Is body armor necessary for a civilian?

[Awag1000]

Look, I know that body armor is very useful. As a civilian that has absolutely no intention of getting in a shoot out. It seems to have no purpose for me. However my close friend keeps insisting that I get LVL4 ceramic plates and a carrier. Should I buy them or is this just hype? If "Stuff" hits the fan, I'm not going to make myself look like a target.
Am I wrong? Am I missing something?

 

[AirGunShawn]

I rock climb, scuba dive and hang-glide among other things. I have new gear, training and back up equipment.
IE: parachute on my belly, hook knife, spare cash in the harness etc. I have spare o-rings and back up regulator while diving.
I have quick ditch weights in my buoyancy compensator. I dive solo about 50% of the time and on occasion under thin ice.
At 140 feet, the quarry is 38* F in the summer and 36* in the winter.
I absolutely believe in being prepared for any reasonable eventuality. I have two full sets of keys in my truck at all times and
a third spare key affixed to the outside of the truck should I lock both sets in and the battery goes dead rendering my entry key
pad inoperable. The third key doesn't have a chip and only gets me into the truck. To be forthcoming, I often lock all of my stuff
including both sets of keys, wallet etc. in the truck during a dive.

I can't ever see the need for me to waste money on body armor.... To be candid, it sounds laughable.
If a stranger suggested it, what would be your first gut reaction?

 

[Awag1000]

I rock climb, scuba dive and hang-glide among other things. I have new gear, training and back up equipment.
IE: parachute on my belly, hook knife, spare cash in the harness etc. I have spare o-rings and back up regulator while diving.
I have quick ditch weights in my buoyancy compensator. I dive solo about 50% of the time and on occasion under thin ice.
At 140 feet, the quarry is 38* F in the summer and 36* in the winter.
I absolutely believe in being prepared for any reasonable eventuality. I have two full sets of keys in my truck at all times and
a third spare key affixed to the outside of the truck should I lock both sets in and the battery goes dead rendering my entry key
pad inoperable. The third key doesn't have a chip and only gets me into the truck. To be forthcoming, I often lock all of my stuff
including both sets of keys, wallet etc. in the truck during a dive.

I can't ever see the need for me to waste money on body armor.... To be candid, it sounds laughable.
If a stranger suggested it, what would be your first gut reaction?

I can understand like a concealable body armor but if I get info that people are shooting rifles I would avoid that area. I may just invest in something that's level 3 ish that I can hide better.

 

[W54/XM-388]

How often have you used the fire extinguishers at your house?
Would you be comfortable without one for the just in case?

Body armour is a pain in the ass to wear at best, most likely you'll never wind up needing the protection it gives.
If you are being all "prepared" with all your guns and ammo, do you want to pass up something simple that could easily mean the difference between living and dying in some significant event?

Even if you don't plan for any trouble, the police show up at your door in the middle of the night with the whole pile of jack boots screaming and yelling and pointing lights at your house, do you want to step your front door and risk some roid raging, trigger happy coward killing you because he was afraid of his own shadow? Or would you like to put on your plate carrier vest and all your armour, throw a bath robe over everything and hope to have a chance to come out alive even if said trigger happy cowards try to shoot you because they have no consequences?
(If you are all upset at me saying this, well tough, because it's happened multiple times to innocent people so... truth hurts).


Someone kicks in your door at night, do you want to go clear the house in your shirt, or would you like to throw on a vest if you have a moment, just incase there are more than one of them and they get a shot off at you?

Perhaps you didn't notice the Antifa goons that all had arms and were shooting people during the riots?

Again, you might never need it, but if you have a pile of guns, cases of ammo and visions of "SHTF" and don't have body armour, I'd say you're pretty silly.

 

[Awag1000]

How often have you used the fire extinguishers at your house?
Would you be comfortable without one for the just in case?

Body armour is a pain in the ass to wear at best, most likely you'll never wind up needing the protection it gives.
If you are being all "prepared" with all your guns and ammo, do you want to pass up something simple that could easily mean the difference between living and dying in some significant event?

Even if you don't plan for any trouble, the police show up at your door in the middle of the night with the whole pile of jack boots screaming and yelling and pointing lights at your house, do you want to step your front door and risk some roid raging, trigger happy coward killing you because he was afraid of his own shadow? Or would you like to put on your plate carrier vest and all your armour, throw a bath robe over everything and hope to have a chance to come out alive even if said trigger happy cowards try to shoot you because they have no consequences?
(If you are all upset at me saying this, well tough, because it's happened multiple times to innocent people so... truth hurts).


Someone kicks in your door at night, do you want to go clear the house in your shirt, or would you like to throw on a vest if you have a moment, just incase there are more than one of them and they get a shot off at you?

Perhaps you didn't notice the Antifa goons that all had arms and were shooting people during the riots?

Again, you might never need it, but if you have a pile of guns, cases of ammo and visions of "SHTF" and don't have body armour, I'd say you're pretty silly.

I can't argue with that. I suppose I should look into that more. With that said. Is level 4 necessary or would something lighter be good? I have no experience with this kind of stuff.

 

[Makinchips208]

I can't argue with that. I suppose I should look into that more. With that said. Is level 4 necessary or would something lighter be good? I have no experience with this kind of stuff.

Level 3a should be good. That will cover most handgun rounds. If you want to be somewhat protected against rifle calibers the get the level 3 or level 4.

 

[W54/XM-388]

I can't argue with that. I suppose I should look into that more. With that said. Is level 4 necessary or would something lighter be good? I have no experience with this kind of stuff.

My suggestion would be to also get a good set of concealable IIIA soft body armour that has a pocket in the front for a strike plate.
It's a nice thing to have available, but just know that if you have to wear it, you will get hot in a huge hurry unless it's mid winter.
But it gives you the option to have some protection when you need to not scream "Tactical".

If you can afford a level 4 set of plates and a good plate carrier, go for it, there are lots of options.
That being said, the higher Level 3 stuff will stop standard .308 rounds as well as .223 AP rounds and that's about the most you are going to be up against unless something nuts is going down and then they might actually be aiming...

 

[MadDuner]

I put this in the category with fire extinguishers and first aid kits.
You seldom need them, but when you do - you do!

 

[_Windrider_]

I never plan on being in a shootout but I carry a gun everywhere I go Take a training class with some fudds without body armor and In guarantee you won’t do it twice.

 

[MadDuner]

I never plan on being in a shootout but I carry a gun everywhere I go Take a training class with some fudds without body armor and In guarantee you won’t do it twice.

Oh c'mon man.
How often does that AD actually hit a vital organ anyway?

 

[_Windrider_]

Oh c'mon man.
How often does that AD actually hit a vital organ anyway?

I mean you could just follow Detroit urban survival training and never have to worry about anything.

 

[MadDuner]

I mean you could just follow Detroit urban survival training and never have to worry about anything.

I thought that was called "White Flight?"

 

[aslrookie]

If you have to ask if you need something, you probably don’t.

 

[Milf Dots]

Since when does NEED have anything to do with it?!

Buy body armor because you have the RIGHT to.

 

[Hobo Hilton]

Is body armor necessary for a civilian?
______________
I'm in the same camp as some of the previous replies.
Do you have insurance on your auto?
Do you wear a helmet to ride motorcycle, snow machine, bucking bulls?
Do you understand that "when you need it"... It's too late to buy it?
Just an FYI - Armor will be a per-requisite to get into many camps. Why should they cover your ass ?
If you are in denial, stick around, it will become reality.

 

[Hobo Hilton]

I mean you could just follow Detroit urban survival training and never have to worry about anything.

Dead men don't worry

 

[Hobo Hilton]

I thought that was called "White Flight?"

That was the term 25 years ago.... That flight has landed in less populated areas.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Our local LE is Sheriff's Deputies, and they gear up pretty much like camo'd SWAT. In all honesty, if things go South (and it's only 50 miles to Mexico here), the last thing I'm gonna want to look like is a Deputy or ICE Agent. It would be like drawing a big red crosshair on my chest. I respect them and the job they do too much to try looking like a Wannabe; many of them are members of our Veterans' Posts and personal friends. If they need help; I'll take their call, take my chances like the rest of the concerned citizens, and keep to rifle distances.

I spent 13 months in combat wearing early gen flak Jacket that might stop shrapnel fragments and reduce the consequences of a hit with x39 stuff. Compared to what a PFC on today's battlefield has to put on, I'd be Boots, Helmet, Flak Jacket, M-14, and gone, baby, gone way faster. I once turned out for an alert with the former and skivvies on, nothing else. We used to dye our Skivvies O.D.

BTW, I originally came from Newark, NJ; where the term White Flight originated, and was one of the last White Flyers. I left because I was no longer able to converse with my neighbors in their language, nor they in mine.

Greg

 

[diverdon]

Should you decide to get some body armor, do not tell this friend. His obsessive interest in your body armor indicates he may have some scenario playing in his head where you play Butch Cassady to his Sundance kid.

 

[Awag1000]

I see what you mean. I'll look into it more. I'll definitely consider some low profile armor.

 

[GenericBadGuy]

Not necessary. But it's nice to have in case you need it. Level 3 and 3a stuff can be had for a reasonable price. I'm basically a cooked vegetable on the couch but I found the Premier Armor Discreet Executive vest on sale and its good enough for my needs.

 

[Mister Ridge]

Doesn't body armor have a shelf life? That's a lot of money to be spending multiple times in your lifetime.

 

[Awag1000]

Doesn't body armor have a shelf life? That's a lot of money to be spending multiple times in your lifetime.

From what I have heard. Yes and no. It's like an expiration date on honey. It never really "goes bad" but who really wants to use 6 year old honey in their food?

 

[TheGerman]

Can a bullet kill you if you're a civilian?

The answer to that is the answer to your question.

It's also why even CONUS, I have all of my guys drilling head/K zone shots as the desired effect as opposed to just getting 'a hit on target' at distances of up to 50 yards.

 

[TheGerman]

Doesn't body armor have a shelf life? That's a lot of money to be spending multiple times in your lifetime.

Only 2 things damage it (other than shooting it).

Heat and being tossed around against things.

 

[Awag1000]

Can a bullet kill you if you're a civilian?

The answer to that is the answer to your question.

Can't argue with that.

 

[Im2bent]

 

[candyx]

If you want to look like a grunt then get a plate carrier, if you want style then get the BulletBlocker Wool Topcoat.

 

[aard3]

I believe in being prepared... but also being realistic. I 100% support the right of any law abiding citizen to own whatever body armor they want... but reality is that most civilians probably don't "need" LVL 4 Plates and a carrier.... It's just not realistic that they are going to ever be in a situation to use it, and if they are, will they have it with them, do they have time to kit-up, and have they trained with it, etc. etc.

I think that some discrete soft armor that can be worn under clothes is not a bad idea, and can be worn all the time. If you feel you need more protection, get a slicked-low-profile carrier in a color like MAS Grey, with some lightweight Hesco 200 series plates... you could throw that over your soft armor easily.

Something like the above won't attract nearly as much attention, easier/lighter to wear, and would be easier to transport. If shit does hit the fan, you don't want to look like a target.

 

[elwarpo]

Consider what you might encounter. Lvl 4 playes will stop AP rifle rounds, what is the chance of running into them. 3a will stop most common handgun rounds, but newer solid copper rounds will go through them. Level 3 will stop some rifle rounds but not m855 and steel core 7.62x39. Level 3+ (not an actual rating) available from some companies will stop m855/ss109, m193, 7.62x39, 308... they cost more than level 4 but weigh half as much. That is what I chose because it stops everything I think I will encounter. Do not buy steel plates, they may stop the rounds but spalling will kill you and they are heavier. Also condider your condition, can you throw on 20 to 30 lbs of playes, carrier... 20 more lbs of rifle, pistol and ammo without giving yourself a heart attack? I have 2 sets of armor, a lighter set with 3a rear and 3+ front so I can wear it, and a heavier set of 3+ front, rear and sides for home defense. Body armor is useless if you do not wear it.

 

[DaveSC]

I have 3A concealable that will also take plates. I also have a 3A ballistic helmet. I have always thought it is something good to have because of all the mayhem this country has been going through. Just insurance for me. Not much different than having your place fenced or deadbolts on doors. Most armor is rated for 5 years, but it does not really go bad if you store it as you would a jacket or clothing. Another reason I got it is because I can. Not too long ago there was a bill in Congress to prohibit people from getting it. If you already have it you would be grandfathered in. Why are people buying ammo? I expect in the future...another bill will be introduced and who knows what will happen?

Responsible Body Armor Possession Act (2019 - H.R. 4568)

To prohibit the purchase, ownership, or possession of enhanced body armor by civilians, with exceptions.

www.govtrack.us

 

[BCP]

Look, I know that body armor is very useful. As a civilian that has absolutely no intention of getting in a shoot out. It seems to have no purpose for me. However my close friend keeps insisting that I get LVL4 ceramic plates and a carrier. Should I buy them or is this just hype? If "Stuff" hits the fan, I'm not going to make myself look like a target.
Am I wrong? Am I missing something?

I think it would be cool to have just for giggles but to wear it every day is nuts.

 

[Awag1000]

Do not buy steel plates, they may stop the rounds but spalling will kill you

Yeah I have 0 intent on buying steel.
Boggles my mind on why people would wear steel armor.

 

[MadDuner]

Yeah I have 0 intent on buying steel.
Boggles my mind on why people would wear steel armor.

It's a great workout?

 

[Hairball]

If it’s properly coated then spalling is a not an issue. Steel provides a cost effective solution for some and holds up much better to rough handling or repeated strikes over ceramic. The only downside is weight or contour when compared to other options. While I am not recommending them, they do present an option for some.

 

[Awag1000]

If it’s properly coated then spalling is a not an issue. Steel provides a cost effective solution for some and holds up much better to rough handling or repeated strikes over ceramic. The only downside is weight or contour when compared to other options.

Some ceramic is multi hit rated. I'm just thinking if you find yourself getting hit more than once, some seriously bad decisions have been made.

 

[MadDuner]

What are the chances of being hit multiple times in the plate - and not hit anywhere else at the same time?

 

[Makinchips208]

We live in a country where civilians can buy body armor, night vision, thermal equipment, etc. so exercise your rights and buy something, preferably made in USA.
Soft armor is great and can be worn everyday, although it gets hot.
Hard armor can be heavy, but also actually can be semi concealed with a front plate only with the proper carrier.
Spalling injury can be an issue with steel plates, but a round through the heart is a bigger issue.
Ceramic is great also.

Just get a decent plate carrier and plates and put it in the closet. Why? Well why do the gun control freaks want to ban armor? That’s reason enough to have it.

 

[elwarpo]

What are the chances of being hit multiple times in the plate - and not hit anywhere else at the same time?

Close range where the person aims center if mass. Especially with low recoil pistol caliber carbines and a red dot sight. Even moving, I consistently hit a 6 inch center if mass circle on a silhouette target at 25 yards or less. I have also trained myself for 2 center of mass followed by groin and head shot in case they are wearing armor.

 

[MadDuner]

Close range where the person aims center if mass. Especially with low recoil pistol caliber carbines and a red dot sight. Even moving, I consistently hit a 6 inch center if mass circle on a silhouette target at 25 yards or less. I have also trained myself for 2 center of mass followed by groin and head shot in case they are wearing armor.

I just know that I do NOT feel bullet proof by wearing a 10x12 plate on my chest.
There's a whole bunch of the rest of me to hit that is unprotected and very vulnerable.

Sometimes listening to some of my buddies talk about their armor - they forget that little detail.

 

[acudaowner]

nope you can wear trash cans and hope they will stop bullets which they wont . maybe coat your self in flex seal lol no again darn you could just buy them and let your socialist neighbors wear them after you take out the protection .you know keep the sheep happy mmm warm mutton .

 

[308pirate]

Look, I know that body armor is very useful. As a civilian that has absolutely no intention of getting in a shoot out. It seems to have no purpose for me. However my close friend keeps insisting that I get LVL4 ceramic plates and a carrier. Should I buy them or is this just hype? If "Stuff" hits the fan, I'm not going to make myself look like a target.
Am I wrong? Am I missing something?

Make your own decisions like a man and stop looking for validation from others.

 

[308pirate]

If you already have it you would be grandfathered in.

Everyone assumes that bans will always have such a clause.

LOL

 

[MadDuner]

Everyone assumes that bans will always have such a clause.

LOL

Not a chance.
If they decide to ban body armor - it's because they know they are going to tip over the apple cart.

 

[UpSideDown]

If it’s properly coated then spalling is a not an issue. Steel provides a cost effective solution for some and holds up much better to rough handling or repeated strikes over ceramic. The only downside is weight or contour when compared to other options.

I don't expect the overworked Rhino-Liner spray guy making $12/hr to 'properly coat', by hand, steel plates. That ship sailed years ago. Stop buying steel.

 

[TacDad]

I have it, hopefully never need it.

I spend money for good quality and lightweight. As the saying goes "cheap, light, quality, pick two" well for armor anyway. I would recommend take a look at RMAdefense. Their III+ is a great offering of low weight, protection and not crazy expensive.

 

[308pirate]

I don't expect the overworked Rhino-Liner spray guy making $12/hr to 'properly coat', by hand, steel plates. That ship sailed years ago. Stop buying steel.

Not a problem

 

[TurboTrout]

Based on recent history over the last 20 years, with the ramp up over the last 2, yes. Also if you think the “hoodlums” are your only threat, rethink that.

Body armor is much like a home generator, don’t use it much, but when you need it you REALLY need it.

 

[Choid]

Do you guys buy a subscription to a QRT with your body armor, or at least travel with a medic?

It seems like a great idea if you have an organized team of people, and if you do, good on you. But I think people overestimate its efficacy by itself.

 

[theLBC]

i don't have any, but not because i am not operator af, but because i am a poor and have other priorities that have more roi.