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Rifle Scopes Flipping a coin between USO and PH

ZLBubba

ZLBubba

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Minuteman
Jan 15, 2009
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After doing a lot of research, I've pretty much narrowed my new scope pick down to 2: the USO with Horus reticle or the PH. Both are nearly the same price with the options I chose, both are American companies, and both have glowing recommendations from those who use them. I've heard there's a backlog for Horus reticles at USO, though, so I'm leaning toward the PH for the sake of time. It seems like I can't go wrong with either one. The USO's reputation for CS is pretty fantastic, and the one factor that I don't know much about in terms of PH. Any thoughts?

The scope will be for a custom 308 AICS build for 600-1000m comps. I'll be getting a 260 barrel for my rifle as well.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

You cant go wrong with both, if time isnt a concern USO with the Horus reticle you will be pleased. PH is also a great optic, im waiting on a PH 5-25, if you are going to be deployed for a few more months and can wait USO seems like your choice, if you are CONUS and dont want to wait PH. But as i said you cant go wrong with either
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

I love my USO with the Horus, have one, waiting on another now.... The PR is an awesome looking scope, but I just couldn't get with the Gen2XR reticle. I almost pulled the trigger on one, but decided to stick with the USO/Horus.

I think you'll be happy with the quality of either, it sounds like it will come down to which reticle you want...
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

USO!
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

Does anyone know the approximate wait time at USO for the Horus reticles? I did in fact get extended for a few more months so I've got extra time before I actually mount it on a rifle and take it shooting.

If I go with the Horus H25, what device should I use for the ballistics tables for that reticle? I like to get ahead of the tech curve instead of having to update every couple years because I went too cheap the first time. Buy once, cry once.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

Shoot me a PM. I will talk with Arnold and get a definitive answer as this is the 2nd query on this reticle I've had in as many hours. Build time currently is about 14 weeks +/-.

Mil-Dot Master is always the answer.

Cheers,

Doc
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

While I have no experiance with PR, I can tell you that you will not find a better company than USO to give your money to. They pretty much wrote the book on excellent customer service!
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

I can speak about both..I traded off a Gen II XR in the PR 3-15. You can't see the reticle until on about 8x. I will state that I wear corrective lenses and that can contribute to the problem. Corrective leneses don't work with all optics equally. I traded it for a SN3 with H-25 and can see it down to 3.2 power. I want to see the Gen II XR in a SN3. Go with the H-25 in a SN3 or the Gen II XR wold be vote.

I will say the PR is one of the best mechanically designed scopes made but the XR reticle maybe works ok in the 5-25..but not the 3-15.

One reason I liked the SH IOR reticle Boyette designed was it was usable down to 3x for close up shooting.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

If you are looking for comps, I would go with the USO with the H25. The H25 is the fastest reticle next to a DTAC setup.

Personally I'm waiting on a PR 5-25, but am not sure how I will warm up to the GenIIXR, we'll see when it gets here. My choice was guided by a major factor though, Scott at Liberty Optics. He worked some horse trading with me to put me into the top level optics.

The SN3 I had was fine, I just didn't like the Type1 moa reticle for comps.


Both USO and Premier are whoop-ass CS.
S&B may be stepping up on the CS end by having a Service facility stateside sometime in the future.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

I think they are both great scopes. I prefer the Erek knob of the USO to PR's but the optics are better with PR. In the end, I decided to sell my two USOs and have a PR.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

I think your method of choosing is the best way as both make excellent optics and have outstanding service! If you want one now Premier will be easier, if you want the horus, go USO. Either will make you happy.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

I'm on the waiting list for the PH as well. I already have the SN3 3.2-17x with all of the trimmings. My rifle is also being set as a switch barrel. I decided to try the PH as a replacement for the SN3 for the following reasons:

Re-zeroing: I already shoot several loads in 1 caliber and re-zeroing the EREK is a PITA. There is no way to get even a rough zero (at the stop) without shooting the rifle. If you know the offsets between two loads, it should be easy to adjust your zero without even firing. I do this all the time with my Quad, switching between .22 LR and .17 HMR and I am at most off by 0.1 mil. Adjusting the EREK is fiddle work and its hard to get it to stop exactly on 0. Its meant to be rock solid for a single load, adjust it once and forget about it. I deal multiple loads now by setting the stop to my lowest zero and then just moving the knob to new zeros or making range cards with offsets. Only one load uses the stop and it isn't the one that really needs it. So, its paying for a feature that I'm not using, but wanted to use.

Tactile feel: I don't like the feel of the clicks on my SN3. They feel kind of mushy IMO as compared to NF or S&B, for example.

Clarity: I've found it to be less clear than the majority of NF and S&B scopes I've seen at the range.

Illumination: inconvenient to get at unless you leave the cap off. I don't like leaving fine thread exposed so I don't do it. Illumination is very useful if you have a fine crosshair that sometimes gets lost on dark backgrounds. The convenience of the PH switch is a big plus.

Magnification: You get more of it for the money with the PH and you have a low range that is still usable by all accounts.

If you can, try and get a look at both of them in person before you purchase. I'm hoping that the PH will solve a lot of the issues I don't like about the SN3. But, I'm keeping the SN3 until I'm satisfied that it does.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

Fortunately I don't have corrective lenses anymore. Uncle Sam zapped my eyes last year with LASEK and I've been living easy ever since. If you're active duty and haven't taken advantage of that eye surgery, don't miss out. It's phenomenal.

One of the primary reasons I'm leaning heavily toward the H25 reticle is so that I don't have to constantly be dialing the wind and elevation, and then returning back to zero. Most of my scoped rifle shooting has been with Leupolds up to this point so I'm not nearly as discerning as some of you. That doesn't mean I want to skimp on my scope, but I'll be a bit more forgiving when it comes some features since the reticle is designed to make using holdover and windage easier.

Doc PM'ed me that they offer a military discount as well, and that alone means a lot. 10% on a purchase like this is chunk of change. And I have to admit that after reading that post about the pinched USO scope tube that USO replaced for free, I'm heavily leaning in that direction.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

Get what works best for you based on how you plan to use it now. Once you get some time on it, you're opinions may or may not change... Scopes like these hold their value pretty well, so you aren't loosing much if you decide to go a different route in the future.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

Check out the Mil-Scale MPR reticle for holdovers. The Horus reticle is useful once your used to it but it is easy to look at the wrong hash mark.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

Both are great scopes. I looked through them both and thought the Premier was crystal.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

I have owned 4 USO scopes and 1 spotter. I now have 1 St 10 and 3 PR Heritage scopes. I don't see how anyone can prefer the EREK to the Heritage knob unless you are running 1/2 " clicks. With 1/4" clicks you get 22.5 moa (iphy) per rev. Even with my 260 Rem that is over 1 rev to reach 1000 with the EREK. With Heritage less than 1 rev to 1000 even with my M1A. USO cs is great but out of 4 scopes ,I had to send 2 back. One was a major screw up on their part the other was minor. I remember Zak Smith saying one out of 3 or 4 USO scopes have to go back to get tweaked. My experience was similar. PR has better glass and features I like better. USO makes very good scopes but seem to have quality control issues that have not been addressed. Their superb custom service wouldn't be needed nearly as often if better quality controls were used before the scopes were shipped out the first time. If you check with Scott at Liberty optics , I think you will find PR will be less expensive than USO even with military discount. The gen 2 xr reticle would probably help with holdoffs.

david
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Everyone I know that bought a USO sold them and bought better telescopes.</div></div>

Includes me.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

Nasir: "Your quality will be known among your enemies, before ever you meet them." -Kingdom of Heaven

It is a good thing, my friend.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lindy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Everyone I know that bought a USO sold them and bought better telescopes.</div></div>

Includes me.
</div></div>

Includes me too....
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

Damn I feel like a total cowboy here marching to his own drum getting rid of a Heritage, but if you can't see through that damn thing its worthless. Maybe when they get the Horusvision reticles out..I will revisit the issue. Nightforce as of today is still monkeying around seeing if they can make the Horus's work so thats dead issue.

So I guess I will be the only dumbass on the Hide buying up your cheap lightly used scopes now that they have very little value.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

ZL

Another vote for the Premier, and their CS. I have used PR's Customer Service recently and it was outstanding. I had a minor issue with my 3-15 and called them to ask about it. Next thing I know I'm on the phone with Jerry. He explained the issue to me in detail and told me to send the scope in and he would take care of it personnaly as soon as it hit the door. He then gave me info to have them billed for the shipping. The scope was gone a total of 4 days. He even called me on my cell to tell me what he had done and that it was on its way back. When it arrived it was perfect. I cant say enough about the way I was treated. It's very clear to me that PR is all about taking care of their customers.

Kit
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

Wow, thanks for all the responses. I read that PH was adding Horus to their reticle line up and realized my decision got that much harder. I assume the Horus markup will happen to PH just like it did to USO. I somewhat doubt there will be an enormous difference. Still, I'm going to wait on the pricing before I make a decision either way.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

If their doing the Horus reticle then I'm getting one!!!!!

That's the only thing that it was missing.It'll be the ultimate scope!!!!

Steve
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

I would get the Premier. You should read up on the comparison that we had in the Houston area.
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

My pick
9g9a8k.jpg
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

dammit man i am going stir crazy waiting on my 5-25. Scott says end of the month. Im tryin to keep my nerves in check
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

Loving my 5-25 PH so far. Big step up in quality and features vs the 6.5-20 mark4 I had before
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

My kind of thread.

As a dealer who sells one and takes the other in trade, I have a unique perspective on what works and what doesn't.

Bottom line: It's hard to go wrong with either.

Scott
 
Re: Flipping a coin between USO and PH

I have most of them USO, Leupold as personal property and S&B PMII and NSX as part of the scopes mounted on work guns.
All are good scopes but my money will go to a SN3 again and again.
Their is something about it that makes me confident, it is more clear and luminous than leupold and NSX, about the same as the PMII but it is made to your specs, built like a tank and BEAUTIFUL. YES !!!!! that counts for metoo.
I have not had the chance to test the Premiere units, but I have two premiere tritium reticles on old Leupolds and they never failed on me.
I wish I could test one.... but for now
my USO SN-2 5-25x56 TPAL full MILS with ilum RDP reticles
RULES!!!
NOTE: It may sound little professional but my SN3 is the beauty champ on all scope comparisons. They ask me about it all the time, and when they look though it they say: WOW!!!
Eduardo

FILE0651smallSSGvsLONGbarrelPACK.jpg

http://i584.photobucket.com/albums/ss282/REALcybersniper/FILE0651smallSSGvsLONGbarrelPACK.jpg
 
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