Range Report Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

[earthquake]

So currently I'm running 168gr. BTHP, with Winchester 748 powder @ 43gr. with a Winchester WLR primer in a Lake City Match case. MV = 2,500fps. I've been told that this is probably too low.

They performed pretty well at a recent 600yd. match, but I've heard also that a heavier bullet, maybe a 175gr.(?) would punch through the wind more. If so, what is a recommended powder and powder amount in gr. for a good .308 load. What would be a good target MV to aim for?

I'm thinking a Scenar 170gr. bullet or....? Of course, that's only 2 more gr. than I"m shooting now. If I go to a 190gr. what powder load would I need to get a higher MV?

Lots of questions, I know, but if you have the time to help, it'd be MUCH appreciated!

 

[pazzo]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Try 178 gr Hornady AMax! It will get you to 1000 no probs

Then again, I've shot 1300 yds with 168 gr AMax

. The heavier bullets would definitely be better though.

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

The Amax is nice if you want to load long, the 175 is better suited if you are going mag length.

I'm still running 168 (Nosler CC BTHPs) out of my 308, as I rarely go much past 600, but I too need to work up a load for when I do get to stretch my legs, I'm leaning towards 175SMK's personally.

 

[swarrick]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

What type of powder and what charge wieght do you use with the 178Amax.

 

[pazzo]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

I haven't developed a load for the 178's yet. Having said that, I can't wait to dial in less MOA to hit that far

 

[memilanuk]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Just to be contrary... you might consider running one of the newer 155gr bullets - Berger 155.5 BT 'Fullbore', Sierra 155 'Palma' (the new one), Lapua 154gr Scenars... stuff a Winchester case full of Varget (~47+gr) and enjoy the (much) higher velocity with nearly the same BC than a 175... you do the math.

 

[Mc85]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Im having ok luck with this load out of my savage fcp 10..

Win case
178 A-Max @ 2.812 OAL
43.5 Varget
and CCI primer

gets me around 2700fps

as always your results may vary

 

[Mc85]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Oh it may of been mentioned already but 2500 fps is pretty low.
I like Varget powder too for my .308 bolt gun.

 

[lordt313]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

I have completely converted from SMK's to AMAX, I shoot the 178's with 43.5gr of RE-15, OAL to 2.884 and average about .75 MOA at 500yds. Have not been out to 1000 yet but I began these loads at 100 yds and they have held accurate to 500.

-Taylor

 

[427Cobra]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Amax's flat out kill, the 178 would be a good all around choice for hunting and target shooting, but I agree with Monte, the 155's with there hyper FPS, combined with a tad higher BC makes them the perfered choice for target shooting, Vargay is hard to find, I use RL15 with plano CCi200 primers and get 3000fps out of 155 Scenars coated with HbN.

 

[Mc85]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

got plenty of "Vargay" in Indiana... Atleast I haven't had a hard time finding any anyways....

 

[earthquake]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Hmmm...lots to think about and to read up on. By the way, where can I get a book or url link to ballistics etc.? Such as, what velocity a bullet weight of xxxgr. will be pushing at 1,000yds. etc.? Is there a bible of ballistics tables?

 

[bigdog2084]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

I use sierra matchking 175 with 41 grains of varget powder and they shoot very well at 1000 yards. I just shot them last weekend.

 

[Strickland]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

I run my 190 SMK with 43.5 Varget. Sub MOA to 1k if I do my part. I won't shoot anything else with the 308

Oh, 2625 is the sweet spot for velocity with that round.

 

[TCA4570]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

168 A-max and 45.0 RL-15
Keep Below Hornady match by .005/.010.
Strecthing out is bad!
Temp plays too.

 

[Shumba]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Anyone try TAC powder in the .308 with 168 grain or 175/178 grain bullets? Couldn't find Varget at my local store, so bought a pound of TAC to try out. I have Federal brass and some virgin Lapua brass (also some Federal Match primers) that I was going to use to load up with 175 SMK. Hoping for +/- 2,625 FPS out of my Rem 700 5R.

Thanks.

Tim

 

[memilanuk]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: COfox</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hmmm...lots to think about and to read up on. By the way, where can I get a book or url link to ballistics etc.? Such as, what velocity a bullet weight of xxxgr. will be pushing at 1,000yds. etc.? Is there a bible of ballistics tables?</div></div>

Try http://www.jbmballistics.com/calculations/calculations.html

 

[earthquake]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

A heavy bullet with a lower MV will push through the wind better than a lighter weight bullet and a higher MV? The higher the MV, the faster the barrels wear out correct? So I'm thinking a heavier bullet, rather than the 155gr. Scenars might be best. Am I wrong? This is fun!

 

[Breeze260]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

New Savage 10 FCP-K (just through break in)
168 Amax
41.0 gr Varget
average 2521 fps
100yd 5 shots .359

Ballistics software says its still going 1150 fps at 1000yds with a 43 moa adjustment

Just the third load I've tried but its looks very promising

 

[memilanuk]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: COfox</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A heavy bullet with a lower MV will push through the wind better than a lighter weight bullet and a higher MV? The higher the MV, the faster the barrels wear out correct? So I'm thinking a heavier bullet, rather than the 155gr. Scenars might be best. Am I wrong? This is fun! </div></div>

As with most things in life... it depends. If you want absolutes, you may want to look elsewhere. I rarely stick my neck out that far, as experience continues to prove that for every rule, there is an exception (at least one)!

It depends on the bullet, how much difference between 'low' and 'high' velocity, etc. It's very much a balancing act - if you can push the heavy bullets hard enough they should in theory shoot inside a lighter bullet. Getting a 155 up to speed even out of factory barrels is pretty easy. The people really wringing the mostest out of heavy bullets in a .308 are doing it with custom throated barrels throated to suit. I've had *very* good success with 155gr bullets (Berger VLDs and their newer BT design), but I'll probably do some tinkering with heavier bullets in the off season just for something to do. I certainly don't think you'll go wrong with 155s. Either way, you're still shooting a .308 Winchester... theres only so much you can do in terms of making it shoot better in the wind.

As far as the barrel life issue... yes the light bullet is going faster - like a few hundred feet per second, in a .30 cal with <50gr of powder. We're talking a gun that gets 3000-3500+rds minimum of 'match' accuracy, 5000+ of 'minute of man' accuracy (sometimes much, much more). You'll likely never notice any meaningful difference in barrel life running light bullets faster. By the time you have enough rounds through the barrel to accomplish that, you probably won't care what I say

 

[bigmerv]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

I am using TAC in .308 with 175 SMK. I am using 42.0 gr in virgin lapua brass and fed 210's. Sorry I don't have a velocity for ya, no chrono. Here is an article that give's load data for powders including TAC with MV.

http://www.6mmbr.com/308Win.html

 

[marc.soileau1]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: memilanuk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just to be contrary... you might consider running one of the newer 155gr bullets - Berger 155.5 BT 'Fullbore', Sierra 155 'Palma' (the new one), Lapua 154gr Scenars... stuff a Winchester case full of Varget (~47+gr) and enjoy the (much) higher velocity with nearly the same BC than a 175... you do the math. </div></div>

I load both the Sierra 175 and A-max 178 with 43 gr of RE-15. I have made shots up to 1100 yards with these - both with great and similar results. Like Memilanuk suggested, I am serously considering trying one of the 155 class bullets above. After the success of the Scenar all the bullet makers were scrambling to re-engineer their bullets in this class. Now we have a bunch of choices. I'm interested but never got around to it because I'm too much a creature of habit at times.

 

[skinney_7]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bigdog2084</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I use sierra matchking 175 with 41 grains of varget powder and they shoot very well at 1000 yards. I just shot them last weekend. </div></div>

175gr SMK
43.5gr varget
LC brass
case overall length 2.810
FGM210 primers
works well with my stoner, average velocity of 2650fps

 

[tat668]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

178 Amax, 45 grain RL15, CCI Br2 primer, PPU brass, load to 2.845". Ran good all the way to 1K yards. Average velocity in the Ruger 77v Mark I: 2750fps. A bit faster in the Remington M40.

Real consistent up to 800 yards, beyond that I cannot verify. My wind doping suc big time, I got in on paper at 1K yards though.

 

[SAS_Sniper]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

175 gr sierra MK
43.5 gr N140
primer fed 210
OAL freebore 0 - 2 mm (depende by your rifle)

mouches of 15.2 cm at 1000 Y

Became subsonic at 1100 mt!!!

 

[Arkhangel5]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

For the guys running the 175 smk's with the reasonable charges(42-43gr powder) and getting good performance out to 1k, what twist rate does your barrel have.

I am running a R700 SPS-V w/26in 12twist factory barrel. Holds MOA or better to 600yds. MV is ~2640fps.

Just curious if it would get me to 1k with reasonable accuracy.

SY

 

[TCA4570]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tat668</div><div class="ubbcode-body">178 Amax, 45 grain RL15, CCI Br2 primer, PPU brass, load to 2.845". Ran good all the way to 1K yards. Average velocity in the Ruger 77v Mark I: 2750fps. A bit faster in the Remington M40.

Real consistent up to 800 yards, beyond that I cannot verify. My wind doping suc big time, I got in on paper at 1K yards though. </div></div>

Your load might be just a tad more than hot.
168 A-Max gets kinda picky with that charge.
Jump .005 to .01 more than match ammo.
Longer is bad.
2850 out of 12ftr

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

COFox;

What are you shooting? Three pages of responses, and I musta missed the barrel length, twist, and action type.

I have reservations about posting loads without knowing what they're being fired from, and at what actual distances. For instance, I'd be talking different bullets for 800yd than for 1000yd with the .308.

Greg

 

[Jimmy2Times]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Tag.

 

[vmpglenn]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: skinney</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bigdog2084</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I use sierra matchking 175 with 41 grains of varget powder and they shoot very well at 1000 yards. I just shot them last weekend. </div></div>

175gr SMK
43.5gr varget
LC brass
case overall length 2.810
FGM210 primers
works well with my stoner, average velocity of 2650fps </div></div>

Does your Stoner have a 24" or 20" barrel? Thanks.

 

[minnesotadan]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

CO Fox:
Rem 700 Mil Spec 5 and AIAW both really like SMK 175 with 43.5/44. Varget, seat 282 to 285 1.75 to Ogive. This combo at 900 yards will shoot 8"lower than Factory Lapua 155 secnar. Last Sunday shot a .25 MOA at 300 with that combo. A good day at the range for me.

Dan

 

[earthquake]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">COFox;

What are you shooting? Three pages of responses, and I musta missed the barrel length, twist, and action type.

I have reservations about posting loads without knowing what they're being fired from, and at what actual distances. For instance, I'd be talking different bullets for 800yd than for 1000yd with the .308.

Greg </div></div>

Whoa, I haven't looked back at this post in quite some time! Anyway, I'm shooting a .308 Rem700 out of a 26" barrel with a 1:12 twist. It's a PSS that was tweaked some by IBA. I then added my own stock, a McM A4.

 

[earthquake]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: minnesotadan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...seat 282 to 285 1.75 to Ogive...</div></div>

English please!

 

[TCA4570]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Not meaning to give load, only say ten grain lighter bullet was over top sometimes.
to some, factory match may be best.
Many work well to 600.
Good chance shooter is bigger factor, farther than that.
Can your spotter call?
Can you smoke a chuck @ 500 consistantly?

Just a couple questions.

TC

 

[Killswitch Engage]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SYK</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For the guys running the 175 smk's with the reasonable charges(42-43gr powder) and getting good performance out to 1k, what twist rate does your barrel have.

I am running a R700 SPS-V w/26in 12twist factory barrel. Holds MOA or better to 600yds. MV is ~2640fps.

Just curious if it would get me to 1k with reasonable accuracy.

SY </div></div>

yep

 

[mattj]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SYK</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For the guys running the 175 smk's with the reasonable charges(42-43gr powder) and getting good performance out to 1k, what twist rate does your barrel have.

I am running a R700 SPS-V w/26in 12twist factory barrel. Holds MOA or better to 600yds. MV is ~2640fps.

Just curious if it would get me to 1k with reasonable accuracy.

SY </div></div>

I run 44.5gr Varget under 175 SMKs (Lapua brass, BR2 primers, seated .015" from the lands of my stock Savage barrel -- fits unmodified AICS mag length)... I'll let you decide whether it is an "unreasonable" charge -- worked it up using OCW, been using it for over a year now hot and cold weather with no pressure signs, good brass life, and low STDDEV over the chrono.

Anyway -- 26" 1:10 twist for 2750 fps. Have shot it out to 1111 yards and was able to get consistent hits on steel at that range after a couple of shots to get the wind figured out.

 

[vman]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Cofox for those types of distances i would say anything that uses a secant ogive shaped projectile should do you sweet.

Lapua Scenars
Hornady Amax
Berger VLD
Sierra Matchking

I think those 4 are good choices as they are relatively well priced and have good ballistic coefficients. They also tend to come in larger pack sizes (not sure on the sierras) of 100... Barnes and Nosler stuff tends to come in packs of 50 and can be quite expensive... and they dont offer the ballistics these projectiles offer for paper punching. As a hunting bullet maybe a different story.

The Berger VLD are excellent and also come in a hunting variety as well, so if your after a "one round system" for both paper punching and hunting, check out their Hunting VLD range. BC's are above .5 and can take down big game withing 200-300 yard range depending on velocity and gr weight of the projectile used.

Thats my 0.02 anyways

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Coming back to this thread, I used a 1Kyd supersonic load for the M1A that also worked well an several bolt guns.

175gr SMK 2.815" OAL for mag feeding
Rem brass, flash holes reamed
42.2gr IMR-4064
Match primer, I suggest CCI BR-2

Greg

 

[ReaperDriver]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

I REALLY like the 178 AMAX for 1K. I have two loads worked up for this bullet using Varget and RE-15 and both work very well at 1K.

20" SPS-T, 1:12 factory barrel/chamber

178 AMAX
44.4 Varget
Fed 210M
Lapua
2.875 COAL
MV: 2540 (55F @ 3000MSL)

178 AMAX
45.3 RE-15
Fed 210 (not match)
Lapua
2.835 COAL
MV: 2601 (65F @ 3K MSL)

Both of these loads are shooting sub MOA at 1K and are very consistant. I also have some good 175 SMK loads that I've shot at 1K and work well. But I feel like the AMAXs are just a smidge better shooting. And the apparant energy the AMAX has compared to the SMK when it hits a steel plate at 1K is very noticable. My spotters have consistantly remarked that the AMAX just rocks the plate whereas the SMK is just a "ding".

WARNING: I worked these loads up for MY rifle and conditions. It is not the same as your rifle. Work up your own loads for your own setup.

 

[earthquake]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

O.K., how would you guys go about this scenario?

I don't have the time, resources or money to reload on my own, but my old man is a reloading machine! He and his cousin reload everything, and can load ~1,500 rounds per day with all the stuff they have set up. Unfortunately he lives in Ohio and I in Colorado. I could pick a general load, buy it all (bullets, powder, primers) and send it to Ohio. Have him load it all up and send me the finished product. Then just shoot them to see how they perform.

I can give him the info on OAL etc. from my stick, but that's about it. This all may be pointless and I should just go to Bass Pro and buy boxed ammo!

I suppose I just need a place in the middle to start 'eh?

This is what I'm thinking:

168gr. SMK's
Lake City Brass (since I already have nearly 1,000 pieces)
CCI large rifle primers
Powder: not sure, Varget, H4895 or RL15 I've heard nothing but good things. Amounts, no idea.

Sorry for all the newb questions, but I'd eventually like to get a decent shooting round for this rifle and have lots of ammo to shoot thus saving money in the long run.

 

[ReaperDriver]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ReaperDriver</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I REALLY like the 178 AMAX for 1K. I have two loads worked up for this bullet using Varget and RE-15 and both work very well at 1K.

20" SPS-T, 1:12 factory barrel/chamber

178 AMAX
44.4 Varget
Fed 210M
Lapua
2.875 COAL
MV: 2540 (55F @ 3000MSL)

178 AMAX
45.3 RE-15
Fed 210 (not match)
Lapua
2.835 COAL
MV: 2601 (65F @ 3K MSL)

Both of these loads are shooting sub MOA at 1K and are very consistant. I also have some good 175 SMK loads that I've shot at 1K and work well. But I feel like the AMAXs are just a smidge better shooting. And the apparant energy the AMAX has compared to the SMK when it hits a steel plate at 1K is very noticable. My spotters have consistantly remarked that the AMAX just rocks the plate whereas the SMK is just a "ding".

WARNING: I worked these loads up for MY rifle and conditions. It is not the same as your rifle. Work up your own loads for your own setup. </div></div>

I'm going to amend the above favorite Varget/178 AMAX load. I went out and re-shot a 45.0 Varget load today with both 175 SMK and 178 AMAXs and both shot lights out with that powder load. 45.0 Varget is my new go-to load. Here's the details out of a 20" SPS-T 1/12 twist:

178 AMAX
45.0 Varget
Lapua
Fed 210 (not match)
2.865 COAL
MV: 2580 (55F)
3x 5 shot groups (.71", .62", and .48")

175 SMK
45.0 Varget
Lapua
Fed 210
2.815 COAL
MV: 2610
had 5 rounds loaded (used 1st two to sight in scope after re-mounting, next 3 shot group = .44")

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

If your Dad can make the ammo, better to send him the cash for the components. Otherwise you're going to need to pay Hazmat 2X (powder and primers must occupy separate shipments), and shipping lead bullets is not cheap either. Money orders go much easier, cheaper, and quicker, and finished ammo does not require a hazmat on the return trip (ORM-D Consumer Commodity labelling usually suffices. You could also label it as ORM-D Small Arms Ammunition, but I don't think that's any of their business).

Greg

 

[earthquake]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

I can get a screaming deal from a friend on 500 175gr. SMK's. However, should I stick to the 168's since I have a 1:12 twist barrel?

 

[earthquake]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Nevermind...screaming deal gone!

 

[MitchAlsup]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: COfox</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A heavy bullet with a lower MV will push through the wind better than a lighter weight bullet and a higher MV? </div></div>

You might want to check out the thread already running on this:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1681637&gonew=1

A light bullet with equivalent BC as a heavier bullet creates a situation where neither is superior to the others in any metric (drop, windage, energy). The differences are insignificant and well inside the margin of error in distance resolution or windage calling.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The higher the MV, the faster the barrels wear out correct? </div></div>

As long as the 308 stays inside 3000 fps the barrel wear is not significantly different than a 175 SK at 2700 fps.

 

[Switchblade]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Winchester case
Fed 210M primer(have used WLR, and Fed 210 as well)
45.0 Varget
175SMK

Velocity: 2700fps

In two different rifles(one PSS, one Custom) I get 2700 to 2750, and almost 2800 in the custom barrel. If I can keep them consistant at 2700fps I get the best groups at 300, and 400.
I got this load from Arctic Light who uses it from 600M to 1000M as well as Several Matches a while back

 

[rware91]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

i like:
44.5 g of varget
remington case
cci benchrest primer
and 155 SMK

 

[ArcticLight]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

Switch - the stuff I sent you initially was 45.5gr - 175SMK, Fed 210M but the length was 2.866 - for a factory tube - heaven forbid if you try to shoot that out of a custom tube!!!

Those things were still cooking at 1k!!!

The standard 45.0/Fed 210M/175SMK still applies


Rware - your load is probably damn near identical becauseof the CCI primer- have heard they cook things up.

But on a 155??? You can go 46 or 47 grains on that round!

That thing would probably be subsonic at 1k...with only 44.5...

Chrono time...I bet your are running right about 2550 to 2600 max!!!

 

[MitchAlsup]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ArcticLight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">But on a 155??? You can go 46 or 47 grains on that round!

That thing would probably be subsonic at 1k...with only 44.5...</div></div>

Most bolt guns can get up to 47.8 gr Varget on 155s.

These things are still supersonic at 1200 yards, at any reasonable altitude (1000+ feet), they are supersonic at 1300 yards.

 

[.22 lefty]

Re: Good .308 loads for 600yd.'s and beyond?

I've been using TAC powder in remington casings for my .308. With #200 primers from cci and using 41 gr of TAC I'm getting 2550 fps and good results on accuracy. only shot to 400 m though.