• Watch Out for Scammers!

    We've now added a color code for all accounts. Orange accounts are new members, Blue are full members, and Green are Supporters. If you get a message about a sale from an orange account, make sure you pay attention before sending any money!

Gold, God and Guns! ???

Phil1

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Mar 3, 2009
465
7
Minot N.D.
June 12, 2010
Uncertainty Restores Glitter to an Old Refuge, Gold
By NELSON D. SCHWARTZ

It is the resurgent passion of the doomsday crowd, a bet that everything will go wrong. No matter what has you worried, they say, the answer is gold.

Inflation, deflation, government borrowing or the plunging euro — you name it — the specter of these concerns has set off a dash to gold, driving the precious metal to new highs and illustrating how fears of economic turmoil have moved from the fringe to the mainstream.

And gold bugs, often dismissed as crackpots who hoard gold bars in the basement, are finally having their day.

“I just think you’re in a world where a lot of chickens are coming home to roost,” said John Hathaway, manager of the Tocqueville Gold fund. “Gold is an escape hatch.”

The most visible new gold enthusiasts range from the Fox News commentator Glenn Beck on the right to the financier George Soros on the left, with even some sober-minded Wall Street types developing a case of gold fever. While their language may differ, they share a fundamental view that the age-old refuge of gold is relevant again, especially as other assets like stocks and national currencies show signs of weakness.

Now, individual investors are following their example around the world. The United States Mint is running short of gold coins, and the South African mint increased Krugerrand production by 50 percent late last month, to its highest level in 25 years, on brisk European demand.

The debt crisis in Europe and the ensuing drop in the value of the euro are the most recent catalysts for gold’s spike last week to $1,254 an ounce, a record before adjusting for inflation, but the deeper concern is that even in the United States, government borrowing is unsustainable and the day of reckoning is at hand. Sales of American Eagle one-ounce gold coins tripled in May from the month before.

If governments print more money to pay off their debts, the logic goes, inflation will destroy the value of the dollar, the euro and other paper currencies — thus enhancing the value of gold. What is more, with tax increases unlikely and with Europe on the brink, the unthinkable — a sovereign debt default or the collapse of the credit system — has suddenly become thinkable.

To be sure, gold buyers have always been motivated by fear. What has changed is that some of the most respected investors on Wall Street are now among the fearful.

“In recent years, we have gone from one bubble and bailout to the next,” David Einhorn, a New York money manager who was among the first to foretell the failure of Lehman Brothers, said in a speech last month. “Our gold position reflects our concern that our fiscal and monetary policies are not sufficiently geared toward heading off a possible crisis.”

Since ancient times, gold has been deemed intrinsically valuable, holding its worth even as governments fell and currencies collapsed, while seemingly casting a spell on its owners.

Still, gold can go down — sometimes sharply. After peaking in 1980 at more than $800 an ounce, gold sank over the next two decades, bottoming out at just over $250 an ounce in 1999. But unlike paper assets that can become worthless, gold always retains at least some value.

These days, gold is also something of a political Rorschach test. On conservative talk radio, opposition to the Obama administration’s economic policies and warnings that huge budget deficits will set off runaway inflation have made gold a hot topic of on-air discussion — and lured gold companies as advertisers.

Tongue only half in cheek, Glenn Beck advised his audience to consider “Gold, God and Guns,” while laying out three possible scenarios for the economy: recession, depression or collapse.

One major advertiser on Mr. Beck’s show is Goldline, a huge California marketer of gold coins and bars that is also a sponsor of programs hosted by other prominent conservative commentators like Laura Ingraham and Mike Huckabee. Mr. Beck has said he “was a client of Goldline long before they were a client of mine,” adding: “I personally don’t buy gold as an investment. I buy it for protection.”

Of course, the right hardly has a monopoly on gold. Mr. Soros, a prominent donor to liberal causes and candidates, holds more than $600 million in bullion and gold mining shares.

Even as worries about the global economy have intensified, gold has become easier to buy.

Although some people still regard bars of gold in a vault as the ultimate insurance policy, exchange-traded funds, or E.T.F.’s, that hold gold have exploded in popularity in recent years. Gold E.T.F.’s, which trade like stocks but track the price of physical gold, account for 1,856 tons of gold, up from less than 500 tons in 2005, according to Credit Suisse.

Besides luring individual investors, these funds have also made gold more appealing to hedge funds and other institutions, allowing them to own vast amounts of gold without the burden of having to store it.

John A. Paulson, a top New York hedge fund manager who earned billions betting against subprime mortgages, holds $3 billion worth of gold E.T.F.’s, making gold the largest single position in his $35 billion portfolio.

Daniel J. Arbess, who manages more than $2 billion in Perella Weinberg’s Xerion fund, is another new gold lover. A few years ago, he said, he would not have taken a second look at gold as an investment. But now Mr. Arbess, a Harvard Law graduate and a generally conservative investor, is very serious about gold.

Spiraling deficits in the United States, Japan and Britain are unsustainable, he said, and could eventually hurt confidence in what are called “fiat currencies” — paper money not backed by gold, including the United States dollar.

“Indebted countries may soon be forced to choose among three politically difficult alternatives: sharp cuts in expenditures, debt default or printing money to pay off debt,” he said, with the last option the most likely outcome. Gold, he said, is a logical hedge against this risk, because firing up the printing presses ignites inflation.

True believers note that gold has risen in each of the last nine years, and that while the Standard & Poor’s 500-stock index is down 13 percent since 2001, gold is now worth nearly five times what it was then.

For all its newfound respectability, gold still manages to bring out the inner survivalist in its adherents. Gold bugs like Peter Schiff of the investment firm Euro Pacific Capital in Westport, Conn., envision a black market arising in the United States, with merchants refusing paper money and insisting on gold instead, while Mr. Hathaway, the gold fund manager, says the credit system has entered “the end game.”

“People probably still think I’m nuts,” Mr. Hathaway said. “But I’m not talking to myself in an isolation chamber anymore. We’ve got company now.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/13/busine...BHSlkTvavAGxiag
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

Seems this is Déjà vu of the late 70's early 80's when that recession was ramping up, everyone was crying the blues and I remember the gold guys were saying buy buy buy because you can protect yourself from the failing dollar. And they were laughing on the way to the bank because they were selling high and buying back low later on. If you truly believe people like goldline want to protect you from the falling/failing dollar think again. They are in the business of making money and if they were really worried about the dollar disappearing, I doubt they would be trading dollars in exchange for gold. Probably would be hoarding it themselves for when that is the only acceptable form of currency. Problem is what is typical of human nature is people have a tendency to buy when things are going up or are already up because it looks good, it's safe. Typically when everyone starts jumping on the bandwagon, it is time to start planning an exit.

Compare the DJI to gold over the last 30 years (80 to the present) and gold is up apprx 118% (559-1220) . The DJI is still up roughly 1133% (828-10211) even in a recession. Not to mention last time I checked, gold doesn't pay dividends.

Also I like how they compare the S&P 500 to gold. They took a historic lower point for gold and compared it to what appears to be the highest point the S&P was in 2001. When in reality if you take its lowest point during 2001 (965) and compare it to what it is today(1091) which is more in line like what they are doing with gold, it is actually up 13%.

My only regret is not having a shitload of gold picked up in the 90's to sell to sell to Glenn Beck right now.
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

now is the time to dump or hold gold, not buy it. sell it and buy ammo instead
smile.gif
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

All the hype for gold is coming from the people that OWN gold.
If you are hearing that you should buy gold then it's already too late.
Profits are only maximized to the current owners from the current buyers.

+1, Buy ammunition instead
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

actually buy shares in companies that mine rare earth minerals instead!china currently controls about 97% of the market.
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

May not be the optimum time to sell ones worldly possessions and buy gold, however gold has gone up 28% in the last year. Nothing to turn your nose up at. Also not a guarantee of future performance.
At the present silver would be my choice, again only with $$ that aren't needed for day to day operation. The gold / silver price ratio is way out of whack. Gold and silver are more of an insurance then anything.
Even the coin and bullion merchants usually talk about 5-10% of wealth in precious metals. If purchasing, use due diligence, common sense, and moderation. Up to the minute prices are available at kitco.com There also links there that will give you current buy/ sell prices on bullion, coins etc.
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

I've heard it said in the last few weeks (twice this week) by financial analysts that I trust that because of the expiring tax cuts and coming tax increases next year (on top of everything else) that our economy will almost assuredly collapse. This isn't like the 70's and 80's by any stretch.
I'm just sayin...
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

Sorry ,I can't eat gold,nor shoot it out of my firearms.
Food,seeds,and good gear,clothes are beter investments,IMHO.

Can someone please explain the true value of gold,or silver,other then decorative or industrial?

All I see are the wheelbarrels of Lira just to buy a loaf of bread.
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BAMCIS</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry ,I can't eat gold,nor shoot it out of my firearms.
Food,seeds,and good gear,clothes are beter investments,IMHO.

Can someone please explain the true value of gold,or silver,other then decorative or industrial?

All I see are the wheelbarrels of Lira just to buy a loaf of bread. </div></div>X2.
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EmergencyNrse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All the hype for gold is coming from the people that OWN gold.</div></div>
Precisely.
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steelcomp</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BAMCIS</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry ,I can't eat gold,nor shoot it out of my firearms.
Food,seeds,and good gear,clothes are beter investments,IMHO.

Can someone please explain the true value of gold,or silver,other then decorative or industrial?

All I see are the wheelbarrels of Lira just to buy a loaf of bread. </div></div>X2. </div></div>


<span style="font-weight: bold">Money 101</span>

Just to scratch the surface here. The idea is far more detailed and complex.

Money is what the government says it is...
The US Government says it stands behind the Dollar so it is our "legal" tender for goods & services as a means of exchange.

If you have dollars in your possession then you have a representation of value that is far from definite. Its a promise that the government will pay you the value for your dollar. The problem: That value like gold changes.

Hell, The dollar is nothing more than a "Federal Reserve Note" from the Federal Reserve Bank a <span style="font-weight: bold">PRIVATE</span> (yes private) entity that no more a part of Government than Federal Express.
The dollar is paper nothing more. When there is no more value to the dollar you will have nothing. Gold, Silver, Oil will always have value. It might not be as much as you paid for it in dollars but will still HAVE value as a means of exchange. Paper has no worth.

<span style="font-size: 8pt">The purchasing power of the dollar has been dwindling since the 50's. CREDIT kills and the US Gubment has been selling the souls of its sons and daughters for decades. It owes far more than it can repay. We can barely pay on the interest on all the defecit/borrowing. Freedom is an illusion from the banking industry. We the people no longer control this Republic. If you owe money then you are a slave. It could be said that it has been going down since the establishment of the Federal Reserve. A crime perpetrated by big banking on the American people while they were sleeping. The US Government owes money and that weakens our position in this world. We started paying interest on the first bill that was printed by the Federal Reserve and it's been getting worse ever since.</span>


Savings, 401k's, Stocks, Bonds... all in dollars. If that is all you have at the end of the day...
when the music stops and dollars have no longer any value. You're fucked!

Again, just an intro to money here. I suggest a little more research on the issue to protect yourself. You shouldn't be depending on money here, it's a false sense of security. Whatever direction you go in absolutely get out of any debt and owe nothing.
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EmergencyNrse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Hell, The dollar is nothing more than a "Federal Reserve Note" from the Federal Reserve Bank a <span style="font-weight: bold">PRIVATE</span> (yes private) entity that no more a part of Government than Federal Express.
The dollar is paper nothing more. When there is no more value to the dollar you will have nothing. Gold, Silver, Oil will always have value. It might not be as much as you paid for it in dollars but will still HAVE value as a means of exchange. Paper has no worth.

<span style="font-size: 8pt">The purchasing power of the dollar has been dwindling since the 50's. CREDIT kills and the US Gubment has been selling the souls of its sons and daughters for decades. It owes far more than it can repay. We can barely pay on the interest on all the defecit/borrowing. Freedom is an illusion from the banking industry. We the people no longer control this Republic. If you owe money then you are a slave. It could be said that it has been going down since the establishment of the Federal Reserve. A crime perpetrated by big banking on the American people while they were sleeping. The US Government owes money and that weakens our position in this world. We started paying interest on the first bill that was printed by the Federal Reserve and it's been getting worse ever since.</span>


Savings, 401k's, Stocks, Bonds... all in dollars. If that is all you have at the end of the day, when the music stops and dollars have no longer any value. You're fucked!

Again, just an intro to money here. I suggest a little more research on the issue to protect yourself. You shouldn't be depending on money here, it's a false sense of security. Whatever direction you go in absolutely get out of any debt and owe nothing. </div></div>

I realize you are responding to BAMCIS question an the value of gold. But I call BS.

First, while the federal reserve is technically a private institution, congress still maintains absolute legal authority to shut down, reorganize, or take direct control of it through the same legislation that created it in the first place.

Second, the dollar doesn't have value because the government promises to pay anything. The dolor has value because if someone refuses to take it as payment, you are no longer legally responsible for your debt to said person; as such they can not seek any legal remedy for your "non-payment".

Third, even if hyperinflation were to transpire, every hard asset you own has value. When it costs a trillion to buy a loaf of bread, you can still trade a brick of top ramen for bread. Every commodity is a hedge against inflation; or do you reason that gold will be the only metal that goes up in value? What about lead, copper, and brass?

Fourth, Saving will do you little good, be it gold or bonds. Gold doesn't actually gain much value during hyperinflation, it mostly holds it. If a gram of gold will by you a cow today, it will theoretically buy you a cow when you would need a wheelbarrow full of cash for one. I say theoretically, because you are going to run into guys like me, BAMCIS, and steelcomp, who don't see the value of gold for survival. The true winners in a hyperinflation economy are the indebted. My mortgage contract does not fluctuate with inflation, and congress doesn't have the authority to make it; so if they are handing out trillion dolor notes at the soup kitchen, my mortgage is paid. If the bank refuses to take it as payment I'm no longer obligated to pay them back. I win. the only kind of debt you should be striving to unload is adjustable interest rate debt, because the interest rates will skyrocket. Pay it off, or roll it into a fixed rate loan ASAP.


In any case, the best plan of action for feeding your family is to buy seeds, learn how to reclaim them from the food you grow with them, and learn to live with less meat. Now, buy ammo and teach your family to shoot, so you can keep the looters at bay.


 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

Physical gold does not produce an income stream like bonds, dividend paying stocks, or Real Estate.

If you buy gold as an investment, you are counting purely on asset appreciation, which is ultimately a game of timing.

IMHO gold should be used to preserve wealth, not create it.
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tigerbikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> If you buy gold as an investment, you are counting purely on asset appreciation, which is ultimately a game of timing. </div></div>

exactly a "game" which is why I would choose physical gold... that is after the powder, primers, bullets, and guns!!!
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

Anybody ever wonder why, after all the uncounatable financial collapses, through time immemorial, every economy above the level of clubs and stone tools has used fiat money as a means of exchange.

Any economy is based on faith. The belief, as JR pointed out, that what you offer will be accepted as a means of exchange and be a reasonable store of value for the near, to moderately long term, future.

No one will be able to make change for a gold coin. Hell, most people can't even buy a car worth a damn let alone conduct all their transactions in a barter economy, which is what a collapse into a gold (and any other precious commodity) based specie would mean.

In a society where people tolereate the intolerable, it is easy to speak about a calamitous, distopic future where the rules we've all played by seem to have evaporated. While there is a potential for the end times to befall us, the odds are far greater that the future, long and short term, is more likely to be like the present than the hell advertised by some in the panic industry.

Self reliance, a once accepted hallmark of most American's work ethic, is essential. Being stampeded by high margin sucker seekers is more of the same kind of gullibility that duped people into buying Pets.com stock in '99' and termite infested shitholes in 2007.

The best financial advice is best summarized by the time honored saying,

"Don't be a dumbass!"

 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

EmergencyNrse,,you have not convinced me of the value of gold.

Once upon a time we had a gold backed system,and silver certificates. The silver certificates could actually be traded for silver.

Now we have a paper backed currancy,guarented by our respected governments.

IF the economy fails,your $1200/once of gold would be worth less then you paid. It would be worth a meal,maybe 2.
wink.gif


No one has yet convinced me of 2 things
1-The value of gold,silver,platinum,jems
2-The real reason for inflation/ $ devaluation{IMHO this is greed plain and simple}

I did take Economics,and understand WHY money replaced a barter system.
I argued then my same points,about gold,silver,platinum,even diamond,emeralds.
To the average person they are worthless,except for jewrelry.

Industry does have uses,for rare earth metals.
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BAMCIS</div><div class="ubbcode-body">EmergencyNrse,,you have not convinced me of the value of gold.

Once upon a time we had a gold backed system,and silver certificates. The silver certificates could actually be traded for silver.

Now we have a paper backed currancy,guarented by our respected governments.

IF the economy fails,your $1200/once of gold would be worth less then you paid. It would be worth a meal,maybe 2.
wink.gif


No one has yet convinced me of 2 things
1-The value of gold,silver,platinum,jems
2-The real reason for inflation/ $ devaluation{IMHO this is greed plain and simple}

I did take Economics,and understand WHY money replaced a barter system.
I argued then my same points,about gold,silver,platinum,even diamond,emeralds.
To the average person they are worthless,except for jewrelry.

Industry does have uses,for rare earth metals. </div></div>Gold will be a valuable commodity among those who value it. My greatest "asset" is myself. Drop me naked on a mountain top and I'll survive. Drop me in an economy where the only thing you have to barter with is your skill sets, and I'll flourish. I feel sorry (well, not really) for those people who are at the mercy of society, and can only survive on what they can buy and "plug in". THEY are the ones at the mercy of the con man. All the gold and silver in the world can't change that.
Besides, you can't take a single gram or penny weight with you when you're dead. You're better off worrying about your eternal investments than wasting a lot of time arguing about which or what is more valuable.
JMO
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

Economy is failing due to failing trust and people having enough. Trust was squandered by bastards, getting rich with market manipulations, money printing and government with its spending. All that however has absolutely no bearing on individual and his security per se. If civilization fails then its going to be MadMax on steroids and in that case only thing that will matter will be friends whom one can trust (lots of them), food/food production (lots of it), guns&ammo (huge amounts of it) for protection of both of the above. If there is only a long depression/inflation coming then there will be no Madmax scenes but more like totalitarian government with possibly a major war (good way to reduce/distract population) in that case what you'll need is still friends/food but also a way to protect any excess capital you might have today.

Gold is only a way to store excess in a more mobile way. So when does it come into play, after you've got yourself nice little farm, buddies close by, weapons stacked (ammo can be procured later at no expense...) and farm equipped. Now you've got all that and you still have plenty of capital in stocks, bonds, laying around in your pillow. With that buy gold at least some of it. In case of total civilization collapse there will sure be a barter system with gold having it's place however with amount of human vermin on the planet first currency will be food and maybe after initial "cleaning" a more advanced system of exchange (with possibly gold based - i doubt it though as survivors will have absolutely no desire to return to this system we have today but 100% stocks and bonds will be worthless).

Of course gold/silver/platinum are still good investments even today as they are climbing however be sure to be conservative and set your priorities as in this wild times anything can happen. There is no magic recipe that will in one swing rescue the problem of survival in this coming shitstorm...
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phil1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...
Although some people still regard bars of gold in a vault as the ultimate insurance policy, exchange-traded funds, or E.T.F.’s, that hold gold have exploded in popularity in recent years. Gold E.T.F.’s, which trade like stocks but track the price of physical gold, account for 1,856 tons of gold, up from less than 500 tons in 2005, according to Credit Suisse.

Besides luring individual investors, these funds have also made gold more appealing to hedge funds and other institutions, allowing them to own vast amounts of gold without the burden of having to store it....

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/13/busine...BHSlkTvavAGxiag </div></div>

The "burden"?!!!

I believe Gold (and Silver) is poised for a significant move upwards, based on Maguire's information. For every ounce of gold in an ETF, there's 100 "owners" of that same ounce (and all 100 are paying the "burden of storage" fees on that single ounce - what a deal!)....

Cheers,

Bill
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sharac</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Economy is failing due to failing trust and people having enough. Trust was squandered by bastards, getting rich with market manipulations, money printing and government with its spending. All that however has absolutely no bearing on individual and his security per se. If civilization fails then its going to be MadMax on steroids and in that case only thing that will matter will be friends whom one can trust (lots of them), food/food production (lots of it), guns&ammo (huge amounts of it) for protection of both of the above. If there is only a long depression/inflation coming then there will be no Madmax scenes but more like totalitarian government with possibly a major war (good way to reduce/distract population) in that case what you'll need is still friends/food but also a way to protect any excess capital you might have today.

Gold is only a way to store excess in a more mobile way. So when does it come into play, after you've got yourself nice little farm, buddies close by, weapons stacked (ammo can be procured later at no expense...) and farm equipped. Now you've got all that and you still have plenty of capital in stocks, bonds, laying around in your pillow. With that buy gold at least some of it. In case of total civilization collapse there will sure be a barter system with gold having it's place however with amount of human vermin on the planet first currency will be food and maybe after initial "cleaning" a more advanced system of exchange (with possibly gold based - i doubt it though as survivors will have absolutely no desire to return to this system we have today but 100% stocks and bonds will be worthless).

Of course gold/silver/platinum are still good investments even today as they are climbing however be sure to be conservative and set your priorities as in this wild times anything can happen. There is no magic recipe that will in one swing rescue the problem of survival in this coming shitstorm... </div></div>

My dystopic movie comparison for what could be is "RoboCop"

So many people today, very likely a majority sadly, believe that they are entitled to things that are to be paid for by others. This of course is nothing more than theft poised on a tasteful doiley. But good taste and a soothing voice trumps any and all logical counter points to the unending demands of the growing ranks of free stuff demanders!

With the absence of anything resembling courage or accountability (In spite of unusually high pay and benefits for so little accomplishment!)on the part of government or corporate officers above the operational level (no one in either field actually knows how to actually do anything beyond moving paper around, passing blame for the things they screw up and taking credit for the achievements of underlings in operations!), coupled with an increasing move from suburban to exurban flight, to create yet more distance between them and their tasteless (and ungrateful
frown.gif
) urban constituents, I could see a urban RoboCop nightmare of rampant crime as more likely than a rural Mad Max scenario.

Naturally, I'd rather not see either.

Here's an idea; How about we get back to good old intelligent commerce as the optimal way of allocating scarce goods to consumers of same at market prices?

Imagine...well we shouldn't have to since it has worked for millenia until enough numbers of parasites (of all classes) begin to feel entitled to what we have earned, built, created and saved.

Buy precious metals if you can afford to but crush parasitism wherever you find it.

 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

There's a reason gold is recommended.

Smart people bought in 2007 when Gold was $400 an oz (July 2007).

Gold at $1400 is a profit of $1000 an oz so they are trying to sell their investment.

Now is the worst time you could buy precious metals!!!!
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Now is the worst time you could buy precious metals!!!!
</div></div>

Problem is: Now may be the last time you could buy precious metals!!!

No black/white answer as future atm is very unpredictable even more the timetable. I did my buying in 2007 before stock crashes and i remember vividly about some preaching gold will be back to 200$ (remember bull market climbs on a wall of worry). To me future can be foretold to some degree by using lessons from history and if i sum up all the economic indicators, psychological/sociological status of the population and history I suddenly feel an urge to move to Mars and Earth be damned....hope i'm wrong and i'd rather be thousand times wrong on this one that one bit right...

We'll see what happens just remember even having a tonne of gold will not get you can of dog food if there is none or none is willing to have a tonne of gold on the other hand buying a tonne of gold and seeing price of gram quadruple will get you lots of cans... I think community and friends (not those lets have a beer kind but those real ones...) will be the most important thing in coming years...
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

The bottom line is this.

If the world ever fails apart, and The SHTF, a box of 9mm, or .223rem will be worth more than its weight in GOLD!!!!

So think about how many people will be tradings EVERYTHNIG for a rifle, and / or ammunition to run that firearm.

John
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: J.Boyette</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The bottom line is this.

If the world ever fails apart, and The SHTF, a box of 9mm, or .223rem will be worth more than its weight in GOLD!!!!

So think about how many people will be tradings EVERYTHNIG for a rifle, and / or ammunition to run that firearm.

John </div></div>

As well as food.

Yet there won't be a collapse.
Greece wasn't allowed to fail.
But there may well be some civil unrest,just like Greece.

Also <span style="font-weight: bold">IF</span> there is an economical collapse stocks and bonds might be only a dream.
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

You guys are right -

If my stocks in the last dot-com had come to fruition I would be long retired now....stocks aren't worth the paper they are printed on if you do not cash them in!

Food and ammo will be the key.

I bought my mom's silver from her but back in 1978 she and my step-dad bought $1800 worth of silver - at that price at that time. Jimmy Carter days.


Fast forward to 2 or 3 years ago I bought it from her for market value (She had cashed the "nice" coins in so I got 1200 coins)...

So she LOST money on that one by buying too high.

All things will pass, the economy will pick back up when we get a responsible gov - and we will sooner or later, always happens.

Next time around when gold is cheap, I'm going to buy a bunch of it...

and a few more boxes of these chicken-n-biscuits, damn these are good 2n ite..
 
Re: Gold, God and Guns! ???

Invest in the three B's

Beans
Bullets
Bandages