to see where the dye gets rubbed off. I would prefer measuring the cases though.

Insufficient case lube may make it feel like the case is being worked than it actually is, but my guess is that you already know that.

 

[milo 2.0]

Each time you squeeze the body shoulder grow.

It really can't grow any more than what my die is set for can it?

 

[milo 2.0]

It is possible that while you did not set the shoulder back, you may have felt the die sizing the outside diameter of the shoulder or base of the case. You can measure all dimensions of the cases before, and after sizing to find out where the die is working the case. Or you could try putting layout dye on the case before sizing to see where the dye gets rubbed off. I would prefer measuring the cases though.

Insufficient case lube may make it feel like the case is being worked than it actually is, but my guess is that you already know that.

I was kinda referring to working it as far as case head seperation goes. I know the base is being constricted, you can feel it, this is some stout ass stuff. I've given up trying to size it on my coax, especially if the die needs to contact the shell holders.
I'm veering away from just neck sizing, tired of taking five loaded rounds home from an afternoon of shooting, only to have to run them through a body die just to get them to fire.

 

[bjay]

bh

It really can't grow any more than what my die is set for can it?

This is when my budies from .002 to .010 competition shell holder come to the picture.using the right size shell holder can prevent and keep shoulder push up stays the amount you desire on shoulder.

 

[Unknown]

Milo,
If you are having rounds not chamber, then I would start measuring rounds to figure out where the ones that did not chamber are bigger. It could be any of a number places on the case, or maybe even the ogive of the bullet jamming into the throat, or an over length case. Measure factory cases from a couple of manufacturers if possible, then measure cases that did not chamber, and compare to fired cases, and to cases that chamber properly. Maybe a couple of dummy cases you can safely try in your rifle would help.

 

[milo 2.0]

Milo,
If you are having rounds not chamber, then I would start measuring rounds to figure out where the ones that did not chamber are bigger. It could be any of a number places on the case, or maybe even the ogive of the bullet jamming into the throat, or an over length case. Measure factory cases from a couple of manufacturers if possible, then measure cases that did not chamber, and compare to fired cases, and to cases that chamber properly. Maybe a couple of dummy cases you can safely try in your rifle would help.

I'm really not having problems, have in the past with neck sized stuff, more of an annoyance than problem. I was just questioning working the brass, if one didn't bump the shoulder. My primer pockts will be gone long before I see chs.

 

[BWB]

Sorry for the dumb question, as I'm a little new to the reloading world. Are the Competition shell holders used so you don't have to move your die or do they do something different that I'm not getting?

 

[milo 2.0]

Sorry for the dumb question, as I'm a little new to the reloading world. Are the Competition shell holders used so you don't have to move your die or do they do something different that I'm not getting?

You're right on with your speculation. They would really come into play if you had two guns the same caliber, different bumps etc...

Sorry but bjay's post was somewhat out of context here, I know what my bump is, and had the die set for it.

 

[bjay]

I'm really not having problems, have in the past with neck sized stuff, more of an annoyance than problem. I was just questioning working the brass, if one didn't bump the shoulder. My primer pockts will be gone long before I see chs.

Mate do you use comparator? I use to worry about bumping and growing shoulder each time i do a full length size.on my precision rifle i usualy measure a factory lapua then compare it after fired.if shoulder grew .001 i neck size it when .02-.03 its when they kinda tight on loading it usualy after 3-4 neck sizing then i full length them back to virgin lapua.i use body die

 

[milo 2.0]

Mate do you use comparator? I use to worry about bumping and growing shoulder each time i do a full length size.on my precision rifle i usualy measure a factory lapua then compare it after fired.if shoulder grew .001 i neck size it when .02-.03 its when they kinda tight on loading it usualy after 3-4 neck sizing then i full length them back to virgin lapua.i use body die

Yes, I stated earlier that for 7mm SAUM I use a .338 comp for meaasuring.

 

[chariotdriver]

Sorry for the dumb question, as I'm a little new to the reloading world. Are the Competition shell holders used so you don't have to move your die or do they do something different that I'm not getting?

The comp shell holders still bottom out on the die but they have a little extra material above the extraction rim of the case so slightly less of the case goes into the die. They come as a set of 5, all of which have different amounts of adjustment.

 

[Skigolfmike]

I had a bench rest guy tell me when he set the record for group and score, he full length resized every firing. He gave me his method for setting up the die and I have used it ever since with good results.

Remove the firing pin assembly from your bolt and the ejector. If the bolt and receiver are clean and lubed properly, when you push the bolt forward and let go it will fall into closed position. Put in a fired piece of brass and chamber it and the bolt will not fall. Now, setup your full length die backing it out a turn from where it kisses the shell holder. Then resize that piece of brass and chamber it again. Repeat until the bolt closes the same as when the chamber is empty. Lock the die down and have at it. If you do this right you'll only be bumping the shoulder back about .001".

FWIW, I run a Redding Bushing die and only work the neck enough to get .003" neck tension. I use a .337 with Lapua and Hornaday 308 brass, a .332 with Winchester 308 brass and a 288 with Hornaday 6.5CM brass.

 

[turbo54]

When I got serious about shooting long range I started neck sizing for the famed "accuracy benefits". They never materialized.

What did materialize though, was a live round STUCK in my chamber, which caused me to DNF a match. It also caused some serious pucker-factor when I beat the live round out of the chamber by using a rod from the muzzle end. <--- I DO NOT ADVISE YOU DO THIS.

I don't dispute that all other things being equal, NS-only brass will last a little longer than FLS'd brass. You are certainly "working" the brass more. However, it is not a large difference, and insignificant unless you have a special wildcat chamber that requires a LOT of brass prep.

I don't dispute that it's NS-only ammo may be ***slightly*** more accurate than FLS ammo, but I've never been able to shoot the difference, and I've shot little bugholes at 200 yards on many ocassions with FLS'd brass. Maybe a benchrester could make use of the enhanced accuracy, but a tactical shooter certainly couldn't.

 

[turbo54]

Remove the firing pin assembly from your bolt and the ejector. If the bolt and receiver are clean and lubed properly, when you push the bolt forward and let go it will fall into closed position. Put in a fired piece of brass and chamber it and the bolt will not fall. Now, setup your full length die backing it out a turn from where it kisses the shell holder. Then resize that piece of brass and chamber it again. Repeat until the bolt closes the same as when the chamber is empty. Lock the die down and have at it. If you do this right you'll only be bumping the shoulder back about .001".

I disagree.

Your method will almost work reliably with two key caveats:

1. Buying the (inexpensive) equipment/tools to directly measure the headspace length of your brass is a superior method compared to the "test fit in your chamber" method...

2. Continually sizing ONE single piece of brass while you adjust your dies has NEVER produced consistent and reliable results for me. By the time my sizing die is adjusted such that the one case I've been working with is sized properly, the die will size the other cases too much. I can't explain why this is, but it makes a difference if the case goes in/out of the die ONCE vs. MULTIPLE times. I recommend lubing/sizing one piece of brass and checking it for size. Use another piece of brass to check sizing after EACH die adjustment.

 

[Skigolfmike]

I usually work a new case each time until the bolt drops and then rework the previous cases. I usually have it in about 4 cases. You can do the same thing with a headspace gauge; however, if what you say is true, you'd need to run a different piece of brass in the die each time until you got it right. You only need to move the shoulder .001".

I am with you on a tactical gun. Sticking a bullet in the lands, having a case stick, or loading longer than mag length is just not worth it. Especially if you are shooting comps.

 

[ksthomas]

Guys, you need to forget about what/how Benchrest shooters do, and focus on the types of rifles and activities that YOU'RE involved with. What works for a Benchrest gun is a disaster when applied to a Service Rifle. And often either a waste of time or a genuine problem when applied to a conventional hunting rifle. There's no accuracy loss when dealing with Full Length sizing, and it will stave off a lot of problems. Problems that you WILL eventually run into if you Neck Size only. On the first question, if accuracy was decreased by the use of F/L sizing, it wouldn't be standard procedure in accuracy lab work, which it is. Sierra, for example, uses virtually nothing but F/L sized cases in all their daily QC firings. There, anything failing to make 1/2 MOA is cause for concern,and the vast majority of the test groups will go well under half of this. All with F/L sized cases. The case life issue only comes into play when you're using F/L dies incorrectly, as several here have already pointed out. Use case gages like the Wilson, the Stoney Point/Hornady, or the RCBS Precision Mic to determine just how much bump you're actually applying to the shoulders, and that'll solve the entire case life matter once and for all. Use bushing dies, with an appropriately chosen bushing, and that'll extend the life of the necks substantially. I've frequently gotten 25-30 firings out of Federal brass (yes, butter-soft Federal brass) when using F/L sizing, without loss of accuracy. I usually lost them when the primer pockets loosened up, but that took a while with the relatively gentle loads used for most QC accuracy firing.

Full Length sizing is not the bugaboo that a lot of guys want to make it out to be, and is actually the better way to go in the vast majority of situations out there. Neck Sizing may have some place, and I've used it occasionally in the past. But there's problems that go with it, and I just can't justify the additional headaches they have the potential for. Stick to F/L sizing, with the dies adjusted correctly for your brass and chamber, and don't look back.

 

[M_16_4_REAL]

I appreciate all the responses and good info shared here. I've been using a fl die, hornady comparator, and setting it up for a .001 shoulder bump since I reload for only one rifle. I honestly think the only thing holding my accuracy back is inconsistant neck tension. I've considered using a bushing die but no one I know uses one so I haven't been in a rush to acquire one to try. Im thinking I should get one sooner rather than later though.

If you have any suggestions or reviews of neck dies I'd love to hear about it. And maybe even some suggestions on bushing sizes for fc, rp, and hornady brass.

 

[jfseaman]

I've converted to Lee collet dies for neck sizing.

I now neck turn and collet size unless I need to push the shoulder back.

 

[Deadshot2]

Being a reloader for about 40 years I've found a way to make existing dies yield the proper shoulder "setback" for my rifles. The key is to remove any variable that might occur due to press looseness or "spring". That means set the die so the shell holder always contacts the bottom of it when the case is fully in the die. The die has to be the upper travel "stop", not the press mechanism. Some use shims that need to be placed on the shell holder when the case is in place. The thickness of this shim pack then determines the amount of "bump" with the case fully pushed into the die. One can also use the various shell holders that hold the case lower and lower in calibrated increments so again, the die and shell holder are in full contact when the case is fully into the die.

I've taken a combination of both. Using some shim stock I have created a "horseshoe" shaped shim that is just the right thickness and glued it with super-glue to the top of my shell holder. Cases are now sized so the shoulder is bumped back an exact .0015" without any variation due to press spring.

I also use a similar system with my Seater Des, making them "Dead Length" dies by slipping a surface ground washer over the case before seating the bullet. This way I can run the shell holder tight against the die. I back the die off so there is no crimp and just adjust the seater plug for the desired OAL. By using this method the case is held in a "chamber" of a fixed length and OAL variations are now limited solely to whatever exists in the bullet itself. (from ogive to meplat)

 

[dmike]

When I got serious about shooting long range I started neck sizing for the famed "accuracy benefits". They never materialized.

What did materialize though, was a live round STUCK in my chamber, which caused me to DNF a match. It also caused some serious pucker-factor when I beat the live round out of the chamber by using a rod from the muzzle end. <--- I DO NOT ADVISE YOU DO THIS.

I don't dispute that all other things being equal, NS-only brass will last a little longer than FLS'd brass. You are certainly "working" the brass more. However, it is not a large difference, and insignificant unless you have a special wildcat chamber that requires a LOT of brass prep.

I don't dispute that it's NS-only ammo may be ***slightly*** more accurate than FLS ammo, but I've never been able to shoot the difference, and I've shot little bugholes at 200 yards on many ocassions with FLS'd brass. Maybe a benchrester could make use of the enhanced accuracy, but a tactical shooter certainly couldn't.

great info, thanks

 

[One Thumb]

In 1954 I bought a Winchester Model 70 in 257 Roberts caliber. My pay back then was $1.05 per hour and thr rifle was $157.00. I needed to reload so I also bought a Lyman 310 "Tong tool" with 5 dies for every operation and there was a no ability to get enough pressure to full length resize. All I did was neck size and fire the same cartridges time and again. Weighed every powder charge to within a tenth of a grain and once I found the right load, the groups were impressive.
I've never worn out a case and not too long ago I was at the range with a doctor who had just enlisted in the Air Force and wanted to learn how to shoot, my demo group was 3/4" at 100 yds. Not to bad for an old friend of a rifle and an old coot at the trigger.
I neck size as much as possible.

 

[Deadshot2]

I had a bench rest guy tell me when he set the record for group and score, he full length resized every firing.

Did he also tell you that he had his rifle chambered with a nice tight chamber so that a full length sized case just barely fit in it? That his brass wasn't being "worked" all that much differently from F/L sizing to only Neck Sizing. That's pretty much a reality in the BR world.

When shooting rifles with Factory Chambers it often pays to merely neck size, shoulder bumping only s necessary to insure proper bolt operation, so the case isn't overworked. That is if you really are concerned with case life.

 

[dauntedfuture]

For what its worth I don't neck size anything. I have tried NS in several .308 and .223 bolt guns. I find that in highpower and factory chambers I get inconsistent bolt close when I neck size which indicates that that the cases are not all the same dimensions. You need consistent sized cases in your rifle. If your cases are not sized consistently you will experience variations in velocity. At 1000 yds this can be .5 to 1 MOA. I have found that in all my rifles, the primer pockets are the first thing to go. As such, there is no reason to attempt to keep necks from splitting etc. I cant speak to BR rifles, but as I see things in a standard factory type chamber there is not a benefit for neck sizing other then you don't need to lube cases. I use FL dies and attempt to bump the necks back .002, but provided im bumping .002-.005 and its consistent, I don't think ill see a difference in real case life and I don't think there is a real difference with accuracy on target that I can see shooting highpower, there might be if I was a BR shooter attempting to shave .020 off a group at 200 yds etc. I suggest the following experiment if you neck size; chronograph a 10 shot group, number and record each case, I suspect that those cases that are easier to close or harder to close then others will have more of a variation in velocity then others. I have done this and this is what I noted.

 

[Deadshot2]

For what its worth I don't neck size anything. I have tried NS in several .308 and .223 bolt guns. I find that in highpower and factory chambers I get inconsistent bolt close when I neck size which indicates that that the cases are not all the same dimensions. You need consistent sized cases in your rifle. If your cases are not sized consistently you will experience variations in velocity. At 1000 yds this can be .5 to 1 MOA. I have found that in all my rifles, the primer pockets are the first thing to go. As such, there is no reason to attempt to keep necks from splitting etc. I cant speak to BR rifles, but as I see things in a standard factory type chamber there is not a benefit for neck sizing other then you don't need to lube cases. I use FL dies and attempt to bump the necks back .002, but provided im bumping .002-.005 and its consistent, I don't think ill see a difference in real case life and I don't think there is a real difference with accuracy on target that I can see shooting highpower, there might be if I was a BR shooter attempting to shave .020 off a group at 200 yds etc. I suggest the following experiment if you neck size; chronograph a 10 shot group, number and record each case, I suspect that those cases that are easier to close or harder to close then others will have more of a variation in velocity then others. I have done this and this is what I noted.

Have you ever tried a Forster Neck Size/Shoulder Bump Bushing Die? I've found that it does a great job of making cases chamber smoothly while only neck sizing and bumping the shoulders the amount you prefer. When combined with a Redding Competion Shell Holder Set it's produce extremely uniform shoulder bumps. With the shell holders that have .002" increments of adjustment, you can set the die so the press cams over then adjust bump with a different shell holder. This makes sure that there is no 'press slop' being factored into the process. Just like when one uses a "Dead Length" seating die.

I like the idea of neck sizing only because it gives me maximum case capacity. In some rifles that can make the difference between just a 100% fill and "crunch".

 

[damoncali]

The "benchrest guys do it" reasoning isn't really even valid. Lots of BR guys full length size (they may use custom dies and do it the absolute bare minimum required, but it's still full length sizing). There's an argument to be made that it's better than neck sizing because it allows for more room for the bullet to center itself in the bore. Not sure if I totally buy that one way or another, but in my experience, FL sizing does not reduce accuracy, even for benchrest rifles.

What it will do is keep you from getting a round stuck in the chamber, which is always a good thing. There is no downside to FL sizing. If you do it properly, your brass will last a long time. I'm on firing number 10 of some 6XC brass that has never been annealed. Haven't lost a single case yet.

 

[dauntedfuture]

Deadshot2, I have not tried the Foster Neck/ shoulder dies. The advantage I see is that with a body formed to the chamber the ctg should be a little better centered. All I used in my 6.5x.284 is a standard redding FL die and a foster BR seating die. I have begun to experiment with FL bushing dies in .223 and .308 as well as neck turning .308 on some of my ammo to get more uniform neck tension and reduce my ES numbers.

 

[InkedIan]

Get this.... Despite everything i've read about needing to bump the shoulder or FL sizing in order for a rifle to run reliably(especially with an AR). I'm a firm believer in finding out the hard way(unless very dangerous) so I decided the only neck size(lee collect die) my AR308 handloads and to my surprise I saw a small accuracy increase and have had zero problems with reliability. Doesn't mean you will get the same result, but it doesn't hurt to try. In a lot of cases I find it's best to find out for yourself because you'll see a lot of "my way is right" or "it didn't work for me so it's wrong" on most forums and sometimes you'll find the "norm" isn't what works the best for you.

 

[dauntedfuture]

Provided you shot the brass in that AR based rifle you can safely neck size ammo in an AR type rifle. The right might not function as it should, but in most cases its just fine. You have lots on inertia behind the bolt to lock the rifle up. While I have not NSed ammo for my AR service rifle I know of several guys in KY that did/do this to avoid having to lube the cases.

 

[damoncali]

The trouble with neck sizing is that it works great until it doesn't. Eventually, something gets stuck.

 

[orkan]

I use custom FL sizing dies. Best of both worlds. Custom neck sizing, and minimum operational bump everywhere else.

 

[DIBBS]

The trouble with neck sizing is that it works great until it doesn't. Eventually, something gets stuck.

and having stuck a case myself, I choose to FL size and measure shoulder bump with a comparator. I tried tight necks and NS only...and for me it was MUCH more trouble than it was worth, particularly with a field rifle. A couple coyote hunts ended early because of...a stuck case, and another time or two (ok I'm a slow learner...) a bullet in the rifling and powdah in the chamber. Sucks when you're an hour from cleaning equipment...

 

[07yzryder]

for my 338 and 308 boltguns i typically FL size them, Never had any issues with brass life aside from typical FGMM loose primers after a few firings. Ill also be annealing the brass every 3-4 loads with a local annealer to soften the worked brass back to soft.

I was always told on the FL sizing to measure a fired case and bump it .002 fire it again measure repeat until the case stops growing. You know now your rifles headspace, write that down and size to .002 less.

 

[Deadshot2]

a bullet in the rifling and powdah in the chamber. Sucks when you're an hour from cleaning equipment...

Why not just carry a "GI Cleaning kit", a can of lighter fluid, and a bore snake. Use the cleaning kit rod to knock the bullet out, the lighter fluid to "flush" and the bore snake to finish cleaning. Don't want the "steel against steel" from the cleaning rod? Just put a single wrap of electrical tape on the rod segments.

Just remember, "If it can happen it will happen someday". Even if you F/L size etc, there eventually will be a situation where you will want to clean a bore. How about after a fall and you have some mud stuck in the muzzle. No need to end the hunt if you're prepared.

 

[spamassassin]

I FL size everything that's semi-automatic. Usually with small base dies. Each full length sizing gets a check for case length and a trim. For guns that I don't have to worry so much about smooth automatic feeding I normally prefer to neck size. As far as brass life, my powder charge weights seem to affect my brass life a lot more than my sizing choices.

 

[InkedIan]

and another time or two (ok I'm a slow learner...) a bullet in the rifling and powdah in the chamber. Sucks when you're an hour from cleaning equipment...

a bullet stuck in the rifling has nothing to do with sizing(except neck tension)... Thats all seating depth.

 

[ksthomas]

Full Length size, only, and always in any autoloader. S/B sizing die, even better, and just a little added insurance that makes things easier on the rifle. You guys who are neck sizing, stand by. Can't say just when, but I'll promise you, you will see the light after Murphy visits. There's so many reasons for this I don't even want to get started on them here. Suffice it to say, you're asking for trouble, and you'll get it at some pint. Whether that's just a jammed round that can't fully chamber and now can't be extracted, a slam fire, or a full on out of battery firing, it WILL eventually bite you.

 

[Seandradamus]

Full Length size, only, and always in any autoloader. S/B sizing die, even better, and just a little added insurance that makes things easier on the rifle. You guys who are neck sizing, stand by. Can't say just when, but I'll promise you, you will see the light after Murphy visits. There's so many reasons for this I don't even want to get started on them here. Suffice it to say, you're asking for trouble, and you'll get it at some pint. Whether that's just a jammed round that can't fully chamber and now can't be extracted, a slam fire, or a full on out of battery firing, it WILL eventually bite you.

TRUTH
when I started getting into long range shooting seriously, I started neck sizing only ,you know ,to get the most accurate loads,
After 2 firings the rounds started getting stuck in the chamber I would have to slap my bolt open, I was irritated these were great loads I worked up and now 2 out of 3 were sticking . I reluctantly tried some fl sized with the same loads. BINGO...exact same accuracy and no sticky chamber. Learned my lesson