Neighbor has lost numerous sheep, cats, chickens etc. to a pack of feral dogs all at night. Local animal control will do nothing and told him to take care of it himself so that's what he is going to do and asked me to help, problem is I have no clue. Dogs range max 50 yards he is old on fixed income so would like a 22rf with laser. My question will the cheap crap nv scopes all over eBay for around $250-500 work in this app? Any suggestions greatly appreciated.
Night Vision Help with cheap nv feral dogs
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Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Neighbor has lost numerous sheep, cats, chickens etc. to a pack of feral dogs all at night. Local animal control will do nothing and told him to take care of it himself so that's what he is going to do and asked me to help, problem is I have no clue. Dogs range max 50 yards he is old on fixed income so would like a 22rf with laser. My question will the cheap crap nv scopes all over eBay for around $250-500 work in this app? Any suggestions greatly appreciated. </div></div>
We always try to tell everyone to save for at least a Gen 2 system such as M845 NV rifle scope or other Gen 2 systems.
Cheap Gen 1 is like looking into a cloudy fish bowl and many mounts on the Gen 1 systems have difficulty holding zero along with getting into good shooting positions behind the scope.
I am sure some will tell you otherwise, but it's just our experience working with many folks and devices over the years and the enormous feedback we get from these folks using cheap Gen 1 gear, they tell us they should have saved their pennies after looking into a Gen 2 SHP or Gen 3 for that matter.
With that said on Gen1, there is some Gen1 Cascade systems that seem to work OK we are told. CJ7Hawk who is quite knowledgeable and a few others talk about these systems.
Hope this helps.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Neighbor has lost numerous sheep, cats, chickens etc. to a pack of feral dogs all at night. Local animal control will do nothing and told him to take care of it himself so that's what he is going to do and asked me to help, problem is I have no clue. Dogs range max 50 yards he is old on fixed income so would like a 22rf with laser. My question will the cheap crap nv scopes all over eBay for around $250-500 work in this app? Any suggestions greatly appreciated. </div></div>
We always try to tell everyone to save for at least a Gen 2 system such as M845 NV rifle scope or other Gen 2 systems.
Cheap Gen 1 is like looking into a cloudy fish bowl and many mounts on the Gen 1 systems have difficulty holding zero along with getting into good shooting positions behind the scope.
I am sure some will tell you otherwise, but it's just our experience working with many folks and devices over the years and the enormous feedback we get from these folks using cheap Gen 1 gear, they tell us they should have saved their pennies after looking into a Gen 2 SHP or Gen 3 for that matter.
With that said on Gen1, there is some Gen1 Cascade systems that seem to work OK we are told. CJ7Hawk who is quite knowledgeable and a few others talk about these systems.
Hope this helps.
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
Thanks Victor, guessing this would be a one time only set up. Once he gets rid of the problem I doubt it will ever be used again. Basically a throw away setup except for the rifle.
Thanks Victor, guessing this would be a one time only set up. Once he gets rid of the problem I doubt it will ever be used again. Basically a throw away setup except for the rifle.
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks Victor, guessing this would be a one time only set up. Once he gets rid of the problem I doubt it will ever be used again. Basically a throw away setup except for the rifle. </div></div>
Hi Mark,
I am presently working on a DIY solution for ultra-cheap NV ( Think less than $200 ) that doesn't require re-zeroing or much set up and is intended to work with the existing day-scope in place. At the moment, the discussion is only happening on Australian forums, but this weekend I will be going through the technical evaluations necessary to begin the project.
Because it's a DIY solution, that means that to some extent, it should be implementable by anyone. The intent is to make as much as possible from "Off the shelf" parts that anyone can buy. It's also intended to be suitable for .22 rimfire applications. ( Rather specifically in fact ).
If you like, I can email you the details once I have enough information and you can determine if it's suitable for your need. Max range will be 100yds, so 50yds is not a problem. If you like glue and plastic, it will be a fun project and will require minimal skills and the parts can be used as a monocular for scanning as well. Though I will point out that although it's effective, it's little more than a toy in real terms.
Otherwise, I have many instructions on how to make your own Gen1 cascade scope if you are interested in that - With cheaper cascade tube parts, you can create a spotting scope that will see several hundred yards - almost as well as with Gen3 technology - with which you can track and spot pests before engaging them with a spotlight.
Both are DIY solutions that can be achieved with common parts and are easily made by people with average skills at making things - you can even use duct-tape and cardboard if you want to save money !
PM me your email if you like and I'll send you all the links
Regards
David
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks Victor, guessing this would be a one time only set up. Once he gets rid of the problem I doubt it will ever be used again. Basically a throw away setup except for the rifle. </div></div>
Hi Mark,
I am presently working on a DIY solution for ultra-cheap NV ( Think less than $200 ) that doesn't require re-zeroing or much set up and is intended to work with the existing day-scope in place. At the moment, the discussion is only happening on Australian forums, but this weekend I will be going through the technical evaluations necessary to begin the project.
Because it's a DIY solution, that means that to some extent, it should be implementable by anyone. The intent is to make as much as possible from "Off the shelf" parts that anyone can buy. It's also intended to be suitable for .22 rimfire applications. ( Rather specifically in fact ).
If you like, I can email you the details once I have enough information and you can determine if it's suitable for your need. Max range will be 100yds, so 50yds is not a problem. If you like glue and plastic, it will be a fun project and will require minimal skills and the parts can be used as a monocular for scanning as well. Though I will point out that although it's effective, it's little more than a toy in real terms.
Otherwise, I have many instructions on how to make your own Gen1 cascade scope if you are interested in that - With cheaper cascade tube parts, you can create a spotting scope that will see several hundred yards - almost as well as with Gen3 technology - with which you can track and spot pests before engaging them with a spotlight.
Both are DIY solutions that can be achieved with common parts and are easily made by people with average skills at making things - you can even use duct-tape and cardboard if you want to save money !
PM me your email if you like and I'll send you all the links
Regards
David
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cj7hawk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">PM me your email if you like and I'll send you all the links.</div></div>
Post 'em up! Pretty sure a lot of people here would be interested as well.
1911fan
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cj7hawk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">PM me your email if you like and I'll send you all the links.</div></div>
Post 'em up! Pretty sure a lot of people here would be interested as well.
1911fan
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
In my experience of shooting feral dogs and coyotes, you'll probably want more than a rimfire cartridge, and something at least supersonic.
It is also believed by many that canines have a hard time seeing the redder side of the light spectrum. Try a red spot light, as that's what most fox hunters go with. Call or bait them in and then light them up with a red filter until they're in a position to engage. Rinse. Repeat.
In my experience of shooting feral dogs and coyotes, you'll probably want more than a rimfire cartridge, and something at least supersonic.
It is also believed by many that canines have a hard time seeing the redder side of the light spectrum. Try a red spot light, as that's what most fox hunters go with. Call or bait them in and then light them up with a red filter until they're in a position to engage. Rinse. Repeat.
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cj7hawk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks Victor, guessing this would be a one time only set up. Once he gets rid of the problem I doubt it will ever be used again. Basically a throw away setup except for the rifle. </div></div>
Hi Mark,
I am presently working on a DIY solution for ultra-cheap NV ( Think less than $200 ) that doesn't require re-zeroing or much set up and is intended to work with the existing day-scope in place. At the moment, the discussion is only happening on Australian forums, but this weekend I will be going through the technical evaluations necessary to begin the project.
Because it's a DIY solution, that means that to some extent, it should be implementable by anyone. The intent is to make as much as possible from "Off the shelf" parts that anyone can buy. It's also intended to be suitable for .22 rimfire applications. ( Rather specifically in fact ).
If you like, I can email you the details once I have enough information and you can determine if it's suitable for your need. Max range will be 100yds, so 50yds is not a problem. If you like glue and plastic, it will be a fun project and will require minimal skills and the parts can be used as a monocular for scanning as well. Though I will point out that although it's effective, it's little more than a toy in real terms.
Otherwise, I have many instructions on how to make your own Gen1 cascade scope if you are interested in that - With cheaper cascade tube parts, you can create a spotting scope that will see several hundred yards - almost as well as with Gen3 technology - with which you can track and spot pests before engaging them with a spotlight.
Both are DIY solutions that can be achieved with common parts and are easily made by people with average skills at making things - you can even use duct-tape and cardboard if you want to save money !
PM me your email if you like and I'll send you all the links
Regards
David </div></div>
Thaks David appreciated pm sent. Red light suggestion also appreciated will try that ASAP since dogs visit every other night or so and driving my neighbor crazy. He can shoot some hot ammo just can't get a shot off before they high tail. Last night he heard a commotion went outside just in time to see a dog jump over fence with his wife's favorite cat. He figured ok inside fence close to house, he figured wrong.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cj7hawk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks Victor, guessing this would be a one time only set up. Once he gets rid of the problem I doubt it will ever be used again. Basically a throw away setup except for the rifle. </div></div>
Hi Mark,
I am presently working on a DIY solution for ultra-cheap NV ( Think less than $200 ) that doesn't require re-zeroing or much set up and is intended to work with the existing day-scope in place. At the moment, the discussion is only happening on Australian forums, but this weekend I will be going through the technical evaluations necessary to begin the project.
Because it's a DIY solution, that means that to some extent, it should be implementable by anyone. The intent is to make as much as possible from "Off the shelf" parts that anyone can buy. It's also intended to be suitable for .22 rimfire applications. ( Rather specifically in fact ).
If you like, I can email you the details once I have enough information and you can determine if it's suitable for your need. Max range will be 100yds, so 50yds is not a problem. If you like glue and plastic, it will be a fun project and will require minimal skills and the parts can be used as a monocular for scanning as well. Though I will point out that although it's effective, it's little more than a toy in real terms.
Otherwise, I have many instructions on how to make your own Gen1 cascade scope if you are interested in that - With cheaper cascade tube parts, you can create a spotting scope that will see several hundred yards - almost as well as with Gen3 technology - with which you can track and spot pests before engaging them with a spotlight.
Both are DIY solutions that can be achieved with common parts and are easily made by people with average skills at making things - you can even use duct-tape and cardboard if you want to save money !
PM me your email if you like and I'll send you all the links
Regards
David </div></div>
Thaks David appreciated pm sent. Red light suggestion also appreciated will try that ASAP since dogs visit every other night or so and driving my neighbor crazy. He can shoot some hot ammo just can't get a shot off before they high tail. Last night he heard a commotion went outside just in time to see a dog jump over fence with his wife's favorite cat. He figured ok inside fence close to house, he figured wrong.
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Thaks David appreciated pm sent. Red light suggestion also appreciated will try that ASAP since dogs visit every other night or so and driving my neighbor crazy. He can shoot some hot ammo just can't get a shot off before they high tail. Last night he heard a commotion went outside just in time to see a dog jump over fence with his wife's favorite cat. He figured ok inside fence close to house, he figured wrong. </div></div>
That is not good
OK, to get things started then, I'll post up a thread on DIY Night Vision Riflescopes this weekend - Just basically what I've been talking about on the Aussie forums.
The base intensification of the project comes from using an Xgen Digital Night Vision monocular - It's inexpensive and works OK out to 100m - and would be more than suitable for spotting dogs as a handheld - so it might be worth getting in advance, since it is what I am going to be modifying for the project.
eg:
Xgen for sale from a Snipers Hide sponsor
Though I think more than one of the site sponsors sell this model and provide discount to hide members also, so it's pretty cheap.
I'll also post up a review of the Xgen digital so you know what you're getting - Keep in mind it IS a toy compared to any serious NV device, but it will see out to 50 yds just fine and with a very good image.
And here's a picture of what happens when you stick it behind a low-magnification dayscope.
Not pretty - range about 80~90 yds and there's a LOT more light in that picture than will probably be available with just an IR illuminator alone, but it's a good example of kind of what I'm thinking.
And a review of the Xgen I wrote up a few weeks back - Until I get a chance to post it locally here.
Regards
David
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Thaks David appreciated pm sent. Red light suggestion also appreciated will try that ASAP since dogs visit every other night or so and driving my neighbor crazy. He can shoot some hot ammo just can't get a shot off before they high tail. Last night he heard a commotion went outside just in time to see a dog jump over fence with his wife's favorite cat. He figured ok inside fence close to house, he figured wrong. </div></div>
That is not good
OK, to get things started then, I'll post up a thread on DIY Night Vision Riflescopes this weekend - Just basically what I've been talking about on the Aussie forums.
The base intensification of the project comes from using an Xgen Digital Night Vision monocular - It's inexpensive and works OK out to 100m - and would be more than suitable for spotting dogs as a handheld - so it might be worth getting in advance, since it is what I am going to be modifying for the project.
eg:
Xgen for sale from a Snipers Hide sponsor
Though I think more than one of the site sponsors sell this model and provide discount to hide members also, so it's pretty cheap.
I'll also post up a review of the Xgen digital so you know what you're getting - Keep in mind it IS a toy compared to any serious NV device, but it will see out to 50 yds just fine and with a very good image.
And here's a picture of what happens when you stick it behind a low-magnification dayscope.
Not pretty - range about 80~90 yds and there's a LOT more light in that picture than will probably be available with just an IR illuminator alone, but it's a good example of kind of what I'm thinking.
And a review of the Xgen I wrote up a few weeks back - Until I get a chance to post it locally here.
Regards
David
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
David great review. That image at 80 meters is more than good enough for what I'm looking to do.
David great review. That image at 80 meters is more than good enough for what I'm looking to do.
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
Neat review David, projects like that are always peaking my interest, I like duct tape and bailing wire
I wonder how the Xgen compares to a little higher dollar unit like the Minox.
http://www.cameralandny.com/nightvision/minox.pl?page=minox62408
The Minox looks like it's a good size to figure out how to weapons mount one on a 22lr or similar.
Neat review David, projects like that are always peaking my interest, I like duct tape and bailing wire
I wonder how the Xgen compares to a little higher dollar unit like the Minox.
http://www.cameralandny.com/nightvision/minox.pl?page=minox62408
The Minox looks like it's a good size to figure out how to weapons mount one on a 22lr or similar.
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
This interests me also.
This interests me also.
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
cj7hawk and jasonk, what do you think the eye relief is on those? Do you think the recoil of repeated 5.56's would destroy it if you could find a way to mount one behind a scope? I don't think it would turn out too great but would be cool to know.
cj7hawk and jasonk, what do you think the eye relief is on those? Do you think the recoil of repeated 5.56's would destroy it if you could find a way to mount one behind a scope? I don't think it would turn out too great but would be cool to know.
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: redirt78</div><div class="ubbcode-body">cj7hawk and jasonk, what do you think the eye relief is on those? Do you think the recoil of repeated 5.56's would destroy it if you could find a way to mount one behind a scope? I don't think it would turn out too great but would be cool to know. </div></div>
To be honest, not very much. A few millimeters. It would be possible to extend it for use on larger calibers, but the intent is to work out how to do it as cheap as possible. I'll let people modify theirs later. Hence why it's only really suitable for rimfire and smaller calibers.
You could also soft-mount the monocular with foam so it would take a little more recoil.
However I've previously created video screens suitable for long eye relief before - Up to 5 inches or more... So it is possible.
Would 5.56 destroy one without modification? Probably not right away at least - I guess they are cheap enough to find out if anyone wants to.
As for how digital compares? Most use similar performing CCD modules - so the main differentiator seems to be whether they have a variable frame rate - and this one does. It's a shame the CCD itself isn't larger, but they do appear to do some frame to frame aggregation, which improves the image.
Anyway, it's about as complicated as it looks. The two critical things are to be able to mount it so that the objective lens isn't quite touching so it can be adjusted, and also mount it so that the monocular remains upright at all times. That's actually about it. And put some black duct tape over the IR torch ( or disable it internally ) and use a cheap 3W IR torch.
So if anyone wants to run off and complete this project ahead of me, you all know the destination now
Oh yeah...My wife heard the story of the cat and told me to make sure you can obliterate the dogs that did it...
Regards
David.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: redirt78</div><div class="ubbcode-body">cj7hawk and jasonk, what do you think the eye relief is on those? Do you think the recoil of repeated 5.56's would destroy it if you could find a way to mount one behind a scope? I don't think it would turn out too great but would be cool to know. </div></div>
To be honest, not very much. A few millimeters. It would be possible to extend it for use on larger calibers, but the intent is to work out how to do it as cheap as possible. I'll let people modify theirs later. Hence why it's only really suitable for rimfire and smaller calibers.
You could also soft-mount the monocular with foam so it would take a little more recoil.
However I've previously created video screens suitable for long eye relief before - Up to 5 inches or more...
Would 5.56 destroy one without modification? Probably not right away at least - I guess they are cheap enough to find out if anyone wants to.
As for how digital compares? Most use similar performing CCD modules - so the main differentiator seems to be whether they have a variable frame rate - and this one does. It's a shame the CCD itself isn't larger, but they do appear to do some frame to frame aggregation, which improves the image.
Anyway, it's about as complicated as it looks. The two critical things are to be able to mount it so that the objective lens isn't quite touching so it can be adjusted, and also mount it so that the monocular remains upright at all times. That's actually about it. And put some black duct tape over the IR torch ( or disable it internally ) and use a cheap 3W IR torch.
So if anyone wants to run off and complete this project ahead of me, you all know the destination now
Oh yeah...My wife heard the story of the cat and told me to make sure you can obliterate the dogs that did it...
Regards
David.
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EWOAF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In my experience of shooting feral dogs and coyotes, you'll probably want more than a rimfire cartridge, and something at least supersonic. </div></div>
Probably, but remember that he's not looking to recover them necessarily, but just get rid of the problem. A 22LR through the lungs or heart of a dog would most likely be fatal, but might just allow them enough time to get deep in the woods or den and lay down before they expire. Now 2 problems solved, no dead dog to dispose of.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EWOAF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In my experience of shooting feral dogs and coyotes, you'll probably want more than a rimfire cartridge, and something at least supersonic. </div></div>
Probably, but remember that he's not looking to recover them necessarily, but just get rid of the problem. A 22LR through the lungs or heart of a dog would most likely be fatal, but might just allow them enough time to get deep in the woods or den and lay down before they expire. Now 2 problems solved, no dead dog to dispose of.
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jasonk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EWOAF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In my experience of shooting feral dogs and coyotes, you'll probably want more than a rimfire cartridge, and something at least supersonic. </div></div>
Probably, but remember that he's not looking to recover them necessarily, but just get rid of the problem. A 22LR through the lungs or heart of a dog would most likely be fatal, but might just allow them enough time to get deep in the woods or den and lay down before they expire. <span style="font-weight: bold">Now 2 problems solved, no dead dog to dispose of</span>. </div></div>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jasonk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EWOAF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In my experience of shooting feral dogs and coyotes, you'll probably want more than a rimfire cartridge, and something at least supersonic. </div></div>
Probably, but remember that he's not looking to recover them necessarily, but just get rid of the problem. A 22LR through the lungs or heart of a dog would most likely be fatal, but might just allow them enough time to get deep in the woods or den and lay down before they expire. <span style="font-weight: bold">Now 2 problems solved, no dead dog to dispose of</span>. </div></div>
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
I'm a glass half full type of guy
I'm a glass half full type of guy
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jasonk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm a glass half full type of guy </div></div>
drink up shriner..............
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jasonk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm a glass half full type of guy
drink up shriner..............
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
I want to see what I kill,No recovery, NO KILL where I am from. 556 minimum Insurance for the runners..
Bolt I was thinking about you today, Hope your well !
I want to see what I kill,No recovery, NO KILL where I am from. 556 minimum Insurance for the runners..
Bolt I was thinking about you today, Hope your well !
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I want to see what I kill,No recovery, NO KILL where I am from. 556 minimum Insurance for the runners..
Bolt I was thinking about you today, Hope your well ! </div></div>
I understand the sentiment, but at 50 yds, a .22 rimfire with night vision in a shoot-through configuration should be able to drop a dog in it's own footprint.
The trick is getting them to pay attention before you pull the trigger. The fox pic I posted in the NV kill pics thread is a good example.
A .22rf should be quite adequate for close-range work of the type described IMO. We're talking about 1" groups under 50 yds here -
Regards
David
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I want to see what I kill,No recovery, NO KILL where I am from. 556 minimum Insurance for the runners..
Bolt I was thinking about you today, Hope your well ! </div></div>
I understand the sentiment, but at 50 yds, a .22 rimfire with night vision in a shoot-through configuration should be able to drop a dog in it's own footprint.
The trick is getting them to pay attention before you pull the trigger. The fox pic I posted in the NV kill pics thread is a good example.
A .22rf should be quite adequate for close-range work of the type described IMO. We're talking about 1" groups under 50 yds here -
Regards
David
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
Yeah your Right man..AWSOME SHOOTING your skill show..
So whats your head count on Fox kills ?<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cj7hawk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I want to see what I kill,No recovery, NO KILL where I am from. 556 minimum Insurance for the runners..
Bolt I was thinking about you today, Hope your well ! </div></div>
I understand the sentiment, but at 50 yds, a .22 rimfire with night vision in a shoot-through configuration should be able to drop a dog in it's own footprint.
The trick is getting them to pay attention before you pull the trigger. The fox pic I posted in the NV kill pics thread is a good example.
A .22rf should be quite adequate for close-range work of the type described IMO. We're talking about 1" groups under 50 yds here -
Regards
David </div></div>
Yeah your Right man..AWSOME SHOOTING your skill show..
So whats your head count on Fox kills ?<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cj7hawk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I want to see what I kill,No recovery, NO KILL where I am from. 556 minimum Insurance for the runners..
Bolt I was thinking about you today, Hope your well ! </div></div>
I understand the sentiment, but at 50 yds, a .22 rimfire with night vision in a shoot-through configuration should be able to drop a dog in it's own footprint.
The trick is getting them to pay attention before you pull the trigger. The fox pic I posted in the NV kill pics thread is a good example.
A .22rf should be quite adequate for close-range work of the type described IMO. We're talking about 1" groups under 50 yds here -
Regards
David </div></div>
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
Xgen ordered, $123 shipped. Neighbor not interested in kill confirm, blood trail sufficient. He may be an old buzzard but can make 22rf 50 yard heart/ lung.
Xgen ordered, $123 shipped. Neighbor not interested in kill confirm, blood trail sufficient. He may be an old buzzard but can make 22rf 50 yard heart/ lung.
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Xgen ordered, $123 shipped. Neighbor not interested in kill confirm, blood trail sufficient. He may be an old buzzard but can make 22rf 50 yard heart/ lung. </div></div>
That should be sufficient with most dogs too. I am just working out how to mount it and a lot of mounting options involve taking it apart.
In the short term, I'd recommend using a couple of popsticks and some duct tape Should work fine. But do remember to cover the IR illuminator with black duct tape or the near-reflections will swamp the image. Perhaps a single roll of duct tape around the eyepiece/NVlens to keep light out when you're done too.
For an extra IR torch, you need something to throw a bit of light forward.
Start with a mount, either this torch mount or this barrel adapter or perhaps both.
Then you'll need a flashlight supporting 2x batteries.
Either this with 2xCR123 batteries or if you want longer life from your batteries, or this for 2x18650 batteries.
Then you'll need an IR module so it's invisible - This should do the trick nicely.
Between all of those, you have everything you need. Now just mount it up.
Also, if you want a mountable IR so you can just leave it on, then something like this is also an option, since it's stationary, can be left on and will give good coverage out some distance.
Regards
David
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Xgen ordered, $123 shipped. Neighbor not interested in kill confirm, blood trail sufficient. He may be an old buzzard but can make 22rf 50 yard heart/ lung. </div></div>
That should be sufficient with most dogs too. I am just working out how to mount it and a lot of mounting options involve taking it apart.
In the short term, I'd recommend using a couple of popsticks and some duct tape
For an extra IR torch, you need something to throw a bit of light forward.
Start with a mount, either this torch mount or this barrel adapter or perhaps both.
Then you'll need a flashlight supporting 2x batteries.
Either this with 2xCR123 batteries or if you want longer life from your batteries, or this for 2x18650 batteries.
Then you'll need an IR module so it's invisible - This should do the trick nicely.
Between all of those, you have everything you need. Now just mount it up.
Also, if you want a mountable IR so you can just leave it on, then something like this is also an option, since it's stationary, can be left on and will give good coverage out some distance.
Regards
David
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
Thanks David just ordered it all. Pretty inexpensive to get job done. One of cats nabbed was his wife's $1000 whatever, I never realized there was such a thing as a $1000 cat .
Thanks David just ordered it all. Pretty inexpensive to get job done. One of cats nabbed was his wife's $1000 whatever, I never realized there was such a thing as a $1000 cat .
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
My wife is on the war path because we have lost 3 cats to coyotes in the last 5 or 6 months and so have a lot of people around the area. Always have young turkeys come into the yard in spring, i hope they will be back. So i am selling a lot of stuff to buy some NV for my AR. Best of luck to you. MM
My wife is on the war path because we have lost 3 cats to coyotes in the last 5 or 6 months and so have a lot of people around the area. Always have young turkeys come into the yard in spring, i hope they will be back. So i am selling a lot of stuff to buy some NV for my AR. Best of luck to you. MM
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
Hi Mexican Match,
A dedicated night scope is a good choice -
Mark -
Once you get the scope, let me know and I'll send some more detail through on how to make sure it's going to work well with your setup - so that you can determine whether it's best to use the torch mounted on the rifle for spotlighting and the monocular for spotting, or if the range is OK so that you can use the monocular in shoot-through mode and convert the flashlight to infra-red.
Don't forget that the rifle may need to be re-zeroed after installing the flashlight, depending how how you mount it.
I've worked out where to drill the Xgen to mount it, so will send details of that through the week in case you want to go for a permanent mod, but I can help you work out the best way to do this ahead of time do you don't have to drill anything until you're ready and have worked out the most effective way to address the situation with the tools at hand.
Regards
David
Hi Mexican Match,
A dedicated night scope is a good choice -
Mark -
Once you get the scope, let me know and I'll send some more detail through on how to make sure it's going to work well with your setup - so that you can determine whether it's best to use the torch mounted on the rifle for spotlighting and the monocular for spotting, or if the range is OK so that you can use the monocular in shoot-through mode and convert the flashlight to infra-red.
Don't forget that the rifle may need to be re-zeroed after installing the flashlight, depending how how you mount it.
I've worked out where to drill the Xgen to mount it, so will send details of that through the week in case you want to go for a permanent mod, but I can help you work out the best way to do this ahead of time do you don't have to drill anything until you're ready and have worked out the most effective way to address the situation with the tools at hand.
Regards
David
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
Great David much appreciated, I should have everything in a week or so. Friend want's a permanent shoot through. Will get my drill motor warmed up
. Mark
Great David much appreciated, I should have everything in a week or so. Friend want's a permanent shoot through. Will get my drill motor warmed up
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
OK, some pics. Don't anyone go expecting anything fancy - just the basics. As cheap as possible.
1. The adapter from the bottom.
2. From the side
3. From above.
4. A photo - late twilight.
5. Through the adapter and scope - late twilight.
6. What the adapter looks like - just cut from some lightweight rigid plastic.
7. And the same from the side - just a little mounting platform - would probably work with Gen2 as well.
8. Slightly earlier twilight.
9. Early twilight - bench at 100m.
OK, effective range is about 50 yds, though you will probably see some stuff past that - the scope is a 4x32 so not all that great. Go for the biggest objective you can get ( eg, 40mm ) with the lowest magnification ( eg, 2x or 1x ) and that's about it. That one is 4x - the magnification is way too high as you can see, but it still works.
Oh yeah, don't forget to turn your IR off. I did It got really hot.
Anyway, I duct-taped the Xgen to the pipe - but you can use hose clamps all over - two for the Xgen and one to fit it to the dayscope - just loosen the dayscope clamp to remove it. Get some pipe that is just a little larger than the dayscope ocular and cut a slot out like you can see. Then clamp it tight. Easy to fit and very strong - won't fall off when hunting/shooting.
With the IR I got good results out to 40m and some results out to 100m - but it's not intended for distance shooting
There's a LOT more can be done with it, but for this part, I just wanted to keep it as cheap and simple as possible - You also need something under the back of the Xgen to hold the back up - I just cut off a piece of hot-melt-glue rod and used that - not melted or anything - just between the pipe and the inset of the Xgen to hold the back up and the clamp ( tape in my case ) held it all together - quite rigid too - even like that it would have worked fine on a rifle.
Also, tape up the IR lens on the Xgen - it will get in the way. Just black duct tape.
Also, make sure you can adjust the focus of the Xgen - because you'll need to adjust slightly once you've installed everything to bring it into focus.
Regards
David
OK, some pics. Don't anyone go expecting anything fancy - just the basics. As cheap as possible.
1. The adapter from the bottom.
2. From the side
3. From above.
4. A photo - late twilight.
5. Through the adapter and scope - late twilight.
6. What the adapter looks like - just cut from some lightweight rigid plastic.
7. And the same from the side - just a little mounting platform - would probably work with Gen2 as well.
8. Slightly earlier twilight.
9. Early twilight - bench at 100m.
OK, effective range is about 50 yds, though you will probably see some stuff past that - the scope is a 4x32 so not all that great. Go for the biggest objective you can get ( eg, 40mm ) with the lowest magnification ( eg, 2x or 1x ) and that's about it. That one is 4x - the magnification is way too high as you can see, but it still works.
Oh yeah, don't forget to turn your IR off. I did
Anyway, I duct-taped the Xgen to the pipe - but you can use hose clamps all over - two for the Xgen and one to fit it to the dayscope - just loosen the dayscope clamp to remove it. Get some pipe that is just a little larger than the dayscope ocular and cut a slot out like you can see. Then clamp it tight. Easy to fit and very strong - won't fall off when hunting/shooting.
With the IR I got good results out to 40m and some results out to 100m - but it's not intended for distance shooting
There's a LOT more can be done with it, but for this part, I just wanted to keep it as cheap and simple as possible - You also need something under the back of the Xgen to hold the back up - I just cut off a piece of hot-melt-glue rod and used that - not melted or anything - just between the pipe and the inset of the Xgen to hold the back up and the clamp ( tape in my case ) held it all together - quite rigid too - even like that it would have worked fine on a rifle.
Also, tape up the IR lens on the Xgen - it will get in the way. Just black duct tape.
Also, make sure you can adjust the focus of the Xgen - because you'll need to adjust slightly once you've installed everything to bring it into focus.
Regards
David
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
Thanks much David I just finished up the neighbors and it will do exactly what it needs to do on the cheap and does it pretty dang well. And to think always thought it was good old American ingenuity that got things done, . I have NO doubt the feral dog problem will be taken care of mid week.
Thanks much David I just finished up the neighbors and it will do exactly what it needs to do on the cheap and does it pretty dang well. And to think always thought it was good old American ingenuity that got things done,
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks much David I just finished up the neighbors and it will do exactly what it needs to do on the cheap and does it pretty dang well. And to think always thought it was good old American ingenuity that got things done, . I have NO doubt the feral dog problem will be taken care of mid week. </div></div>
I had a think about the definitions of both.
"American Ingenuity" A term that describes the tendency for those living in the US to find elegant solutions to complicated problems that get the job done. Fix it once, fix it well.
"Australian Ingenuity" - Tie it up with wire. If it breaks, use more wire. If she ain't broke, don't fix it.
You've probably already improved on the design since implementing it
Besides, Australia and the US have a LONG and distinguished history of sharing technology and ideas. We gave you the integrated circuit and the photocopier, you gave us the over-the-horizon radar.
Our countries are more alike than you'd imagine
Anyway, I'm looking forward to seeing the results and my own wife is nagging me to make sure none of your neighbor's wife's cats go missing again. Please post back on the outcome
Regards
David
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks much David I just finished up the neighbors and it will do exactly what it needs to do on the cheap and does it pretty dang well. And to think always thought it was good old American ingenuity that got things done,
I had a think about the definitions of both.
"American Ingenuity" A term that describes the tendency for those living in the US to find elegant solutions to complicated problems that get the job done. Fix it once, fix it well.
"Australian Ingenuity" - Tie it up with wire. If it breaks, use more wire. If she ain't broke, don't fix it.
You've probably already improved on the design since implementing it
Besides, Australia and the US have a LONG and distinguished history of sharing technology and ideas. We gave you the integrated circuit and the photocopier, you gave us the over-the-horizon radar.
Our countries are more alike than you'd imagine
Anyway, I'm looking forward to seeing the results and my own wife is nagging me to make sure none of your neighbor's wife's cats go missing again. Please post back on the outcome
Regards
David
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
A missing Kitty is not acceptable! A couple Of Our new Kittys and our 16 year old Flampoint.Dam Coyotes Try to get my kittys all the time, I kill alot of coyotes, In the hundreds by now.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cj7hawk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks much David I just finished up the neighbors and it will do exactly what it needs to do on the cheap and does it pretty dang well. And to think always thought it was good old American ingenuity that got things done, . I have NO doubt the feral dog problem will be taken care of mid week. </div></div>
I had a think about the definitions of both.
"American Ingenuity" A term that describes the tendency for those living in the US to find elegant solutions to complicated problems that get the job done. Fix it once, fix it well.
"Australian Ingenuity" - Tie it up with wire. If it breaks, use more wire. If she ain't broke, don't fix it.
You've probably already improved on the design since implementing it
Besides, Australia and the US have a LONG and distinguished history of sharing technology and ideas. We gave you the integrated circuit and the photocopier, you gave us the over-the-horizon radar.
Our countries are more alike than you'd imagine
Anyway, I'm looking forward to seeing the results and my own wife is nagging me to make sure none of your neighbor's wife's cats go missing again. Please post back on the outcome
Regards
David
</div></div>
A missing Kitty is not acceptable! A couple Of Our new Kittys and our 16 year old Flampoint.Dam Coyotes Try to get my kittys all the time, I kill alot of coyotes, In the hundreds by now.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cj7hawk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks much David I just finished up the neighbors and it will do exactly what it needs to do on the cheap and does it pretty dang well. And to think always thought it was good old American ingenuity that got things done,
I had a think about the definitions of both.
"American Ingenuity" A term that describes the tendency for those living in the US to find elegant solutions to complicated problems that get the job done. Fix it once, fix it well.
"Australian Ingenuity" - Tie it up with wire. If it breaks, use more wire. If she ain't broke, don't fix it.
You've probably already improved on the design since implementing it
Besides, Australia and the US have a LONG and distinguished history of sharing technology and ideas. We gave you the integrated circuit and the photocopier, you gave us the over-the-horizon radar.
Our countries are more alike than you'd imagine
Anyway, I'm looking forward to seeing the results and my own wife is nagging me to make sure none of your neighbor's wife's cats go missing again. Please post back on the outcome
Regards
David
</div></div>
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
Scratch 1
Scratch 1
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Scratch 1 </div></div>
MUST have pics!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark S</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Scratch 1
MUST have pics!
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
why not one of these
http://www.sportoptics.com/laser-genetics-nd3-laser-designator.aspx
i've used mind on coyotes, dogs can't seem to see it very well
why not one of these
http://www.sportoptics.com/laser-genetics-nd3-laser-designator.aspx
i've used mind on coyotes, dogs can't seem to see it very well
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Opticsspecialist</div><div class="ubbcode-body">why not one of these
http://www.sportoptics.com/laser-genetics-nd3-laser-designator.aspx
i've used mind on coyotes, dogs can't seem to see it very well </div></div>
They are interesting devices, but basically just a green spotlight - I had a look at one at shot show and while the optics are impressive, it's hard to justify the price when you can get a similar power green LED that will snap into the flashlight mentioned above for under $10 that will give the unit >100m range and provide similar functionality.
Had the NV turned out to be a problem ( eg, didn't fit the scope, had issues with the magnification, head position caused too much of an issue etc ) then I would have recommended the LED adapter for the flashlight as the alternative - though they come in red and green and probably both are equally good.
Having seen a laser genetics in use, I would expect it to have a better range than just a well-focussed LED, but in this case, the range wasn't the issue.
The LEDs can be bought on Ebay.
One example here - Red and Green for $20.
So while the Laser genetics appears to be the better of the two options as flashlights go, it costs an order of magnitude more too! If they made it in IR though they might have a winner.
Mark S - Any feedback on how well the Digital home-made unit is working for you? Glad to hear one is down already Would love to see pics if you get a chance
Regards
David
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Opticsspecialist</div><div class="ubbcode-body">why not one of these
http://www.sportoptics.com/laser-genetics-nd3-laser-designator.aspx
i've used mind on coyotes, dogs can't seem to see it very well </div></div>
They are interesting devices, but basically just a green spotlight - I had a look at one at shot show and while the optics are impressive, it's hard to justify the price when you can get a similar power green LED that will snap into the flashlight mentioned above for under $10 that will give the unit >100m range and provide similar functionality.
Had the NV turned out to be a problem ( eg, didn't fit the scope, had issues with the magnification, head position caused too much of an issue etc ) then I would have recommended the LED adapter for the flashlight as the alternative - though they come in red and green and probably both are equally good.
Having seen a laser genetics in use, I would expect it to have a better range than just a well-focussed LED, but in this case, the range wasn't the issue.
The LEDs can be bought on Ebay.
One example here - Red and Green for $20.
So while the Laser genetics appears to be the better of the two options as flashlights go, it costs an order of magnitude more too! If they made it in IR though they might have a winner.
Mark S - Any feedback on how well the Digital home-made unit is working for you? Glad to hear one is down already
Regards
David
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
it's more than just a green filter on a normal flashlight, it's more like a laser than a normal flashlight, you don't have to rig everything, it comes with everything you need and is effective at distance, way better performance than a flashlight or even a spotlight
it's more than just a green filter on a normal flashlight, it's more like a laser than a normal flashlight, you don't have to rig everything, it comes with everything you need and is effective at distance, way better performance than a flashlight or even a spotlight
Re: Help with cheap nv feral dogs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Opticsspecialist</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it's more than just a green filter on a normal flashlight, it's more like a laser than a normal flashlight, you don't have to rig everything, it comes with everything you need and is effective at distance, way better performance than a flashlight or even a spotlight </div></div>
I take it you're referring to the Laser Genetics ND3?
I don't disagree with you - but it's just hard to justify the price for what it does. If a $30-ish green/red torch will do the job at short range, then why buy an expensive laser to do the same thing?
For people who need to use a flashlight at <span style="font-style: italic">much</span> longer ranges? sure.
What really surprises me is that they haven't brought the same model out with an IR laser instead of the green laser. Now that would make it quite an interesting item. Based on what I saw at SHOT show, I'd buy one at the normal price if it was in infrared.
But then again, I'm not sure US law would allow them to make or sell such a beast.
Regards
David
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Opticsspecialist</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it's more than just a green filter on a normal flashlight, it's more like a laser than a normal flashlight, you don't have to rig everything, it comes with everything you need and is effective at distance, way better performance than a flashlight or even a spotlight </div></div>
I take it you're referring to the Laser Genetics ND3?
I don't disagree with you - but it's just hard to justify the price for what it does. If a $30-ish green/red torch will do the job at short range, then why buy an expensive laser to do the same thing?
For people who need to use a flashlight at <span style="font-style: italic">much</span> longer ranges? sure.
What really surprises me is that they haven't brought the same model out with an IR laser instead of the green laser. Now that would make it quite an interesting item. Based on what I saw at SHOT show, I'd buy one at the normal price if it was in infrared.
But then again, I'm not sure US law would allow them to make or sell such a beast.
Regards
David
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