Gunsmithing How bad did I F up?

[krink85]

So I decided to start reloading the cheap way. Went with lee classic reloader. It only sizes the neck and it said use brass from the gun you fired it from. Well I own 2 308s but most of the brass I have was out of this gun so I thought no problem. I loaded the rounds up and remember the use the same brass thing. So I start seeing what brass will work in one of my guns (it has a match cut chamber fwiw). Well after around 7 rounds one gets stuck (some wouldnt let the bolt go home but I was able to rack the round out). I grab my Rubber mallet and start lightly tapping the bolt. It feels like it is coming and finally pops out. I try to push the bolt home and notice something is not right. It seems that I damn near ripped the handle off the bolt. So How f---ed am I, how much will this cost me to fix and when I take/send it in to get fixed do I have to send the gun with?

 

[Hooper]

Re: How bad did I F up?

That can be shaped back and soldered or welded on. Some folks also like to have screws installed that will prevent this.

Find a used RCBS Rockchucker so you can re size the case. Takes the guess work out of it and will give more consistent loads.

If you need some dies, I will give you some RCBS dies if you pay the shipping. That is if you are short on cash.

 

[19Scout77]

Re: How bad did I F up?

Unless you want to deal with this again--WELD it on. Screws and solder?? no thanks.

I suggest you send it to Dan Armstrong (DANS40X).
[email protected]

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: How bad did I F up?

The above is good.

But mainly, you have a learning opportunity here.

Loads need to be developed for each gun. Brass periodically requires full length resizing, get the proper dies to do this as well. Smaller chambers can and often do generate higher pressures from loads which operate 'normally' in other guns. Learn to recognize and heed pressure signs. Disdadvantages usually outweigh advantages when dealing with hot loads.

The point here is that an overpressure event (or several) has/(have) ocurred here. Consequences go beyond the bolt handle issue.

The fact that damage occurred generally indicates that pressures even went well beyond proof levels. This barrelled action has been overstressed.

Failures due to excessive pressures do not follow predictable paths.

Such failures do not wait for the end of the designed life cycle limits, and do not necessarily occur from subsequent excesses. They can fail using 'normal' loads.

Warrantee provisions are generally voided by damage involving hand loaded ammunition.

The rifle needs to be seen in its entirety by a more capable gunsmith, and the events leading to this condition must be fully dislosed.

Greg

 

[Kells81]

Re: How bad did I F up?

Send it in to Dan and get a right proper bolt handle TIG welded on.

 

[Bacarrat]

Re: How bad did I F up?

I've done that twice already. Best to get it welded on. There is a reason why a lot of aftermarket actions now use a 1 piece bolt now.

 

[LRI]

Re: How bad did I F up?

TIG

 

[Victor N TN]

Re: How bad did I F up?

Just another reason I full length size rifle rounds.

 

[Downzero]

Re: How bad did I F up?

I don't see any evidence of an overpressure condition, just a piece of brass that was not properly sized and a bolt handle that nearly broke getting it out.

Just get your bolt repaired and you'll be good to go.

 

[Sean the Nailer]

Re: How bad did I F up?

It happens to more of us than those willing to admit.

Another option is to sent it to George at GAP, as he TIG's them as well. Don't ask me how I know.

 

[Raven 6]

Re: How bad did I F up?

Send it to Dan and have him put on a PYG bolt handle, then you can interchange bolt knobs if you want. Contact him, there is a measurement you will need to give him as well that is in relation to the action. Dans40X is GTG.

 

[ewoaf]

Re: How bad did I F up?

you sure got what you paid for.

 

[krink85]

Re: How bad did I F up?

Well I don't think there was pressure signs due to it being a live round. I never fired it. The bolt pushes forward and then engages the lugs about 1/8 of an inch and stops. When trying to cycle it back it goes back up but wont come rearward. I learned my lesson here and hopefully i can get a full length die and press. It only takes money and I don't have that much right now. Maybe for my birthday.

I will PM Dans40x and see if he can fix it. Thank for the info everyone.

 

[Elxx]

Re: How bad did I F up?

The press has nothing to do with your rounds. Just saying...lot of people rag on Lee stuff when it had nothing to do with the Lee product. Gotta FL size those cases. Also, if the case is tough to chamber as it is, remember they expand when fired..

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: How bad did I F up?

DZ; I reread the OP and see you are absolutely correct. I had assumed the bolt's sticking was consequent to the firing of the rounds. For this I apologize.

Greg

 

[Straight Shooter]

Re: How bad did I F up?

I have seen this happen more than a few times without a rubber mallet or a tactical handle. On hunting rifles I have seen them just fall off while working the bolt normally. When I get my tactical handle put on I'm haveing it tig welded at the same time. I was wondering why with all the tactical handles around here I haven't seen this more.

On reloading never mix brass with another rifle. Nothing wrong with neck sizing. I only bump the shoulder about every 5 firings just to keep them closing easy. Full Length sizing everytime leads to excess working/lengthing of the brass and head separations. My dad used to insist we be able to share ammo so he always full length sized. On a 7mag that will get you a head separation in 2 firings. Game over unless you know how to extract a brass without the head on it. I know now how.

 

[Kells81]

Re: How bad did I F up?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Hired Gun</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <span style="color: #FF0000">On a 7mag that will get you a head separation in 2 firings</span>. Game over unless you know how to extract a brass without the head on it. I know now how. </div></div>

LOL I have a box of 50 7mm mag brass that has been reloaded at least 10 times and everytime I only FL size. Full length size every round every time. Some peole do, some dont its like cleaning or sex we all do it a little different yet most of the time it has the same results.

As far as the Lee stuff, I started with it and it worked for what I was doing. Now I use RCBS equiment and have gained a little love for the redding dies. Not the cheapest way to reload but I have been buying a Redding FL die, Redding Trim Die, and Redding Comp seater die for my rifles when I get them.

 

[Straight Shooter]

Re: How bad did I F up?

If your dies closely fit your chamber you can full length resize until the brass gives it up another way but the chamber in my Ruger is far longer than the chamber in dads old Sako. Sized to fit in the Sako and on the second firing all I extract is the head of the brass. <span style="color: #FF0000"> No one was LOL ing 500 miles from home on a hunt.</span>

My RCBS dies for my 338-378 Accumark fit that chamber perfect. You have to crush those dies into the shellholder to get the bolt handle to drop easy. Every situation is different. To blindly full length size everytime is looking for trouble.

I mainly use Lee Collet neck dies for all my high volume shooters and have greatly extended my brass life and completely retired the need for a trimmer.

 

[Snakum]

Re: How bad did I F up?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">To blindly full length size everytime is looking for trouble.</div></div>

Could you expand/expound on that a little?

I full length resize with a Lee single stage press. I run all my Win/BHA cases thru a trimmer each time (2.006"), and I have been able to bump the shoulders down enough that they still chamber fine after four reload cycles. I was told that with a .308, as long as I kept an eye on the ridge that can develop inside near the case head (I check them with a paper clip) to full length resize every time and I should be able to reload most of them seven or eight times till the primers eventually no longer seat.

Izzat not necessarily the case?

 

[Straight Shooter]

Re: How bad did I F up?

If pressures are not out of sight you should have no trouble going 5 times before having to bump the shoulder. At that time I anneal the necks and bump the shoulder. I have 300 Wby brass over 30 reloads. On my 22-250 I am working the same 100 Winchester brass since 1990. They get loaded at least 3 or 4 times a year. None are growing because on those calibers I run collet dies. No squeezing so no lengthing of the brass occurs. On any die that forces the neck or brass through a smaller sized hole the only place for that brass to go it up and out the neck. The stretch occurs down near the head of the brass about 1/2" up from the base. You are on the right track checking for the valley that will form but the problem is by the time you can feel it you are very near a separation. When I had my couple separations it was not damaging or dangerous. I just had a puff of smoke about the action and only the head extracted. Depending on the length of your chamber verses your sizing die if the fit is good you could full length size until you can't hold a primer or eventually split the neck. If your chamber is longer than what you are crushing your brass back too it will lead to separation much sooner.

If you have some shallow dies I would just adjust them a bit at a time until the bolt handle will just close with minimal effort. Set like that you are fine to full length size everytime. Then you just watch the length and when a seated primer will not stay they are all done. Without annealing though you will lose the necks long before that happens.

Does that make more sense?

 

[Snakum]

Re: How bad did I F up?

Definitely. Thanks.